kenny entering hhof this monday

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

If you ask Leaf fans I doubt you find many that like how Dubas managed his RFA negotiations.

*looks at Toronto's cap structure with the RFA deals to Marner, Matthews, etc.*

I can think of at least one...

oh crap, right!

I was trying to think back to more the time when Holland was still GM of the Wings what was going on around the league, and I had the Kyle Dubas of it all sitting right there in front of me the whole time.

 

[deca guard]

 

[better Red than Dead]

Very happy for KH, well deserved and his legacy wasn’t just the Cups but the stable of future GMs that he mentored. Having said all that, he neesed to leave it was all too clear he was too close to the players and developed blind spots towards certain players and was too stuck in his ways.

 

[MBH]

Kevin Lowe has to be the worst HOF induction ever.
1 top 5 All Star selection.

Clark Gillies, at least, was a first-team all star twice.

 

[Dotter]

Well deserved!

Also, if a guy like Hossa is getting inducted, then Osgood should have been a HHOF goalie years ago. Hossa put up lots of points, but I will never consider him a winner (other than a stacked CHI team). Osgood put up over 400 wins and has 3 Cup rings.

Osgood for HHOF.

 

[dalem177]

Holland was far from perfect, not going to get an argument from me. It just annoys me when people say he was awful post cap, umm Detroit won a cup in the salary cap how does that work.



I would add that Holland was great at Restricted free agent negotiating, he signed a lot of awesome team friendly deals.

I'm ignorant - how is his pre/post cap performance compared to other GMs? No dog in this fight, I'm just curious because to me that's the only valid measure.

-dale

 

[StargateSG1]

I'm ignorant - how is his pre/post cap performance compared to other GMs? No dog in this fight, I'm just curious because to me that's the only valid measure.

-dale

That's cause in 2008 his cap mismanagement didn't catch up with him yet, due to 20% rollback in salaries. It was ALL the "pre-cap" riches.
After that, he screwed up every decision he had to make, having 8-9 unmovable, terrible contracts on the books
for years, and that's according to the resident MLive bootlicker Ansar Khan.

 

[kliq]

I'm ignorant - how is his pre/post cap performance compared to other GMs? No dog in this fight, I'm just curious because to me that's the only valid measure.

-dale

His post cap work was probably more impressive then his pre cap work. While he made some tweaks, the '98 team was largely put together for him, same with '02. He pretty much drafted/traded/signed the entire 2008 team. Where he ran into problems is when he was given a mandate to keep the streak alive and not re-build. With that said, there is no denying he made some awful deals with some of the contracts he handed out. For me though, his 2008 team is his finest work.

 

[14ari13]

One of the greatest GM's of all time, very well deserved. It's too bad he wasn't given the green light to re-build by Illitch when he requested it, unfortunately some fans will always hold that era against him, not that he should even care.

He has sleepless nights.
He also has a job for a team which broke the 80s Oilers team record.

If he was just lucky or partly lucky I wouldn't know.

Congratulations anyhow.


PS. Has anyone seen a film "being there"?

 

[deca guard]

 

[Gniwder]

One of the greatest GM's of all time, very well deserved. It's too bad he wasn't given the green light to re-build by Illitch when he requested it, unfortunately some fans will always hold that era against him, not that he should even care.

I wonder if it would have mattered, his drafting history is pretty sketchy. This team needed new leadership anyways, too many departments stuck doing things the old way.

 

[Mlotek]

goat of all time and it's not even ainec.

Might be confused with Scotty.

I mean, Scotty did leave in like summer of 08 for Chicago.... before leaving them for retirement down the road from Yzerman in Tampa.

Must be just a co-incidence.

 

[kliq]

I wonder if it would have mattered, his drafting history is pretty sketchy. This team needed new leadership anyways, too many departments stuck doing things the old way.

I think his overall drafting history was pretty good, but his first round picks were pretty brutal. Either way, I agree. Holland is perfect at keeping a winner together and adding little pieces, Edmonton was the perfect fit for him, and Yzerman was the perfect fit for us. Win-win.

 

[deca guard]

 

[Retire91]

I don't agree with this. The second half of his career exposed that he can do a decent job of inheriting a hall of fame roster but doesn't know what to do once the players age out of their primes. He assembled one of the worst hockey rosters in hockey history while simultaneously being spent to the cap. I just want to say that again for it to sink in. He put together one of the most embarrassing rosters "in the history of hockey". He set a new standard for the bottom of the modern NHL. Is this maybe the first season that the team has been even remotely fun to watch in what 8 years and it took finally getting rid of Holland for it to start happening and he cock blocked that from happening sooner where we could probably be contending by now.

The second half of his career should have washed out the first.

 

[Sentinel]

I will never forgive him for not giving Datsyuk and Zetterberg ANY stars to play with. Datsyuk ended up centering Cleary and Abdelkader. Ridiculous.

 

[deca guard]

 

[deca guard]

 

[deca guard]

 

[deca guard]

 

[Retire91]

 

[kliq]

He assembled one of the worst hockey rosters in hockey history while simultaneously being spent to the cap. I just want to say that again for it to sink in. He put together one of the most embarrassing rosters "in the history of hockey".

He and Jimmy D pitched a re-build and we’re told to continue making the playoffs.

You can’t hold the direction given by the owner against the GM. I don’t get why people just blindly give Illitch a pass while shitting all over Holland. He 100% made some bad moves, but take back the cleary, Abby, helm, E, Nielsen contracts, nothing changes.

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

They look like two made guys in the Mafia lol

 

[deca guard]

 

[Retire91]

He and Jimmy D pitched a re-build and we’re told to continue making the playoffs.

You can’t hold the direction given by the owner against the GM. I don’t get why people just blindly give Illitch a pass while shitting all over Holland. He 100% made some bad moves, but take back the cleary, Abby, helm, E, Nielsen contracts, nothing changes.

I don't understand that when in light of that knowledge and objective he still did a terrible job how many trade, draft, and contract wins did he have over that lengthy time period. Sandbagging around lidstrom, daytsuk and Zetterberg could have been done by any GM and probably done better. If he did such a good job supporting his star players why did a likely HOF player even abandoned their contract to get out.