Player Discussion Mike Reilly (D) acquired from the Montreal Canadiens

[bert]

He hasn’t been struggling recently. But it’s pretty obvious the plan is to let the young players simmer in the minors. Trading a meaningless 5th doesn’t mean you’re not rebuilding.

Its a meaningless 5th when its 1 pick agreed. When its 4,5,6,7 picks over 3 years it adds up its a full draft for players that have no future in this organization. Thats why the sens are in the position they are in asset mangement its not just picks its when they choose to trade players or sign players etc. This orgnization is fundamentally flawed in how they are building this team.

 

[Xspyrit]

They only had 6 healthy D in NA under contract... and why was that? Because they only had 11 in total signed. And why was that? Think real hard, put the galactic brain to use.

Dorion left them vulnerable and unable to withstand only a few injuries.

The trade itself is fine but there should have been a couple of Mike Riellys kicking around in Belleville when needed and signed in the offseason. If they hadn't wasted contract spots on guys like Beaudin, Sabourin and Swartz they could have just given 2 way deals to Corrado and Percy and be done with it.

When Ebert was traded, Wolanin was already out long term. That left us with 10 guys to use, which is just not enough in a 82 game schedule and leaves Belleville in terrible shape when he have even a couple of injuries.

Don't love that he has another year left on his contract. Would have preferred an expiring deal.

"only a few injuries"? lol

A couple of Mike Reillys kicking around in Belleville? Reilly is in his 3rd year of 1 way contracts after his ELC. Not the type of player that gets stuck in the AHL, at least not for now. It suggests you never seen him play or even know about him. He looked pretty good at times for the Habs last year but he has a huge consistency problem.

Wasted contract spots on guys like Beaudin, Sabourin and Swartz?

Beaudin was already on his ELC when acquired, to get rid of Max McCormick's salary for the rest of the 2018-19 season. He's a "prospect", 21 y/o when acquired...

Swarz has 11 goals, 21 pts in 29 games in Bingo, seems like a nice veteran presence and has been named captain. I really don't think they regret this 1 year contract, Belleville already has less veteran talent than most other AHL teams.

Sabourin you may have a point, although he probably deserved it through camp and it's only a 1 year 2-way contract (100 K$ for the AHL). It's such a non-issue and pretty much a waste of bandwidth to even talk about it. For me, it helps keeping a talented prospect in Belleville longer.

Finally, 10 guys with NHL contracts (1-way or 2-ways) is not... enough? First time I ever heard anything like that. I mean, how many should a NHL team have? When you have multiple simultaneous injuries, then you can always sign players like Percy (injured too) and Corrado, who have a bit of NHL experience.

Bingo. This team has no direction.

Not necessarily a big fan of this move or even some other moves but I don't understand the mantra "this team has no direction" you can sometimes read on this board. I mean, it looks pretty simple and pretty clear

 

[stempniaksen]

Finally, 10 guys with NHL contracts (1-way or 2-ways) is not... enough? First time I ever heard anything like that. I mean, how many should a NHL team have? When you have multiple simultaneous injuries, then you can always sign players like Percy (injured too) and Corrado, who have NHL experience.

Not even close to enough. Most teams went into the year with 14-16 defencemen under contract for a reason.

The Senators decided (for many varying reasons) that they needed extra depth up front and in nets (with some of those spots being taken up by LTIR'ed players) at the expense of their defence. There were people on these very boards who pointed out the lack of organizational depth on defence before the season even started. Obviously that was compounded by the rash of injuries that all came up simultaneously.

And if it was as easy as signing guys like Percy and Corrado the team wouldn't have had to give up a pick for Mike Reilly. Contract spots matter, and (for better or worse) having guys like Swarz, Sabourin and the LTIR club around forced the team into giving up an asset (as minor as it ended up being) instead of being able to grab a body for "free".

 

[GCK]

Not even close to enough. Most teams went into the year with 14-16 defencemen under contract for a reason.

The Senators decided (for many varying reasons) that they needed extra depth up front and in nets (with some of those spots being taken up by LTIR'ed players) at the expense of their defence. There were people on these very boards who pointed out the lack of organizational depth on defence before the season even started. Obviously that was compounded by the rash of injuries that all came up simultaneously.

And if it was as easy as signing guys like Percy and Corrado the team wouldn't have had to give up a pick for Mike Reilly. Contract spots matter, and (for better or worse) having guys like Swarz, Sabourin and the LTIR club around forced the team into giving up an asset (as minor as it ended up being) instead of being able to grab a body for "free".

I’m glad you noticed the 3 contracts Dorion is force to carry for cap purposes. Basically we started the year with 47 max contracts not 50.

 

[GCK]

Its a meaningless 5th when its 1 pick agreed. When its 4,5,6,7 picks over 3 years it adds up its a full draft for players that have no future in this organization. Thats why the sens are in the position they are in asset mangement its not just picks its when they choose to trade players or sign players etc. This orgnization is fundamentally flawed in how they are building this team.

You are yelling at Clouds. We have 11 picks this year, including 1 minimum in every round. We have 7 next year including 3 2nd rounders. The draft assets were used to help with prospect development. You need to do what is best for the prospects you have as opposed to sacrificing them for future longs shots from the 4th and 5th round.
The tear down was last year it’s now time to cultivate.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

I’m glad you noticed the 3 contracts Dorion is force to carry for cap purposes. Basically we started the year with 47 max contracts not 50.

By "cap purposes" you mean cap floor circumvention and in one case to not have to pay for a buyout or bury Condon whom Dorion also spent a pick to acquire and decided to give a 3 year contract (with Hammond still on the books on his own 3 year contract, who was also dumped using mid round picks).

 

[GCK]

By "cap purposes" you mean cap floor circumvention and in one case to not have to pay for a buyout or bury Condon whom Dorion also spent a pick to acquire and decided to give a 3 year contract (with Hammond still on the books on his own 3 year contract, who was also dumped using mid round picks).

Yes to ensure we reach the floor. Cap purposes.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

"only a few injuries"? lol

A couple of Mike Reillys kicking around in Belleville? Reilly is in his 3rd year of 1 way contracts after his ELC. Not the type of player that gets stuck in the AHL, at least not for now. It suggests you never seen him play or even know about him. He looked pretty good at times for the Habs last year but he has a huge consistency problem.

Wasted contract spots on guys like Beaudin, Sabourin and Swartz?

Beaudin was already on his ELC when acquired, to get rid of Max McCormick's salary for the rest of the 2018-19 season. He's a "prospect", 21 y/o when acquired...

Swarz has 11 goals, 21 pts in 29 games in Bingo, seems like a nice veteran presence and has been named captain. I really don't think they regret this 1 year contract, Belleville already has less veteran talent than most other AHL teams.

Sabourin you may have a point, although he probably deserved it through camp and it's only a 1 year 2-way contract (100 K$ for the AHL). It's such a non-issue and pretty much a waste of bandwidth to even talk about it. For me, it helps keeping a talented prospect in Belleville longer.

Finally, 10 guys with NHL contracts (1-way or 2-ways) is not... enough? First time I ever heard anything like that. I mean, how many should a NHL team have? When you have multiple simultaneous injuries, then you can always sign players like Percy (injured too) and Corrado, who have a bit of NHL experience.



Not necessarily a big fan of this move or even some other moves but I don't understand the mantra "this team has no direction" you can sometimes read on this board. I mean, it looks pretty simple and pretty clear

It was already addressed but 10 defensemen isn't nearly enough between your affiliate and NHL team. Most teams have at least 15. I haven't gone through every team's roster but I didn't see a single other club with only 11.

Beaudin was a wasted contract because he was traded for McCormick who was on an expiring deal. Should have let McCormick walk. Should have also let Englund walk as well and signed a Reilly type AHL vet too.

It was entirely avoidable. They had 4 injuries between their AHL and NHL team. That's not a crazy number.

Also, "Mike Reilly isn't the type of guy who gets stuck in the AHL"... uh yes he is. Have you ever watched the AHL? Hello Frank Corrado, Stuart Percy, Chris Wideman, Cody Goloubef etc etc. Those guys were all probably a lot higher regarded than Reilly at one point or another. That guy has career AHLer or off to play in the KHL all over him.

 

[GCK]

It was already addressed but 10 defensemen isn't nearly enough between your affiliate and NHL team. Most teams have at least 15. I haven't gone through every team's roster but I didn't see a single mother club with only 11.

Beaudin was a wasted contract because he was traded for McCormick who was on an expiring deal. Should have let McCormick walk. Should have also let Englund walk as well and signed a Reilly type AHL vet too.

It was entirely avoidable. They had 4 injuries between their AHL and NHL team. That's not a crazy number.

Actually 5. Reilly wasn’t acquired to play in Belleville, he will be in Ottawa. McCormick being moved while on a 1 way for a prospect was shrewd.

 

[bert]

You are yelling at Clouds. We have 11 picks this year, including 1 minimum in every round. We have 7 next year including 3 2nd rounders. The draft assets were used to help with prospect development. You need to do what is best for the prospects you have as opposed to sacrificing them for future longs shots from the 4th and 5th round.
The tear down was last year it’s now time to cultivate.

Well I think we just fundamentally dissagree on how to build a team and manage assets. Plenty of people believe in both our perspectives so I dont think this is falling on def ears even if you dont agree. Just because they have alot of picks doesnt mean they have gone about this the right way, nor does it devalue the picks that they are trading.

The fact that you think the year to tear down was when they dont have their first pick and the year to cultivate is when they do, leads me to believe you dont really understand the value in managing assets or the depth of this draft and how important it is that the sens land a franchise forward this season. Or that this team wont compete for a Stanley Cup in the next 3 years anyway. In the grand scheme of things if this organization is commited to winning a Stanley Cup this season does not matter. So with all these injuries if they really thought that it was harmful for Brannstrom to play with the big club then they should have slotted someone else in and took the lumps and lost the games at the NHL level. Thats what a real plan would have looked like, one where they are commited to the long term goal.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

Actually 5. Reilly wasn’t acquired to play in Belleville, he will be in Ottawa. McCormick being moved while on a 1 way for a prospect was shrewd.

Sure, if you include Wolanin who we put on LTIR before the season started and knew was gone long term when we traded Ebert and signed Sabourin.

 

[GCK]

Well I think we just fundamentally dissagree on how to build a team and manage assets. Plenty of people believe in both our perspectives so I dont think this is falling on def ears even if you dont agree. Just because they have alot of picks doesnt mean they have gone about this the right way, nor does it devalue the picks that they are trading.

The fact that you think the year to tear down was when they dont have their first pick and the year to cultivate is when they do, leads me to believe you dont really understand the value in managing assets or the depth of this draft and how important it is that the sens land a franchise forward this season.

I’ve been on this draft for a couple years. We are going to finish bottom 5 for sure and with the lottery changes finishing last is no guarantee.

We have played better than expected but it only gets tougher from here. Reilly will help Chabot so that is worth a 5th. Names keeps forwards in Belleville and to me that’s worth a 4th. Next years draft is not deep, those picks are not the sams 2020.

 

[Laphroaig]

To all those who keep referring to a fifth round pick as meaningless please bear in mind that the two greatest right wingers in team history (with apologies to Marian Hossa) were drafted in the sixth round.

Ottawa took on a bad contract of a player Montreal had no use for. It would have made more sense to me If Ottawa was the team acquiring a fifth round pick for doing Montreal a favor.

 

[Mark Stones Spleen]

I can't believe there is this much discussion about trading a 5th for an nhl defensemen. We are slammed with injuries right now and this trade allows us to keep our prospects where they belong.

It's always going to be harder to plan in years like this when very few kids actually took the step forward. There's a reason why we have so few NHL bodies. Management left spots open for kids, none took them.

But seeing patterns of posters here, they'd whine if we didn't pay a nominal fee to keep players developing and they'd whine when we do.

Reilly might be a big piece of crap, but if signing him allows brannstrom to help Belleville, he's with the 5th. He's also signed for another year, so his signing can allow us to possibly trade other dmen without worrying about needing a contract back necessarily.

 

[Larionov]

Mike Reilly is basically another Goloubef but signed to a 1.5 m contract for another year. I feel like we could have gotten better value for a plug to fill a hole but the options are limited because of our contract situation and the fact that were mid season. Not sure how far away Wolanin is, to bad we couldn't hold off till he was back.

Goloubef? Ouch. Surely to God he's better than that. Goloubef is an AHL scrub at best.

As for Wolanin, unfortunately he's out until mid-February, according to Dorion today. At that point, he'll head to Belleville. No way we could tread water for six to eight weeks.

 

[GCK]

Sure, if you include Wolanin who we put on LTIR before the season started and knew was gone long term when we traded Ebert and signed Sabourin.

The only issue I have is moving Ebbert for Names to save cash. They could have moved a forward and a pick for NYR to retain or made the forward a decent prospect. Money is always a factor.

EDIT: I overlooked that NYR retained 750K which explains the 4th.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Solid move, Branstrom back down to continue developing with the other kids.

Small contract and decent but not great bottom pairing NHLer to hold down a D spot during the period of tanking for rebuilding picks is solid.

We don’t have any quality defensive prospects kicking down the door this season, and we have at least one if not two defensemen coming off the books this season (could be 3), and Branstrom is the only prospect that looks like a lock to make the team for good next season. JBD and Tompson will likely needs more time, and neither Jaros or Lajoie have been particularly exciting.

We need the right bodies to ply the right roles on our squad, and so far we have done a great job picking up players that have been able to at the very least maintain their value. We don’t need a bunch of crap fodder in the summer, we need the right character guys that can maintain value, or have their value increase.

 

[bert]

I can't believe there is this much discussion about trading a 5th for an nhl defensemen. We are slammed with injuries right now and this trade allows us to keep our prospects where they belong.

It's always going to be harder to plan in years like this when very few kids actually took the step forward. There's a reason why we have so few NHL bodies. Management left spots open for kids, none took them.

But seeing patterns of posters here, they'd whine if we didn't pay a nominal fee to keep players developing and they'd whine when we do.

Reilly might be a big piece of crap, but if signing him allows brannstrom to help Belleville, he's with the 5th. He's also signed for another year, so his signing can allow us to possibly trade other dmen without worrying about needing a contract back necessarily.

You really cant believe that there is this much discussion about giving away ANOTHER pick? There are plenty of sound arguments as to why this move was simply poor asset management. Poor asset management is something that has put the sens in this position in the first place and has plagued this organization since Dorion became the general manager. They have given away I believe 7 picks for nothing but moving salary and bandaid replaceplent players on a team that is tanking. They traded franchise players in their prime for picks.... How do you not find this frusterating as a fan of this team?

The fact of the matter is aquiring Reilly was not the bottom line in allowing Brannstrom to help Belleville. The organization easily could have had another player up here. Demelo and Zaitsev are both only a week away, did they really need to give up a 5th round pick to wait a week? Do they really need to try and win these games this week? The answer is absolutely not if they are commited to winning a stanley and there is a real plan in place.

 

[Ice-Tray]

The only issue I have is moving Ebbert for Names to save cash. They could have moved a forward and a pick for NYR to retain or made the forward a decent prospect. Money is always a factor.

We also need to consider that perhaps NYR wanted an AHL defensemen for their squad instead of assuming that it was just a throw away from PD. Names actually has value as an NHL player, it would make sense that NYR would choose their AHL pick up.

 

[Mark Stones Spleen]

You really cant believe that there is this much discussion about giving away ANOTHER pick? There are plenty of sound arguments as to why this move was simply poor asset management. Poor asset management is something that has put the sens in this position in the first place and has plagued this organization since Dorion became the general manager. They have given away I believe 7 picks for nothing but moving salary and bandaid replaceplent players on a team that is tanking. They traded franchise players in their prime for picks.... How do you not find this frusterating as a fan of this team?

The fact of the matter is aquiring Reilly was not the bottom line in allowing Brannstrom to help Belleville. The organization easily could have had another player up here. Demelo and Zaitsev are both only a week away, did they really need to give up a 5th round pick to wait a week? Do they really need to try and win these games this week? The answer is absolutely not if they are commited to winning a stanley and there is a real plan in place.

It's a 5th round pick in 2021. Whoever we chose wouldn't have played for another 5+ years if we're lucky.

Reilly is signed for another year. If trading for him allows us to trade demelo for a 2nd or 3rd (same goes with Hainsey, or any other damn), we come out ahead. Hell, in a year's time, we may be able to recoup that pick for a team needing a depth dman.

If you think these are the trades that no longer let you win a Stanley Cup, then there's much bigger problems at hand. Also, is argue the opposite, if trades like this let you develop players more effectively, then this would only help the team become more competitive with its other resources.

 

[2CHAINZ]

Belleville just brought in Thomas Parisi on PTO

Any relation to Zach ?

 

[Cosmix]

Guys, we took on money in a trade...what the hell is going on? New owner???? Are we selling both of our firsts this year for cash????

We need more 5, 6 & 7 level (aka cheap) Defensemen due to injuries and upcoming trades.

From a “glass is half full” perspective, this just might help the tank.

 

[Cosmix]

He is 26 years old and looks to have untapped offensive potential. It is a pretty good deal for a reasonably young d man who still has 2nd pairing potential.

We seem to have quite a few players now with untappable offensive potential.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

Any relation to Zach ?

This is is Zac's sister's uncle-inlaw's best-friend's neighbour. He's better than Zac

 

[Ice-Tray]

We seem to have quite a few players now with untappable offensive potential.

With added minutes on a bad team, he may be able to increase his value, like a Names, Brown, Tierney, Duclair (the gold standard), etc...

These lost in the shuffle guys in their mid primes are the perfect players to pick up. A 5th rounder got a player that could easily net a 4th rounder if he’s able to show a little something with a consistent roster spot and some play time.

And each of these guys also gets a chance to audition to be a part of the squad on a more permanent basis if they can break out a little. If neither happens then they simply hold down a roster spot on a tanking team, allowing prospects to stay in a prime development situation in Belleville.

It’s wins all around, at the cost of a 5th round pick.