Kotkaniemi V/S Svechnikov

[Jack Skellington]

Id take Kotkaniemi. They’re very close right now and Svechnikov in my opinion is much farther along in his development. I think Kotkaniemi is smarter and more talented but he’s like Bambi out there. Needs to bulk up significantly to buy that time and space that makes guys like Barkov and Wheeler so great. I still think Svech will be a 1st liner however.

 

[Hoquei]

Svech

 

[Thenameless]

So far, both look good. The Habs could have used either one - a more pure goal scorer like Svechnikov or a more well rounded center like Kotkaniemi. Since we already have him, I'll be loyal to Kotkaniemi. I also like the little tidbit about him being the first athlete born in the 2000's to play in one of the Big 4 North American sports.

 

[CanadienShark]

Kotkaniemi. I've never been this impressed with an 18 yo. Svech is almost half a year older. (4-5 months iirc)

KK has looked good, but yikes. Never been so impressed? And 4-5 months isn't enough to consider.

 

[Legend123]

KK has looked good, but yikes. Never been so impressed? And 4-5 months isn't enough to consider.

I meant habs players only obviously

 

[CanadienShark]

I meant habs players only obviously

Why would that be obvious, when you OBVIOUSLY didn't specify that?

 

[Legend123]

Why would that be obvious, when you OBVIOUSLY didn't specify that?

I'm s habs fan but I still watch other teams and players such as McDavid

 

[CanadienShark]

I'm s habs fan but I still watch other teams and players such as McDavid

What's your point? Do you think we're all mind readers? If you want people to understand you the way you want to be understood, then actually be specific. It's like if I say Couture is the greatest Shark player ever, then you call me out, and I say "obviously the greatest Shark to have ever played for the Ottawa 67s, because I'm a Sharks fan that used to live in Ottawa."

 

[A Loyal Dog]

What's your point? Do you think we're all mind readers? If you want people to understand you the way you want to be understood, then actually be specific. It's like if I say Couture is the greatest Shark player ever, then you call me out, and I say "obviously the greatest Shark to have ever played for the Ottawa 67s, because I'm a Sharks fan that used to live in Ottawa."

You're making a big deal over nothing at all.

 

[Legend123]

What's your point? Do you think we're all mind readers? If you want people to understand you the way you want to be understood, then actually be specific. It's like if I say Couture is the greatest Shark player ever, then you call me out, and I say "obviously the greatest Shark to have ever played for the Ottawa 67s, because I'm a Sharks fan that used to live in Ottawa."

Man move on. Kotka is the GOAT.

 

[ottawa]

Kotka

 

[Canadienna]

Svech is scoring at pretty much the same rate as Kotka, it’s hilarious seeing how much people can flip flop based on such a small size of pretty much identical play.

Kotka has been non stop getting better every game.

Since the new year -

Kotkaniemi
47 point, 27 goal pace

Svechnikov
32 point, 11 goal pace

Not that close right now, Kotka goes #2 in a redraft.

 

[tony d]

Svechnikov.

 

[ESH]

Kotka has been non stop getting better every game.

Since the new year -

Kotkaniemi
47 point, 27 goal pace

Svechnikov
32 point, 11 goal pace

Not that close right now, Kotka goes #2 in a redraft.

The games before the new year count as well.

Are you really trying to argue that 20 games makes it “not that close”? I’m sure lots of people and GMs would still take Svechnikov ahead of Kotkaniemi, despite Kotkaniemi having a whopping 3 more points than Svechnikov since the start of January.

You must realize that all players go through different hot and cold streaks right?

 

[Hugh Mungus]

This again?

 

[Kairi Zaide]

It's close. Right now, they're producing similarly offensively, but going forward, I expect Svechnikov to be much more impactful in that regard. His high danger shots for rates are absolutely ridiculous. Defensively, Kotka is already pretty good and dwarfs Svech. I think they could end up having similar overall global impact on winning.

 

[Canadienna]

The games before the new year count as well.

Are you really trying to argue that 20 games makes it “not that close”? I’m sure lots of people and GMs would still take Svechnikov ahead of Kotkaniemi, despite Kotkaniemi having a whopping 3 more points than Svechnikov since the start of January.

You must realize that all players go through different hot and cold streaks right?

No need to act flabbergasted.

The new year isn't some arbitrary date, it's at least a fixed point. I'm not picking games at random.

And my point was simply that Kotkaniemi has shown more improvement than Svech, backed up by referencing their recent point totals.

Kotkaniemi is outscoring Svechnikov on the season slightly, but more dramatically within the last few months. I think this is relevant considering how young they both are.

Kotka plays a tougher position, has better corsi and advanced stats, is outscoring Svech on the season, is significantly outscoring him since the new year, and has a trajectory since pre-draft that is way higher than Svechnikov's.

Kotka since the new year has 7 goals and 12 points in 21 games (47 point, 27 goal pace). Svech has 3 goals and 9 points in 23 games (32 point, 11 goal pace). That's a decent sample size, and it seems everyone in here is still saying they expect Svech to outscore Kotka going forward, but provide no explanation.

 

[ESH]

No need to act flabbergasted.

The new year isn't some arbitrary date, it's at least a fixed point. I'm not picking games at random.

And my point was simply that Kotkaniemi has shown more improvement than Svech, backed up by referencing their recent point totals.

Kotkaniemi is outscoring Svechnikov on the season slightly, but more dramatically within the last few months. I think this is relevant considering how young they both are.

Kotka plays a tougher position, has better corsi and advanced stats, is outscoring Svech on the season, is significantly outscoring him since the new year, and has a trajectory since pre-draft that is way higher than Svechnikov's.

Kotka since the new year has 7 goals and 12 points in 21 games (47 point, 27 goal pace). Svech has 3 goals and 9 points in 23 games (32 point, 11 goal pace). That's a decent sample size, and it seems everyone in here is still saying they expect Svech to outscore Kotka going forward, but provide no explanation.

Any point in time is arbitrary in a season. Of course it’s a fixed point, so is every other day of the year. Today isn’t a day of any significance, how is that not arbitrary?

Outscoring someone by 3 points is not significant. If we were talking literally 3 days ago, Kotkaniemi would’ve only had 1 more point than Svechnikov in 2019. They’re so close in scoring that a good game from Svechnikov could make your tiny argument even more moot.

 

[Fig]

I don't know enough of the two players to compare. I just wanted to meander into this thread and write, "Coke can Niemi".

 

[Kairi Zaide]

No need to act flabbergasted.

The new year isn't some arbitrary date, it's at least a fixed point. I'm not picking games at random.

And my point was simply that Kotkaniemi has shown more improvement than Svech, backed up by referencing their recent point totals.

Kotkaniemi is outscoring Svechnikov on the season slightly, but more dramatically within the last few months. I think this is relevant considering how young they both are.

Kotka plays a tougher position, has better corsi and advanced stats, is outscoring Svech on the season, is significantly outscoring him since the new year, and has a trajectory since pre-draft that is way higher than Svechnikov's.

Kotka since the new year has 7 goals and 12 points in 21 games (47 point, 27 goal pace). Svech has 3 goals and 9 points in 23 games (32 point, 11 goal pace). That's a decent sample size, and it seems everyone in here is still saying they expect Svech to outscore Kotka going forward, but provide no explanation.

21-23 games is actually a very small sample size. As I said above, Svech is a high danger scoring chance machine (see image below, and he has 5.71 iHDCF/60 - individual high danger corsi for - and 10.01 iSCF/60 - individual scoring chances for, whereas Kotka is at 2.19 iHDCF/60 and 6.5 iSCF/60), all that while having a relatively low PDO (0.983) especially considering it's mostly driven by a low on-ice shooting % (5.92%). It's fair to expect him to be better offensively (at least at scoring points) going forward considering this.

 

[ole ole]

They’re not equal players though.

Just because they’ve had equal seasons doesn’t make them equal players.

True the Center in this case is the better player.

 

[Taluss]

I'm very happy with Tkachuk, I wouldn't trade him 1/1 for Sve or Kot but I think I'd take Sve over him in a redraft

 

[CanadienShark]

You're making a big deal over nothing at all.

I'm responding to someone who said "obviously" when it was anything but obvious. That wasn't you.

 

[KevSkillz4]

Jesperi Kotkaniemi is the best thing for Hockey

 

[Just Linda]

Both are great players. I'd take the centre overthrow winger any day but both well before Tkachuk