Player Discussion Leon Draisaitl - 2019 All-Star

[Little Fury]

Not every team needs a line driver for their 2nd line. RNH is plenty good enough to be the best player on the 2nd line as long as he doesn't have table scraps for linemates.

Well that depends: do we want to win a Cup or nah?

There's no blueprint for winning, but it sure seems like having at least two lines that can dominate is a prerequisite. I love RNH, but he's a break even guy at best.

 

[Porkleaker]

^his pace rounds out to 51G 51A. small quibble..

He might score 40 though. That would be something else. Looks like he's going to have a PPG season or better. Depends on usage obviously do to the talent dropoff of linemates on this club anytime you are not on topline.

His numbers are more amazing considering he played 16 of those games primarily on 2nd line.

Let's see if Hitchcock can maybe get that power play working, then 50+ wouldn't even be a problem.
That is if they ever get a power play again.

 

[Zaddy]

Agenda lol. Saying that MCDavid needs Draisaitl to be productive is the biggest agenda load of crap in HF history.

I get that you need to praise Drai to the max, even when he was terrible to start the season, but this is too much.

That's not exactly what he was saying though, but of course I know you rather attack the poster and deliberately misinterpret what they're saying instead of replying to what they're actually writing.

Anyway, outside of the first six games of the season (or five actually if you want to include the Nashville game where both were pointless) Drai has outproduced McDavid by 1 point. That's 16 games. Let that sink in. In a stretch of 16 out of 21 games of the season, Drai has more points than McDavid.

With that in mind it's not exactly 'out there' to suggest that Drai could help energize McDavid by putting him back on his line. They love to play together and for good reason. Only a fool (and a stubborn one at that) would not care to admit that they both make each other better. No one feeds McDavid passes like Drai. He's one of the best playmakers in the entire league. No one finishes plays like Drai (on this team) either and he's developed into quite the goalscorer.

 

[nabob]

Well that depends: do we want to win a Cup or nah?

There's no blueprint for winning, but it sure seems like having at least two lines that can dominate is a prerequisite. I love RNH, but he's a break even guy at best.

Playing with complete scrubs his line manages to break even.

He actually produces very similar to Drai over the last year and a bit with regards to points with/without McDavid.

Odd that we expect Nuge at $6M to carry scrubs but not Drai.

 

[nabob]

That's not exactly what he was saying though, but of course I know you rather attack the poster and deliberately misinterpret what they're saying instead of replying to what they're actually writing.

Anyway, outside of the first six games of the season (or five actually if you want to include the Nashville game where both were pointless) Drai has outproduced McDavid by 1 point. That's 16 games. Let that sink in. In a stretch of 16 out of 21 games of the season, Drai has more points than McDavid.

With that in mind it's not exactly 'out there' to suggest that Drai could help energize McDavid by putting him back on his line. They love to play together.

It’s not the first time that poster has said McDavid needs Drai to produce.

Also I never said that they don’t make each other better. Just disputing the claim that McDavid needs Drai as much as Drai needs McDavid to be productive at a high level. This season has been a perfect example of that.

Edit: site acting weird on my phone.

 

[Little Fury]

Playing with complete scrubs his line manages to break even.

He actually produces very similar to Drai over the last year and a bit with regards to points with/without McDavid.

Odd that we expect Nuge at $6M to carry scrubs but not Drai.

I actually do trust Nuge to carry his own line over Leon at this point and that's kind of the problem IMO.

 

[Joey Moss]

I watched that Tim and Sid clip yesterday where one of them was ripping on the players calling everyone other then McDavid garbage and inconsistent etc.. Had to facepalm. Carving the 8th leading point scorer in the league..

Brilliant.

 

[FlameChampion]

I hope that Hitchcock can get Draisaitl to play harder and more consistently.

Draisaitl is a tremendous player. The sky is the limit for him. The guys a beast. When hes on his game, you cant contain him.

 

[Little Fury]

Anyway, outside of the first six games of the season (or five actually if you want to include the Nashville game where both were pointless) Drai has outproduced McDavid by 1 point. That's 16 games. Let that sink in. In a stretch of 16 out of 21 games of the season, Drai has more points than McDavid.

Pretty sure they both have 20 points in their last 16 games.
But here's another stat: McDavid has been in on 17 of Drai's 26 points. That's 65%.

With that in mind it's not exactly 'out there' to suggest that Drai could help energize McDavid by putting him back on his line. They love to play together and for good reason. Only a fool (and a stubborn one at that) would not care to admit that they both make each other better. No one feeds McDavid passes like Drai. He's one of the best playmakers in the entire league. No one finishes plays like Drai (on this team) either and he's developed into quite the goalscorer.

Not sure anyone is arguing that the 29/97 combo isn't great together. The issue is, as good as they are, this roster as it is constructed won't go anywhere with those two as the primary (and really, only) offensive threat. Generally speaking, you want your team to at least come close to break even when your best players aren't on the ice and the Oilers aren't even close. Unless McDraivid is so good that they shatter the paradigm, I don't see how a team that has a 35% 5v5 goal share when those two are on the bench ever does a damn thing.

 

[ConnorMcMullet]

Downright dominant right now. Worth every penny and more, especially considering players like Skinner will get 8-9 million this year and Matthews 11+.

Anyone complaining about his contract is delusional.

 

[Giggli G]

Pretty sure they both have 20 points in their last 16 games.
But here's another stat: McDavid has been in on 17 of Drai's 26 points. That's 65%.



Not sure anyone is arguing that the 29/97 combo isn't great together. The issue is, as good as they are, this roster as it is constructed won't go anywhere with those two as the primary (and really, only) offensive threat. Generally speaking, you want your team to at least come close to break even when your best players aren't on the ice and the Oilers aren't even close. Unless McDraivid is so good that they shatter the paradigm, I don't see how a team that has a 35% 5v5 goal share when those two are on the bench ever does a damn thing.

RNH is just fine as a second line threat. He just needs one or two more decent producers.

What percentage of McDavid's points is Draisaitl in on? The goals yesterday for example were as much or more his skilled passing as McDavid's talent.

 

[Jimmi McJenkins]

I watched that Tim and Sid clip yesterday where one of them was ripping on the players calling everyone other then McDavid garbage and inconsistent etc.. Had to facepalm. Carving the 8th leading point scorer in the league..

Brilliant.

Well that would involve actually looking at the team, and that's not what the shallow dive and related pots shot is intended to do

 

[Little Fury]

RNH is just fine as a second line threat. He just needs one or two more decent producers.

Like Drai? It makes more sense to try to see if those two can push a second line than loading up the top line at the expense of the rest of the roster.

What percentage of McDavid's points is Draisaitl in on? The goals yesterday for example were as much or more his skilled passing as McDavid's talent.

55%

 

[Oilers 322]

Like Drai? It makes more sense to try to see if those two can push a second line than loading up the top line at the expense of the rest of the roster.



45%

Isn’t it 55% if they share 17 points amongst each other? Also I agree that they should play Nuge with Drai.

 

[Little Fury]

Isn’t it 55% if they share 17 points amongst each other? Also I agree that they should play Nuge with Drai.

Whoops, typo.

 

[McIce Whole]

Isn’t it 55% if they share 17 points amongst each other? Also I agree that they should play Nuge with Drai.

Maybe if/once Connor and Drai stop clicking and aren’t leading us to wins. Right now, we don’t have the skill throughout the lineup to separate these two, they play amazing together, they’re both on pace for 100+ points

It would be like Colorado splitting up Rantanen and Mackinnon to drive the second line. Or Benn and Seguin. One of Pasta/Bergeron/Marchand etc. Other teams load up their top lines and if it translates to wins, then do what you have to do.

Long term, of course the goal is to have Mcdavid and Drai drive their own lines but our lineup around them isn’t good enough to do that right now.

 

[Zaddy]

Pretty sure they both have 20 points in their last 16 games.
But here's another stat: McDavid has been in on 17 of Drai's 26 points. That's 65%.

I counted it like 3 times and got it to 19, but now I checked again and you're right McDavid is also at 20 points. Doesn't matter, my point still stands. If McDavid was dragging Draisaitl along there's no way in hell they'd have the same amount of points in such a long stretch of games.

Anyway, to further illustrate my point just look at the three goals they both were in on. If you were to say that that was Drai getting 'gravy points' off McDavid then I wouldn't be able to take you seriously. Drai contributed to those goals every bit as much as McDavid.

I'd honestly love to see some examples from the people who say he's leeching of McDavid. Go ahead and show me actual video sequences of these so-called gravy points and also how often they have happened over the course of the season.

Then be fair and do the exact same thing for McDavid and see how many gravy points he has gotten thanks to Draisaitl. Results may be shocking. (They both benefit, Drai probably more but not by a huge amount)

Not sure anyone is arguing that the 29/97 combo isn't great together. The issue is, as good as they are, this roster as it is constructed won't go anywhere with those two as the primary (and really, only) offensive threat. Generally speaking, you want your team to at least come close to break even when your best players aren't on the ice and the Oilers aren't even close. Unless McDraivid is so good that they shatter the paradigm, I don't see how a team that has a 35% 5v5 goal share when those two are on the bench ever does a damn thing.

Well this is a completely different argument and I have never argued against that the forward depth on this club is problematic, in fact I've been arguing exactly that because the personnel here isn't even good enough to form 2 decent lines, regardless of whether RNH or Drai is the 2nd line center. We just don't have the wingers to give either of them a legit shot at putting up big numbers on a 2nd line. The best we can do is playing them with two careers 3rd liners in Rieder and Chiasson. Pretty sad.

 

[Zaddy]

55%

So 65% vs 55%, that's about the difference you would expect between these two. Certainly not a huge gap.

 

[Little Fury]

I counted it like 3 times and got it to 19, but now I checked again and you're right McDavid is also at 20 points. Doesn't matter, my point still stands. If McDavid was dragging Draisaitl along there's no way in hell they'd have the same amount of points in such a long stretch of games.

Most of those points were with McDavid, though. I'd have to go back and check, but I think he had 5 points without 97 in that span.

I'd honestly love to see some examples from the people who say he's leeching of McDavid. Go ahead and show me actual video sequences of these so-called gravy points and also how often they have happened over the course of the season.

Then be fair and do the exact same thing for McDavid and see how many gravy points he has gotten thanks to Draisaitl. Results may be shocking. (They both benefit, Drai probably more but not by a huge amount)

That's all I'm saying: I think Drai needs Connor more than Connor needs Drai. Yeah they're good together, but what's good for their counting numbers isn't necessarily what's best for the team.

Well this is a completely different argument and I have never argued against that the forward depth on this club is problematic, in fact I've been arguing exactly that because the personnel here isn't even good enough to form 2 decent lines, regardless of whether RNH or Drai is the 2nd line center. We just don't have the wingers to give either of them a legit shot at putting up big numbers on a 2nd line. The best we can do is playing them with two careers 3rd liners in Rieder and Chiasson. Pretty sad.

I think our best chance is to run RNH and Drai. Hopefully Hitch gives that combo a look.

 

[Duke74]

Agenda lol. Saying that MCDavid needs Draisaitl to be productive is the biggest agenda load of crap in HF history.

I get that you need to praise Drai to the max, even when he was terrible to start the season, but this is too much.

If you read my post more carefully, you will see that I wasn't saying McDavid needs Draisaitl. I was saying that the lines were changed because NO ONE was producing INCLUDING McDavid and therefore McLellan switched the lines.

Yes, I'll acknowledge he played like shit to start the season if that makes you happy and helps you sleep at night. And, in return, you need to acknowledge the he's doing well WITH OR WITHOUT McDavid (which I see you did to some extent in this thread). He had 17 points in 17 games ON HIS OWN LINE, which includes Yamamoto and Lucic, two players McDavid couldn't even piss a drop with. Putting him with McDavid understandably further elevated his point totals. So you have an 82 point player WITHOUT McDavid or a 100-point player with him. The point is that both versions of Draisaitl are more than worth their contract. The problem is the shit depth that surrounds McDavid and Draisaitl rather than either of those players alone.

 

[CornKicker]

Drai excels in the extra space mcdavid creates. he is one of th emost dangerous players in the league when he has any space at all. Mcdavid creates space because if you dont he will single handedly destroy you. Im not saying that drai needs 97 but until someone can figure out a way to stop them you have to let them rip.

for the record i am all about a nuge/drai combo and letting 97-98 do lifting on the other line.

 

[Chef de Cuisine]

If you read my post more carefully, you will see that I wasn't saying McDavid needs Draisaitl. I was saying that the lines were changed because NO ONE was producing INCLUDING McDavid and therefore McLellan switched the lines.

Yes, I'll acknowledge he played like **** to start the season if that makes you happy and helps you sleep at night. And, in return, you need to acknowledge the he's doing well WITH OR WITHOUT McDavid (which I see you did to some extent in this thread). He had 17 points in 17 games ON HIS OWN LINE, which includes Yamamoto and Lucic, two players McDavid couldn't even piss a drop with. Putting him with McDavid understandably further elevated his point totals. So you have an 82 point player WITHOUT McDavid or a 100-point player with him.

wait.. Draisaitl was a ppg without McDavid for a single one of them? Are you sure? I really want to believe you.

 

[Duke74]

Saying he’s a 60-70 point player that he isn’t actually as good of a player as people think he should be isn’t really defending him.

I think you're taking Drivesaitl's posts out of context. He was saying that if Draisaitl was stuck with Lucic and Yamamoto all year (which btw even McDavid struggled to produce with) that Drai would have 70 pts or less.

 

[Duke74]

wait.. Draisaitl was a ppg without McDavid for a single one of those. Are you sure? I really want to believe you.

Yes he was. He played on his own line for the first 17 games and had 17 points.

 

[Chef de Cuisine]

Yes he was. He played on his own line for the first 17 games and had 17 points.

omg

lets get it