Post-Game Talk: Look on the bright side, the economy is improving.
- Thread starter Boruto
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aufheben
#Norris4Fox
Patience? Teams are never as good or bad as they look. They'll be fine.
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Machinehead
GoAwayTrouba
I Eat Crow
Fear The Mullet
- Jul 9, 2007
- 19,643
- 12,716
First game I caught live of the preseason. Horrible puck luck and lack of finish hurt the team tonight. I can only really blame Hank for the second goal...the puck knuckled but he wasn't screened at all. Nothing you can do about two deflections, an impossible angle rebound, and a bad bounce off a defenseman blocking a shot in the slot. Don't fret, we're gunna smoke these guys at MSG November 30th.
This was the first game most of the opening night lineup, save Stepan, played together. Have some patience. Powe and Pyatt have no right to be playing once Callahan and Hagelin come back. I think Fast an Miller stick once everyone is healthy. Keep Asham as the spare and demote the former two guys I mentioned. At the very least, Pyatt and Powe shouldn't be playing 2nd and 3rd line minutes, respectively.
This was the first game most of the opening night lineup, save Stepan, played together. Have some patience. Powe and Pyatt have no right to be playing once Callahan and Hagelin come back. I think Fast an Miller stick once everyone is healthy. Keep Asham as the spare and demote the former two guys I mentioned. At the very least, Pyatt and Powe shouldn't be playing 2nd and 3rd line minutes, respectively.
Calad
Section 422
I agree, I thought they played mostly fine. They had a lot of good chances with poor puck luck and there were a lot of really strange goals we gave up
silverfish
got perma'd
eh, their defensive zone coverage is spotty at best so far, but hopefully that will improve. I expect the first month of the season might be rough as they continue to adapt to something new.
Lots of good things, lots of bad things, hopefully it evens out once we're no longer in the preseason
Ail
Based and Rangerspilled.
oh and I thought Richards actually played well last night, about as well as anyone else. He made several very good passes and created some chances,
The reffing also seemed weirdly biased but that's not what kept the Rangers from scoring any goals
The reffing also seemed weirdly biased but that's not what kept the Rangers from scoring any goals
Megustaelhockey
"I like hockey" in Spanish
- Apr 29, 2011
- 21,292
- 13,533
Another embarrassing loss in a game carried nationally in Canada, right? Maybe we just want people to think the Rangers are terrible...
Blue Blooded
Most people rejected his message
OK let me illustrate why I prefer Strålman over Girardi.
In a game where AV just rolled the lines and pairings giving the defence equal 5v5TOI (G: 14:03, S: 14:43) the difference in territorial play was humangous big. I'm assuming that they faced similarly difficult matchups, but considering the Canucks had last change it is actually more likely that Strålman got the more difficult matchups as Tortorella may have wanted his better players out against the "3rd pairing".
5v5 play:
In Strålman's 14:43 the Rangers outshot the Canucks 16-3, the Fenwick was 22-4, the Corsi was 27-7. No goals were scored.
In Girardi's 14:03 the Rangers outshot the Canucks 10-9, the Fenwick score was 13-14, and the Corsi was 15-16. The Canucks scored 3 goals to the Rangers 0.
While this is just a 1 game sample where the difference was quite extreme, the difference between them in Corsi per 20 minutes was 5.6 over the past season. Girardi did get tougher minutes, but not tough enough to explain a difference of that magnitude.
Strålman did cause two odd man rushes against in the 3rd, but those comes with the territory when you play the game the way he does and the benefits in offensive pressure greatly outweighs the drawbacks in a few scoring chances the other way. Both came off of failed keep-in attempts at the offensive blue-line.
I only checked the two of them because I have to hand-count that **** in the pre-season, but I'm guessing the Staal-Del Zotto pairing were somewhere in between. There is for example still a +9 shot differential remaining for the Rangers where neither Girardi nor Strålman was on the ice.
In 43 minutes of 5v5 play the Canucks had 12 SOG and 3 goals. 9 of those shots and all 3 of the goals came in the 14 minutes Girardi played 5v5.
So, to the poster who wondered whether I thought Strålman was great last night. Yes I thought he was, and I thought so before I counted up his differentials since it was pretty obvious from his on-ice play. It is not his fault that the forwards couldn't put the chances home. If he could play like this night-in night out (he won't, this game was an extreme example) he'd have an Erik Karlsson-type season.
He is calm with the puck and has the best break-out pass on the team. Del Zotto probably has the best "wow" passes, but he screws up too often for me to rank him #1. Girardi still goes for the Torts style "shoot it at the forward in the NZ so it bounces off of him into the OZ" break-out play most of the time, no wonder our possession play lacks with him on the ice.
Honestly, once I stopped believing that McD-G was a great pairing because everyone said so and started to actually watch them specifically in the games it became quite clear that they just aren't. Granted, they were not nearly as bad last year as they have been in the pre-season but I still think we need to put Girardi back with Staal or maybe with Moore.
Girardi is a fantastic PK:er and is the ideal defenceman for a 2010-11 Rangers-type team. A team that blocks shots, grinds it out, and scrapes into the playoffs only to go out in the first round. But they way the current Rangers are built, a talented team that wants to outplay the opposition on a nightly basis and actually contend for the cup, Girardi shouldn't get first pairing minutes 5v5.
In a game where AV just rolled the lines and pairings giving the defence equal 5v5TOI (G: 14:03, S: 14:43) the difference in territorial play was humangous big. I'm assuming that they faced similarly difficult matchups, but considering the Canucks had last change it is actually more likely that Strålman got the more difficult matchups as Tortorella may have wanted his better players out against the "3rd pairing".
5v5 play:
In Strålman's 14:43 the Rangers outshot the Canucks 16-3, the Fenwick was 22-4, the Corsi was 27-7. No goals were scored.
In Girardi's 14:03 the Rangers outshot the Canucks 10-9, the Fenwick score was 13-14, and the Corsi was 15-16. The Canucks scored 3 goals to the Rangers 0.
While this is just a 1 game sample where the difference was quite extreme, the difference between them in Corsi per 20 minutes was 5.6 over the past season. Girardi did get tougher minutes, but not tough enough to explain a difference of that magnitude.
Strålman did cause two odd man rushes against in the 3rd, but those comes with the territory when you play the game the way he does and the benefits in offensive pressure greatly outweighs the drawbacks in a few scoring chances the other way. Both came off of failed keep-in attempts at the offensive blue-line.
I only checked the two of them because I have to hand-count that **** in the pre-season, but I'm guessing the Staal-Del Zotto pairing were somewhere in between. There is for example still a +9 shot differential remaining for the Rangers where neither Girardi nor Strålman was on the ice.
In 43 minutes of 5v5 play the Canucks had 12 SOG and 3 goals. 9 of those shots and all 3 of the goals came in the 14 minutes Girardi played 5v5.
So, to the poster who wondered whether I thought Strålman was great last night. Yes I thought he was, and I thought so before I counted up his differentials since it was pretty obvious from his on-ice play. It is not his fault that the forwards couldn't put the chances home. If he could play like this night-in night out (he won't, this game was an extreme example) he'd have an Erik Karlsson-type season.
He is calm with the puck and has the best break-out pass on the team. Del Zotto probably has the best "wow" passes, but he screws up too often for me to rank him #1. Girardi still goes for the Torts style "shoot it at the forward in the NZ so it bounces off of him into the OZ" break-out play most of the time, no wonder our possession play lacks with him on the ice.
Honestly, once I stopped believing that McD-G was a great pairing because everyone said so and started to actually watch them specifically in the games it became quite clear that they just aren't. Granted, they were not nearly as bad last year as they have been in the pre-season but I still think we need to put Girardi back with Staal or maybe with Moore.
Girardi is a fantastic PK:er and is the ideal defenceman for a 2010-11 Rangers-type team. A team that blocks shots, grinds it out, and scrapes into the playoffs only to go out in the first round. But they way the current Rangers are built, a talented team that wants to outplay the opposition on a nightly basis and actually contend for the cup, Girardi shouldn't get first pairing minutes 5v5.
Only watched first period.
We dominated possession. We controlled the game. We attacked. I liked a lot of what we did...
In the end it was 2-0. Bad PP positioning, and interference not called.
I cant really remember the second goal off the top of my head.
Woke up to hear it was 5-0.
So now we got killed in Canada trip. Im not liking this whatsoever.
I am now thinking this:
We got what you wanted you fans! You wanted another high priced, big name, known sniper... We got Nash for ya and left behind two key role players. A team that was #1 in the East under Torts.
Torts was the issue... Well his team seemed to have no problem last night.
We attacked and played OFFENSE and RUSHED like u all wanted. We created a beautiful offense...
Yet now were losing games and by large margins.
Not happy. Worried for season. May miss playoffs.
We dominated possession. We controlled the game. We attacked. I liked a lot of what we did...
In the end it was 2-0. Bad PP positioning, and interference not called.
I cant really remember the second goal off the top of my head.
Woke up to hear it was 5-0.
So now we got killed in Canada trip. Im not liking this whatsoever.
I am now thinking this:
We got what you wanted you fans! You wanted another high priced, big name, known sniper... We got Nash for ya and left behind two key role players. A team that was #1 in the East under Torts.
Torts was the issue... Well his team seemed to have no problem last night.
We attacked and played OFFENSE and RUSHED like u all wanted. We created a beautiful offense...
Yet now were losing games and by large margins.
Not happy. Worried for season. May miss playoffs.
I think its important to keep a couple things in mind this preseason...
1.) Its Preseason
2.) Worst preseason schedule in the NHL
3.) No home preseason games
4.) No Stepan, Cally, or Hagelin for any game
5.) Besides last night every other preseason game we either had the Nash line, or the Brassard line. Meaning that we only had 1 of our top 3 lines for each preseason game.
6.) New coach, new system
Its hard to imagine with all these factors that we could have a good preseason. But I love seeing the defense step up, and even though we lost 5-0, we out shot them 2-1. I think that is the important thing to take away from this game.
1.) Its Preseason
2.) Worst preseason schedule in the NHL
3.) No home preseason games
4.) No Stepan, Cally, or Hagelin for any game
5.) Besides last night every other preseason game we either had the Nash line, or the Brassard line. Meaning that we only had 1 of our top 3 lines for each preseason game.
6.) New coach, new system
Its hard to imagine with all these factors that we could have a good preseason. But I love seeing the defense step up, and even though we lost 5-0, we out shot them 2-1. I think that is the important thing to take away from this game.
PavelBure9
Registered User
- Jul 31, 2007
- 399
- 0
We're talking about preseason. PRESEASON!!!!!!!! I don't think they played bad but the puck luck wasn't on our side.
It happens. We've had blowout wins before under torts, it has happened before.
Now if it goes on during the regular season for an extended period of time. Feel free to go crazy. But not yet, it's too early to get caught up in. The Rangers have a solid team, we need to see more then just the preseason with out arguably their best line last year.
Yes, thats what we all wanted. Sather sat down, read all our posts on HF and did the Nash trade and Torts firing accordingly.
These are things that Sather and crew want. I am just waiting for the first losing streak so people can say "Ha! See?! [insert ANYTHING] wasn't the problem. I was right!"
Can we wait until the season starts before we write this team as a bunch of losers who lack any offensive ability and will be missing the playoffs without Torts, Gabby, Dubi and Arty?
These are things that Sather and crew want. I am just waiting for the first losing streak so people can say "Ha! See?! [insert ANYTHING] wasn't the problem. I was right!"
Can we wait until the season starts before we write this team as a bunch of losers who lack any offensive ability and will be missing the playoffs without Torts, Gabby, Dubi and Arty?
Whiplash27
Quattro!!
eco's bones
Registered User
Watched two periods--which was enough. It's not that the Rangers looked awful. They pretty much controlled the pace of the first period. Vancouver's first goal could have easily been called back for goaltender interference. Unfortunately it wasn't--it was the best opportunity for the refs to call a penalty against the Canucks maybe in the game and they missed it. They didn't miss any opportunity to call penalties against the Rangers in the two periods I watched.
Henrik had no chance on the first goal--with the interference and the puck deflecting straight on to Henrik Sedin's stick. The second goal--a long shot from the blue line by Corrado should have been stopped. For outplaying the opposition going into the locker room down 2-0 isn't something you want to see.
The second period was more or less even apart from the fact that Vancouver scored 3 more goals. Another puck deflected over to an absolutely open Henrik Sedin to make it 3-0. Then Kesler deflected one in 4 seconds into a pwp and then Shinkaruk's shot coming off the boards deflected off Girardi into the net.
Both Edmonton and Vancouver scored a lot of deflected goals against us. Don't know if this is just bad luck or some kind of glitch in our defensive scheme or the result of trying to force the offense every chance we get or a combination of those or other factors but the Rangers defense right now looks really leaky. It may take time for our team to adjust going from Tortorella's system to AV's.
By the way the economy is not improving--not unless you're very rich already. Without getting into partisan politics I'll just say that whatever the Wall St. numbers has very little to do with the greater % of American workers who have been losing their jobs and/or continually to have to change jobs to work for less in worse and worse situations for the last 3 decades. There are less and less decent paying jobs and meanwhile the population is continually increasing. We hit 300 million people around the turn of the century and we will have about 400 by mid century. An economy built primarily around service jobs can hardly keep up with the 300 million--and considering there are no real political initiatives to change the tack we are on and diversify our economy back into other areas such as manufacturing/industrial don't expect any kind of sustained improvement on that situation. The fact is our economy like our political situation like all such systems is dysfunctional and it's evolutionary in its dysfunction.
Henrik had no chance on the first goal--with the interference and the puck deflecting straight on to Henrik Sedin's stick. The second goal--a long shot from the blue line by Corrado should have been stopped. For outplaying the opposition going into the locker room down 2-0 isn't something you want to see.
The second period was more or less even apart from the fact that Vancouver scored 3 more goals. Another puck deflected over to an absolutely open Henrik Sedin to make it 3-0. Then Kesler deflected one in 4 seconds into a pwp and then Shinkaruk's shot coming off the boards deflected off Girardi into the net.
Both Edmonton and Vancouver scored a lot of deflected goals against us. Don't know if this is just bad luck or some kind of glitch in our defensive scheme or the result of trying to force the offense every chance we get or a combination of those or other factors but the Rangers defense right now looks really leaky. It may take time for our team to adjust going from Tortorella's system to AV's.
By the way the economy is not improving--not unless you're very rich already. Without getting into partisan politics I'll just say that whatever the Wall St. numbers has very little to do with the greater % of American workers who have been losing their jobs and/or continually to have to change jobs to work for less in worse and worse situations for the last 3 decades. There are less and less decent paying jobs and meanwhile the population is continually increasing. We hit 300 million people around the turn of the century and we will have about 400 by mid century. An economy built primarily around service jobs can hardly keep up with the 300 million--and considering there are no real political initiatives to change the tack we are on and diversify our economy back into other areas such as manufacturing/industrial don't expect any kind of sustained improvement on that situation. The fact is our economy like our political situation like all such systems is dysfunctional and it's evolutionary in its dysfunction.
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HatTrick Swayze
Just Be Nice
This is really the bottom line. And to your point on the defense I have always maintained that they WILL give up more goals this year. It's just a fact of life that Torts' system promoted limiting GA above all else. With Lundqvist the Rangers won't be "bad" but they will give up more. The kicker is if under AV they can score more to make up for it. Or else we will just be watching "entertaining losses".
They've got time here and they need it. Stepan and Callahan back will be enormous. Hagelin too in a few weeks.
I wimped out and fell asleep after the first. Pyatt looked better than I thought he would.
But obvi it was Tortsy cakes' fault for no goalz! Not da playurz. Come awn. Cheer up m8! He's gone so its bound to get better! Har har har; so glad Torts was fired!
But nah man, naw dawg. Torts was the problem here too. It was his collapsing system. Clearly you didn't see what you saw the last couple games with deflection goals. Surely they would disappear once Torts was gone!!!1!!11!!!!1! JUST LET HONK SEE DEM. GET OUT OF HIS WAY. HELP HIM HELP YOU.
--
For the record, before people freak out and get their feelings hurt, like in the GDT -- I was a Torts defender, but I'm mostly joking (though I did seriously try to have these substantive discussions with Torts haters prior to his firing - to which I mostly got responses like my imitations above). But its ridiculous to judge the team/coach/players based on preseason. Calm down for now people. If we're still seeing this crap 20 games in, fine; go crazy. Burn it all down. But preseason is dumb.
Not to mention the benefits of the growth that has occurred since the recession has not gone to the majority of Americans; it has gone to an increasingly smaller amount of people. And the 'job creation' has been a flooding of **** jobs; not jobs people can live off of - which, by the way, further benefits those select few.
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Unpredictable1
Registered User
broadwayblue
Registered User
I called it a night after the 2nd period. I dreamed that we scored three in the third. lol
DeadPuck
Registered User
I didn't catch the game, but I thought this tweet by the Rangers summed it up pretty good.
"Boyle blocks shot, puck comes straight to Henrik Sedin and Canucks lead 1-0 on a PP goal"
"Boyle blocks shot, puck comes straight to Henrik Sedin and Canucks lead 1-0 on a PP goal"
EspenK
Registered User
- Sep 25, 2011
- 15,619
- 4,186
Synergy27
F-A-C-G-C-E
I think I may have finally outgrown this message board. Scary thought, but man is it hard to read 90% of this nonsense.
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