LD Jamie Oleksiak (2011, 14th, DAL)

Bjorn Le

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May 17, 2010
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If your a duel citizen you can play for either or. Depends how you treat both I guess. Brett Hull felt snubbed when he was left off a U18 tourny IIRC so never wanted to play for Canada (It was very rare for team Canada to take college kids back then). He was a jerk about it though.

He didn't play for the US because he didn't want to play for Canada again, it was because it was his second option because he couldn't make Canada. I'm sure he would have rather played for Canada.

Regarding Oleksiak, if Canada offers him a spot next year he'll take it most likely but if not definitely the US.
 

AmericanDream

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Oct 24, 2005
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He didn't play for the US because he didn't want to play for Canada again, it was because it was his second option because he couldn't make Canada. I'm sure he would have rather played for Canada.

Regarding Oleksiak, if Canada offers him a spot next year he'll take it most likely but if not definitely the US.

you really need to stop typing this nonsense.

now all of a sudden you have a residency in Brett Hull's head and heart. you now know who he would rather have played for because you apparently know more then the rest of us.

I am sure since 1987 (which he has stated numerous times), that he never looked back when it comes to playing for Canada. Hull made his choice as he had the bloodlines to do so, mom is American and spent over half his youth in the states as well...

USA hockey was not in the same shape back then as it is now, most American players were embarassed at times to represent their country with how second rate things where run. Saying that Canada was his #1 because of birth right is silly because the gap between the two (US and Canada) was so gigantic that almost every player with a dual citizenship would want to play for the winner over the loser.

If USA Hockey was as sturdy back then as it is now, who knows if Hull would have tried out for Canada first...

As for Oleksiak, he seems to be the reverse Tyler Myers and looks to be sticking with the US, as he has the bloodlines to do so. Canada will be making a big push for him, I have zero doubt, but he seems to want to stay loyal to the US as his comments from not making the US WJC team have indicated. Jamie said he is more motivated then ever to make the US team next year, and if you read the article it really shows his passion for playing for the US. It is only an article and not the bible, but it looks like a good start for the man child.
 

BluechipBulletin

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As for Oleksiak, he seems to be the reverse Tyler Myers and looks to be sticking with the US, as he has the bloodlines to do so. Canada will be making a big push for him, I have zero doubt, but he seems to want to stay loyal to the US as his comments from not making the US WJC team have indicated. Jamie said he is more motivated then ever to make the US team next year, and if you read the article it really shows his passion for playing for the US. It is only an article and not the bible, but it looks like a good start for the man child.

Between Oleksiak and Galchenyuk, next year should be very interesting for USA Hockey. Those are two guys who could easily play for Canada and Russia respectively, but both have made it clear that they want to play for USA Hockey. It's good for the game that USA Hockey has become desirable for top players.
 

AmericanDream

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Oct 24, 2005
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Between Oleksiak and Galchenyuk, next year should be very interesting for USA Hockey. Those are two guys who could easily play for Canada and Russia respectively, but both have made it clear that they want to play for USA Hockey. It's good for the game that USA Hockey has become desirable for top players.

it is good for USA Hockey, but it will also be attacked by others. If Oleksiak and Galchenyuk make team USA next year, and they win the Gold, guess how many people are going to start saying that the US cant develope its own players and that we need to steal players from other countries???

those are the extremists, but they do exsist on here and they will make those comments. they will make those comments yet forget about all the kids that were born in the US or spent significant time in the US as kids, yet switched sides to play for Canada (Kozun, Couturier, Myers, Erixon-Sweden, Foligno, etc).

the lines between the US and Canada are starting to get blured even more, and within the next decade I think there is going to be more bidding wars for these dual citizen players. More jobs then ever seem to be bouncing around between North America, and where the parents go so to go the children.
 

Man Hole Inspector*

Guest
it is good for USA Hockey, but it will also be attacked by others. If Oleksiak and Galchenyuk make team USA next year, and they win the Gold, guess how many people are going to start saying that the US cant develope its own players and that we need to steal players from other countries???

those are the extremists, but they do exsist on here and they will make those comments. they will make those comments yet forget about all the kids that were born in the US or spent significant time in the US as kids, yet switched sides to play for Canada (Kozun, Couturier, Myers, Erixon-Sweden, Foligno, etc).

the lines between the US and Canada are starting to get blured even more, and within the next decade I think there is going to be more bidding wars for these dual citizen players. More jobs then ever seem to be bouncing around between North America, and where the parents go so to go the children.

The US hockey development program is making strides in molding some very good upcoming talents. Hockey Canada (CHL) is still the #1 North American prospect system by far right now. In terms of talent coming out of the CHL as opposed to NCAA. The US is catching up though and in my opinion could surpass the Hockey Canada within the next 10 years. The idea of getting education mixed in with playing hockey is an attractive program that will continue to catch the eyes of many upcoming prospects. In a society that is now "education" orientated I look for many U.S prospects to emerge as the program continues to get better.
 

birddog*

Guest
B's grabbed Valabik in the Wheeler/Stuart/Peverley deal, and he's expected to be that monster-to-learn-from-Chara guy.

So I don't think they grab Oleksiak unless they believe he's the bpa at that slot.

Valabik isn't expected to be anything -- he passed through waivers this year.
 

birddog*

Guest
Quick question here, hopefully you guys have an answer for me. I see that Jamie Oleksiak is listed as a Canadian on CSS' Rankings, but he played for the US in the Ivan Hlinka tournament and also tried out for the US in this year's WJC. All indications from that information would lead me to believe that he has chosen to represent the US in international play until I read an article on him on ESPNBoston's site that stated,



Does the site have this correct that he's not locked in to playing for the US or is this ESPN's "great knowledge" of hockey showing again?

Not uncommon for players that can't make team Canada suit up for other nations. This has happened with many kids in the past.
 

Bjorn Le

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May 17, 2010
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you really need to stop typing this nonsense.

now all of a sudden you have a residency in Brett Hull's head and heart. you now know who he would rather have played for because you apparently know more then the rest of us.

I am sure since 1987 (which he has stated numerous times), that he never looked back when it comes to playing for Canada. Hull made his choice as he had the bloodlines to do so, mom is American and spent over half his youth in the states as well...

USA hockey was not in the same shape back then as it is now, most American players were embarassed at times to represent their country with how second rate things where run. Saying that Canada was his #1 because of birth right is silly because the gap between the two (US and Canada) was so gigantic that almost every player with a dual citizenship would want to play for the winner over the loser.

If USA Hockey was as sturdy back then as it is now, who knows if Hull would have tried out for Canada first...

As for Oleksiak, he seems to be the reverse Tyler Myers and looks to be sticking with the US, as he has the bloodlines to do so. Canada will be making a big push for him, I have zero doubt, but he seems to want to stay loyal to the US as his comments from not making the US WJC team have indicated. Jamie said he is more motivated then ever to make the US team next year, and if you read the article it really shows his passion for playing for the US. It is only an article and not the bible, but it looks like a good start for the man child.

Your posts get more ridiculous every time you post, you read one thing and if it doesn't agree with your American agenda you fly off the handle and make absurd statements you have no buisness making.

First off, Hull wanted to play for Canada, that's obvious, he's even said it, it was his country, but back then Canada didn't take players in Hulls situation so he tried out for the US and made it. Of course players will say they have no regrets, but you're feeble minded if you think given the choice he would still pick the US. That's common sense, he grew up Canadian, the only time he speant in the US was when Bobby was still playing in Chicago, and that was only 6 or 7 years, so half the year for those years isn't half his youth. The rest was speant in Canada untill he left at 18 for University and the NCAA. Hes not some average dual-citzenship person, his mom (Who moved to Canada with Brett) is the only reason he has US citzenship.

And on Oleksiak, given the choice there is definitely a possibilty he picks Canada. You said it yourself, nothing concrete has been said yet, just some comments.
 

AmericanDream

Thank you Elon!
Oct 24, 2005
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Your posts get more ridiculous every time you post, you read one thing and if it doesn't agree with your American agenda you fly off the handle and make absurd statements you have no buisness making.

First off, Hull wanted to play for Canada, that's obvious, he's even said it, it was his country, but back then Canada didn't take players in Hulls situation so he tried out for the US and made it. Of course players will say they have no regrets, but you're feeble minded if you think given the choice he would still pick the US. That's common sense, he grew up Canadian, the only time he speant in the US was when Bobby was still playing in Chicago, and that was only 6 or 7 years, so half the year for those years isn't half his youth. The rest was speant in Canada untill he left at 18 for University and the NCAA. Hes not some average dual-citzenship person, his mom (Who moved to Canada with Brett) is the only reason he has US citzenship.

And on Oleksiak, given the choice there is definitely a possibilty he picks Canada. You said it yourself, nothing concrete has been said yet, just some comments.

if you want to say my posts are getting more ridiculous, that is fine, but you have to look in the mirror and realize you have a hidden agenda on your own. though I do have a life, and dont feel like pulling up all your old quotes, you go far out of your way to discredit Brett Hull and Alex Galchenyuk on this site.

it seems you have a problem with any player that picks USA Hockey that didnt spend most of their life or was not born in the US. you have made that perfectly clear. you are going out of your way with comments about Galchenyuk, and you have done it numerous times with Hull. it is either mere hatred or jealousy, not sure which yet.

you speak in absolutes all the time and act like you know everything and situation as fact. sadly, you dont. I dont have to worry about why Brett Hull picked the US, because history has him in a US sweater and not a Candian one, and I can sleep at night knowing he is one of the greatest American hockey players ever. I know that irks you when I wrote that. but it is fact. the kid spent much of his young life in the US, played college hockey in the US, and if the US actually had a well run program, you sure he wouldnt have picked the US from the start? you cant say for sure and neither can I.. he also spent more then 6 years in the US, he came to the US often with his mom and her family...it wasnt as clear cut as you make it out to be.

as for Oleksiak, yes he could pick Canada. he has that birthright and bloodline to do so. but from his comments and his inclusion to last years US WJC camp, I find it doubtful that he would go that road. he has spent a good portion of his young adult life in the US, and with a US born father, he might consider himself more American then Canadian.

if he picks the US, does he continue to draw your wrath like some of the others? if he picks Canada, then God bless him, I wish the best of him but I will not discredit what he has chosen because he has that right to.
 
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BluechipBulletin

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it seems you have a problem with any player that picks USA Hockey that didnt spend most of their life or was not born in the US.

To be fair, that's becoming less and less common. These days, Team USA is going more toward US-born, US-trained American players. They've gotten past the point where they rely on Canadians with dual-citizenship, and that's only going to become more and more the case over time.

I think the most interesting development in recent years is that the tide has shifted in the other direction, with Canada taking Americans.
 

Bjorn Le

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May 17, 2010
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if you want to say my posts are getting more ridiculous, that is fine, but you have to look in the mirror and realize you have a hidden agenda on your own. though I do have a life, and dont feel like pulling up all your old quotes, you go far out of your way to discredit Brett Hull and Alex Galchenyuk on this site.

it seems you have a problem with any player that picks USA Hockey that didnt spend most of their life or was not born in the US. you have made that perfectly clear. you are going out of your way with comments about Galchenyuk, and you have done it numerous times with Hull. it is either mere hatred or jealousy, not sure which yet.

you speak in absolutes all the time and act like you know everything and situation as fact. sadly, you dont. I dont have to worry about why Brett Hull picked the US, because history has him in a US sweater and not a Candian one, and I can sleep at night knowing he is one of the greatest American hockey players ever. I know that irks you when I wrote that. but it is fact. the kid spent much of his young life in the US, played college hockey in the US, and if the US actually had a well run program, you sure he wouldnt have picked the US from the start? you cant say for sure and neither can I.. he also spent more then 6 years in the US, he came to the US often with his mom and her family...it wasnt as clear cut as you make it out to be.

as for Oleksiak, yes he could pick Canada. he has that birthright and bloodline to do so. but from his comments and his inclusion to last years US WJC camp, I find it doubtful that he would go that road. he has spent a good portion of his young adult life in the US, and with a US born father, he might consider himself more American then Canadian.

if he picks the US, does he continue to draw your wrath like some of the others? if he picks Canada, then God bless him, I wish the best of him but I will not discredit what he has chosen because he has that right to.

You contradict yourself in your two parts. Obviously Oleksiak is more American then Canadian, but so was Myers. In your above post about Hull, you try to put him off as more American than Oleksiak. He speant the majority of his childhood in Canada, spending the off seasons in Bellville till age 6 or 7 when he moved full time to Canada, where he grew up, went to school, played hockey. So what if he visted family in the US, plenty of people did that. Why would a person like that feel more American then Canadian, his mother was American yet she lived in Canada and I believe still does.

His case is similar to Foligno except Nick Foligno's mother was Canadian. He played for the US because he thought he could never make Team Canada, Hull accepted the US roster spot because of that reason after Team Canada wouldn't take him due to him playing in the NCAA. You can think of Hull as American, but just because you put on the jersey doesn't mean its who you are, or in a more literal sense, even as a hockey player because Hull is almost completely Canadian trained. Is Trottier American? He wore the US sweater, but he's Canadian trained.

Oleksiak obviously is American, more so then Hull and others, but there's a good chance if Canada offers him the spot he'll take it.
 

bluechipbonzo

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Feb 12, 2010
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if you want to say my posts are getting more ridiculous, that is fine, but you have to look in the mirror and realize you have a hidden agenda on your own. though I do have a life, and dont feel like pulling up all your old quotes, you go far out of your way to discredit Brett Hull and Alex Galchenyuk on this site.

it seems you have a problem with any player that picks USA Hockey that didnt spend most of their life or was not born in the US. you have made that perfectly clear. you are going out of your way with comments about Galchenyuk, and you have done it numerous times with Hull. it is either mere hatred or jealousy, not sure which yet.

you speak in absolutes all the time and act like you know everything and situation as fact. sadly, you dont. I dont have to worry about why Brett Hull picked the US, because history has him in a US sweater and not a Candian one, and I can sleep at night knowing he is one of the greatest American hockey players ever. I know that irks you when I wrote that. but it is fact. the kid spent much of his young life in the US, played college hockey in the US, and if the US actually had a well run program, you sure he wouldnt have picked the US from the start? you cant say for sure and neither can I.. he also spent more then 6 years in the US, he came to the US often with his mom and her family...it wasnt as clear cut as you make it out to be.

as for Oleksiak, yes he could pick Canada. he has that birthright and bloodline to do so. but from his comments and his inclusion to last years US WJC camp, I find it doubtful that he would go that road. he has spent a good portion of his young adult life in the US, and with a US born father, he might consider himself more American then Canadian.

if he picks the US, does he continue to draw your wrath like some of the others? if he picks Canada, then God bless him, I wish the best of him but I will not discredit what he has chosen because he has that right to.

So what you're saying is, is that Americans invented hockey, and are better at it than Canadians.

:laugh:
 

Qvist

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Apr 14, 2009
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Excellent analysis. Considering his skating ability relative to his size though, I could see Oleksiak find his way into that subgroup of five and be a top six d-man someday.

Well, the main point of the analysis you think is excellent is that skating ability relative to size doesn't seem to be much of an indicator of likely success. :)
 

Qvist

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Apr 14, 2009
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why even make this comparison?

Valabik simply could not skate, he was drafted on mere size. Same goes for Joe Finley.

Nobody is drafted in the first round on mere size - let alone in the top 10.

As said, being a good skater for his size is the most common reason why big defensemen with relatively undeveloped games get picked in the first round. If you want a credible separator between Oleksiak and the plethora of big blueline 1st round busts over the past two decades, it's not going to be skating, alone or mainly.

I haven't seen Oleksiak play, but it sounds to me from descriptions that a better reason to like him as a mid-1st selection is a relatively developed overall game to go along with his size and skating.
 

BluechipBulletin

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Mar 22, 2011
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Nobody is drafted in the first round on mere size - let alone in the top 10.

As said, being a good skater for his size is the most common reason why big defensemen with relatively undeveloped games get picked in the first round. If you want a credible separator between Oleksiak and the plethora of big blueline 1st round busts over the past two decades, it's not going to be skating, alone or mainly.

I haven't seen Oleksiak play, but it sounds to me from descriptions that a better reason to like him as a mid-1st selection is a relatively developed overall game to go along with his size and skating.

If you don't think players are drafted on size alone, you need to go back and look at the NHL Draft from 1999 to the lockout. An embarrassing number of total plugs who happened to have size were taken. And yes, some in the top 10.

The thing you have to remember about Oleksiak is that he's not a guy who is just about size. When Oleksiak was on that Toronto Young Nats midget team with Seguin and Skinner, Oleksiak was 6'0" 170lbs. He was a smooth-skating defensive defenseman. Then he hit a growth spurt and grew 7 inches and 75lbs.

He's still learning to play the dominant physical game because he didn't always have the size that he does now. That's quite a bit different than a guy who always had the size and is trying to work on his skating and whatnot. You can train Oleksiak to be physically dominating, but you can't train Valabik to be a smooth skater.
 

AmericanDream

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Oct 24, 2005
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You contradict yourself in your two parts. Obviously Oleksiak is more American then Canadian, but so was Myers. In your above post about Hull, you try to put him off as more American than Oleksiak. He speant the majority of his childhood in Canada, spending the off seasons in Bellville till age 6 or 7 when he moved full time to Canada, where he grew up, went to school, played hockey. So what if he visted family in the US, plenty of people did that. Why would a person like that feel more American then Canadian, his mother was American yet she lived in Canada and I believe still does.

His case is similar to Foligno except Nick Foligno's mother was Canadian. He played for the US because he thought he could never make Team Canada, Hull accepted the US roster spot because of that reason after Team Canada wouldn't take him due to him playing in the NCAA. You can think of Hull as American, but just because you put on the jersey doesn't mean its who you are, or in a more literal sense, even as a hockey player because Hull is almost completely Canadian trained. Is Trottier American? He wore the US sweater, but he's Canadian trained.

Oleksiak obviously is American, more so then Hull and others, but there's a good chance if Canada offers him the spot he'll take it.

listen, I am going to end this because I dont want this turning into something even more stupid then it already has become. I stand by what I have said about your comments towards players that picked the US over other countries. for whatever the reason it irks you, and you go out of your way to make snide remarks and find ways to bring them down as players as well as their accomplishments.

as for who picks what country, or who is more American or Canadian, you lost me there. I dont care where Nick Foligno spent most of his life, he picked the US and that is the end of it. I dont care where Tyler Myers spent the majority of his life. He picked Canada and thats the end of it.

I think you have an issue with players being able to make the choice of what country to play for, and I simply dont. As long as you have the birth right or bloodlines to do so, then that is fine with me. I dont care that Kozun, Olsen, and Couturier all picked Canada to play for despite being all born in the US. they had the right to play for whichever country they wish, but you never comment about those players that were born in the US yet now call Canada home.

Brett Hull, Adam Deadmarsh, Cam Fowler, Mike Knuble, Patrick Eaves, Patrick O'Sullivan, etc are all American players in my eyes and nothing else. They all chose to play for the US despite being born in Canada. Some of them spent under a year or two in Canada if that, but it is their birth place. All of Brett Hull's brothers were born in the US, with Brett just missing out..he is surrounded by more Americans then you know.

Alex Galchenyuk is a terrific kid and player. If he picks the US, I would be excited as he is a legit top line forward. He has the right to pick the US because of his birth and the time spent here. If he doesnt pick the US, so be it, I still love the kid. I dont want to hear your expert theroies about what this kids reasons are for picking the US, because you dont know where his heart is. I have talked to him in the past, kid always said he loved it here, but I never fully considered him an American partly because of his accent and the way his family was around the rink (both my reasons were petty and ignorant by the way). But none of that matters, all that matters is that little thing on his birth certificate that says Milwaukee Wisoonsin, USA.

Maybe you dont realize it POG, but you have an attitude towards Hull, Galchenyuk, and a lot of other Americans. I am a homer for US hockey, zero doubt, but I still respect many Canadian kids every single year. Hall and Skinner were kids I touted bigtime last year. And this year Ty Rattie, Couturier, Michael St Croix, Boone Jenner, etc have all been favorites of mine. Really cant find anything positive you have said about an American player......ever.:(
 

Bjorn Le

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May 17, 2010
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You are so ignorant it's not funny. I can't help but laugh reading through that, you have an extremely warped view of nationality, and you drag it further off topic by going on a rant having to use personal attacks to do it.

I'll only adress the parts I was talking. Brett was born in the Bellville where he the Hull family speant their off seasons. It wasn't "luck". His brothers were born in the US while Bobby played in the NHL. At age 6 or 7, Brett moves back to Canada full time, and lives there full time in various Canadian cities playing in various Canadian minor hockey programs, before at age 18 going to the US to play in the NCAA where he was offered a scholarship. He was completely Canadian untill the National team snubbed him and Team USA quickly offered him a spot.

You can call him American, but anyone who has a clue about him wouldn't, he's Canadian trained and born. That's pretty pathetic if you need those players to be on your list of top Americans ever. Top players to put on Team USA jersey? Sure, you can include Trottier too, but top American player, not even close.
 

AmericanDream

Thank you Elon!
Oct 24, 2005
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Chicago Manitoba
You are so ignorant it's not funny. I can't help but laugh reading through that, you have an extremely warped view of nationality, and you drag it further off topic by going on a rant having to use personal attacks to do it.

I'll only adress the parts I was talking. Brett was born in the Bellville where he the Hull family speant their off seasons. It wasn't "luck". His brothers were born in the US while Bobby played in the NHL. At age 6 or 7, Brett moves back to Canada full time, and lives there full time in various Canadian cities playing in various Canadian minor hockey programs, before at age 18 going to the US to play in the NCAA where he was offered a scholarship. He was completely Canadian untill the National team snubbed him and Team USA quickly offered him a spot.

You can call him American, but anyone who has a clue about him wouldn't, he's Canadian trained and born. That's pretty pathetic if you need those players to be on your list of top Americans ever. Top players to put on Team USA jersey? Sure, you can include Trottier too, but top American player, not even close.

and the ignorance continues....

not going to talk with brick walls anymore.
 

Bjorn Le

Hobocop
May 17, 2010
19,593
610
Martinaise, Revachol
and the ignorance continues....

not going to talk with brick walls anymore.

When your posts stop being rants you're accepting you're wrong but you won't admit it so you resort to an attack on the character of the person who proved that you're wrong.

You know I'm right about Hull which is why you didn't push it further. Thanks for affirming me ;)
 

BluechipBulletin

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Mar 22, 2011
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You are so ignorant it's not funny. I can't help but laugh reading through that, you have an extremely warped view of nationality, and you drag it further off topic by going on a rant having to use personal attacks to do it.

When your posts stop being rants you're accepting you're wrong but you won't admit it so you resort to an attack on the character of the person who proved that you're wrong.

The irony here is so thick that they could build fallout shelters out of it.
 

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