Pre-Game Talk: Leafs vs Montreal vs Ottawa Rookie Tournament Thread

[deletethis]

Bracco's insanely skilled offensively. The "he's only good on the powerplay" is BS, and has no standing. There's nothing that backs it up. He needs work defensively. Luckily, Keefe has done a great job of getting guys focused on defense.

The reason I agreed with the "good on PP, not good other times" sentiment is that once the time and space of a PP are taken away from Bracco in the offensive zone his right side boards playmaking becomes mostly neutralized. He needs to keep moving a lot more at even strength.

 

[ULF_55]

If memory serves me, Dermott didn't look very good at all in his first rookie tournament and his skating didn't stand out. Now look. Even the most critical of Liljegren recognized that his skating was outstanding at this tournament. Liljegren's mistakes shouldn't be too scary. If in two years they are still this frequent then I'll start to wonder about his progression.

Hoping Liljegren and Dermott gets paired with experienced pros whether with the Leafs or Marlies.

Dermott isn't an experienced pro, so I hope they aren't joined at the hip with the Marlies.

They don't have to be paired up with the best but I think they'd learn more with players who've been around the block a few times.

 

[ULF_55]

http://www.tsn.ca/dermott-s-stock-rising-ahead-of-leafs-training-camp-1.852625

Dzierkals: A standout at last season’s rookie tournament, Dzierkals picked up where he left off with another strong showing. He was the Leafs’ leading scorer, with two goals in two games, and along with Grundstrom was their most consistent offensive threat. Dzierkals is relentless when it comes to sniffing out pucks and doesn’t quit on a play, attributes that made him more than a point-per-game player in junior. Now 20 and having exhausted his eligibility in the CHL, Dzierkals will have to prove his size (5-foot-10, 172 pounds) won’t hold him back as a next season – he signed a one-year AHL contract in August.

Interesting.

 

[Mess]

Based on this tournament Dermott is the only player involved that might be knocking on the Leafs door this year or at least ready to challenge for a spot.

 

[Anthrax442]

Kinda sucks that Ricoh was only about half full. I got unexpectedly drunk.

 

[Cor]

The reason I agreed with the "good on PP, not good other times" sentiment is that once the time and space of a PP are taken away from Bracco in the offensive zone his right side boards playmaking becomes mostly neutralized. He needs to keep moving a lot more at even strength.

Bracco has shown at every level he can produce at 5v5. He does perfectly fine at 5v5. Now, from my several viewings the past couple years, his offensive game is becoming... for a lack of a better term, mature. He doesn't rely on dangling through offences. He uses his vision and passing ability to set players up for tap-ins.

Listen, if people want to criticize Bracco, that is fine. He needs work on everything to do with defense. His first step needs to get quicker. He needs to continue to add muscle. However, saying he can't play 5v5 is wrong. Plain and Simple. Bracco has always had the offensive skills of a top 10 draft pick. The issue always was his commitment to the defensive game, and his size.

Like, I'm sorry, I HATE discrediting opinions, but this "criticism" is objectively wrong. Does he make a powerplay more dangerous? 100%. Is that where all his offense comes from? Not even close.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

Bracco has shown at every level he can produce at 5v5. He does perfectly fine at 5v5. Now, from my several viewings the past couple years, his offensive game is becoming... for a lack of a better term, mature. He doesn't rely on dangling through offences. He uses his vision and passing ability to set players up for tap-ins.

Listen, if people want to criticize Bracco, that is fine. He needs work on everything to do with defense. His first step needs to get quicker. He needs to continue to add muscle. However, saying he can't play 5v5 is wrong. Plain and Simple. Bracco has always had the offensive skills of a top 10 draft pick. The issue always was his commitment to the defensive game, and his size.

Like, I'm sorry, I HATE discrediting opinions, but this "criticism" is objectively wrong. Does he make a powerplay more dangerous? 100%. Is that where all his offense comes from? Not even close.

Great analysis. I'd also add that his skating through the neutral zone and in the offensive zone is elite. He's so elusive and so good at buying time and creating space

It's also tough to gauge his real state of defensive ability in an exhibition rookie tournament. It probably didn't mean much to him

 

[saltming]

Bracco has shown at every level he can produce at 5v5. He does perfectly fine at 5v5. Now, from my several viewings the past couple years, his offensive game is becoming... for a lack of a better term, mature. He doesn't rely on dangling through offences. He uses his vision and passing ability to set players up for tap-ins.

Listen, if people want to criticize Bracco, that is fine. He needs work on everything to do with defense. His first step needs to get quicker. He needs to continue to add muscle. However, saying he can't play 5v5 is wrong. Plain and Simple. Bracco has always had the offensive skills of a top 10 draft pick. The issue always was his commitment to the defensive game, and his size.

Like, I'm sorry, I HATE discrediting opinions, but this "criticism" is objectively wrong. Does he make a powerplay more dangerous? 100%. Is that where all his offense comes from? Not even close.

Agreed with all you say especially the bolded.
I would add that this year he also is a lot stronger on his skates and he improved his board game.
All in all he slooks like he is becoming a more responsible player.

 

[Cor]

Agreed with all you say especially the bolded.
I would add that this year he also is a lot stronger on his skates and he improved his board game.
All in all he slooks like he is becoming a more responsible player.

mhmm, I noticed this weekend he was coming out of board battles with the puck more often. It was good to see.

 

[Damisoph]

Based on this tournament Dermott is the only player involved that might be knocking on the Leafs door this year or at least ready to challenge for a spot.

Yep, he was head and shoulders better than anyone else on the ice yesterday. Hope he can fill a void

 

[amack081]

My thoughts on the two games:

Goaltenders: I didn't like the idea of both goalies coming in as relief for the other during the respective games. Its incredibly hard for a goalie to come in cold. I thought Scott had a nice bounce back game but is still a long-term project. I think he is clearly behind Woll in the organization's depth chart.

Defense:

Dermott looks like he will be in the conversation for the big squad. I think the question is whether we want him playing third pairing minutes or top pairing minutes with the Marlies.

Nielsen looked to have improved his overall skating this summer but not to the point of being ready for the NHL. Still only 20, I think he needs at least another year in the AHL playing tough minutes prior to assessing what he will be at the NHL level. At times, he's Bryan McCabe or Sheldon Souray and other times he's Tim Erixon.

Liljegren looked his age out there and that's not a bad thing, what I mean by that is that this kid looks confident in his ability but is still raw and is prone to mistakes. I thought he looked rather slight but a year of the gym can do wonders. You can't teach the way he skates and moves the puck, you can teach him defensive positioning and his decision making will improve with experience. Look how long Dallas was patient on Julius Honka, Leafs will do the same.


Forwards:

I really liked Trevor Moore's game and I think we transitioned the puck a lot better in game 2 vs game 1 because of him being a smart center.

I think Marchmants games were very effective, I think he will be a nice compliment to some of the smaller Marlies going into next season.

I also really like Piccinich's game, I don't think he will ever be a top 9 forward at the NHL level, but he has the tools to be a bottom trio guy who is tough on the puck and kills penalties. He reminds me of Jerry D'Amigo whether that's good or bad I'm not sure but Jerry did play some games in the NHL.

Timashov looked to makes as you would expect from having minor pro experience but didn't take over as one would expect. He also played one game and I'm not reading to much into that.

Dzierkals I thought was around the puck a lot and will need time with the Marlies. I think we are talking about a 4th line winger at the NHL level if he can round his defensive game.

Grundstrom was fantastic and with his progression will see time with the Leafs this year assuming injuries and will make the team for 2018-2019.

Bracco with the puck is one of those guys that seems to make the right plays. For me it comes down to this with him: he is either going to play a skill role with the Leafs and will have to push Kappy/Brown/Hyman down the depth chart or he is going to be a career AHL/ not with the Leafs. I'm not sure why people would be upset with that because that speaks to our organizational depth at forward.

 

[SEER]

So he for sure not staying in NA?

Nothing is for sure.., until season start, but I think with the amount of new players signed.. and the success of last season's group.., it will be pretty hard "cap-wise" to fit many more into the active Leafs roster, before making a trade or two.. Just my opinion, though..

 

[SEER]

Game in Six - Leafs (3) - Sens (4) - S/O - Game #2 - September 10th 2017



Full Shoot-Out - Leafs - Sens - Game #2 - September 10th 2017

 

[SEER]

Game in Six - Leafs (2) - Habs (5) - Game #1 - September 8th 2017

 

[Anthrax442]

Nothing is for sure.., until season start, but I think with the amount of new players signed.. and the success of last season's group.., it will be pretty hard "cap-wise" to fit many more into the active Leafs roster, before making a trade or two.. Just my opinion, though..

Oh they just said on LL that Grundy has togo back if he isn't staying with the Leafs

 

[Damisoph]

Oh they just said on LL that Grundy has togo back if he isn't staying with the Leafs

from what I understand, any Swedish player not picked in the first round has to be in the NHL or back in Sweden. Seems like a strange rule.

 

[v-man]

Kinda sucks that Ricoh was only about half full. I got unexpectedly drunk.

Only half of the seats were up for sale (the entire north end and north-east side weren't available), so there was no way it could have been full.

 

[Johny Drama]

Only half of the seats were up for sale (the entire north end and north-east side weren't available), so there was no way it could have been full.

Didnt they have it so you had to purchase all 3 games to get tickets?
That would certainly cut down on sales if that were the case.

 

[saltming]

from what I understand, any Swedish player not picked in the first round has to be in the NHL or back in Sweden. Seems like a strange rule.

It's so that we don't poach all their talent. That way their own league stays fun and has and fans can see their future stars.

 

[saltming]

My thoughts on the two games:


Defense:


Nielsen looked to have improved his overall skating this summer but not to the point of being ready for the NHL. Still only 20, I think he needs at least another year in the AHL playing tough minutes prior to assessing what he will be at the NHL level. At times, he's Bryan McCabe or Sheldon Souray and other times he's Tim Erixon.

I have doubts about his feet. I was hoping for a huge jump in that aspect this but I didn't see it.
Of concern was his stick skills. He had problems receiving several passes that were tape to take. I'm hoping that was just rust.
I am really hoping he will make it but I have huge doubts just based on his insufficient growth in his skating.

 

[bobermay]

http://www.tsn.ca/dermott-s-stock-rising-ahead-of-leafs-training-camp-1.852625



Interesting.

Dzierkals had a really good couple of games, and I wouldn't disagree with that quote.

Bracco has shown at every level he can produce at 5v5. He does perfectly fine at 5v5. Now, from my several viewings the past couple years, his offensive game is becoming... for a lack of a better term, mature. He doesn't rely on dangling through offences. He uses his vision and passing ability to set players up for tap-ins.

Listen, if people want to criticize Bracco, that is fine. He needs work on everything to do with defense. His first step needs to get quicker. He needs to continue to add muscle. However, saying he can't play 5v5 is wrong. Plain and Simple. Bracco has always had the offensive skills of a top 10 draft pick. The issue always was his commitment to the defensive game, and his size.

Like, I'm sorry, I HATE discrediting opinions, but this "criticism" is objectively wrong. Does he make a powerplay more dangerous? 100%. Is that where all his offense comes from? Not even close.

Its not that wrong though, and nobody has suggested ALL his offense is from the PP... Just because you WANT him to be an effective 5v5 player doesn't mean he is one... yet. Bracco wasn't all that effective 5v5 this weekend, and on rationale could be that its the lack of time and space. Its a legitimate concern.

That said, this was a rookie tournament, so really his play this weekend should be taken with a grain of salt. However, things are only going to get more difficult. From my viewings, I worry that Bracco will struggle to translate to the next level large in part to his 5v5 play. Reason being 1) His defensive abilities (or lack thereof) as you've stated AND 2) Being less effective with less time and space (which will only be harder to find the higher up he plays)...

I'm not HATING on Bracco... just raising legitimate concerns.

 

[Lightsol]

I'm not HATING on Bracco... just raising legitimate concerns.

"I'm not hating on Bracco! Just ignore that pretty much every post I've made in this topic has been a shot at something about his game!"

 

[bobermay]

"I'm not hating on Bracco! Just ignore that pretty much every post I've made in this topic has been a shot at something about his game!"

1) Its not hate, its raising concerns... 2) people on here seem to think he's a Kapanen/Dermott/Grundstrom level of prospect right now. He isn't. Thats all.

 

[Sittler 27]

Based on this tournament Dermott is the only player involved that might be knocking on the Leafs door this year or at least ready to challenge for a spot.

That i totally agree with, also based on Grundstrom going home and forwards ahead of him

 

[Pyrophorus]

Korostelev is of of the best shootout scorers in the O.
He wasn't used