Post-Game Talk: KY with the clutch DP

[nabob]

Gagner put up those numbers as a raw rookie, all when he was 18yrs old and all in one go off in what is a true rookie season. Yamamoto has his through 3 development seasons and is 21yrs old. Yama also getting to play with McDrai who are far superior to anybody Gagner was playing with. Gagner was gathering most of his points from guys like Nillson and Cogliano who were also young, and haven't been known as consistent NHL producers since.

Gagner also produced quite a lot immediately after that first 27 game segment and to wit had 5pts in his next 4 games. Gagner also started his NHL career on fire being hot throughout camp and into the season. Gagner had 4pts in his first 4GP and 7pts in his first 8NHL games played. he served notice he could produce at this level, served it immediately, and all as an 18yr old. Way more impressive.

ps what is "upside" other than a term that is a narrative construct. In 3yrs of pro hockey Yamamoto has yet to put up impressive numbers anywhere. He's yet to demonstrate goal scoring acumen. In reference to being the smallest player in the league isn't it an odd notion to infer that such an outlier has so much upside? Robbie Schremp had so much upside. He was going to be a star. The few here that have followed this board since inception know that all these players are touted to be stars, that they are fait accompli, just waiting to ignite.

Every Oiler fan here is quick to mock Flames or Nucks prospects and say all the fervor is presumptuous and yet do the same here.

Benson and Yama are stated to be sure things on this board. They're so good they should immediately be playing with Leon Draisaitl, one of the top two producers in hockey, and the top goal scorer in all of 2019. They're a shoe in with that guy. They're all light years better than Gagner, excepting that they haven't been at any point, and are showing less signs of that now. I mean I hate to bring this up but Gagner was putting up the numbers Benson and Yama have put up in the AHL, but in the much harder NHL, and again as an 18yr old in a rookie season.

I have never seen a poster so upset that fans hope a couple of prospects succeed. Imagine only cheering for a team because you only care about the name on the back of one of the jerseys. You should really just admit you’re not an Oilers fan at all. You’re a Drai fanboy and nothing more.

 

[nexttothemoon]

Why a GM would make a deal without running it by the coach is something I'd never figure out.

Even the Manning deal. Gregor and others pointed out if PC would've been more open with local media that PC would've gotten a free scouting report and would've never made the deal. Media guys maybe aren't the best at scouting other teams, but they talk to other media guys that watch their hometown players every game. CHI media didn't even think Manning would get picked on waivers, yet we traded a guy that was at least a decent place holder at the time.

Chia said he was following and watching Manning for years... sounds like he was a true "Chia-type" player... which is really all you have to know about Chiarelli.

If he had made that trade 1st as GM we could have seen the writing on the wall and known what he was all about instead of some of us being tricked into thinking he was going to be a decent GM for this team.

Of course he did make the goofy Reinhart trade so that in retrospect should have been warning enough.

Those two trades end up being the shit covered sandwich slices at the start and finish of the chicken shit salad sandwich he built over his term in Edmonton.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Why a GM would make a deal without running it by the coach is something I'd never figure out.

Even the Manning deal. Gregor and others pointed out if PC would've been more open with local media that PC would've gotten a free scouting report and would've never made the deal. Media guys maybe aren't the best at scouting other teams, but they talk to other media guys that watch their hometown players every game. CHI media didn't even think Manning would get picked on waivers, yet we traded a guy that was at least a decent place holder at the time.

Chiarelli listens to the little voices in his head telling him he's a genius. That's about it.

 

[MaxR11]

I'm not really convinced Drai is killing one of the best PP's in the league when McD or him are involved in the most PP pts and production by a landslide and virtually make our PP. When Drai is in hold mode its because no lanes are open. Gretzky often did the same thing. Would rag the puck for awhile looking to create, and was dynamic doing it. In modern Era Drai is damn good at doing it as well, just that with todays far superior D schemes, far superior goaltending its harder to find openings. But Drai makes wizard passes, often, which no other player on this team makes.

Watch Drai carefully with the puck on PP. Its patended Gretzy halfboard hold. Wait for the flies to come to you, then deliver a lethal pass. Drai works really well in a phonebooth and often gets the pass away even when being teamed by a pk. When that happens the other players on the ice should be able to produce a serious chance. Drai services like this basically every PP.

Now one critique could be that Drai needs to move around more when doing this but sometimes his space he has to work with is very confined. Drai also occupies much more complicated spots on the PP, and arguably more than anybody on it so that Drai is expected to be able to freeform and learn several different spots on the PP and keep production going from those various spots. Drai in the slot for instance is not in my view his strongsuit use on the PP but he's operated reasonably well from there as well. In anycase Drai is a setplay player. In Soccer parlance he's a midfielder. He is that guy. Expecting him to quickly adapt to not being that guy is not easily done.

Drai is a good player for sure... when he's on his game. When he's not he looks putrid and one main reason is because he doesn't move his feet anymore and still wants to hang on to the puck for too long. Starts forcing a LOT of bad passes and makes a lot of questionable decisions. He doesn't seem to understand how to make quicker plays and simplify when the mojo aint there.

Disagree. His mindset on the pp is that he wants to be the guy that sets it all up from the side boards... the guy that makes that ultimate pass for the one T or tip. It's hard to do nowadays... at least all the time, with the way guys penalty kill. To be a consistently good PP you generally have to move that puck quickly and have you PP guys move around to throw the PK unit off kilter and open up some seam passes etc. We've seen how in recent month plus how this PP struggles when they don't move around and don't move the puck quickly. They then find success when they move the puck around quicker. PKs have found their game/PK-legs at this point in the season. In the last month plus been seeing Drai (and once in a while Connor) hang on to the puck too long and try to force that pass through the slot and it gets easily knocked away or intercepted. Happened a lot in one stretch and Drai just KEPT forcing it and not learning. MOVE the ****ing puck around. Snap those passes around and move bodies and take some shots from the outside with traffic to the net sometimes... the seams WILL eventually open when you do this.

 

[MaxR11]

Hard to believe Drai is getting absolved of all blame by some people, when the player HIMSELF has just stated that he's been playing like crap for the last while. And I will give him credit for saying the obvious, but hopefully it's more than just words and he really bears down.

Bang on.... though the most infuriating thing about it is he KNOWS... he admits it.... he talks the talk but is slow to walk the walk. Slow learner. Also him saying Kopitar is his role model and him wanting to be a Selke winner is a joke statement the way he's been playing. He's literally been the complete opposite of a Selke player.

 

[MaxR11]

Gagner put up those numbers as a raw rookie, all when he was 18yrs old and all in one go off in what is a true rookie season. Yamamoto has his through 3 development seasons and is 21yrs old. Yama also getting to play with McDrai who are far superior to anybody Gagner was playing with. Gagner was gathering most of his points from guys like Nillson and Cogliano who were also young, and haven't been known as consistent NHL producers since.

Gagner also produced quite a lot immediately after that first 27 game segment and to wit had 5pts in his next 4 games. Gagner also started his NHL career on fire being hot throughout camp and into the season. Gagner had 4pts in his first 4GP and 7pts in his first 8NHL games played. he served notice he could produce at this level, served it immediately, and all as an 18yr old. Way more impressive.

ps what is "upside" other than a term that is a narrative construct. In 3yrs of pro hockey Yamamoto has yet to put up impressive numbers anywhere. He's yet to demonstrate goal scoring acumen. In reference to being the smallest player in the league isn't it an odd notion to infer that such an outlier has so much upside? Robbie Schremp had so much upside. He was going to be a star. The few here that have followed this board since inception know that all these players are touted to be stars, that they are fait accompli, just waiting to ignite.

Every Oiler fan here is quick to mock Flames or Nucks prospects and say all the fervor is presumptuous and yet do the same here.

Benson and Yama are stated to be sure things on this board. They're so good they should immediately be playing with Leon Draisaitl, one of the top two producers in hockey, and the top goal scorer in all of 2019. They're a shoe in with that guy. They're all light years better than Gagner, excepting that they haven't been at any point, and are showing less signs of that now. I mean I hate to bring this up but Gagner was putting up the numbers Benson and Yama have put up in the AHL, but in the much harder NHL, and again as an 18yr old in a rookie season.

Gags is putrid. It goes to show you points do NOT always tell you an accurate story. He was able to produce early on (a decade ago) because those teams allowed the youngsters to cheat and not focus intently on defence. And they finished DFL year after year and looked horrendous doing so. Those young guys picked up a lot of nothing points when games were well out of hand. Yamamoto, though not a sure fire NHLer already looks better than gags as far as being a complete player that can better help your team WIN. Imo, gags is not an NHLer and was a fringe one in his prime despite the points. He was one of the reasons (having him as an everyday player) the Oil were so bad back in the day.

 

[Stoneman89]

Agree with most of this, particularly the movement, but watch how many times teams are scheming pressure on Drai before he hits blueline, or hitting him on the halfwall. Time and space is being removed. Pretty much what one would expect teams to do to an NHL #2 producer. This is what happens.

The board looks at is as "Wow Drai is struggling" and Even Drai is keen on acknowledging. But teams are really scheming him hard and some of the answers have to be reworks or new answers. He's not going to be blowing up the league with production numbers forever. NHL correction occurs, and is occurring. McDrai are being chopped down like trees every game because teams can easily over focus resource on shutting down those two players and pretty much ignore the rest during EV play.

Beat McDrai and you beat the Oilers. EVERY time.

Except the last game, right?