Looking back were these Tim Leiweke comments what lead to Phil Kessel being traded?

[moon111]

After the fact, I see Kessel in a Pen's shirt... looking good. He's training with Gary Roberts, etc. Seems the only time he doesn't get complacent is when he's embarrassed by Ovechkin or Leaf's nation. He'll do good based more on that fact he has something to prove then he will that he's playing with Crosby or Malkin. But left in Toronto, he showed he didn't care and would of continued this.

 

[Daisy Jane]

Now that kind of reasoning I dont understand? He might not be part of the current Leafs or our future. But he is part of our most recent history and have been part of two of the clubs biggest ever trades so there is a lot of reasons to discuss him on our board.

well not really. most of that stuff generally gets shunted right to Across the League. Not a Leaf, not Leaf Board material. Same with Burke (or should be anyway).

Plus. it always goes into the whole thing

1/2 people don't like him
1/2 people will defend him
some people will go but he had this
some people will go NOOOOOO that's not true.

like. to me. there's nothing more to discuss. he was here, he scored goals, now he's gone.

 

[Durrr]

He didn't lead, he was followed.

Pretty much sums up how brutal this thread is.

 

[johnny_rudeboy]

well not really. most of that stuff generally gets shunted right to Across the League. Not a Leaf, not Leaf Board material. Same with Burke (or should be anyway).

Plus. it always goes into the whole thing

1/2 people don't like him
1/2 people will defend him
some people will go but he had this
some people will go NOOOOOO that's not true.

like. to me. there's nothing more to discuss. he was here, he scored goals, now he's gone.

Hi

We discuss ex-Leafs all the time. Nothing different with Kessel from that POV. I do agree with you on what direction the discussions always take.

 

[Durrr]

After the fact, I see Kessel in a Pen's shirt... looking good. He's training with Gary Roberts, etc. Seems the only time he doesn't get complacent is when he's embarrassed by Ovechkin or Leaf's nation. He'll do good based more on that fact he has something to prove then he will that he's playing with Crosby or Malkin. But left in Toronto, he showed he didn't care and would of continued this.

You know he signed up for Robert's camp while still a Leaf right?

A lot of people like to pretend it's the media that's a circus, but I swear the fan base eats it up like candy. Half the fans have been repeating the same nonsense for so long that they actually think it's fact now.

 

[Daisy Jane]

Hi

We discuss ex-Leafs all the time. Nothing different with Kessel from that POV. I do agree with you on what direction the discussions always take.

yeah maybe. i'm just tired of this particular one. i should just ignore the thread.

You know he signed up for Robert's camp while still a Leaf right?

A lot of people like to pretend it's the media that's a circus, but I swear the fan base eats it up like candy. Half the fans have been repeating the same nonsense for so long that they actually think it's fact now.

actually, he only made contact with Roberts as last reported (when he was a leaf). that's what i remember, but i could be wrong, i easily could be.

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

I'm not sure why anyone put much stock in anything Leiweke had to say about anything? It took 16 years for his organization to win more than a single playoff round. He always was and continues to be Richard Peddie. That's what he does well.

 

[Warden of the North]

There is zero reason to believe that Phil had any sort of a problem with his teammates. In fact they really seemed to like him. By all accounts he loved playing in Toronto.

 

[colchar]

Now I do think someone like Ron Wilson should not be taken to seriously considering he waited almost 3 years after being fired to mention what he thinks, only after Kessel was getting bashed in the media after Carlyle was fired.

So the fact that he waited means he isn't credible

 

[Ovate]

Looking at the return we got for Phil, you've got to think management knows something we don't. It certainly wasn't his on ice performance that got him traded, and the return we got shows he was someone who needed to be moved.

Maybe he was behind salutegate and that pissed Shanny off. Maybe he didn't have good relations with his teammates. Maybe Shanny knew Stamkos will sign next year, and they needed to clear cap space. We'll never know for sure.

 

[pcruz]

Can anyone imagine if we had Patrick Kane or Evander Kane or Tyler Seguin?

We have people creating theories and storylines in regards to a player based on beliefs that are not only unsubstantiated, but all evidence to the contrary.

What would this city be like if we had a guy charged with assaulting taxi drivers and accused of rape?

How about the real issues surrounding Evander Kane, the "money phone", the altercations with other teammates, etc?

How about the genius comments that Tyler made just after being traded to Dallas, the quote from Full Metal Jacket?

We had a guy who never created any sort of bad image of himself (never created a good image either, or even a neutral one for that matter), never got himself into any sort of trouble with the law or on social media. He had all the excuses that these other guys have been attributed - Young, single guy, filthy rich, living away from his parents, etc!!!

Instead, we had a guy who for all intents and purposes appeared to be a humble, quiet and introverted person who enjoyed his time away from the game like the old greats did - away from the game!

As for the topic at hand, anyone who even takes anything Tim says with any sort of respect or acknowledgement deserves a swift and steadying slap back to reality.

Here is a guy who wanted to come in, take down all the old photos from the stadium because they represented the past, and started off his tenure by drawing up the Stanley Cup Parade Route!

Very shortly afterwards, he tried to step down from his position. How long ago was he supposed to have left MLSE? Where has he been over the last 9 months? Who is the CEO of MLSE and how come we haven't heard the announcement of Tim's replacement? Oh that's right, he hasn't left, but he hasn't made any public appearances either. Does he even come to visit Toronto anymore, or does he spend all his time in California with his wife?

Why would anyone take that guy's comments in regards to character and put any stock in them? I don't go to Stalin to get his humanitarian views, nor do I go to Wall Street to ask for advice on the best ways to implement a pure Socialist society and economy.

 

[New Liskeard]

There is zero reason to believe that Phil had any sort of a problem with his teammates. In fact they really seemed to like him. By all accounts he loved playing in Toronto.

As with many posters here, they will find anything to support their bias and dislike towards a certain individual, even if it includes false claims. He was a talented player to watch and I wish him well. Don't be surprised if he scores 500 goals in his career before it is all said and done; and see what other career NHLers that would put Phil with in the same category.

 

[Durrr]

As with many posters here, they will find anything to support their bias and dislike towards a certain individual, even if it includes false claims. He was a talented player to watch and I wish him well. Don't be surprised if he scores 500 goals in his career before it is all said and done; and see what other career NHLers that would put Phil with in the same category.

This exactly. People keep repeating the same crap so often that they actually pass it off as fast.

The problem with this team was management, and always was.

 

[pcruz]

As with many posters here, they will find anything to support their bias and dislike towards a certain individual, even if it includes false claims. He was a talented player to watch and I wish him well. Don't be surprised if he scores 500 goals in his career before it is all said and done; and see what other career NHLers that would put Phil with in the same category.

This exactly. People keep repeating the same crap so often that they actually pass it off as fast.

The problem with this team was management, and always was.

You can't make the argument that Kessel wasn't part of the problem in Toronto. However small a part could be attributed to him is debatable, but he was a part of the organization and therefore he has some blood on his hands.

The thing is, the rest of the organization has nearly all of the blood on their hands. If any of the rest of the organization did their jobs even to half the degree Kessel did his, this would have been a contender perennially!

There was no talent around this guy.
There was no defensive ability on this team.
The coaching staff couldn't maximize the effectiveness of the team (except maybe Carlyle if we take the nose-dive after his firing as any indication).
The management couldn't get any sort of high-end talent onto this team. The biggest splash after bringing in Kessel was Dion and then JvR. After that was Clarkson.....think of that for a second.

One could argue that the only guy(s) who maximized their duties to the extent that Kessel did while he was here, were Orr and McClaren.

The guy's job was to come into a "decent" team, create scoring chances, generate offense, score goals and put on a show. He did all of those things in spades without any semblance of help.

If you expected him to come in here and turn into Jere Lehtinen, then you're the fool.

 

[LeafsNation75]

So the fact that he waited means he isn't credible

I think he was an opportunist to keep bashing Phil after Carlyle getting fired and those questions from Dave Feschuk asking if he was a coach killer. Why not come out and say all that after the Leafs fired him in March 2012?

 

[Durrr]

You can't make the argument that Kessel wasn't part of the problem in Toronto. However small a part could be attributed to him is debatable, but he was a part of the organization and therefore he has some blood on his hands.

The thing is, the rest of the organization has nearly all of the blood on their hands. If any of the rest of the organization did their jobs even to half the degree Kessel did his, this would have been a contender perennially!

There was no talent around this guy.
There was no defensive ability on this team.
The coaching staff couldn't maximize the effectiveness of the team (except maybe Carlyle if we take the nose-dive after his firing as any indication).
The management couldn't get any sort of high-end talent onto this team. The biggest splash after bringing in Kessel was Dion and then JvR. After that was Clarkson.....think of that for a second.

One could argue that the only guy(s) who maximized their duties to the extent that Kessel did while he was here, were Orr and McClaren.

The guy's job was to come into a "decent" team, create scoring chances, generate offense, score goals and put on a show. He did all of those things in spades without any semblance of help.

If you expected him to come in here and turn into Jere Lehtinen, then you're the fool.

Of course Kessel deserves some blame, but the way he's talked about around here is pathetic. It was pretty brutal to watch him almost give up last season, but we all knew it was over.

I agree though, the team built around Kessel was brutal. This guys going to light it up in Pittsburgh and bring them back into contending status if they can add sufficient depth.

 

[LeafsNation75]

I'm not sure why anyone put much stock in anything Leiweke had to say about anything? It took 16 years for his organization to win more than a single playoff round. He always was and continues to be Richard Peddie. That's what he does well.

So it happens to be a coincidence that after his comments there were other reports about Kessel at least not willing to listen to Steve Spott and etc.

 

[Durrr]

So it happens to be a coincidence that after his comments there were other reports about Kessel at least not willing to listen to Steve Spott and etc.

See, more speculative nonsense.

Kessel was NEVER accused of not listening to Steve Spott. He was reported to have had a discussion with Spott where they talked about him moving to the other wing, in which Kessel said he'd prefer to remain where he was. Again, this is being reported though a writer using an un-named source.

Either way, you really don't think these kind of conversations take place all of the time in sports? Even Spott laughed the comments off, declaring he has conversations with athletes all the time.

 

[Preisst*]

Phil Kessel is a bad apple. I think even his biggest fans know this whether they admit it or not.

No surprise the Leafs had a one track mind during the off season. Dispose of Kessel no matter what, worry about everything else later.

 

[Woll Smoth]

Kessel has had rumoured character issues follow him since his university days. But yeah, bury your heads in the sand because you haven't witnessed any of these rumours yourself. Where there's smoke, there's fire.

 

[A1LeafNation]

1 Kessel is a fine personality.

2 He probably rubs people/teammates the wrong way because of his lack of defence.

3 He would be fine on a contending team...hidden.

4 Its done, management screwed up with their "plan".

5. Close thread.

 

[21ByTorML12]

I think it is likely to change as he won't be in the spotlight so much anymore. This media here has a bad habit of making a mountain out of a molehill. The hot dog scandal is a great perfect example of the Hollywood like sensationalism that goes on around here.

Hotdogs are delicious.

THIS you know steve simmonds crushes at least 4 daily.

 

[diceman934]

pathetic....unsubstantiated my rear end....funny how people will ignore the CEO, ex Coaches and former team mates. Hockey is usually a closed shop....and people do not usually talk about their team mates or ex team mates....when they do you should know they are telling the truth.

Kessel was responsible for his own actions and they were telling....he was lazy and not motivated last season.

I also laugh every time some one calls him shy....he could not wait to speak to the media when Carlyle was fired...

I hope we run him at every opportunity this season....

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

1 Kessel is a fine personality.

2 He probably rubs people/teammates the wrong way because of his lack of defence.

3 He would be fine on a contending team...hidden.

4 Its done, management screwed up with their "plan".

5. Close thread.

One trade is going to ruin the plan? I fail to see how they screwed up.

 

[RoadWarrior]

Looking at the return we got for Phil, you've got to think management knows something we don't. It certainly wasn't his on ice performance that got him traded, and the return we got shows he was someone who needed to be moved.

Maybe he was behind salutegate and that pissed Shanny off. Maybe he didn't have good relations with his teammates. Maybe Shanny knew Stamkos will sign next year, and they needed to clear cap space. We'll never know for sure.

He absolutely got traded because of his on ice performance. Phil needed a tour guide to show him his own end of the ice and his inconsistent efforts and general laziness started infecting the entire team.

Phil is incapable of leadership and Pittsburgh knows it. If Crosby wasn't there to push Kessel they wouldn't have made the trade.