Post-Game Talk: Leafs win 2-1 in OT

[NightTrain1]

For a team this talented on paper, if playing good defensively means giving up 103 shots in 3 games and relying on your goalie to absolutely save your butts for long stretches of play; i dont want to know what bad defensively means.

3 wins in a row sure seems to take the edge off of a not good season so far, but good lord they did not play well for most of the past 3 games. At the very least not nearly as good as they should be. Ill take the points of course and let league parity do the rest, but Im still not happy at all with how this team plays or is coached. Los Angeles is a terrible team, and I would be hard pressed to say Philly is much more than a middling team. Vegas is a legit good organized team and IMO although the shots were close I think Anderson saved our bacon last night.

21st in the league on PP and 24th on the PK. Good god.

 

[AreBe]

"I was really happy to see the prenatally at the end of the game that the Leafs took. That's the spirit, hopefully we can remember to do that in the playoffs," Moron Man said, as he pulled down his ball cap and pulled up his track pants, believing that smart hockey for the Leafs means good old fashion toughness. "Quick, let's trade Marner and his stupid 'pay me on the upswing of my career' contract that stupid Dubas gave him. What an idiot! Does he not know we have a salary cap and money needs to be wisely spent? Trade Marner while his value is still high! We can get a grizzled veteran who has toughness and who has won the cup before! Enough with this stupid analytics! Time for us to sucker the other GM!" Some Leafs Nation members clapped in agreement, and they all hoisted a pint of made- under- license beer bearing some American brand, felt proudly Canadian for doing so, and dreamed of the day the Leafs got rid of all of this silly skating and passing, being fully confident, the idiots that they are, that the American Association of US Ice Hockey Teams will call games between American teams and teams in the Canadian Branch Plant Division fairly in the playoffs and refusing to accept that the AAUSIHT not only can, but must, call everything when it comes to the Leafs

 

[rumman]

Barrie needs to be unleashed.

if you mean disposed of I'm in agreement.

 

[Madap]

As much as Babcock loves these kind of wins, I don't like it. I do think he's right when he says its good for the team, but at the same time, we should not rely on winning these types of games. They work against bad teams, but they wont work against a good team like Boston or something.

We need to start playing to our strengths and this coaching staff has just not got it done yet. I don't want to sound like the "always angry fan" who's upset even when we win, but I really do believe we can do so much better. I'm a strong believer in competitive advantage and this team is just not using that.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Yes... that makes a lot of sense...

The team is asking Barrie to scale it back, while letting Rielly, Muzzin, Dermott and Ceci frequently jump up! That must be happening!!!

I don't see either Dermy or Ceci or Muzzy skating puck up ice into other teams end. I do see it from time to time from Rielly. I think it is a Leafs system thing likely but it may be a Babs thing too. Barrie needs the green light so he can take puck from his own end and skate it into other teams end when he wants like 3 or 4 times a period. Watch him last playoffs he very rarely turns it over. and he creates offense. All Babs needs to do is drop our centres back to play defense on his rushes.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

I don't see either Dermy or Ceci or Muzzy skating puck up ice into other teams end. I do see it from time to time from Rielly. I think it is a Leafs system thing likely but it may be a Babs thing too. Barrie needs the green light so he can take puck from his own end and skate it into other teams end when he wants like 3 or 4 times a period. Watch him last playoffs he very rarely turns it over. and he creates offense. All Babs needs to do is drop our centres back to play defense on his rushes.

And if Leafs don't want to let him go and adjust their system then Babs is over ruling Dubie again. Why get the guy for this season if we don't plan on using his strengths? I'd say trade him for a 1st rounder if this is what continues to be his usage.

 

[Teeder Keon]

As much as Babcock loves these kind of wins, I don't like it. I do think he's right when he says its good for the team, but at the same time, we should not rely on winning these types of games. They work against bad teams, but they wont work against a good team like Boston or something.

We need to start playing to our strengths and this coaching staff has just not got it done yet. I don't want to sound like the "always angry fan" who's upset even when we win, but I really do believe we can do so much better. I'm a strong believer in competitive advantage and this team is just not using that.

I agree
Also , let’s be very honest , if Fred didn’t play lights out , we are all saying how the Leafs are giving up so many chances
I’m always blown away by the lack In knowledge of nuanced substance in sports but in this case in hockey and especially the way the Leafs play under Babs .
Playing the way we did against LA was horrible , playing the same way against V was not better , just that they didn’t score , playing against a team or a line that scores more than less when giving them opportunities is disaster , Boston ..
It amazes me that these obvious observations are not noticed ??
It’s not the way to play if your a team like the Leafs
It is a way to play if your the “ classic “ Devils of the past or teams that aren’t that deep in offence as most teams aren’t , that’s why we see it more ..
Boston plays their style because the have one line that scores on pp and regular shift at will and the rest of the forwards play hard nosed heavy game .
But to say that we played to our advantage and strengths last night is not knowing your sport .
When we played our style in the 1st period , we were all over them and they couldn’t forecheck as well .
Then we reverted to dumping it in and that’s not us and the result was they get the puck and put it up and they then played in our end , which is not where we want to be , nor is it how we want to be .
Face it
Our team is agsin , sorry to labour this point but we are closer to the 80s oilers but less mean in bottom 6
But style wise that’s how we are built to play and who we are naturally .
Let’s win with scoring , cuz in the playoffs we can’t win against other teams that play Boston style or V for that matter the margin of error is to tight that way and then need to have Fred make no mistake what so ever
That’s not realistic

 

[deletethis]

Barrie needs to be unleashed.

I think it's safe to assume he won't run out into traffic.

 

[Madap]

I agree
Also , let’s be very honest , if Fred didn’t play lights out , we are all saying how the Leafs are giving up so many chances
I’m always blown away by the lack In knowledge of nuanced substance in sports but in this case in hockey and especially the way the Leafs play under Babs .
Playing the way we did against LA was horrible , playing the same way against V was not better , just that they didn’t score , playing against a team or a line that scores more than less when giving them opportunities is disaster , Boston ..
It amazes me that these obvious observations are not noticed ??
It’s not the way to play if your a team like the Leafs
It is a way to play if your the “ classic “ Devils of the past or teams that aren’t that deep in offence as most teams aren’t , that’s why we see it more ..
Boston plays their style because the have one line that scores on pp and regular shift at will and the rest of the forwards play hard nosed heavy game .
But to say that we played to our advantage and strengths last night is not knowing your sport .
When we played our style in the 1st period , we were all over them and they couldn’t forecheck as well .
Then we reverted to dumping it in and that’s not us and the result was they get the puck and put it up and they then played in our end , which is not where we want to be , nor is it how we want to be .
Face it
Our team is agsin , sorry to labour this point but we are closer to the 80s oilers but less mean in bottom 6
But style wise that’s how we are built to play and who we are naturally .
Let’s win with scoring , cuz in the playoffs we can’t win against other teams that play Boston style or V for that matter the margin of error is to tight that way and then need to have Fred make no mistake what so ever
That’s not realistic

Agreed. I was beyond impressed with Babcock in his first year here, even though we came in last. He knows how to bring the best out of a bad team. But he doesn't know how to bring the best out of a good team, I think. He says all the right things, and I know he's a smart guy, but I still think he can do better and it doesn't seem like he's even willing to try.

 

[deletethis]

It's quite weird that it's Muzzin I notice the entire game while often forgetting about Muzzin's defense partner. You know that's not an entirely bad thing. It's just that historically it's the steady physical stay-at-home type who gives the stability for his partner to bloom.

 

[Teeder Keon]

Agreed. I was beyond impressed with Babcock in his first year here, even though we came in last. He knows how to bring the best out of a bad team. But he doesn't know how to bring the best out of a good team, I think. He says all the right things, and I know he's a smart guy, but I still think he can do better and it doesn't seem like he's even willing to try.

Agree
I think he’s a good person as well and ok coach , very smart .
But
It’s killing us that he’s the wrong coach for us now ..,
I truly believe we are on the cusp as is Tampa as the way hockey is headed to and will be and we just happen to have the first draft of it and Babcock can’t recognize it or capable of it or can’t alter his ways
We really need a progressive younger coach relating to these new type of players and individuals and new way of playing ..

 

[egd27]

Mike Babcock turned the Canadian Olympic team into a 2-1 lockdown team.

Dont you remember the thrilling defensive gems against Latvia or wherever? 2-1

I remember 5 Latvians collapsing in front of there own net while Canada peppered 57 shots on goal (and countless others at goal)

But sure, Babcock put the offensive leash on them.

No agenda here.

 

[Zybalto]

I took his comments to be about the years the team would do well in the regular season then flame out in the post season and how they had to learn how to play a post season style of hockey and not specifically that year, but I could be wrong.

I hear you and there is certainly wisdom in his words for sure but I thought the catalyst for their run was more the play of Holtby than a team game, although they did play a stronger team game as the playoffs wore on.

The Leafs have never really flamed out in the playoffs either as they have always been the underdog in close series.

If you were to look at those results, season finishes, etc independently, it looks about right. Better team from the regular season won against a slightly worse team in a close series the last two times.

The seeding is the only reason the Leafs havnt been to the second round really.

 

[Teeder Keon]

The seeding is the only reason the Leafs havnt been to the second round really.

sorry I disagree big time .
We lost because we aren’t tough enough
Couldn’t contain there top line
We’re out coached
Didn’t play to our strengths
Had no Pp
Couldn’t stop them on Pk
Didn’t get enough out of our top players
We’re to young
Etc

 

[Madap]

I remember 5 Latvians collapsing in front of there own net while Canada peppered 57 shots on goal (and countless others at goal)

But sure, Babcock put the offensive leash on them.

No agenda here.

Are you joking? We played Latvia... I'm pretty sure a men's rec team could have put 60 shots on net against them.

Look at the whole tournament and tell me you honestly believe Babcock didn't stifle their offense. It worked, no doubt. But this team easily could have averaged 4+ goals a game, instead of less than 3. Acknowledging the fact that Babcock prefers a defensive game does not mean that there is some agenda.

 

[Zybalto]

For a team this talented on paper, if playing good defensively means giving up 103 shots in 3 games and relying on your goalie to absolutely save your butts for long stretches of play; i dont want to know what bad defensively means.

3 wins in a row sure seems to take the edge off of a not good season so far, but good lord they did not play well for most of the past 3 games. At the very least not nearly as good as they should be. Ill take the points of course and let league parity do the rest, but Im still not happy at all with how this team plays or is coached. Los Angeles is a terrible team, and I would be hard pressed to say Philly is much more than a middling team. Vegas is a legit good organized team and IMO although the shots were close I think Anderson saved our bacon last night.

21st in the league on PP and 24th on the PK. Good god.

Pretty sure our PP is going to improve as the season goes on.

As for the PK, I dont know why but Rielly has really struggled there this year. Hoping he finds his game a little more defensively but hes just seemed a step behind this year in that area.

 

[Zybalto]

sorry I disagree big time .
We lost because we aren’t tough enough
Couldn’t contain there top line
We’re out coached
Didn’t play to our strengths
Had no Pp
Couldn’t stop them on Pk
Didn’t get enough out of our top players
We’re to young
Etc

Since it was a close 7 games series both times and all the underlying numbers were tight as hell, make a list of what we did right as well.

 

[Teeder Keon]

Since it was a close 7 games series both times and all the underlying numbers were tight as hell, make a list of what we did right as well.

Agreed
We did do some nice things as well
We were resilient

 

[Teeder Keon]

For a team this talented on paper, if playing good defensively means giving up 103 shots in 3 games and relying on your goalie to absolutely save your butts for long stretches of play; i dont want to know what bad defensively means.
Totally agree with your points

3 wins in a row sure seems to take the edge off of a not good season so far, but good lord they did not play well for most of the past 3 games. At the very least not nearly as good as they should be. Ill take the points of course and let league parity do the rest, but Im still not happy at all with how this team plays or is coached. Los Angeles is a terrible team, and I would be hard pressed to say Philly is much more than a middling team. Vegas is a legit good organized team and IMO although the shots were close I think Anderson saved our bacon last night.

21st in the league on PP and 24th on the PK. Good god.

totally agree with everything you pointed out

 

[Suntouchable13]

I hear you and there is certainly wisdom in his words for sure but I thought the catalyst for their run was more the play of Holtby than a team game, although they did play a stronger team game as the playoffs wore on.

The Leafs have never really flamed out in the playoffs either as they have always been the underdog in close series.

If you were to look at those results, season finishes, etc independently, it looks about right. Better team from the regular season won against a slightly worse team in a close series the last two times.

The seeding is the only reason the Leafs havnt been to the second round really.

We did not go to the second round because we are not good enough. Period. Stop blaming external factors.

 

[egd27]

Are you joking? We played Latvia... I'm pretty sure a men's rec team could have put 60 shots on net against them.

Look at the whole tournament and tell me you honestly believe Babcock didn't stifle their offense. It worked, no doubt. But this team easily could have averaged 4+ goals a game, instead of less than 3. Acknowledging the fact that Babcock prefers a defensive game does not mean that there is some agenda.

Ok, It was a defensive gem. Babcock stifled the offence by only allowing them to take 57 shots on goal. Masterfully argued.

 

[saltming]

I hear you and there is certainly wisdom in his words for sure but I thought the catalyst for their run was more the play of Holtby than a team game, although they did play a stronger team game as the playoffs wore on.

The Leafs have never really flamed out in the playoffs either as they have always been the underdog in close series.

If you were to look at those results, season finishes, etc independently, it looks about right. Better team from the regular season won against a slightly worse team in a close series the last two times.

The seeding is the only reason the Leafs havnt been to the second round really.

I agree with all you're saying. I would add that the Caps under Trotz were a tighter team and played 'different' than before.
Team play will help a goalie too and that is not to discredit the goalie. I'm in record here saying a goalie is the most important position.

 

[Gary Nylund]

For a team this talented on paper, if playing good defensively means giving up 103 shots in 3 games and relying on your goalie to absolutely save your butts for long stretches of play; i dont want to know what bad defensively means.

3 wins in a row sure seems to take the edge off of a not good season so far, but good lord they did not play well for most of the past 3 games. At the very least not nearly as good as they should be. Ill take the points of course and let league parity do the rest, but Im still not happy at all with how this team plays or is coached. Los Angeles is a terrible team, and I would be hard pressed to say Philly is much more than a middling team. Vegas is a legit good organized team and IMO although the shots were close I think Anderson saved our bacon last night.

21st in the league on PP and 24th on the PK. Good god.

Fantastic post IMHO, my sentiments exactly!

 

[Zybalto]

We did not go to the second round because we are not good enough. Period. Stop blaming external factors.

While not massively important reason, it's also important to not discount factors like officiating and seeding.

Game 2 last year was one of the worst officiated playoffs games I've ever seen and it went against us. If you have it PVRd, I'd advise to go watch it again. Even out of the moment and after the fact, it's just stunning how bad it was.

The Leafs may have lost the game anyway but I think thses things do matter.

 

[Griffin76]

I thought Subban looked good. Think he'd look even better as our backup