Player Discussion: Josh Ho-Sang 2018-19 Pt. III

[Bood12]

Management didn't tell him to oversleep, to not shoot, to not play hard, to not play defense.

he overslept once as far as I know and he was punished harshly for it, and those other things is just crap people say to put him down, or have no merit to them

 

[periferal]

My mistake then. Though, I do think it could still be referring to his age here. Is there a video of the quote? I thought there was.

"He's [young], he's immature and he's got a lot of growing to do."

What difference does it make? There's no one else in the Isles organization (or many organizations anywhere) that are being scratched not because of their talent, but because of how they approach the game. If the argument is that JHS is young and therefore can turn it around...Fine. But the fact that he has to "turn it around" at any age and hasn't shown an ability to do so after multiple years and numerous teams/coaches isn't just noteworthy...It's reached the point where we should expect he never will.

Management didn't tell him to oversleep, to not shoot, to not play hard, to not play defense.

Correct. He's a natural.

 

[PK Cronin]

he overslept once as far as I know and he was punished harshly for it, and those other things is just crap people say to put him down, or have no merit to them

You know there is video evidence and statistical evidence of them, right? They have this category on NHL.com for shots a player has taken, and here's a hint, lower numbers aren't good.

 

[PK Cronin]

What difference does it make? There's no one else in the Isles organization (or many organizations anywhere) that are being scratched not because of their talent, but because of how they approach the game. If the argument is that JHS is young and therefore can turn it around...Fine. But the fact that he has to "turn it around" at any age and hasn't shown an ability to do so after multiple years and numerous teams/coaches isn't just noteworthy...It's reached the point where we should expect he never will.

Intent of the quote really changes if you think he's just berating him for being a baby when compared to him just being young. One is much more positive than the other, because it does mean he could turn it around, that's the difference.

I don't expect it, but there's no reason to give up on it happening at this point. He's not hurting the team by being in Bridgeport and if he ever puts it together, he'll be worth it, at least for the next few seasons.

 

[GrandmaSlices51631]

Management didn't tell him to oversleep, to not shoot, to not play hard, to not play defense.

Or to ramble to the media, instead of putting his "poor me" thoughts in his diary.

https://nypost.com/2018/10/30/josh-...medium=site buttons&utm_campaign=site buttons

Didn't he just say all the Bridgeport games are "weird" - while it's just a simple word, it is somewhat inflammatory. Best thing he can do is S.T.F.U and execute on his assignments

 

[Islanders4Cups]

Let’s say that many folks around here use the term bust way too soon like in a NY minute.

Dal Colle was considered a bust on these boards when he didn’t make the team out of training camp last season.

He was considered a bust at the end of last season at 23 years old ( Ho Sangs age ) when he went scoreless in a handful of games.

He was considered a bust when he didn’t make the team out of training camp this season.

He was considered a bust when getting recalled and sent back after 2 games in November.

He kept working and earned a chance when it presented itself and now has two game winning goals.

He was never a bust (yet) but perhaps a late bloomer.

Oh and my other gripe. Good thing we didn’t tank in the off season.

 

[Bood12]

You know there is video evidence and statistical evidence of them, right? They have this category on NHL.com for shots a player has taken, and here's a hint, lower numbers aren't good.

yes a guy who had a recent 10 day call up who looked very good only averaged 1 shot per game is now deemed unworthy, meanwhile another recent call up who is known as a goal scorer who has looked less impressive also averages about 1 shot per game

 

[PK Cronin]

yes a guy who had a recent 10 day call up who looked very good only averaged 1 shot per game is now deemed unworthy, meanwhile another recent call up who is known as a goal scorer who has looked less impressive also averages about 1 shot per game

I think Ho-Sang is the more talented of the two, I think he impacts the game more than Dal Colle does (and mostly in a positive way), but if he's not going to listen to the coaching staff, he shouldn't be playing.

Your claim that it "is just crap people say to put him down, or have no merit to them" isn't accurate. It's a fact that he did or didn't do those things people are criticizing.

 

[Bood12]

Or to ramble to the media, instead of putting his "poor me" thoughts in his diary.

https://nypost.com/2018/10/30/josh-ho-sang-new-islanders-regime-burying-me-even-in-minors/?utm_source=twitter_sitebuttons&utm_medium=site buttons&utm_campaign=site buttons

Didn't he just say all the Bridgeport games are "weird" - while it's just a simple word, it is somewhat inflammatory. Best thing he can do is S.T.F.U and execute on his assignments

I am pretty sure he said it was a "weird" game, which based on the score it was

 

[Bood12]

I think Ho-Sang is the more talented of the two, I think he impacts the game more than Dal Colle does (and mostly in a positive way), but if he's not going to listen to the coaching staff, he shouldn't be playing.

Your claim that it "is just crap people say to put him down, or have no merit to them" isn't accurate. It's a fact that he did or didn't do those things people are criticizing.

someone saying he is not playing hard or not playing defense is just crap to put him down

 

[MJF]

someone saying he is not playing hard or not playing defense is just crap to put him down

Not playing defense, not skating back hard is a real thing. Especially for Barry Trotz. They aren't buzzwords and dog whistles.

How many times did Trotz bench Barzal for a period just for curling around with the puck?

 

[GrandmaSlices51631]

I am pretty sure he said it was a "weird" game, which based on the score it was

He said all their games are weird.

When the most talented guy has his head up his ass, I guess that can happen.

 

[Rehabguy]

he should have been fired after he called him a "baby" last year, it is obvious there are those in the organization and among the fans who have it out for him

I agree with the general sentiment of this post. I and do agree with your other posts that Ho Sang is still far from a bust and the Islanders would be completely stupid to let him go for nothing. That said, I don't think there is a conspiracy within the organization to hurt his career, I think for the most part he has been pretty good at doing that to himself. But, regards to his relationship with Brett Thompson, I do think there is a problem there and Thompson has been abusing his position as a coach. Acting like an adult shouldn't just go one way and calling a professional hockey player a "baby and immature" crosses the line of professionalism. I'm glad I am not the only one who felt this way when I read Thompson's comments regarding Ho Sang in the papers last year.

Let's be 100% clear. Ho Sang was absolutely correct that the problem with the Islanders last year was not HIS play but he alluded that is based on how the Islanders were playing as a team ie. Doug Weight's system. And when Doug Weight was called for a reply on why Ho Sang was being singled out and demoted to the AHL, rather than offering some introspection on the matter he became defensive and blurted some nonsense regarding Ho Sang saying, "you have to be held accountable don't you?" What absolute nonsense. Really Doug? By that point in time Ho Sang was correct in pointing out how terrible the Islander's GAA was and that it was unfair to lay all the blame on him.

But here's the problem. By calling out Doug Weight, he's also calling out everyone who was hired to help train, develop and ready every player to adopt Weight's system including the young prospects coming up in the system, and guess who's job that was. That's right, Brett Thompson. The coach who dutifully towed the line and trained these players how to play within Capuano's and Weight's systems. You better believe Thompson has a close relationship with Weight and he's well aware of Ho Sang's public criticism of him.

Ho Sang won the battle, but it appears like Brett Thompson is trying to make sure he wins the war by burying this kid and throwing salt on the kid's wounds. There is absolutely no reason why Ho Sang should be benched any further. He needs to regain his confidence in himself. He went through a lot last year and if he wasn't as vocal as he was we may not have even gotten to see the change in general manager or head coach. You better believe Ledecky who was very hands on with this team read what was in the newspaper and like me had to feel that there was some logic to Ho Sang's statements. I do, don't you? So in some respects we all need to thank Ho Sang for helping us make the necessary changes in coaching and GM.

Honestly I think the Islanders need to start with a completely clean slate and find a new coach for Bridgeport. Not just for Ho Sang but I believe this organization is going on a new direction and I don't know why Lou didn't completely clear house. The relationship between Thompson and Ho Sang appears caustic and it may be the reason why Ho Sang is completely unmotivated by this point he has a terrible relationship with his coach who has all the power over him right now. I feel for the kid, cause he was right, but he has got to learn to keep his mouth shut and go balls to the wall when he hopefully has the next chance to play for Trotz.

 

[The Real JT]

I agree with the general sentiment of this post. I and do agree with your other posts that Ho Sang is still far from a bust and the Islanders would be completely stupid to let him go for nothing. That said, I don't think there is a conspiracy within the organization to hurt his career, I think for the most part he has been pretty good at doing that to himself. But, regards to his relationship with Brett Thompson, I do think there is a problem there and Thompson has been abusing his position as a coach. Acting like an adult should just go one way and calling a professional hockey player a "baby and immature" crosses the line of professionalism. I'm glad I am not the only one who felt this way when I read Thompson's comments regarding Ho Sang in the papers last year.

Let's be 100% clear. Ho Sang was absolutely correct that the problem with the Islanders last year was not HIS play but he alluded that is based on how the Islanders were playing as a team ie. Doug Weight's system. And when Doug Weight was called for a reply on why Ho Sang was being singled out and demoted to the AHL, rather than offering some introspection on the matter he became defensive and blurted some nonsense regarding Ho Sang saying, "you have to be held accountable don't you?" What absolute nonsense. Really Doug? By that point in time Ho Sang was correct in pointing out how terrible the Islander's GAA was and that it was unfair to lay all the blame on him.

But here's the problem. By calling out Doug Weight, he's also calling out everyone who was hired to help train, develop and ready every player to adopt Weight's system including the young prospects coming up in the system, and guess who's job that was. That's right, Brett Thompson. The coach who dutifully toed the line and trained these players how to play within Capuano's and Weight's systems. You better believe Thompson has a close relationship with Weight and he's well aware of Ho Sang's public criticism of him.

Ho Sang won the battle, but it appears like Brett Thompson is trying to make sure he wins the war by burying this kid and throwing salt on the kid's wounds. There is absolutely no reason why Ho Sang should be benched any further. He needs to regain his confidence in himself. He went through a lot last year and if he wasn't as vocal as he was we may not have even gotten to see the change in general manager or head coach. You better believe Ledecky who was very hands on with this team read what was in the newspaper and like me had to feel that there was some logic to Ho Sang's statements. I do, don't you? So in some respects we all need to thank Ho Sang for helping us make the necessary changes in coaching and GM.

Honestly I think the Islanders need to start with a completely clean slate and find a new coach for Bridgeport. Not just for Ho Sang but I believe this organization is going on a new direction and I don't know why Lou didn't completely clear house. The relationship between Thompson and Ho Sang appears caustic and it may be the reason why Ho Sang is completely unmotivated by this point he has a terrible relationship with his coach who has all the power over him right now. I feel for the kid, cause he was right, but he has got to learn to keep his mouth shut and go balls to the wall when he hopefully has the next chance to play for Trotz.

Quick question. No offense but..
Do you get paid by the word?

 

[Rehabguy]

Quick question. No offense but..
Do you get paid by the word?

By each word of wisdom.

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

Quick question. No offense but..
Do you get paid by the word?

If so, I know a poster here that's rich af.

 

[periferal]

I was told to shift the conversation here, so posting a reply from another thread here...



The overall point here is that until he's not, I think we should all view Ho-Sang as a total bust, and the reason why he isn't an NHL regular is 100% his own fault.

With Tavares gone, there's no player in the Isles organization that is talked about more than Ho-Sang. And why? Not because he's living up to his top-6 potential and helping this team earn a playoff spot, but because always he continually gets in his own way of living up to that potential.

I keep coming back to this...We all know that right after he was drafted he said with a grin, "I am going to be the best player from this draft class." We all ate it up because it was refreshing to fans of a horribly run franchise to hear someone be so confident and brash - Especially since if you watched his junior highlights, he had the talent to back it up.

However what both Ho-Sang (and his most rabid supporters) don't get is that in order to become the best and also DESERVE a shot with the big club, you have to both work your ass off and act like a professional. Sure we see offseason photo-ops of Ho-Sang signing autographs for kids and again we think, "See...He's a great kid." But that has ZERO to do with how hard he works or how he listens to his coaches, and I believe he doesn't do either particularly well.

I'm looking at Ho-Sang's resume and he's had some sort of issue with every single team he's played. If you think that's a coincidence or it's been all those teams that got it wrong, then there's nothing anyone can say to you to consider that Ho-Sang has been digging his own grave all these years.

Now he's dealing with a Hall of Fame coach and GM whose resumes are such that we shouldn't question their handling of Ho-Sang. And yet...Some still think Lou Lamoriallo and Barry Trotz are the ones who are wrong, and that Ho-Sang is a victim.

If you make a claim that you are "going to be the best player in your draft" (and actually have the talent to back that up), then you should literally be the hardest working player at your job each and every day to achieve that. And the fact that Ho-Sang is clearly not close to the best player from the 2014 draft means that either he's not working hard enough and/or his hockey sense isn't good enough to succeed in the NHL. In either case the issue is mental - Not physical.

It's laughable to think Lou/Trotz wouldn't want Ho-Sang up with the big club to help scoring - Both 5 on 5 and with a dreadful power play. The fact that they're keeping him in Bridgeport should tell you all you need to know.

The talent is there. The head is not. And that is the reason he is where he is in his career.

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

 

[buud]

if Thompson is bad, how did MDC and Toews make it up to the big club? and Pulock, Pelech, Mayfield? what about Koivula and Aho? i would not dare to say that Thompson is a great coach (don't know much about him, except what i read), but i don't think he is ruining kids, with his incompetence.

seems pretty obvious that JHS is not a team player. he should have went into golf or tennis.

 

[Rehabguy]

The sad truth about Ho Sang is that the criticism that had been leveled against him in the juniors leading up to draft day was largely exaggerated and uncalled for.
When Ron "know it all" Hextall comments that Ho Sang was a "bad" kid and that there was no way he would sign this kid in the Flyers, and when the NBC commentator questioned Garth's pick to the point that he had to defend Ho Sang by saying, "they sh#t on me too" on national TV, all the comments in the newspapers (honestly without any hard evidence) that this kid was trouble, - how is Ho Sang not going to respond to all of this? Ho Sang is NOT a bad kid and I'm glad that Hextall got buried long before Ho Sang. The guy's an idiot.

There's a phenomenon in psychology where people who are labeled start identifying themselves with that label and they start becoming "what they hate". That's appears to be happening to Ho Sang especially in the past year following his demotion under Weight. He's sulking because that's what he's expected to do. He's tired of it all. Sure the kid has made a lot of mistakes. He wore #66,. He said he was going to be the best player in his draft. He overslept. None of these are reasons to call him a bad kid or trouble.

Doug Weight was wrong, Ron Hextall was wrong. Brett Thompson is wrong. The pundits who want to see this kid fail are wrong.

Yet Barry Trotz and Lou ARE right and I think they did demote Ho Sang with good intentions because he has things to work on and under the right conditions he WILL be a better player. I just don't know if they are aware of all politics surrounding this kid. Having a coach who calls him immature, a baby, and a "weird" player, constantly keeps him on 4th lines or benches him in the AHL is NOT going to help his development. Brett Thompson needs to get his act together as well or I suggest the billboards need to come up. Get this kid back on the ice and teach him. Stop burying him.

 

[ndgolden]

By each word of wisdom.

Speaking words of wisdom, let it be, let it be.

 

[Rehabguy]

Speaking words of wisdom, let it be, let it be.

I think the words, "Boy you're gonna carry that weight, carry that weight, a long time" is more appropriate for Ho Sang.

 

[doublechili]

I think the words, "Boy you're gonna carry that weight, carry that weight, a long time" is more appropriate for Ho Sang.

Or this one.

 

[Macch]

WOW

Sure are a lot of people tired of talking about JHS...talking about JHS

 

[Rehabguy]

WOW

Sure are a lot of people tired of talking about JHS...talking about JHS

and yet there are still those who are tired of people who are tired of people talking about Hosang but are still talking about Hosing- talking about Hosang. (yes the last is you)