Kyle Turris-Is he Crazy?

[thomasincanada]

Thank you. Back to the topic at hand: possibility of Turris going 1st overall?

It's not out of the question - but I'd be a tad surprised. No matter how talented the player is, there is always a risk that a players skills won't translate to the next level. The lower the league that the player is in, the greater the risk and Turris, like it or not, is in what most consider a "lesser" league right now.

 

[Transported Upstater]

Thank you. Back to the topic at hand: possibility of Turris going 1st overall?

I personally think it's possible, but not likely.

It's not out of the question - but I'd be a tad surprised. No matter how talented the player is, there is always a risk that a players skills won't translate to the next level. The lower the league that the player is in, the greater the risk and Turris, like it or not, is in what most consider a "lesser" league right now.

Well said.

 

[hawksfan50]

While the BCHL is only JR A ,not MAJOR JR. --there is onne HUGE difference--the BCHL allows 6 overagers per team--the CHL 3 leagues only allow 3 per team--thus theaverage age of BCHL teams is a lot older than the CHL....that alone makes up some of the talent depth "gap" and consequent difficulty of play between the
CHL leagues vs the BCHL...there are simply more 16 and17 year olds playing in the CHL leagues than in the BCHL and more 20 and 21 year olds playing in the BCHL...
Admittedly,I agree that the BCHL is not the calibre of the 3 Major Jr. leagues -but that doesn't mean that a good BCHL team couldn't beat a bottom feeder team from any of the 3 major Jr.leagurs--thus the perceived gap is that great a factor--especially when you look at how well some BCHL grads have done vs. even older
players in the NCAA,or even some BCHL grads doing very well in the WHL (eg. take Mark Santorelli who has 72 points so far in his WHL rookie season as an 18 year old
--only 5 points back of the WHL 5th place scoring leader--but most of the wHL scoring leaders above him are older than him --yet last season as a 17 year old in the BCHL,his stats were very far below what KYLE TURRIS has accomplished as a 17 year old in the BCHL this year--projected on that basis of how well Santrorelli has done in the perceived much higher calibre league that the WHL is supposed to be
one could project that TURRIS would tear up the WHL with even more PPG than he has done in the BCHL this year! So -it is very dangerous to say that any particular player should be marked down only because of the alleged easier league he plays in
---rather I would look at what is the player doing relative to the scoring leaders of his league vs. the AGE differences among the scoring leaders....When you factor that way--Turris as a 17 year old leading the BCHL at 2.3PPG (a full 1.0 PPG MORE than he had last year as a 16 yr old =showing real IMPROVEMENT and PROGRESSION) compared to the others in the top ten of BCHL scoring (most of whom are 2 and 3 years older than him) and there is just no way you should mark Turris down just because he only plays in the BCHL ...WE can look at SAM GAGNER also doing very well (currently 4th --actually tied in points with Kostitsyn who ranks 3rd by virtue of more goals scored) as a 17 year old dominating in the OHL--BUT he also has Kostitsyn and Pat Kane as linemates--and there isn't any other Jr. team in canada with that much talent on 1 line--so do you mark GAGNER down a bit for that factor of who he plays with?

There is no guarantee that ANY JR. will "translate" his game to the next level (meaning NHL) -but it is false to say that TURRIS can't translate his game to similar or EVEN GREATER success at the CHL level if he had chosen that route instead of BCHL+NCAA : 1. Because of what a lesser talent than Turris like Santorelli has proved ... and 2: Because if Turris improved so much from 16 to 17 --why not also improve from 17 to 18? So that,if say Turris instead would play in the WHL next season who can say with certainty he could not dominate WHL scoring?--there is no
proof he could not--especially when as an 18 year old he'llplay against more 16 and 17 year olds tan he faced last year in the BCHL! On the other hand--what if GAGNER plays in London next year as an 18 yearold-but his buddy line-mates Kane and Kostitsyn are not there (Kostitsyn in MTL or AHL, and KANE perhaps like Kessel
joins a bottom feeder NHL roster as a soon to be 19 yr old)--could GAGNER even maintain his present scoring pace without those talents on his line next year?

My point is -it is ABSURD to mark down TURRIS just because he plays in the BCHL and issue silly statements like QMJHL/WHL/OHL star (fill in a name) would score
200 points if he played in the BCHL--maybe not-since he might not have as good talent to play with on his line---maybe not as he faces a much older group of players on average...

In the NFL scouting system--they often think it irrelevant what level a guy plays at
whether comparing Divison levels or even leagues i the same Div 1 (ie, wheher a guy plays bigtie football at Notre Dame or plays for an Ivy League team)--they just look at combine results (measuring physical traits and ahleticism ) AND what their scouts see in terms of football SKILLS --level of competition is not that great a factor in assesing the talent...THAT is what is should be in hockey too---but because some
faulty thinking based on a bad premise too many teams passed on ANZE KOPITAR
because they somehow downgraded him because after all he came out of Slovenia --not a traditional hockey nation;and now we have to put up with the nonesense that TURRIS can't be ranked higher than (fil in the blank) because after all he only plays in the BCHL...instead of judging the talent for what it actually is --we are getting old fossil thinking that makes GENERALIZATIONS that might be far off the mark,but even if overall were true in respect to difficulty of competition --STILL CANNOT ACCOUNT FOR THE EXCEPTIONS TO THE GENERAL RULE...either way it is an absurd argument now to downgrade any player because of where he plays...JUST LOOK AT WHAT HE DOES ON THE ICE and where he stacks up vs. others in his league and accounting for AGE differences and for whether he mostly by himself enhances the talent he plays with on his team or whether he is just reaping the benefits of a very talented supporting cast...when you judge all this together-THEN make your ranking..but NEVER downgrade on some perceived generalization about about the "level of competition" (whatever that means).

here is one more example>>>>at the Canada Winter Games --Team Ontario composed of "star" OHL'ers under 17 (albeit without John Tavares ) had to squeak by Manitoba 'u-17 team for the Championship even though that team had only 6 WHL'ers (all d-men) --TeamManitoba had to rely on Triple AAA Midgets to complete its forward lines plus some other talent like David Toews who plays at Shattucks St Mary's prep school in the USA...Toews scored 2 goals vs. the "star" oHL'ers...can anyone say that the OHL is so vastly superior that it should have dominated the "weaker" Manitoba squad (in the first game they played --Manitoba got into penalty troubleand paid for it --but in the Championship game --though Ontario wan it wasn't a blow-out)--but my point is: could anyone mark down Toews vs. the Ontario "stars" because after all he only plays prep school hockey which is not as competitive as the oHL? -- IT IS AN ABSURD ARGUMENT! Similarly,you cannot use that argument vs. TURRIS! Generalizations about leagues as a whole have ZERO
merit when applied to any PARTICULAR player case...judge the kid of his talent --he can't help it where he plays--and there is no proof he would not ALSO succeeed at the CHL level if not dominate that league too..

 

[Canadian Chris]

here is one more example>>>>at the Canada Winter Games --Team Ontario composed of "star" OHL'ers under 17 (albeit without John Tavares ) had to squeak by Manitoba 'u-17 team for the Championship even though that team had only 6 WHL'ers (all d-men) ..

not to totally nitpick, BUT, they also had Dale Hunt, who plays for the Prince George Cougars...who for the time being, are still in the WHL.....lol

 

[elvisisalive]

Jeepers 50, do you ever read what you are writing? You can't honestly believe all that gobblygook you're spewing. Wow, so what if the BChl has more overagers allowed. They are still overagers not good enough to play in the WHL, just more pylons for Turris to go around. To say a good BCHL team is better than a lower WHL team is laughable. Even if they are a lower WHL team, they are still WHL quality players, vrs any BCHL team which at best might have one or 2. I know you love Turris but give it a rest. You are really stretching it this time.

 

[Alter Haudegen]

While the BCHL is only JR A ,not MAJOR JR. --there is onne HUGE difference--the BCHL allows 6 overagers per team--the CHL 3 leagues only allow 3 per team--thus theaverage age of BCHL teams is a lot older than the CHL....that alone makes up some of the talent depth "gap" and consequent difficulty of play between the
CHL leagues vs the BCHL...there are simply more 16 and17 year olds playing in the CHL leagues than in the BCHL and more 20 and 21 year olds playing in the BCHL...
Admittedly,I agree that the BCHL is not the calibre of the 3 Major Jr. leagues -but that doesn't mean that a good BCHL team couldn't beat a bottom feeder team from any of the 3 major Jr.leagurs--thus the perceived gap is that great a factor--especially when you look at how well some BCHL grads have done vs. even older
players in the NCAA,or even some BCHL grads doing very well in the WHL (eg. take Mark Santorelli who has 72 points so far in his WHL rookie season as an 18 year old
--only 5 points back of the WHL 5th place scoring leader--but most of the wHL scoring leaders above him are older than him --yet last season as a 17 year old in the BCHL,his stats were very far below what KYLE TURRIS has accomplished as a 17 year old in the BCHL this year--projected on that basis of how well Santrorelli has done in the perceived much higher calibre league that the WHL is supposed to be
one could project that TURRIS would tear up the WHL with even more PPG than he has done in the BCHL this year! So -it is very dangerous to say that any particular player should be marked down only because of the alleged easier league he plays in
---rather I would look at what is the player doing relative to the scoring leaders of his league vs. the AGE differences among the scoring leaders....When you factor that way--Turris as a 17 year old leading the BCHL at 2.3PPG (a full 1.0 PPG MORE than he had last year as a 16 yr old =showing real IMPROVEMENT and PROGRESSION) compared to the others in the top ten of BCHL scoring (most of whom are 2 and 3 years older than him) and there is just no way you should mark Turris down just because he only plays in the BCHL ...WE can look at SAM GAGNER also doing very well (currently 4th --actually tied in points with Kostitsyn who ranks 3rd by virtue of more goals scored) as a 17 year old dominating in the OHL--BUT he also has Kostitsyn and Pat Kane as linemates--and there isn't any other Jr. team in canada with that much talent on 1 line--so do you mark GAGNER down a bit for that factor of who he plays with?

There is no guarantee that ANY JR. will "translate" his game to the next level (meaning NHL) -but it is false to say that TURRIS can't translate his game to similar or EVEN GREATER success at the CHL level if he had chosen that route instead of BCHL+NCAA : 1. Because of what a lesser talent than Turris like Santorelli has proved ... and 2: Because if Turris improved so much from 16 to 17 --why not also improve from 17 to 18? So that,if say Turris instead would play in the WHL next season who can say with certainty he could not dominate WHL scoring?--there is no
proof he could not--especially when as an 18 year old he'llplay against more 16 and 17 year olds tan he faced last year in the BCHL! On the other hand--what if GAGNER plays in London next year as an 18 yearold-but his buddy line-mates Kane and Kostitsyn are not there (Kostitsyn in MTL or AHL, and KANE perhaps like Kessel
joins a bottom feeder NHL roster as a soon to be 19 yr old)--could GAGNER even maintain his present scoring pace without those talents on his line next year?

My point is -it is ABSURD to mark down TURRIS just because he plays in the BCHL and issue silly statements like QMJHL/WHL/OHL star (fill in a name) would score
200 points if he played in the BCHL--maybe not-since he might not have as good talent to play with on his line---maybe not as he faces a much older group of players on average...

In the NFL scouting system--they often think it irrelevant what level a guy plays at
whether comparing Divison levels or even leagues i the same Div 1 (ie, wheher a guy plays bigtie football at Notre Dame or plays for an Ivy League team)--they just look at combine results (measuring physical traits and ahleticism ) AND what their scouts see in terms of football SKILLS --level of competition is not that great a factor in assesing the talent...THAT is what is should be in hockey too---but because some
faulty thinking based on a bad premise too many teams passed on ANZE KOPITAR
because they somehow downgraded him because after all he came out of Slovenia --not a traditional hockey nation;and now we have to put up with the nonesense that TURRIS can't be ranked higher than (fil in the blank) because after all he only plays in the BCHL...instead of judging the talent for what it actually is --we are getting old fossil thinking that makes GENERALIZATIONS that might be far off the mark,but even if overall were true in respect to difficulty of competition --STILL CANNOT ACCOUNT FOR THE EXCEPTIONS TO THE GENERAL RULE...either way it is an absurd argument now to downgrade any player because of where he plays...JUST LOOK AT WHAT HE DOES ON THE ICE and where he stacks up vs. others in his league and accounting for AGE differences and for whether he mostly by himself enhances the talent he plays with on his team or whether he is just reaping the benefits of a very talented supporting cast...when you judge all this together-THEN make your ranking..but NEVER downgrade on some perceived generalization about about the "level of competition" (whatever that means).

here is one more example>>>>at the Canada Winter Games --Team Ontario composed of "star" OHL'ers under 17 (albeit without John Tavares ) had to squeak by Manitoba 'u-17 team for the Championship even though that team had only 6 WHL'ers (all d-men) --TeamManitoba had to rely on Triple AAA Midgets to complete its forward lines plus some other talent like David Toews who plays at Shattucks St Mary's prep school in the USA...Toews scored 2 goals vs. the "star" oHL'ers...can anyone say that the OHL is so vastly superior that it should have dominated the "weaker" Manitoba squad (in the first game they played --Manitoba got into penalty troubleand paid for it --but in the Championship game --though Ontario wan it wasn't a blow-out)--but my point is: could anyone mark down Toews vs. the Ontario "stars" because after all he only plays prep school hockey which is not as competitive as the oHL? -- IT IS AN ABSURD ARGUMENT! Similarly,you cannot use that argument vs. TURRIS! Generalizations about leagues as a whole have ZERO
merit when applied to any PARTICULAR player case...judge the kid of his talent --he can't help it where he plays--and there is no proof he would not ALSO succeeed at the CHL level if not dominate that league too..

Fact is Turris didn't dominate at either the U17 WHC (6GP - 3G - 1A) or the U18 WC (4GP - 1G - 1A). He was good but not dominating.

 

[LaLaLaprise]

While the BCHL is only JR A ,not MAJOR JR. --there is onne HUGE difference--the BCHL allows 6 overagers per team--the CHL 3 leagues only allow 3 per team--thus theaverage age of BCHL teams is a lot older than the CHL....that alone makes up some of the talent depth "gap" and consequent difficulty of play between the
CHL leagues vs the BCHL...there are simply more 16 and17 year olds playing in the CHL leagues than in the BCHL and more 20 and 21 year olds playing in the BCHL...


here is one more example>>>>at the Canada Winter Games --Team Ontario composed of "star" OHL'ers under 17 (albeit without John Tavares ) had to squeak by Manitoba 'u-17 team for the Championship even though that team had only 6 WHL'ers (all d-men) --TeamManitoba had to rely on Triple AAA Midgets to complete its forward lines plus some other talent like David Toews who plays at Shattucks St Mary's prep school in the USA...Toews scored 2 goals vs. the "star" oHL'ers...can anyone say that the OHL is so vastly superior that it should have dominated the "weaker" Manitoba squad (in the first game they played --Manitoba got into penalty troubleand paid for it --but in the Championship game --though Ontario wan it wasn't a blow-out)--but my point is: could anyone mark down Toews vs. the Ontario "stars" because after all he only plays prep school hockey which is not as competitive as the oHL? -- IT IS AN ABSURD ARGUMENT! Similarly,you cannot use that argument vs. TURRIS! Generalizations about leagues as a whole have ZERO
merit when applied to any PARTICULAR player case...judge the kid of his talent --he can't help it where he plays--and there is no proof he would not ALSO succeeed at the CHL level if not dominate that league too..

The BCHL is young in terms of Junior A in Canada. And im not really sure which way youre argueing the point but the BCHL is far inferior to the WHL....not even close. Thats not to say there isnt good players in the BCHL but the competition is inferior in every way shape and form.

Now onto the Canada Games. New Brunswick beat Quebec...Quebec has 18 QMJHL Players..New Brunswick has 4...so I guess NB Migdet AAA is better than the QMJHL?? This is hockey, there will always be aberations in outcomes.

 

[ZombieMatt]

Jeepers 50, do you ever read what you are writing? You can't honestly believe all that gobblygook you're spewing. Wow, so what if the BChl has more overagers allowed. They are still overagers not good enough to play in the WHL, just more pylons for Turris to go around. To say a good BCHL team is better than a lower WHL team is laughable. Even if they are a lower WHL team, they are still WHL quality players, vrs any BCHL team which at best might have one or 2. I know you love Turris but give it a rest. You are really stretching it this time.

I'm not wading into any BCHL vs WHL team debate, but I have to say that choosing to play in the BCHL is by no means a definitive answer that you're not good enough to play in the WHL.

I personally disagree with your assessment that a BCHL has "at best" one or two WHL-quality players. I would say that the Victoria Grizzlies probably have 5-6 guys who could find a place in the WHL.

EDIT: Also, I'd like to add that we are talking about a spectacular BCHL player in this instance. Playing in the BCHL didn't negatively impact guys like Hull and Kariya, Ronning, Courtnall, Adams, Smyl, etc.

 

[elvisisalive]

I'm not saying Turris isn't a big time talent, he's a top 10 pick for sure and possibly a top 5, and saying each BCHL team has 1 or 2 WHL caliber players is a guess, but which would you rather have , a 121 point player from the BCHL or a 115 point player from the OHL? Do you believe a BCHL team could really compete against a WHL team? The fact remains that Turris while playing against inferior opponents has only matched the totals of Kane and Gagner in the OHL. It's kind of hard then to say that Turris is the superior player based on those stats.

 

[espo*]

If i was a scout i'd just look at what both players skill sets and levels are when it came right down to it while trying to get some info on what their attitudes and make-up as people are.The BCHL is not the OHL/QMJHL or OHL bit it's a good league and damn good players have come out of it in the past.

A good scout,imo,should be able to read Kanes skills and Turris's skills in an objective manner and should be very familiar with both leagues and thus be able to adequately project how Turris would produce with those skills in the different CHL leagues right now.It sounds like it's the only way to make a choice between the two in a case like this if you're putting those guys head to head as the best offensive prospects in the draft.

You can't discount Turris because he plays in the BCHL, but you also can't discount kanes proven OHL production and obvious abilities.Look at their skills/mental make-up and think best case scenario in terms of each reaching their potential and how likely each is likely to reach it. Don't go overboard on what league they play in when you've got two players like these.

It's a factor but not the be all and end all.

 

[itshomerdoh]

Also, I'd like to add that we are talking about a spectacular BCHL player in this instance. Playing in the BCHL didn't negatively impact guys like Hull and Kariya, Ronning, Courtnall, Adams, Smyl, etc.

Or Ray Ferraro, Andy Moog, Joe Murphy, Dallas Drake, Shawn Horcoff, Chuck Kobasew, Jeff Tambellini, Scott Gomez, Travis Zajac, and so on...

Turris will be fine.

 

[itshomerdoh]

...The fact remains that Turris while playing against inferior opponents has only matched the totals of Kane and Gagner in the OHL. It's kind of hard then to say that Turris is the superior player based on those stats.

It's important to note that teams don't necessarily draft the player who is best at that time, but have to project who will be the best down the line. But I'm not saying Turris is the best player in this draft, I really have no idea.

 

[ZombieMatt]

I'm not saying Turris isn't a big time talent, he's a top 10 pick for sure and possibly a top 5, and saying each BCHL team has 1 or 2 WHL caliber players is a guess, but which would you rather have , a 121 point player from the BCHL or a 115 point player from the OHL? Do you believe a BCHL team could really compete against a WHL team? The fact remains that Turris while playing against inferior opponents has only matched the totals of Kane and Gagner in the OHL. It's kind of hard then to say that Turris is the superior player based on those stats.

Well, in my opinion he's a top five pick for sure and possible a top 1, but that's neither here nor there.

I don't believe that a BCHL team is on equal footing to a WHL team, but I also believe the gap is not as cavernous as some claim.

 

[God Bless Canada]

I think Turris is the best player to come out of Canadian Junior A since Dany Heatley was in the AJHL in 1999. (I believe Heatley was the national junior A player of the year that season). I also think he's the best player in this year's draft.

I watched him carve up a very good Yorkton Terriers defence in last year's national championship final. At age 16, he was the best player in the tournament, playing against a lot of guys four years older than him. He was the class of the inaugural World Junior A Challenge last fall, even though most players in the tournament were two years older than him.

His skating is already top-notch, and he's able to do a lot of things at a top speed. He needs to get bigger and stronger, but most 17-year-old kids need to do that. I'd rather have a get who needs to bulk up and get stronger, than a kid who needs to improve his hockey sense, decision making, work ethic or skating. As long as he doesn't lose any mobility in his effort to get stronger, he'll be fine.

Some scouts are scared off by a player in Canadian Junior A. That's a croc. You look at any league in Canadian Junior A (except for the Superior Internaitonal league) and you'll see a strong track record of developing players.

 

[Hiishawk]

Scouts ALWAYS factor in the competition BEFORE any viewing whether it's USHS, Can Jr. Tier 2, Major Junior, NCAA, or a European men's league. What this means is that you will expect that players in lower leagues will do a bit better against the competition.

But my point is you do NOT mark down a player for that because it's not a feature or quality of that player. A scout would never ever say, "Yeah, Turris seems to me the most skilled player with the most potential but he plays in a lower league so I'll drop him down five notches in my ratings". If you think the player is the biggest talent with the most potential you pick him #1. Period. You would understand of course that he may not have been so dominant if he had been playing WHL or the NCAA or, like Cherepanov, in the top Russian men's league. It's already factored into the scout's mind before watching the game. The bottom line is if you think he's the best player, you pick him.

By the way, I support the view that the top BCJHL teams could match CHL bottom-feeders. Not only are there 17 year olds like Turris going the NCAA route but some very skilled 18-20 year olds who want scholarships too (e.g. Hobey Baker nominee Brandon Wong). There are also 20 year olds who already played in the WHL but have returned to their hometowns/province for work and to play. It's not like a farm team for the CHL, as some think. It's more like a farm team for NCAA hockey and a lot of 20 year olds who plan to stay live, work in B.C.

 

[Alter Haudegen]

Scouts ALWAYS factor in the competition BEFORE any viewing whether it's USHS, Can Jr. Tier 2, Major Junior, NCAA, or a European men's league. What this means is that you will expect that players in lower leagues will do a bit better against the competition.

But my point is you do NOT mark down a player for that because it's not a feature or quality of that player. A scout would never ever say, "Yeah, Turris seems to me the most skilled player with the most potential but he plays in a lower league so I'll drop him down five notches in my ratings". If you think the player is the biggest talent with the most potential you pick him #1. Period. You would understand of course that he may not have been so dominant if he had been playing WHL or the NCAA or, like Cherepanov, in the top Russian men's league. It's already factored into the scout's mind before watching the game. The bottom line is if you think he's the best player, you pick him.

By the way, I support the view that the top BCJHL teams could match CHL bottom-feeders. Not only are there 17 year olds like Turris going the NCAA route but some very skilled 18-20 year olds who want scholarships too (e.g. Hobey Baker nominee Brandon Wong). There are also 20 year olds who already played in the WHL but have returned to their hometowns/province for work and to play. It's not like a farm team for the CHL, as some think. It's more like a farm team for NCAA hockey and a lot of 20 year olds who plan to stay live, work in B.C.

The difference is pace. That's the answer most players "moving up" to the Dub from either the BCHL or AJHL will give you when questioned about the difference. "Once I got accustomed to the pace ..."
Let's not forget that Brule was over a PPG player as a 15 year old in the BCHL.
Turris playing in the BCHL should make no difference to where he is drafted but to say that Junior A is almost as good as Major Junior is a stretch at best.

 

[Hiishawk]

but to say that Junior A is almost as good as Major Junior is a stretch at best.

I'm confident that it's not a stretch at all being very familiar with both leagues.

How familiar are you with both leagues? How many games have you seen in both? Do you have quotes of players talking about WHL vs. BCJHL pace? You hear it going from AHL to NHL but...

You should note that the BCJHL league is widely considered to be the best tier 2 league in Canada by some margin and is by far the best choice for those who want to get noticed by NCAA colleges. It is pretty much on par with the USHL. Other US junior leagues are lesser and on par with other tier 2 Canadian leagues.

 

[Alter Haudegen]

I'm confident that it's not a stretch at all being very familiar with both leagues.

How familiar are you with both leagues? How many games have you seen in both? Do you have quotes of players talking about WHL vs. BCJHL pace? You hear it going from AHL to NHL but...

You should note that the BCJHL league is widely considered to be the best tier 2 league in Canada by some margin and is by far the best choice for those who want to get noticed by NCAA colleges. It is pretty much on par with the USHL. Other US junior leagues are lesser and on par with other tier 2 Canadian leagues.

I've seen enough WHL, BCHL and AJHL to know what I'm talking about. Both Red Deer Rebels rookies Evan Pighin (BCHL) and Dustin Moore (AJHL) were quoted in papers about the pace (as was Brent Sutter) this season. Oh and I doubt that the BCHL is so much above the AJHL (from the last 7 Doyle Cup winners since 2000 four were from the AJHL and three were from the BCHL.)

 

[Hiishawk]

I've seen enough WHL, BCHL and AJHL to know what I'm talking about. Both Red Deer Rebels rookies Evan Pighin (BCHL) and Dustin Moore (AJHL) were quoted in papers about the pace (as was Brent Sutter) this season. Oh and I doubt that the BCHL is so much above the AJHL (from the last 7 Doyle Cup winners since 2000 four were from the AJHL and three were from the BCHL.)

AJHL would be the consensus next best tier 2 league in Canada. Maybe if someone could show the recruiting numbers for NCAA schools it would be more apparent about BCJHL quality.

True, an AJHL club has won one more title recently but that can be said about the Q in the CHL too. Depth is better in the BCJHL, although I admit the AJHL is a decent calibre too.

 

[LaLaLaprise]

I'm confident that it's not a stretch at all being very familiar with both leagues.

How familiar are you with both leagues? How many games have you seen in both? Do you have quotes of players talking about WHL vs. BCJHL pace? You hear it going from AHL to NHL but...

You should note that the BCJHL league is widely considered to be the best tier 2 league in Canada by some margin and is by far the best choice for those who want to get noticed by NCAA colleges. It is pretty much on par with the USHL. Other US junior leagues are lesser and on par with other tier 2 Canadian leagues.

Its a HUGE stretch man....you cant compare the 2 at all. Obviously that is your opinion but even the crappiest WHL team would beat the best BCHL team. Players are in the WHL for a reason....not everyone in the BCHL is there because of NCAA...most guys just arent good enough to play WHL.

If it is on par with the USHL than that further proves our point...BCHL is no where near as good as CHL.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

I don't believe that a BCHL team is on equal footing to a WHL team, but I also believe the gap is not as cavernous as some claim.

I don't think it is either. A lot of those guys go that route because they want to get an education and go to a NCAA school. This way they can still play in a high level league in Canada and manage to keep their eligibility.

 

[LaLaLaprise]

I don't think it is either. A lot of those guys go that route because they want to get an education and go to a NCAA school. This way they can still play in a high level league in Canada and manage to keep their eligibility.

Yes, but there are as many if not MORE players in the BCHL who are there because they couldnt make their WHL team.

The BCHL isnt bad by any stretch and they do send a lot of players to the NCAA but out of a 20 player BCHL team...less than 10 are there because they WANT to go NCAA. There are more guys there because they were cut from their WHL club team.

 

[ZombieMatt]

Yes, but there are as many if not MORE players in the BCHL who are there because they couldnt make their WHL team.

The BCHL isnt bad by any stretch and they do send a lot of players to the NCAA but out of a 20 player BCHL team...less than 10 are there because they WANT to go NCAA. There are more guys there because they were cut from their WHL club team.

Except for Nanaimo and Penticton, both of which have ten players currently on their roster each who have formally committed to teams at this points.

 

[Alter Haudegen]

Except for Nanaimo and Penticton, both of which have ten players currently on their roster each who have formally committed to teams at this points.

Doesn't necessarily mean they didn't try out for the WHL. Bradley Eidsness for example is comitted to North Dakota. He was drafted by the Rebels but didn't get a chance (was twice in camp, but when Sutter wasn't going to guarantee him the back-up spot, he decided not to forgo his eligibility).

 

[ZombieMatt]

Doesn't necessarily mean they didn't try out for the WHL. Bradley Eidsness for example is comitted to North Dakota. He was drafted by the Rebels but didn't get a chance (was twice in camp, but when Sutter wasn't going to guarantee him the back-up spot, he decided not to forgo his eligibility).

You're right. However, my point is that just because a player is in the BCHL doesn't mean that they aren't good enough to play in the WHL. There are numerous players on most BCHL teams that could easily find a role in the Dub. Overall the league is lower quality, no question. But there are still quality players in the BCHL.