Knowing what you know now.....

[The Apologist]

Seguin looks pretty elite to me. Add in a defenseman with some major upside and really?

Lets see some consistency out of him first.

 

[ViewsFromThe6ix]

Does seguin still get traded for loui eriksson?

Nope. Seguin stays a leaf.

 

[FifthLine]

When you really think about it, if we didn't do the Kessel trade, we wouldn't have had Kessel for that season. So we very likely would have finished last and picked Hall anyways.

 

[ULF_55]

Go back in time and keep the picks and do a proper rebuild and Clarkson is in a different timeline anyway!

 

[Bomber0104]

Close call in terms of how astronomically stupid both of these moves were.

Clarkson cost us nothing but cap-space (a lot, mind you) but is doing literally nothing for us on the ice...

Kessel cost us a metric tonne in terms of assets, cap-space, but is producing as the winger he was expected to be (a very flawed one, mind you)

I go with re-doing the Kessel trade simply because of the assets surrendered.

A rebuilding team should never surrender multiple first round picks. I can't even recall a contending team in the cap-era giving up consecutive firsts....nevermind a barren wasteland like the Leafs.

 

[The Apologist]

When you really think about it, if we didn't do the Kessel trade, we wouldn't have had Kessel for that season. So we very likely would have finished last and picked Hall anyways.

Thats cheating, he said everything stays the same.

 

[Bomber0104]

Seguin (22 years old)

80GP 37G 47A 84PTS 18PIM +16



Kessel (22 years old)

70GP 30G 25A 55PTS 21PIM -8



Seguin beats Kessel in virtually every offensive metric there is both at the same age and even this year (Seguin still has lots of development time left, Kessel is a finished product).

Then factor in the fact that Kessel is the softest most one-dimensional forward in the NHL. Just by default Seguin beats him defensive ability.


Oh and then factor in the additional draft picks we lost....9th overall....2nd rounder....3rd rounder...

And you begin to realize why this is one of the worst trades in the modern NHL.

 

[DD03]

Idk about that being the worst trade. Ryan McDonagh for Gomez, Vanek deal this season for the Isles, etc.

 

[Bomber0104]

Idk about that being the worst trade. Ryan McDonagh for Gomez, Vanek deal this season for the Isles, etc.

I won't say it's the absolute worst.

We'll revisit this trade in a few more years to see just how bad it is compared to the Gomez trade.

My prediction is Kessel scores points and the Leafs continue to tank.

The best years of Phil Kessel have been wasted thus far, and will continue to be wasted even after his peak.

He'd be better off elsewhere, career-wise.

 

[Diatomic]

Kessel trade set us back a few years. Meanwhile the Clarkson signing is just dead cap were going to carry for a while, but hey atleast we got him for free and not for a future #1C and #1D.

So, kessel.

 

[achtungbaby]

For an ELITE winger, yes....

I'd still prefer a center or a dman. I just think that wingers are more easily obtainable. Looking back, Seguin and Hall were both there for the drafting and both are putting up similar numbers as Phil is right now on more cap friendly 2nd contracts.

Nothing against Kessel though.

 

[King85Kong]

Voted for the Clarkson option, due to just how terrible the contract is. But having Seguin and Kadri down the middle would be amazing. Good young centers to build off of for years to come.

 

[johnny_rudeboy]

Would I rather have Seguin, Hamilton and Clarkson or just Kessel? I would go with the trio. I voted Clarkson so perhaps my English is not so good as I want it to be, or I am just stupid

 

[The Apologist]

I'd still prefer a center or a dman. I just think that wingers are more easily obtainable. Looking back, Seguin and Hall were both there for the drafting and both are putting up similar numbers as Phil is right now on more cap friendly 2nd contracts.

Nothing against Kessel though.

This is true. Its all fun in retrospect.

 

[Durrr]

Clarkson signing for sure, the Kessel trade got us Kessel lol. People in here seem to be under the impression that even if we got Seguin or Hamilton they would be the exact same players as they are now. Seguin would be crucified by the media (just as Kadri has) when he failed to meet expectations and Hamilton would likley be where Rielly is this year. Seriously guys, when is the last time the leafs actually developed a real star player? This goes for Kessel as well, as I have absolutely no doubt he would be a muli-year 40+ goal scorer by now if he remained on the Bruins or a similar winning team.

All of this, on top of the fact that a winning franchise already gave up on Seguin, obviously there were major character issues going on. Only thing that changes my opinion is if we don't get Hamilton, because without the acquisition of Kessel we likley end up with Strome, Schief, Landeskog etc etc.

 

[DD03]

Bruins also traded Kessel... Clearly there are some character issues there too?

And there's nothing wrong with Hamilton being in the same as Rielly, that's perfect.

 

[HEAVY DUTY]

clarkson signing AINEC.

 

[Durrr]

Bruins also traded Kessel... Clearly there are some character issues there too?

And there's nothing wrong with Hamilton being in the same as Rielly, that's perfect.

Well not really, Kessel had high salary demands as an RFA and they chose to sign other players over him and get value. Seguin was 100% traded due to issues. I saw a video of the Bruins war room when they finalized the trade the discussion was basically "Were trading a 40 goal scorer here guys, anyone have an issue?", followed by "no" all around.

There is nothing wrong with Hamilton being where Rielly is now (besides Rielly being younger) he is just not currently a top pairing defender in the NHL, nor does he look like he'l become an elite player. All I meant was people are talking about these players like we gave up Toews and Kieth, when they are currently far from that level of play.

 

[ULF_55]

We know since the trade the Leafs haven't won very much, and continue to be a bottom feeder.

 

[Durrr]

We know since the trade the Leafs haven't won very much, and continue to be a bottom feeder.

So what? We certainly would not be to far ahead even if you replace Kessel with Seguin/Dougie.

 

[DD03]

Well not really, Kessel had high salary demands as an RFA and they chose to sign other players over him and get value. Seguin was 100% traded due to issues. I saw a video of the Bruins war room when they finalized the trade the discussion was basically "Were trading a 40 goal scorer here guys, anyone have an issue?", followed by "no" all around.

There is nothing wrong with Hamilton being where Rielly is now (besides Rielly being younger) he is just not currently a top pairing defender in the NHL, nor does he look like he'l become an elite player. All I meant was people are talking about these players like we gave up Toews and Kieth, when they are currently far from that level of play.

Seguin was dealt for more depth and a better two-way winger.. He's young, maturity comes with age.

These guys are still young, they aren't Toews and Keith but Seguin is definitely on a similar tier when it comes to offensive production and Hamilton does look to have a pretty decent game especially for his size.

The depth this team would have with both of them on it, assuming they both develop the same skills and abilities with the Leafs is far better then what Kessel brings on his wing with just his offensive skill.

 

[DD03]

So what? We certainly would not be to far ahead even if you replace Kessel with Seguin/Dougie.

You're adding a #1 centre and a potential #2 defenseman. How are we not further ahead when getting those instead of a #1 winger? What?

 

[johnny_rudeboy]

You're adding a #1 centre and a potential #2 defenseman. How are we not further ahead when getting those instead of a #1 winger? What?

Yeah, but Kessel is only 26/27 and is a PPG... oh wait.

 

[ULF_55]

So what? We certainly would not be to far ahead even if you replace Kessel with Seguin/Dougie.

But it isn't just Seguin.

Without Kessel, the Leafs would have been worse, unless Kessel is a negative factor, therefore the next draft could very likely be back in the top 5.



Also, Clarkson probably isn't even considered, so 2 birds with an original stone.

 

[DaveT83*]

Dear God - Clarkson is just money. Not only does he have zero impact on the active roster - but by all accounts will continue to play zero role in the teams future.


Kessel trade bankrupted this franchise for what looks like a decade. He was the beginning and end of the excellerated retool.

Without that trade we'd be looking really great with not only Sequin/Hamilton but a lot of the additional reactionary moves to desperately push this pathetic team into the first round would not have happened. Yes including the Clarkson signing itself.

Lets not forget Jared Knight in the 2nd round - while he may not be the greatest asset - a 2nd rounder netted us our current .922sv starting goaltender.