Player Discussion: John Tavares II
- Thread starter seafoam
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Isles Junkie
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SI90
Registered User
Coach Hammer knows how to play defense. To bad our best defensman and coach has requested a trade.
SI90
Registered User
"Johnny get Ovi!!!! He's your man!!! He's all alone!!!! Get the **** away from the crease!!!!"
Yeah that was on JT. Weak board play to set that up.
Full vid:
https://www.nhl.com/video/ovechkin-blasts-go-ahead-goal/t-277350912/c-40849103
Full vid:
https://www.nhl.com/video/ovechkin-blasts-go-ahead-goal/t-277350912/c-40849103
leeroggy
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- Jan 3, 2010
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That wide angle shows it all . . . JT needs to go down in front of that shot. If you won't do it with a few minutes left in a 2-2 game you are not going to win the close playoff games. He hung his goalie out to dry . . . 'here Jaro, you stop it'.
As bad as JT was in the defensive zone, he was great in the offensive zone. Actually, he was even better offensively. Just didn't get the breaks.
Still, one wonders if one couldn't optimize the formula by having JT play with Frans. It's the one thing the team hasn't tried, but probably should as a wake-up call if not for any other reason. Let JT play wing, but take faceoffs. Maximize strengths. Minimize weaknesses.
JT-Nielsen-Okposo
Lee-Strome-Nelson
Bailey-Grabo-Kule
Still, one wonders if one couldn't optimize the formula by having JT play with Frans. It's the one thing the team hasn't tried, but probably should as a wake-up call if not for any other reason. Let JT play wing, but take faceoffs. Maximize strengths. Minimize weaknesses.
JT-Nielsen-Okposo
Lee-Strome-Nelson
Bailey-Grabo-Kule
Physically, JT looks like he's taken 3 steps backwards
I'm a huge JT fan, don't get me wrong. And, we know the points haven't been there. But, what concerns me, is how physically weak JT looks this year. What the hell happened to his strength?? After his rookie season it seemed he was getting stronger and winning battles on the boards. Now, he gets abused physically on every single shift. I can't remember watching a shift where he hasn't been on his ass at least once. Man up JT, get physical and then goals will come.
I'm a huge JT fan, don't get me wrong. And, we know the points haven't been there. But, what concerns me, is how physically weak JT looks this year. What the hell happened to his strength?? After his rookie season it seemed he was getting stronger and winning battles on the boards. Now, he gets abused physically on every single shift. I can't remember watching a shift where he hasn't been on his ass at least once. Man up JT, get physical and then goals will come.
BillD
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- Feb 12, 2004
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I have come to the conclusion that Tavares is one of the worst defensive forwards in the game. Part of it is lack of dedication, the other part is lack of awareness (because he doesn't care enough about it).
On the other hand, Tavares is more of a primary set up forward than a goal scorer. In his remarkable junior career it was the opposite. he was known for his prodigious goal scoring and his passing skills were overlooked although exceptional.
As a pro, he should be paired with a sniper because he is not one, but he can get a shooter like Nelson the puck in good shooting positions.
Because Nelson is being misused as a center, and Strome misused as a winger, Tavares also winds up under performing.
This is all Cappy.
On the other hand, Tavares is more of a primary set up forward than a goal scorer. In his remarkable junior career it was the opposite. he was known for his prodigious goal scoring and his passing skills were overlooked although exceptional.
As a pro, he should be paired with a sniper because he is not one, but he can get a shooter like Nelson the puck in good shooting positions.
Because Nelson is being misused as a center, and Strome misused as a winger, Tavares also winds up under performing.
This is all Cappy.
periferal
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- Jul 5, 2007
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Hey Bill...
I hope you are dead serious about this post because if so you are 100% right. All you have to do is look at Ovechkin prior to Barry Trotz...And after Barry Trotz. He's a new player and the coach is 100% the reason why.
For those of you still thinking that capuano is "not that bad" or give wang/snow a pass for keeping him around this long, please stop.
We are being denied seeing what this collection of talent can really do until we have a real coach. The wool is being pulled over our eyes every day capuano has been, and is, head coach.
leeroggy
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- Jan 3, 2010
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I doubt this is the solution. He needs to be held accountable on this. If you look at the other forwards in the video they are in position on the goal. Grabs has his point man and Strome is between the puck and his point guy (although Strome did puck watch too much but the point guy didn't move). Frans would just have been on the point unless JT was the wing. But I doubt JT can handle a move to wing, even if it is the better solution.
If he wants to be paid like a star he needs to round out his game. He has too much experience at this point to not get it. Trots got it, Bossy got it. Time for him to get it too. And say what you want about Capuano . . . the one thing you can't criticize his system for is dictating where the guys are supposed to be in this situation in the defensive zone. Everyone was in position on this video but one . . . and it cost us the game.
Gap control has haunted JT all along and he gets away with it too much. Jack needs to bench him for a period the next time he gets burnt for doing the same thing. It will pay dividends both with JT and the others. If you keep giving the star player a pass when he veers away from the system the others will eventually start to get pissed off and it snowballs downhill from there.
Well, yeah, that was actually a big part of my idea. Do you have another suggestion about how he could be held accountable?
leeroggy
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- Jan 3, 2010
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Sit him out for shifts when he doesn't get it, that's the only way at this point. Unless you want to trade him, which I doubt anyone wants to do.
One other thing might be to bring in an older player to take over the locker room leadership and take some of that pressure off his shoulders. Look what Jagr has done for the Panthers. Maybe an Andrew Ladd is more valuable then we think. Or even a Chara.
I think the one thing this team does not have is someone who can look JT in the eye and say "enough, you need to get this!" If Travis had not asked for the trade he might well be the guy who could do that, but so much for that.
If we accept that he can't improve his defense, then moving him to wing isn't a bad idea. He already plays the F1 role in the offensive zone (and rightfully so, he's one of our best forecheckers), and he would have less defensive responsibilities. I'd keep with Grabovski though; they've had excellent chemistry.
But my first move would be to limit his shift length. This 1) holds him accountable, and 2) gives him the energy to be effective in both zones.
But my first move would be to limit his shift length. This 1) holds him accountable, and 2) gives him the energy to be effective in both zones.
PK Cronin
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- Feb 11, 2013
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Just need to send him a highlight reel of Bergeron's defensive plays.
I think Tavares shows moments good play defensively, but he gets lost too often. I really don't think he's dogging it back there most of the time. He just doesn't recognize or know where to go quickly enough. He's also almost always cheating toward breaking out, which hurts his defensive play.
Last night on the Ovechkin goal, it was bad, but he was all the way back at the net. It's not like he was controller disconnecting back from center ice and was super late. He was back, just in the wrong position and took too long to recognize it. As a forward, I know which players to pick up and how far back I should be getting. There's a certain point when getting too low becomes a huge native. There was no reason for him to be that deep and I'm not sure what he's thinking/seeing that makes him believe he should be that deep.
I think Tavares shows moments good play defensively, but he gets lost too often. I really don't think he's dogging it back there most of the time. He just doesn't recognize or know where to go quickly enough. He's also almost always cheating toward breaking out, which hurts his defensive play.
Last night on the Ovechkin goal, it was bad, but he was all the way back at the net. It's not like he was controller disconnecting back from center ice and was super late. He was back, just in the wrong position and took too long to recognize it. As a forward, I know which players to pick up and how far back I should be getting. There's a certain point when getting too low becomes a huge native. There was no reason for him to be that deep and I'm not sure what he's thinking/seeing that makes him believe he should be that deep.
"As a pro, he should be paired with a sniper because he is not one, but he can get a shooter like Nelson the puck in good shooting positions."
Agree totally. I said before, we should give Clutterbuck a chance. He might have the second best wrist shot on the team behind Nelson...
Agree totally. I said before, we should give Clutterbuck a chance. He might have the second best wrist shot on the team behind Nelson...
PK Cronin
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- Feb 11, 2013
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I just re-watched the play. Twice he went behind the net to lend support to his D. The second time bit him because the puck reversed back the other way (he was soft on it) and both he and de Haan were out of position (combined with him gong behind the net instead of back taking longer to get to where he needed to be).
When the play is developing, de Haan is battling in the corner with who I believe to be Oshie. Hamonic is working his way from behind the net to the front and is in okay position. Tavares is in front of the net, in good position. He leaves that spot to go to the corner to help de Haan when he should've pulled off to Backstrom who was creeping down past Grabovski at the top of the dot. When both he and de Haan engage behind the goal line, there are three Islanders staring at Oshie, Ovechkin along with Backstrom are wide open. When the puck is reversed, one retrieves and the other creates space by backing away from the net.
de Haan and Tavares are below the goal line and Hamonic is on the crease's line at the top. They all got too puck focused and are completely screwed by the time Backstrom gets the puck in the corner. That's 3 Isles low with only 1 Capital there. Recipe for disaster.
On the other hand. JT should have had a 3 point night and a solid road win. That OV goal came from failed dump attempts, tired unit and a mental error by JT. Tough to given that up but we failed to convert on multiple chances. Games more on missed chances. He is for sure not a great defensive player which needs to be improved, but I think he's playing best hockey in last 2 weeks in entire season. Boychuck coming back will be a huge addition. Watching Strait every night is much worse than JT on D.
Last night was a great game against top team in NHL. Should have won, shake it off. Playoff race is tight. Take the positives and move onto Detroit.
Last night was a great game against top team in NHL. Should have won, shake it off. Playoff race is tight. Take the positives and move onto Detroit.
BillD
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- Feb 12, 2004
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He made some magnificent passes to set up scoring chances...about 4 to Strome alone. They were "in space" so they would never have been made to MM26. But that was why MM26 became a 30+ goal scorer early in JT's career. The only player we have who has shown he can finish on those kinds of JT set ups "in space" is Brock. Grabo does have that ability but has never been a big goal scorer in his career.
Johnny has the rare ability to morph from playmaker to goal scorer, he has been showing of that talent recently. He is making the passes, no one is finishing. Someone should wake Garth, the trade deadline is coming. Next year may be too late.
He isn't awful when he isn't gassed, but his plight is compounded by being saddled with other poor defensive players, and their getting gassed staying out with him.
First Blood
The Greiss Is Right!
http://nypost.com/2016/02/13/why-brooklyn-frustrated-john-tavares-could-bolt-to-leafs-in-18/
Why Brooklyn-frustrated John Tavares could bolt to Leafs in ’18
Hope this is not true
Why Brooklyn-frustrated John Tavares could bolt to Leafs in ’18
Hope this is not true
TROLLCHUK
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- Jul 1, 2006
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