IF the Rangers continue with their form from the last 2 games and start to win more than they lose, I think there is a chance the Rangers might do nothing at the deadline. They could say why sell the 19 year olds? It is difficult for a 19 year old goalie to make the AHL, let alone the NHL and Damiani may not make the AHL either. If both of those come back, the Rangers would lose the 3 OAs, Bergkvist and Pfeil. Could Rangers brass think they could have a chance this year and next? Not convinced it is a good idea, but with OAs generally not getting as much as 19 year olds and it being so close this season I think there is a chance management might stand pat. There is not enough in the cupboard to buy.
Kitchener Rangers 2019-20 Season Thread (Part 2)
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robertmac43
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He would have to have a terrible second half/bad camp this summer to not be playing elsewhere next year.
rangersblues
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EvenSteven
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He scoring at around the same pace as Meireles last year.
EvenSteven
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About the highest end 19 year old D moved at last year’s deadline would have to be Markus Phillips. The return was 2nd, 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 3rd, 4th*.
Another pretty good 19 year old D moved at last year’s deadline was Fedor Gordeev. That return was 2nd, 2nd, 3rd*, 5th*.
Should we move Vukojovic at the deadline next year, though prices could vary, I think we can expect the return to be somewhere between the returns for Phillips/Gordeev.
In the off season before last year, we moved former Ranger first rounder Giovanni Vallati to Oshawa, with two years remaining in the league plus a possible OA season, for a return of 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 3rd.
Based on these three trades, I think we can assume that the return that we can hope for in any deadline deal next year for Vukojovic would be the Vallati return but if his development soars in the next 12 months, maybe the Phillips return above.
Currently, we have three 2nds and nine 3rds available to be traded this year, should we choose to, as per the new rules regarding the trading of distant draft picks. That won’t change going into next year. As per the rules, 2025 drafts picks (where we have two 2nds) can’t be moved until after next year’s deadline.
So, if MM either decides to stand pat this year, or comes away from the deadline unable to sell off because he “didn’t like the prices” etc etc, we’ll go into next year with those same three 2nds and nine 3rds.
Those assets won’t be enough to make the moves needed to turn next year’s team into a contender AND still have adequate assets needed to make moves to go all in in 21-22 when our 02’s and 03’s are at their peak.
Therefore, standing pat this year, then not going all in next year, means selling off our only high end graduating player, Vukojovic. If trading him means a minimum return of 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 3rd as I suggested above, that would put us at five 2nds and eleven 3rds in the cupboard. Add to those assets the picks we have in 2025 that would then be available to be traded. We’d then stand at seven 2nds and twelve 3rds.
These would be the assets we would have with which to go all in with for the 21-22 season.
That’s not a bad bank of picks to go all in with. But keep in mind, it would have taken three years of being an also ran to get there. (Stand pat last year. Stand pat this year. Sell Vukojovic next year).
Call me crazy, but I don’t want to go through three down years between contending years. It’s not necessary when we can sell off this year and try to contend the next two years.
robertmac43
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I would say he has been a better player thus far, Plus he has more tools that would make him pro-ready imo.
EvenSteven
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I’ll take a page out of Mein Yak’s book and suggest a trade:
Saginaw is all in.
-They have two really good OA’s but an ok one who could be improved upon.
-They are overloaded with 19 year olds.
-They have a player in Perfetti who may move on after this year.
-Their 01 group is very thin (only three players).
All this tells me that they should be all in for this season with the next couple as rebuilding years. It would be their second all in season in a row and based on the above, next year should be lean.
With that in mind, a quick look at their roster shows that with the likelihood that Bode Wilde remains in the pros, they’ll need to upgrade the D. Their goaltending isn’t high end with OA Prosvetov not returning and also, because of that, they have an open import spot. Saginaw has no trouble putting the puck in the net but is having a hard time keeping in out.
They could use an upgrade in net, help on D, and a high end, two way forward.
So:
To Kitchener:
02-G- Tristan Lennox
03-D- Connor Punnett
2nd ‘23
2nd ‘24
2nd ‘24
To Saginaw:
00-C- Riley Damiani
00-G- Jacob Ingham
00-D- Axel Bergqvist
3rd ‘23*
3rd ‘24*
Conditions on the 3rds to Saginaw are that if either Damiani or Ingham play an OA season, the picks come back to Kitchener.
Going into this deal, Saginaw has six 2nds and three 3rds (post Antropov deal). After the deal, they’d have three 2nds and five 3rds (two cond). They’d still have enough to upgrade their OA D should they choose. In this deal, they’ve solidified their net, upgraded their D and brought in one of the top two way forwards in the league who is always a threat to score.
Kitchener gets their future #1 goalie, an 03 1st round d-man, and valuable picks for the bank. With this trade, they set themselves up pretty good for the future.
Our roster going into 20-21:
01-Stepien
01-Petizian
01-Dickerson
02-Valade
02-Langdon
02-MacDonnell
02-Serpa
03-Pinelli
03-Fishman
OA
OA
03-Import
04-rookie
-Vukojovic
-MacPherson
-Sebrango
-Ottavainen
-Motew
-Punnett
-Xhekaj
04-rookie
Lennox
Backup
We’d have a few holes to fill. We’ll have an import coming in, two or three 16 year olds coming in and we’ll have room for two OA’s.
We don’t add the OA’s just yet. We find out “who we are” first. By the middle to end of November, we’ll have a good idea and if we look like we can contend, then we go get a couple high end OA’s. We’d have more than enough assets after having sold off the year prior, to bring in a couple veterans as well as the OA’s.
Saginaw is all in.
-They have two really good OA’s but an ok one who could be improved upon.
-They are overloaded with 19 year olds.
-They have a player in Perfetti who may move on after this year.
-Their 01 group is very thin (only three players).
All this tells me that they should be all in for this season with the next couple as rebuilding years. It would be their second all in season in a row and based on the above, next year should be lean.
With that in mind, a quick look at their roster shows that with the likelihood that Bode Wilde remains in the pros, they’ll need to upgrade the D. Their goaltending isn’t high end with OA Prosvetov not returning and also, because of that, they have an open import spot. Saginaw has no trouble putting the puck in the net but is having a hard time keeping in out.
They could use an upgrade in net, help on D, and a high end, two way forward.
So:
To Kitchener:
02-G- Tristan Lennox
03-D- Connor Punnett
2nd ‘23
2nd ‘24
2nd ‘24
To Saginaw:
00-C- Riley Damiani
00-G- Jacob Ingham
00-D- Axel Bergqvist
3rd ‘23*
3rd ‘24*
Conditions on the 3rds to Saginaw are that if either Damiani or Ingham play an OA season, the picks come back to Kitchener.
Going into this deal, Saginaw has six 2nds and three 3rds (post Antropov deal). After the deal, they’d have three 2nds and five 3rds (two cond). They’d still have enough to upgrade their OA D should they choose. In this deal, they’ve solidified their net, upgraded their D and brought in one of the top two way forwards in the league who is always a threat to score.
Kitchener gets their future #1 goalie, an 03 1st round d-man, and valuable picks for the bank. With this trade, they set themselves up pretty good for the future.
Our roster going into 20-21:
01-Stepien
01-Petizian
01-Dickerson
02-Valade
02-Langdon
02-MacDonnell
02-Serpa
03-Pinelli
03-Fishman
OA
OA
03-Import
04-rookie
-Vukojovic
-MacPherson
-Sebrango
-Ottavainen
-Motew
-Punnett
-Xhekaj
04-rookie
Lennox
Backup
We’d have a few holes to fill. We’ll have an import coming in, two or three 16 year olds coming in and we’ll have room for two OA’s.
We don’t add the OA’s just yet. We find out “who we are” first. By the middle to end of November, we’ll have a good idea and if we look like we can contend, then we go get a couple high end OA’s. We’d have more than enough assets after having sold off the year prior, to bring in a couple veterans as well as the OA’s.
Another thing about having MM behind the bench is he gets to see how each player responds to coaching. It's one thing to draft them and watch them play. It's another thing to actually know how they respond to what he is asking for in practice and with in game adjustments.
He'll see for himself, the strengths and weaknesses of each player and be able to use that for potential trade needs.
This needs to be a sell year, This team is good, but not good enough to get past the second round. Even if they update, others will too and offset any gains we'd make.
He'll see for himself, the strengths and weaknesses of each player and be able to use that for potential trade needs.
This needs to be a sell year, This team is good, but not good enough to get past the second round. Even if they update, others will too and offset any gains we'd make.
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bobber
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Rangers have two seconds over four years. Trade them away and the Rangers will be set back for years. They haven't had a great record of building assets here for years.
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bobber
Registered User
Dirty would the Attack not be rebuilding? If teams going for it are serious and have the assets (2nds) they will pay up for Yantsis , Damiani, Merieles and Hawel. In the end none of us know what the Ranger plan is going forward. We have gotten hopes up for great trade deals over the years and they went down like lead farts. Hopefully MM does what's right.
As well, it give MM an opportunity to see what the assistants are doing up close. Since the new incoming head coach might want to choose his own staff, this might be an opportunity to further clean house behind the bench.
I used OS only because they are a decent team with an open OA spot and could not come up with teams needing an OA RW.
I could definitely see the Attack trading Dudas & Lyle if the price is right.
But that means another OA on the market with 3-4 teams that might take one/give one back
bobber
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K2
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Or ... don't be too surprised if it ends up being a prolonged, successful 'interview' for Karlsson as HC and the 'stacks of resumes' again find their way to the dumpster.
Love to see that but strongly suspect Saggy would value their top prospects higher and perhaps be looking above Damiani + Bergqvist if truly pushing those chips on an all-in.
EvenSteven
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I was thinking that too. But considering Saginaw has no problem scoring goals but that the issue was keeping the pucks out, they may be more inclined to go a little cheaper and bring in a defensive type player like Damiani and maybe the best goalie available on the market as opposed to going after a more expensive big fish like Hayton, Thomas or Noel.
They’d have assets remaining to upgrade the OA group if they wanted and since they’d start rebuilding, its would be nice to hang onto that 2nd in 2020 they still have.
Flint, on the other hand, who don’t have anyone high up in the scoring, may be more likely to go hard after a top gun or two at the deadline.
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with WJC Selection Camp just around the corner, I have a feeling that we will not be losing Riley Damiani. not that he is playing bad, but I don't think he has dominated the league as much as everyone expected after his performance last year. he's on pace to match his point total from last year, and if healthy he plays 9 more games this year than last. so a slight decrease in scoring
the team also looks stacked on paper
the team also looks stacked on paper
Rangers True Blue
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All depends whether Hunter values Damini's strong 2-way play, ability to shutdown top players, and PK skills.
Rangers True Blue
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Faist's call nearly cost Rangers the game. Penalty maybe?....but slew foot? Weak. BUT Rangers won their 3rd.
not to mention the slew foot on Sebrango moments prior
bobber
Registered User
I was pissed on what I thought was a slew foot on Sebrango moments before also. It seems to be a questionable call most times but why did they wait after they called the original. Who made that decision? I loved the game. They out played the Storm and their goalie kept them in this one. Really brought back that old rivalry feeling back. Good effort. At least now they seem to be moving their feet and not stuck in quick sand in their own end.
Rangers True Blue
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A strong team effort today. A great game by both teams. The Rangers came to play.
As good as this win was, I still think we need to sell for the longer term good of the team.
Yes, we can upgrade, but the cost would be high and when others upgrade, it cancels out any upgrade we'd do. We'd get a 2nd round exit and a dim future.
As good as this win was, I still think we need to sell for the longer term good of the team.
Yes, we can upgrade, but the cost would be high and when others upgrade, it cancels out any upgrade we'd do. We'd get a 2nd round exit and a dim future.
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