Proposal: Lucic for Tatar

[Pia8988]

They would want Lucic less. I bet they give Tatar a chance to rebound as well. Your deal does nothing for Vegas and helps the Oilers.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

It's not really a huge exchange. Tatar and Lucic are roughly the same contract EXCEPT for term, which Vegas could help the Oilers out with in exchange for futures - which, contrary to popular belief, is still an important type of asset for Vegas.

Yes but I don't think Bensen or caguila really move the meter on 10 mil over 2 years. If im vegas I keep my 10 mil... and see what tatar can do this year(they potentially will lose some players in FA)…. if he doesn't do well you can move him and its a lot easier to move tatar then lucic…. or potentially buy him out next off season.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

I'm not sure they would want Tatar, either, though.

This gives both players a fresh start of sorts.

Maybe you should try Seabrook for Lucic… that might be a talking point.

 

[Cloned]

Maybe you should try Seabrook for Lucic… that might be a talking point.

The Hawks love Seabrook to an irrational degree based on his history with the team.

 

[Cloned]

Yes but I don't think Bensen or caguila really move the meter on 10 mil over 2 years. If im vegas I keep my 10 mil... and see what tatar can do this year(they potentially will lose some players in FA)…. if he doesn't do well you can move him and its a lot easier to move tatar then lucic…. or potentially buy him out next off season.

I guess we just disagree there.

I think something like Benson + 3rd is a pretty good exchange for 10M over 2 years when 5M is only going to be like 6-7% of the cap.

 

[McSuper]

i don't think value is that far off. Lucic is going to be interesting next year. He was beyond bad last year but i still get the feeling he'll bounce back hopefully. VGK would definitely have to take a chance and i'm not sure they would given Lucic's contract.

As an Oiler fan I hope he bounce back but the way Vegas has built their team Lucic to Vegas is probably the worst fit out there . The way Lucic played he is better suited on lower lines to cycle the puck to ware down other teams . Just not sure he can make it into the other teams end before they have the puck out of their end zone .

The best Edmonton can hope for is to move Lucic for an equally bad contract that is maybe a year or 2 shorter

 

[HockeyDBspecialist]

How does Lucic even have a slight value ? At this point he is worth a 3rd MAX.

 

[Tatar Shots]

I don’t think I’ve ever seen a thread where the OP talks down the player he wants his team to trade for this much.

 

[Hammettf2b]

I don’t think I’ve ever seen a thread where the OP talks down the player he wants his team to trade for this much.

He's horrible, not worth that contract at all. TRADE HIM TO US!!! lol

 

[ScoreZeGoals]

Easy No from Vegas

 

[Cloned]

I don’t think I’ve ever seen a thread where the OP talks down the player he wants his team to trade for this much.

Because I understand that we're not trying to trade for a positive value player? This is a negative value for negative value trade.

Two declining forwards on bad contracts.

 

[Oddbob]

You realize he's been healthy scratched throughout a significant portion of these playoffs, right? Again, it's like saying the Oilers should ask for Kessel if they trade Larsson.

You realize that Lucic is a Big Dumb Ox, with an even bigger, Big Dumb Ox contract, right? Maybe the Oilers should throw him overboard, then at least they have an anchor!

 

[go4hockey]

It's not really a huge exchange. Tatar and Lucic are roughly the same contract EXCEPT for term, which Vegas could help the Oilers out with in exchange for futures - which, contrary to popular belief, is still an important type of asset for Vegas.

Your right, they could help the Oilers out in exchange for some extra added futures. The thing is those futures are going to have to be much nicer ones than the junk you have suggested as teams in a very competitive NHL are not looking to “help out” the other teams especially teams in their own division.

 

[Tatar Shots]

Because I understand that we're not trying to trade for a positive value player? This is a negative value for negative value trade.

Two declining forwards on bad contracts.

McDavid is positive value, William Karlsson is positive value. Positive value for positive value. See how silly that is?

 

[Cloned]

McDavid is positive value, William Karlsson is positive value. Positive value for positive value. See how silly that is?

I can compare Lucic and Tatar directly over the last 3 seasons and draw a reasonable conclusion that they provide similar offense at similar cap hits.

Can you compare McDavid and Karlsson over the last 3 seasons and draw that same conclusion?

 

[Cloned]

Your right, they could help the Oilers out in exchange for some extra added futures. The thing is those futures are going to have to be much nicer ones than the junk you have suggested as teams in a very competitive NHL are not looking to “help out” the other teams especially teams in their own division.

The difference between Lucic and Tatar isn't THAT significant, even with term considered. Certainly not significant enough to warrant adding a first round pick.

2nd round pick, maybe. I'd consider that.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

The difference between Lucic and Tatar isn't THAT significant, even with term considered. Certainly not significant enough to warrant adding a first round pick.

2nd round pick, maybe. I'd consider that.

Its pretty different actually... and the fact that you don't see that is pretty funny.

 

[Cloned]

Its pretty different actually... and the fact that you don't see that is pretty funny.

OK, what's the value of that difference IYO?

Let's change the debate.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

OK, what's the value of that difference IYO?

Let's change the debate.

Weve already said it a few times

Tatars game is better suited to come back around in todays NHL... he still had 20+ goals last season... he just didn't work out well in vegas…. but I think there are plenty of teams that would willingly still move on tatar… his contract is fine for what he is 5.3 for 20+20 is not terrible... and honestly if vegas decided they want to move tatar… why not just retain 1 mil on him and trade him at 4.3... then he looks really good to a lot of teams. And worse case he can be bought out in the near future and not impact much, as worst case scenario... because he only has 3 more seasons left.

From a ducks perspective, id easily trade a 1st for tatar with 1 mil retained.

Lucic even with 1 mil retention is still a 10 goal scorer, at 5 mil a season... that's pretty rough his game doesn't translate well to the direction of the NHL … and hes signed for another 5 years.... that's rough... realistically not a buy out candidate... he also had a chance to play with some of the best centers in the league and that didn't help... I doubt youll find many teams that will take a risk on a guy like lucic w/o getting something pretty shiny attached to it, with that much term left on the contract. Maybe if lucic had 3 years left it would be workable but 5 years is a long investment.

Like I said I could potentially see something around lucic/Seabrook being an option.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

OK, what's the value of that difference IYO?

Let's change the debate.

Essentially the tatar contract can be saved/valued w/ retention... you can still move him and bring back a 1st, Lucic w/retention isn't improving the idea of having lucic for 5 years..


and you can talk about the cap going up that it wont be impactful.... but 5 mil wasted cap space on lucic for barley anything in return is pretty awful asset management. That could be money to pursue guys like Karlsson/Tavares/doughty etc any other big name free agents that come on... or you know resigning guys like perron/neal/nosek/karlsson/sbisa/miller/theodore

 

[Cloned]

Weve already said it a few times

Tatars game is better suited to come back around in todays NHL... he still had 20+ goals last season... he just didn't work out well in vegas…. but I think there are plenty of teams that would willingly still move on tatar… his contract is fine for what he is 5.3 for 20+20 is not terrible... and honestly if vegas decided they want to move tatar… why not just retain 1 mil on him and trade him at 4.3... then he looks really good to a lot of teams. And worse case he can be bought out in the near future and not impact much, as worst case scenario... because he only has 3 more seasons left.

From a ducks perspective, id easily trade a 1st for tatar with 1 mil retained.

Lucic even with 1 mil retention is still a 10 goal scorer, at 5 mil a season... that's pretty rough his game doesn't translate well to the direction of the NHL … and hes signed for another 5 years.... that's rough... realistically not a buy out candidate... he also had a chance to play with some of the best centers in the league and that didn't help... I doubt youll find many teams that will take a risk on a guy like lucic w/o getting something pretty shiny attached to it, with that much term left on the contract. Maybe if lucic had 3 years left it would be workable but 5 years is a long investment.

Like I said I could potentially see something around lucic/Seabrook being an option.

You'd trade your 1st for Tatar? Can you trade your 2nd for Lucic?

5.3 for 40 points isn't good. Keep in mind what Florida "got" for Reilly Smith at 4M for 37 points after a 50 point year the season before. Now Smith rebounded, but his value after that 37 point season wasn't good.

Not that Lucic is good either. But let's not pretend Tatar is leaps and bounds better value-wise.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

You'd trade your 1st for Tatar? Can you trade your 2nd for Lucic?

5.3 for 40 points isn't good. Keep in mind what Florida did with Reilly Smith at 4M for 37 points after a 50 point year the season before.

Not that Lucic is good either. But let's not pretend Tatar is leaps and bounds better value-wise.

Retention was included,
I said tatar at 4.3 for 3 years isn't so bad... hes 27... and a skill player he can def rebound in the right situation and if he doesn't... you can potentially buy him out next year and not get screwed.

You don't have any of those luxuries with lucic… because his contract is 5 years. and his game doesn't easily translate to todays nhl.

 

[Cloned]

Retention was included,
I said tatar at 4.3 for 3 years isn't so bad... hes 27... and a skill player he can def rebound in the right situation and if he doesn't... you can potentially buy him out next year and not get screwed.

You don't have any of those luxuries with lucic… because his contract is 5 years. and his game doesn't easily translate to todays nhl.

Fair enough.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Fair enough.

I also don't know if tatar has a NTC/NMC... but lucic does and with another potential expansion draft... that is dangerous you can at least buy out tatar.

 

[Cloned]

I also don't know if tatar has a NTC/NMC... but lucic does and with another potential expansion draft... that is dangerous you can at least buy out tatar.

I believe he has a NTC.