Confirmed with Link: MacTavish media availability today at 11am

[Oi'll say!]

I wonder how many times I have to say Gagner's season last year WAS factored in to my point before you understand? Honestly guy get a clue. Just bogus arguments from you top to bottom the whole thread.

BTW, you saying the stuff about Gagner's season being horrible under Eakins flies directly in the face of what I just quoted from you. So, in your words, which one is it? :face palm: Oh the irony, lmao.

And honestly, give up on the "Eakins and MacT ruined Dubnyk." Dubnyk was always a **** goalie, even when he had a .915ish save percentage he was letting in absolute float shows from all over the ice. Give your head a shake man. Like I said, your Dubnyk comments are an atrocious way to try and get your point across. Not a great hill to die on. Guy isn't even an NHLer.

You don't like MacT, I get it. Stop trying to base it on ridiculous leaps in logic and just say so. Think I'm done talking to this wall. Playing chess against a pigeon.

Gagner's last season was factored in against an overwhelming number of games from when he was 18, 19, 20, 21... After a while what a player did in the first 30 games of his career ceases to be relevant.

Just because you can find a way to skew a stat towards what you want it to be doesn't make it meaningful to anyone else.


Honestly, you're saying that someone can be an ahl calibre goalie and put up a a .917 sv% over 120 nhl games on a team with one of the worst defenses in the nhl. Is that your hill to die on? The bad news is that noone could survive there, good news is you wouldn't be there long.

 

[SoftDumps]

Gagner's last season was factored in against an overwhelming number of games from when he was 18, 19, 20, 21... After a while what a player did in the first 30 games of his career ceases to be relevant.

Just because you can find a way to skew a stat towards what you want it to be doesn't make it meaningful to anyone else.


Honestly, you're saying that someone can be an ahl calibre goalie and put up a a .917 sv% over 120 nhl games on a team with one of the worst defenses in the nhl. Is that your hill to die on? The bad news is that noone could survive there, good news is you wouldn't be there long.

You actually JUST finished saying the last season is most important. Take a look at DD's last season. Stop contradicting yourself, it is too easy man. Maybe take a break from this thread and go stake out MacT's house. After all, this is the MacT thread, not the Devan Dubnyk is a hero thread. Not even sure why you are trying to say Dubnyk is an NHL goalie, considering people in the know have relegated him to an AHL backup.

You never did respond to the contradictions I pointed out earlier, either. Like, why are you trying to point out how awesome Gagner is when you've been blaming Eakins and MacT for ruining him the whole thread in your MacT critiques? You have so many differing opinions competing in your noggin you're having a hard time trying to make any relevant points.

I'm pretty comfortable on my hill, thanks, considering Dubnyk is playing precisely where I think he should be.

 

[Oi'll say!]

You actually JUST finished saying the last season is most important. Take a look at DD's last season. Stop contradicting yourself, it is too easy man. Maybe take a break from this thread and go stake out MacT's house. After all, this is the MacT thread, not the Devan Dubnyk is a hero thread. Not even sure why you are trying to say Dubnyk is an NHL goalie, considering people in the know have relegated him to an AHL backup.



I'm pretty comfortable on my hill, thanks, considering Dubnyk is playing precisely where I think he should be.

I was pointing out your contradictions. I'm happy taking DD's 2013/2014 season into consideration along with the other 3, DD wasn't injured this season and there's no great excuse for him. I'm happy looking at Gagner's last 3 seasons but this injury season is not a truly great indicator for reasons that I really don't think I need to explain.

You're the one who was actually saying that all you need to know about dd is what happened this season. Remember this useful tidbit:

Dubnyk was always a **** goalie, even when he had a .915ish save percentage he was letting in absolute float shows from all over the ice. Give your head a shake man. Like I said, your Dubnyk comments are an atrocious way to try and get your point across. Not a great hill to die on. Guy isn't even an NHLer.

For the record did you hate Grant Fuhr?

You never did respond to the contradictions I pointed out earlier, either. Like, why are you trying to point out how awesome Gagner is when you've been blaming Eakins and MacT for ruining him the whole thread in your MacT critiques? You have so many differing opinions competing in your noggin you're having a hard time trying to make any relevant points.

As far as Gagner is concerned I don't think he is a complete player. Offensively he is elite for very long stretches and that's not a player to just give up on. Defensively he's anywhere from borderline to garbage. I think he needs his own coach, Todd Marchant maybe.

So yes I do think Gagner's development was incomplete and whether that's his fault or someone else's is up for debate. Who's another talented Oiler that was developed here? Ales Hemsky. Who was his coach? MacT. How did his development go? He was too gifted offensively to pass on and too uninterested defensively to be on the ice most of the time. Interesting similarity, no?

No other offensively gifted players developed under MacT, or at least none came to fruition.

I'm pretty comfortable on my hill, thanks, considering Dubnyk is playing precisely where I think he should be.

Most of your hill is steaming. I think it's where the bull went

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

I have zero respect for him as a coach and GM.

As a person I think he lacks 1) the discretion to do his job with class and 2) the required level of selflessness for someone in his position. IE, he puts his ego far ahead of the needs of the organization.

I definitely do not like him but I don't hate him.

I might say in the heat of the moment that I say I hate Cooke, Ruutu or Kassian but I just think they need to get punched out. I don't really hate them.

I would say that you're telling yourself this more then it actually being the case.

 

[Oi'll say!]

I would say that you're telling yourself this more then it actually being the case.

Who cares Jimmi. You want to try an ad hominem defense to protect MacT now? I'm a bad guy because I don't like MacT, so my arguments lack credibility?

I would love it oif the Oilers were up 3 games to zero with home ice adv in the 1st round. Unrealistic expectation, sure, but it would make me happy. If they got better, cool. If they stayed even that would not be a great sign, considering that they are a young team with 1st overall picks playing in their 4th, 3rd and 2nd years in the nhl. But what if they got worse Jimmi, as in way worse? What did you see with your own eyes Jimmi?

When I watched the games the Oilers stunk, bigtime.

There are mounds of evidence for the team in general and the players individually being much worse under Eakins/MacT than under Krueger/Tambi. The replacement skaters: $3.25M Ference/Eakins vs $3.5M Smid/Krueger. Players under both coaches: Petry/Krueger vs Petry/Eakins. I could go on and on.

Show me one modicum of progress Jimmi.



If you had to talk to Katzie and save MacT's job what could you really say?

No ******** either, it has to be good.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Who cares Jimmi. You want to try an ad hominem defense to protect MacT now? I'm a bad guy because I don't like MacT, so my arguments lack credibility?

No, it just helps to provide perspective on your argument. If you hate Craig MacTavish, that sort of makes you a little bias.

I would love it oif the Oilers were up 3 games to zero with home ice adv in the 1st round. Unrealistic expectation, sure, but it would make me happy. If they got better, cool. If they stayed even that would not be a great sign, considering that they are a young team with 1st overall picks playing in their 4th, 3rd and 2nd years in the nhl. But what if they got worse Jimmi, as in way worse? What did you see with your own eyes Jimmi?

I saw a team who's goaltenders failed them and submarined the entire season at the start. I would love for all the kids to lead the team to the promised land, but you know, they aren't even 23 yet, it does actually take some time, even for them

When I watched the games the Oilers stunk, bigtime.

Me too, though I suspect I saw many things you didn't as you weren't looking for anything other then what helps to "justify" your hatred of Craig MacTavish

There are mounds of evidence for the team in general and the players individually being much worse under Eakins/MacT than under Krueger/Tambi. The replacement skaters: $3.25M Ference/Eakins vs $3.5M Smid/Krueger. Players under both coaches: Petry/Krueger vs Petry/Eakins. I could go on and on.

There really isn't it was just a bad season, and several players struggled. And I've kept trying to explain to you, and you continue to ignore this, the shortened season was a mirage. Toronto and Ottawa were playoff teams in a shortened season, MIRAGE. Bad teams didn't have enough time to be fully exposed.

Show me one modicum of progress Jimmi.

Ben ****ing Scrivens, Taylor ****ING Hall.

If you had to talk to Katzie and save MacT's job what could you really say?

If I had to talk to Mr Katz about Craig MacTavish's job, there are larger issues. Also I would probably avoid being so arrogantly disrespectful.

No ******** either, it has to be good.

What are you talking about, I don't run the team, I don't own the team, If the Owner were to consult with me, there would be Larger Problems.

Oi'll Say, you Hate Craig MacTavish, you hate him with the passion and fervor of someone who has a personal vendetta. It's as if Craig MacTavish did something personally to you or your family. He didn't. He played in the NHL, he coached in the NHL and now he's a GM in the NHL.

What boggles my mind is what could bring someone to such a ridiculous point of utter rage and hatred over something They VOLUNTARILY express interest in and have ABSOLUTELY NO CONTROL over.

The reality is you probably need to stop watching this team, this game, because it's Plainly obvious to me, and probably many others, that you simple don't enjoy it now. There's nothing here for you but this need to express and justify hatred, and I can't ****ing understand that for the life of me.

It's only hockey Oi'll Say, that's it.

 

[Oi'll say!]

No, it just helps to provide perspective on your argument. If you hate Craig MacTavish, that sort of makes you a little bias.

biased jimmi

I saw a team who's goaltenders failed them and submarined the entire season at the start. I would love for all the kids to lead the team to the promised land, but you know, they aren't even 23 yet, it does actually take some time, even for them

blame the goalie for the whole season. Great defender of MacT. If DDs 120 games of .917 were just a fluke and MacT knew it he should have traded DD for more than a 32 yr old checker. FYI, the teams last twelve games were just as bad as the first twelve, and scrivens wasn't better this yr than DD was the last 3 yrs. DD was more consistent and scrivens had some more spectacular games.

Me too, though I suspect I saw many things you didn't as you weren't looking for anything other then what helps to "justify" your hatred of Craig MacTavish

i don't care what you suspect jimmi. Add some substance aside from just agreeing the Oilers sucked.

There really isn't it was just a bad season, and several players struggled. And I've kept trying to explain to you, and you continue to ignore this, the shortened season was a mirage. Toronto and Ottawa were playoff teams in a shortened season, MIRAGE. Bad teams didn't have enough time to be fully exposed.

i wanna play nice but there's not much to say aside from "this is just a dumb comment".

Ben ****ing Scrivens, Taylor ****ING Hall.

ben 72 career gp scrivens, with 6 games of .860 or worse games in only 21 played here.

Taylor "I just matched my last seasons pace, is this season a mirage too" Hall.

If I had to talk to Mr Katz about Craig MacTavish's job, there are larger issues. Also I would probably avoid being so arrogantly disrespectful.

Ya got nothin. No surprises there

What are you talking about, I don't run the team, I don't own the team, If the Owner were to consult with me, there would be Larger Problems.

right again. Wait, when was the first time? Musta been in another thread.

Oi'll Say, you Hate Craig MacTavish, you hate him with the passion and fervor of someone who has a personal vendetta. It's as if Craig MacTavish did something personally to you or your family. He didn't. He played in the NHL, he coached in the NHL and now he's a GM in the NHL.

What boggles my mind is what could bring someone to such a ridiculous point of utter rage and hatred over something They VOLUNTARILY express interest in and have ABSOLUTELY NO CONTROL over.

I cited plenty of things MacT did wrong, you have nothing of substance aside from the fact that I don't like MacT. You lose.

The reality is you probably need to stop watching this team, this game, because it's Plainly obvious to me, and probably many others, that you simple don't enjoy it now. There's nothing here for you but this need to express and justify hatred, and I can't ****ing understand that for the life of me.

the only oilers fans who enjoyed this season watched the games with nipple clamps on. Get your parents to change the obscenity filter off and then google that. You'll never come to this site again or waste any more time on the oilers

It's only hockey Oi'll Say, that's it.

deep.

 

[KlimasLoveChild]

Hiring Eakins for 4 years at $4M seems like it would be good enough, rating his season a success even better, stating that our developmental system is the best in the league is another. If he honestly believes that **** he needs to go.

I don't think anyone is happy with Eakins and he is likely on a short leash for next year. I don't recall Mact stating this year was a success. He pointed out a few positives but he had already decided to stick with Eakins for next year. I don't expect a guy to give the coach a vote of confidence then **** on what the team has been doing all year. They definitely aren't going to get out of this by being negative about everything.

If it wasn't solely on MacT's shoulders then can we at least agree that it was primarily his fault?

There are some decent players there, but you could make a strong case that in all the years of MacT/KLo we didn't develop enough elite talent and someone should be held accountable. KLo stayed, MacT was let go, how can they both be here again?

They should both be gone, no doubt, but MacT is alrerady screwing up and refusing to admit it. Just like old times with JFJ and MAP.

I can't agree it was primarily MacTs fault. You can't make chicken soup out of chicken ****. Who are these elite talents he was supposed to have helped reach their potential? Pouliot, Jacques, Shremp,Nilson,not to mention the handful of terrible 1st round selections.....Scotty Bowman couldn't have turned these guys into players. Blaming this on MacT is ridiculous. If anything it should be on ownership for not putting money into a development system and scouting for just sucking.

Gagner was the 15th highest scoring center in the nhl the year b4, MacT had no choice there.

As for Eakins, the coaching here right now, with all of these valuable draft picks still on the steep curve of their developmental stage, is taking over from scouting as the key role in the organization. There's zero room to screw up.

It's one thing to make a mistake and it's another to throw good money after bad. This one flaw can do massive damage to the org and MacT is letting his false pride make all the decisions.

What's wrong with Gagner?

Did he come back too early? The team was wallowing in defeat and the season was almost over 15 games in.

Did he not play well enough with the full cage on? -10 and one assist in 7 games.

Did he not play well enough after his fiirst 20 games back? Let's try and think of some of the reasons why this might have happened b4 we just hate on a 24 yr old with 300 career points. People lose weight when they have their jaw wired shut. People can't see the puck the same with a jaw protector on. Most of the team got worse under Eakins. There wasn't much to play for because the playoffs were out of reach.

Last season he had points in 25 of his first 29 games or something like that. He needs to be handleded like a valuable asset, not someone who disappointed you personally when he came back from a serious injury.

Duby became an ahl backup overnight, under the tutelage of Eakins and MacT. That's pretty bad considering he had a .917 sv% over his last 120 games. I know you want to believe that's all on him, ditto for Smid and half a dozen other Oilers.

Should we just keep on ditching players who got worse under MacT and Eakins? Does that make a lot of sense to you? At what point do you take a look around?

I think DD was a hefty asset at the beginning of the season and that MacT is responsible for getting almost nothing when he left three months later. MacT hired the coach that made the first 30 games of the season a disaster for so many players.

Hmmm.....interesting segment. You seem to be expert at picking out faults in management yet completely oblivious to the numerous warts on "your guys" players like Duby, Gagner and Smid. If MacT could make Duby stop pucks, Gagner play defense, and Smid do anything but get in the way and act tough I'm sure he would have. The majority of these flaws are on the player and previous management for putting them in over their heads.
MacT is trying to sort things out but it takes time. I hated the Gagner contract and many on here were calling to trade him while his value was high. I give MacT a mulligan on this one simply because he was only a few months on the job. I wouldn't be surprised if he was depending on people who had been with the organization to gauge Gagners worth to the team. It could be a good part of the reason Olczyk is gone from the organization too, he probably had a good part of the say in these terrible contracts being negotiated.

Or to start on a different note, just disregard everything else and look at how poorly this team played at the end of the season - with his coach and his acquisitions settled neatly into the fold.

Look how we lost Belov simply because of the coach he hired who made so many players worse at the beginning of the season. MacT apologists will cry "Belov sucked". He sucked his way onto the Russian Oly team and by coincidence, the Oilers whole blueline sucked. They were all much worse than last year. They allowed the most goals in the league this season and at the end with all MacT's players here and adapted to the coach's new system they were worse than ever.

I could go on and on.

Some folks like to think that none of the bad things this season had anything to do with MacT, he's the teflon don right now.

So let's just carry on next season as if this season was a success, and like it was showing signs of improvement. If we can trade away enough bad players things should keep getting better right? Oh wait, they aren't. Only the welfare draft makes this team any better.

They were 9-10-2 the last month and a half of the season. Kinda looks like an improvement for the "record is all that matters" crowd. I won't say they were great but they had some of their better games towards the end of the year. It's not like they were 2 and 18 and Mact was saying things are peachy. They realize they need to fill alot of holes. It just a matter of getting it done and it's not quite as easy as the weekend warriors seem to think it is.

I don't think anyone is giving MacT an A grade for his first year. You on the other hand are pretty extreme by giving him an F grade. He has made mistakes but nothing to warrant being canned. I think you are clearly frustrated but canning people hasn't worked yet and they have been at it for years now.

Anyways, I guess time will tell as I don't see MacT or Eakins going anywhere soon. Maybe if season ticket sales go bad Lowe will agree to sacrifice himself for show, only to be brought back if they happen to start winning.

 

[missinthejets]

I don't blame MacT for not developing MAP, I blame MacT for wasting so much time on him and JFJ.

It was obvious to most Oiler fans that he added nothing to the game. Not good offensively, defensively, not tough, not anything. Just ok at best in some ways.

So which other players do you think they should have spent time on? Are you forgetting how crappy their drafting was back then and how few picks they were keeping? How much of a disorganized mess the farm system was? A lot of what you're blaming Mctavish for is really the fault of the GM at the time. Lots of players did develop with MCtavish coaching. Hemsky, Stoll, Horcoff, Pisani, Gilbert... plenty more, but because none of them turned into top teir players is that the coaches fault? Or was he just doing the best with what he was given?

 

[Nunymare]

ben 72 career gp scrivens, with 6 games of .860 or worse games in only 21 played here.

Taylor "I just matched my last seasons pace, is this season a mirage too" Hall.

Give it a rest. Seriously if you always think this way then I would seriously just take a break from the team. Nobody is forcing you to watch.

 

[Oi'll say!]

I don't think anyone is happy with Eakins and he is likely on a short leash for next year. I don't recall Mact stating this year was a success. He pointed out a few positives but he had already decided to stick with Eakins for next year. I don't expect a guy to give the coach a vote of confidence then **** on what the team has been doing all year. They definitely aren't going to get out of this by being negative about everything.

A short leash for Eakins next year is too much. There's not even one facet of the team's play, development, outlook, what have you that says Eakins was successful. There are plenty of red flags. Do we want to compare lists? Let's be real, I've made enough lists. You make a list of things you liked about Eakins, or realistic reasons why our 1st overalls should be subjected to his madness again.

I can't agree it was primarily MacTs fault. You can't make chicken soup out of chicken ****. Who are these elite talents he was supposed to have helped reach their potential? Pouliot, Jacques, Shremp,Nilson,not to mention the handful of terrible 1st round selections.....Scotty Bowman couldn't have turned these guys into players. Blaming this on MacT is ridiculous. If anything it should be on ownership for not putting money into a development system and scouting for just sucking.

MacT made some bold moves by 1) firing Krueger and 2) hiring Eakins.

Huge mistake. The team was competitive under Krueger, they were "in" most of the games that they lost last season. The team was a joke under Eakins. Lopsided loss after lopsided loss, long goalless droughts, games on the sked you just knew they had no hope of winning b4 they even started. Did they surprise us at all last year? And I don't mean Scrivens on occasion.

Hmmm.....interesting segment. You seem to be expert at picking out faults in management yet completely oblivious to the numerous warts on "your guys" players like Duby, Gagner and Smid. If MacT could make Duby stop pucks, Gagner play defense, and Smid do anything but get in the way and act tough I'm sure he would have. The majority of these flaws are on the player and previous management for putting them in over their heads.
MacT is trying to sort things out but it takes time. I hated the Gagner contract and many on here were calling to trade him while his value was high. I give MacT a mulligan on this one simply because he was only a few months on the job. I wouldn't be surprised if he was depending on people who had been with the organization to gauge Gagners worth to the team. It could be a good part of the reason Olczyk is gone from the organization too, he probably had a good part of the say in these terrible contracts being negotiated.

This is a straw man argument. Utter garbage.

I never said Smid was a Norris candidate, Gagner was a Selke candidate, DD was a vezina candidate. Are you ****ing for real?

They were 9-10-2 the last month and a half of the season. Kinda looks like an improvement for the "record is all that matters" crowd. I won't say they were great but they had some of their better games towards the end of the year. It's not like they were 2 and 18 and Mact was saying things are peachy. They realize they need to fill alot of holes. It just a matter of getting it done and it's not quite as easy as the weekend warriors seem to think it is.

If you really look at those 9 games, at least 4 of them were won singlehandedly by the goalies. Of the ten games they lost, they were hardly even involved in any of them. The harsh reality is that they played like a 5-14-2 team.

I don't think anyone is giving MacT an A grade for his first year. You on the other hand are pretty extreme by giving him an F grade. He has made mistakes but nothing to warrant being canned. I think you are clearly frustrated but canning people hasn't worked yet and they have been at it for years now.

The only way I can't see him being canned is if he had the brains/balls to fire Eakins. It was a disastrous move and if you look up and down the roster it's just far too common for Oilers to have completely regressed last season. If it was a two-way street, and some Oilers had gotten better that would be something, but noone got any better. Hall matched his last season's pace, that's as close as anyone came to having a good season.

Anyways, I guess time will tell as I don't see MacT or Eakins going anywhere soon. Maybe if season ticket sales go bad Lowe will agree to sacrifice himself for show, only to be brought back if they happen to start winning.

Time will tell, or time is against our developing players?

 

[Oi'll say!]

So which other players do you think they should have spent time on? Are you forgetting how crappy their drafting was back then and how few picks they were keeping? How much of a disorganized mess the farm system was? A lot of what you're blaming Mctavish for is really the fault of the GM at the time. Lots of players did develop with MCtavish coaching. Hemsky, Stoll, Horcoff, Pisani, Gilbert... plenty more, but because none of them turned into top teir players is that the coaches fault? Or was he just doing the best with what he was given?

If you look back at the Oilers drafting/development it's actually impossible for the Oilers to have such a ****** record. Monkeys with a copy of THN literally couldn't have done worse drafting if they were forced to pick within 10 spots of the BPA.

How many times did you see MacT pick a favorite and just give them opportunity after opportunity no matter how bad they were and just forget about everybody else?

Right now Eakins is his favorite and he completely refuses to consider that there's an underlying reason why so many players got so much worse overnight. We're running out of players to trade away to make Eakins look good.

Name me 2 players with more than 80 gp whose stock went up this season? Marincin and Klefbom are still the products of Nelson's tutelage. The effect that Eakins has on their game is just beginning to be seen.

Just 2.

 

[Klimando Kostani]

If you look back at the Oilers drafting/development it's actually impossible for the Oilers to have such a ****** record. Monkeys with a copy of THN literally couldn't have done worse drafting if they were forced to pick within 10 spots of the BPA.

How many times did you see MacT pick a favorite and just give them opportunity after opportunity no matter how bad they were and just forget about everybody else?

Right now Eakins is his favorite and he completely refuses to consider that there's an underlying reason why so many players got so much worse overnight. We're running out of players to trade away to make Eakins look good.

Name me 2 players with more than 80 gp whose stock went up this season? Marincin and Klefbom are still the products of Nelson's tutelage. The effect that Eakins has on their game is just beginning to be seen.

Just 2.

Didn't Perron just have a career year?

 

[Dorian2]

Hooboy!

 

[KlimasLoveChild]

A short leash for Eakins next year is too much. There's not even one facet of the team's play, development, outlook, what have you that says Eakins was successful. There are plenty of red flags. Do we want to compare lists? Let's be real, I've made enough lists. You make a list of things you liked about Eakins, or realistic reasons why our 1st overalls should be subjected to his madness again.

MacT made some bold moves by 1) firing Krueger and 2) hiring Eakins.

Huge mistake. The team was competitive under Krueger, they were "in" most of the games that they lost last season. The team was a joke under Eakins. Lopsided loss after lopsided loss, long goalless droughts, games on the sked you just knew they had no hope of winning b4 they even started. Did they surprise us at all last year? And I don't mean Scrivens on occasion.



This is a straw man argument. Utter garbage.

I never said Smid was a Norris candidate, Gagner was a Selke candidate, DD was a vezina candidate. Are you ****ing for real?



If you really look at those 9 games, at least 4 of them were won singlehandedly by the goalies. Of the ten games they lost, they were hardly even involved in any of them. The harsh reality is that they played like a 5-14-2 team.

The only way I can't see him being canned is if he had the brains/balls to fire Eakins. It was a disastrous move and if you look up and down the roster it's just far too common for Oilers to have completely regressed last season. If it was a two-way street, and some Oilers had gotten better that would be something, but noone got any better. Hall matched his last season's pace, that's as close as anyone came to having a good season.



Time will tell, or time is against our developing players?

Wow..where to start.....haha...always good for some yucks!!! I especially like being accused of the using the old straw man arguement, then have you turn around and use it in your own defense. Classic move.. The grand master himself. Hypocrite.

You are constantly talking in absolutes which makes you look ridiculous. I point out the obvious with some facts and you simply don't respond to the point or go off on a tangent with some bizarre response to the great gazoo. I don't know man....

It's pretty clear you want to blow everything up. I'm somewhere in between. I like MacT but could care less about Eakins,Lowe, Buchberger or Smith. I want them to hang onto the coach just to end the revolving door of coaches. I do think he definitely needs some experienced help for next season.

I'd be interested in what you would want to see happen. The people that want to blow it up never seem to have any of the answers. If we blow up management then what? Who would you like to see in charge? For the love of god please don't have you taking over as General Manager

 

[Playa Hejda]

Didn't Perron just have a career year?

That's 1.

 

[iCanada]

That's 1.

... Taylor Hall anyone?

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

... Taylor Hall anyone?

Apparently doesn't count, neither does Scrivens.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

That's 1.

So I get there's some pointless "case building" going on, but the team missed the playoffs, and would have likely done so even with NHL level goaltending All season, not just after Dubnyk and the like were correctly punted out of town for sinking the season just as it began.

My point though, this team wasn't a playoff team and wasn't very good, but they should have a bunch of guys who had "Career Years"? Usually when a bunch of guys have "Career Years" more good comes out it, see the number of players who had "Career Years" in 2005-06 and what result that had for the Oilers (after they got NHL goaltending)

 

[Beerfish]

Career years only include points and goals? Hmmmm

Hall also had a career high in minus and a career low in game winning goals.

Perron had a career high in minus and a tie for career low in game winning goals.

Without looking it up I bet that Hall also had a career high in giveaways and Perron had a career high in minor penalties of a stupid nature.

 

[Hugo McStiglitz]

Career years only include points and goals? Hmmmm

Hall also had a career high in minus and a career low in game winning goals.

Perron had a career high in minus and a tie for career low in game winning goals.

Without looking it up I bet that Hall also had a career high in giveaways and Perron had a career high in minor penalties of a stupid nature.

Perron still drew more penalties than he took, so it's a net win. Also, have you looked at the league leaders in giveaways? Karlsson, Doughty, Thornton, Kessel, Trouba, Subban are all in the top 10. Gonna crap on them too?

 

[Beerfish]

Perron still drew more penalties than he took, so it's a net win. Also, have you looked at the league leaders in giveaways? Karlsson, Doughty, Thornton, Kessel, Trouba, Subban are all in the top 10. Gonna crap on them too?

A net win, did you actually watch the kind of penalties Perron took in the 2nd half of the season? Most of them in the offensive zone, most of them of the hooking and tripping and such variety which had zero to do with him drawing penalties.

Hall was 2nd in the league in giveaways, if you simply want to dismiss that stat that is your business. He had 30 more giveways than our next highest forward.

If people want to trumpet career years as some kind of justification that the coaching was doing a good job and not look at the whole picture they are welcome to it. There is a reason that despite all these wonderful career years the team sucked badly right?

 

[Hugo McStiglitz]

A net win, did you actually watch the kind of penalties Perron took in the 2nd half of the season? Most of them in the offensive zone, most of them of the hooking and tripping and such variety which had zero to do with him drawing penalties.

Hall was 2nd in the league in giveaways, if you simply want to dismiss that stat that is your business. He had 30 more giveways than our next highest forward.

If people want to trumpet career years as some kind of justification that the coaching was doing a good job and not look at the whole picture they are welcome to it. There is a reason that despite all these wonderful career years the team sucked badly right?

Yeah, Perron has taken some bad penalties no doubt, but playing the kind of game he plays, he's gonna develop a reputation with refs around the league. Doesn't change the fact that he drew more penalties than he took.

I'm not dismissing giveaways at all. Hall has made some boneheaded plays that resulted in giving up the puck. But higher amounts of giveaways are a by-product of having the puck so much.

 

[missinthejets]

The problem with the people who are loudest about how "everything is terrible just look at the results" are doing the absolute easiest thing to do in the world. There is no critical thought put into anything because it's too easy to say "It's all terrible they all suck"

Not everyone sucks, a lot of things went wrong and a lot of things can be done better but to dismiss it all as terrible because of the results is incredibly narrow minded thinking and demonstrates a very clear lack of objectivity and really is an inability to see the forest for the trees.

There are positives here, yes the overall product was ****, but that doesn't mean everyone involved is a pile of ****.

 

[Nunymare]

The problem with the people who are loudest about how "everything is terrible just look at the results" are doing the absolute easiest thing to do in the world. There is no critical thought put into anything because it's too easy to say "It's all terrible they all suck"

Not everyone sucks, a lot of things went wrong and a lot of things can be done better but to dismiss it all as terrible because of the results is incredibly narrow minded thinking and demonstrates a very clear lack of objectivity and really is an inability to see the forest for the trees.

There are positives here, yes the overall product was ****, but that doesn't mean everyone involved is a pile of ****.

Exactly. Seriously. Do we really need to search for negatives for everything here? It seems like some here feel an obligation to put down anything remotely positive about this year to fulfill an agenda.