I don't follow other teams enough to provide suggestions since it wouldn't be an easy deal to negotiate. I would say that an offensive team might be willing to move a vet (27+ year old) with 2-3 seasons remaining for Rieder (23) and Perlini (20) who have plenty of years ahead of them. Rieder is a good Defensive forward and Perlini could turn out to be a pretty solid player.
Confirmed with Link: Lawson Crouse and Dave Bolland for 2nd and 3rd picks
- Thread starter PhoPhan
- Start date
I don't follow other teams enough to provide suggestions since it wouldn't be an easy deal to negotiate. I would say that an offensive team might be willing to move a vet (27+ year old) with 2-3 seasons remaining for Rieder (23) and Perlini (20) who have plenty of years ahead of them. Rieder is a good Defensive forward and Perlini could turn out to be a pretty solid player.
Bonsai Tree
Turning a new leaf
- Feb 2, 2014
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Man, Crouse's value has tanked around these parts in the last few days. You'd think some teams are jealous of the Yotes
Severe case of Phoenix envy.
rt
The Kinder, Gentler Version
Man, Crouse's value has tanked around these parts in the last few days. You'd think some teams are jealous of the Yotes
He was called a bust by about nine different posters on the main thread. He turned eighteen two months ago. 14 months ago he was the 11th overall pick in the draft and not one scout Bob McKenzie polled had him lower than 10th overall, with one having him 5th overall. Since then, he's played one season in which he improved both offensively and defensively and took on a larger leadership role on a now Sam Bennettless team in Kingston. But he's a bust.
rt
The Kinder, Gentler Version
Matias Maccete
Chopping up defenses
- Sep 21, 2014
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Probably similar to how domi was a puck hog who got carried by reinhart, dvorak is carried by marner, strome just sucks, duke was also carried by reinhart,
. Lots of haterade flowing, but overall the trade thread is mostly just props to chayka and saying how stacked our forward prospect pool is.
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Exactly. Toughness is not about fighting and Crouse and Fischerwill both add a lot of much needed toughness to our lineup in the near future.
RemoAZ
Let it burn
Fighting is getting less and less anyway. I want guys that will get physical with the other team's stars when they go after ours. We have several guys in the system that can do that now. Just need to get them on the roster and in the lineup.
I'm sorry but you are completely off on this one. Rieder is worth much then a 2nd round pick. People really need to stop camparing players value based on points. Although that method seems to be the number one way hf boards tends to rate players, nhl teams looking to make deals to improve their team look at a player as a whole. NHL teams watch live games and film to determine players value. The hold out definitely changes some perspective but let's see how things play out before jumping into conclusions. Rieder may not be that all star too line forward but he is tremendously valuable to our team or another team for that matter.
Man, Crouse's value has tanked around these parts in the last few days. You'd think some teams are jealous of the Yotes
How true.
Going back in time and showing the board the future (without context) would be absolutely hysterical:
I knew Stamkos would like it in Arizona
IMO, he's very capable of handling top pairing minutes and he would significantly bolster our right side, even if a potential deal involves Stone. That still leaves Trouba and Murphy taking ~50 minutes on the right, with your choice of Schenn, Michalek, or maybe DeAngelo filling out the rest.
Obviously Connor Murphy has shown he can hold down the 1RD slot, and he has nice chemistry with OEL, but I think that's more of a nice stopgap than a full-time solution.
As far as Trouba, there's a lot to like. Size, nastiness, shutdown ability, strong skater, great shot, and IMO a fair amount of offensive potential he has yet to reach.
Funny you should mention this. Following the trade, the two were on a line together at the BioSteel camp this week.
So true. If Rieder was a top 15 pick and had the same exact season or even a worse one, posters on here would be asking the moon in return for Rieder. Dvorak is a perfect example of that. If he was a top 5 pick the. He would have been a top 3 prospect to almost everyone.
DT said he doesn't care where or what year the player was drafted, it is what they do on the ice. A good example was Gormley. Posters wanted the Yotes to play him, and the team didn't for various reasons.
Can you give me some info on this BioSteel camp? I have not heard of it until this week.
Do you believe Rieder has top line potential? That's what many expect a top 15 pick to grow into or 2nd line. Rieder is a nice 3rd liner who can play 2nd line when needed on a short term basis. Every team has one or two of him. His points total looked better last year as he was getting time he probably won't be getting going forward. Apparently the Coyotes also agree as they won't give him the contract he desires. Could he become more? Of course but it's more likely he doesn't.
Drink the Pink does this each of the last 4 or five summers. Some high end talent getting together to do a high end training camp. Biznasty has been on Champ team last 4 years!!!!
http://www.torontosun.com/2016/08/2...-biosteel-camp-represents-state-of-pro-hockey
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/seguin-secret-weapon-stop-mcdavid-biosteel-camp/
http://www.torontosun.com/2016/08/2...-biosteel-camp-represents-state-of-pro-hockey
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/seguin-secret-weapon-stop-mcdavid-biosteel-camp/
PhoPhan
Registered User
- Feb 27, 2002
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Over the last 10 seasons, 39 wings have scored between 30 and 40 points in their first or second seasons (three of them did it twice). Some of those players (Blake Wheeler, Phil Kessel, James Neal) blossomed into first line players. More of those players (Steve Bernier, Magnus Paajarvi, Colby Armstrong) remained bottom six players.
Few of these players were traded as early as we're proposing Rieder would be, but some comparables:
Peter Mueller (traded at age 21 with Kevin Porter for Wojtech Wolski)
Magnus Paajarvi (traded at age 22 with a 2nd rounder for David Perron)
James Van Riemsdyk (traded at age 23 for Luke Schenn)
TJ Galiardi (traded at age 23 with Daniel Winnik and a 7th rounder for Jamie McGinn, Michael Connolly and Michael Sgarbossa)
Steve Bernier (traded at age 22 with a 1st rounder for Brian Campbell and a 7th rounder, then traded at age 23 for a 2nd and a 3rd)
Every case is unique, of course, but the that Rieder lacks size or a first-round pedigree and is holding out all work against his trade value. He's a fine player and has a place on this team in the short term, but every team has at least one or two guys of his ilk, and I don't see much of a bidding war for him. Defensively responsible players capable of scoring 30-40 points are not typically hard to come by.
rt
The Kinder, Gentler Version
Sucks that neither hockey reference nor NHL.com are able to pull data from multiple tables. I want a list of players who put up >40pts and >2minSHTIOG - which I think is a reasonable projection for Rieder. I suspect top PK+40ish pts guys are fairly rare. Especially excluding star players. So maybe 40-60pts range to eliminate those guys (Kopitar, etc). It'd be easy enough to pull both, and dump them into a data sheet and highlight duplicates but not on an iPhone. Haha.
PhoPhan
Registered User
- Feb 27, 2002
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Man, Crouse's value has tanked around these parts in the last few days. You'd think some teams are jealous of the Yotes
He's always been a divisive prospect. I can't find my rankings from last year, but I think I had him in the 15-20 range. Others had him top 5. He was probably the most polarizing player of his class.
He showed improvement at both ends, but I think he's still in that 15-20 range from the 2015 crop. Players of his ilk tend to be overvalued on draft day, so I think the top 10 talk (or even 11, where he went) was too much, but I also don't think he's Tyler Biggs or Tom Wilson. His production projects him as a third or probably fourth liner, but there were some extenuating circumstances (namely a dearth of offensive talent to play with) that make me a little more optimistic that he could exceed that. He produced noticeably better during the stretch he played with Sam Bennett and Spencer Watson.
In short, he'll never be a player who can carry a line, but he's a physical difference-maker with enough skill that he won't weigh down a second line. With the abundance of undersized forwards in the pipeline, he's a very good fit for this team.
PhoPhan
Registered User
- Feb 27, 2002
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While I agree Rieder has above average defensive ability, it's worth noting here that the Coyotes were 28th in the league in penalty killing last year. They've let up the most powerplay goals each of the last two seasons. On a good or even mediocre team, Rieder's penalty killing role is diminished. He was on the Coyotes 2nd unit for most of the year, and I suspect he'd be on the 3rd for most teams. I know Tippett has compared him to Jere Lehtinen, but he's got a ways to go before he's on that level.
rt
The Kinder, Gentler Version
Just as I'm projecting 40ish points I'm also projecting top 4 fwd mins on the PK. Maybe 2+ was overly optimistic. >40pts + <60pts + >90secs SHTOI/G is probably more like it.
As well, he was one of Canada's best players at last year's WJC. Now, that wasn't a great team, particularly compared to past Canadian rosters, but I think Crouse was probably Canada's third best player or so after Strome and Konecny (he had a good tournament if memory serves).
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