Prospect Info: Jesperi Kotkaniemi

[MSLs absurd thighs]

This is ridiculous. For all the shit I'm giving that pick, physical abilities should not even be something you evaluate in a game filled with Junior-aged players. The guy is not going to make this team this season anyway. Plenty of time to build some meat. This is the least of my concerns. And God knows there are many.

Molson's comments just reflect how out of bound he is when it comes to hockey-based decisions. He's basically as clueless as they come if he actually believes this kid has a shot of making this team this season.

The good news in all of this is that if Molson is that much disconnected from reality, he's going to fire Bergevin weeks into the season. Because there's no way this team does anything good.

Back to JK, I actually believe the best-case scenario for him would be to play in Laval for Bouchard from the get go and play Center in a league where quality is a known commodity. It did Pastrnak a lot of good and I think in his situation it's the way to go.

 

[417]

That would be a terrible decision.

So that's what I expect this organization to do...

The right decision is to allow the kid to come to camp and force Julien/Bergevin's hand...

Which is basically what Molson said.

 

[NotProkofievian]

I think you’re reading too much into this.....all Molson said was he won’t rule it out meaning they’ll let the kid play to his full potential with a mindset that he could make the team.

Imagine in training camp, day 1, having all the players lined up, and Bergevin going to all of them one by one and saying you’re gonna make it, you’re gonna make it, you, you have no chance, you were sending back on first cut.

It doesn’t work like that. You let the kids enter camp with a clear mind and let them play their game. Having that cloud of you’re going back is an unnecessary distraction.

At least that’s the way I see it

I see it differently. You don't even let kids who aren't ready into camp. Jesperi has unfinished business before he thinks about cracking an NHL lineup. IMO, the organization should be straight with him about it, send him on a mission back home, tell him what to focus on, and provide resources to help get him to the next level.

I'm not saying it's some major thing, but this way he's going to get cut, and that's going to suck, and there's no reason for it. It's just a distraction from what he needs to focus on.

 

[417]

This is ridiculous. For all the **** I'm giving that pick, physical abilities should not even be something you evaluate in a game filled with Junior-aged players. The guy is not going to make this team this season anyway. Plenty of time to build some meat. This is the least of my concerns. And God knows there are many.

Molson's comments just reflect how out of bound he is when it comes to hockey-based decisions. He's basically as clueless as they come if he actually believes this kid has a shot of making this team this season.

The good news in all of this is that if Molson is that much disconnected from reality, he's going to fire Bergevin weeks into the season. Because there's no way this team does anything good.

Here are Molson's comments...verbatim

“Marc Bergevin and Claude Julien and the team will certainly take time to evaluate this young player who we just drafted in Dallas,” Molson said in his most recent Like A Boss video. “I hope he comes in and gives it everything he has to make the team and shows he can contribute as an 18-year-old, but we never know. It will depend on a lot of different factors, but he’ll be at camp and he’s going to try his best to make the team.”

Geoff Molson never actually says that he believes the kid has a shot to make the team this season...what he says is that he HOPES he comes to camp and forces the coaching staff/management hand and earns a spot on the team.

I don't know what's so wrong with that...this was an appropriate response for an owner who doesn't and shouldn't make hockey personnel decisions. I wouldn't want him saying "yes" or "no" to this question either way. The best answer is to say that it's up to Kotakniemi, Julien & Bergevin. Which is exactly what he did.

I would love it if Koktaniemi came to camp and was so good, so impressive that the team has to make room for him on the team.

I think that would be wonderful...

As long as they're not forcing the decision, I don't see what's wrong with this approach.

 

[417]

I see it differently. You don't even let kids who aren't ready into camp. Jesperi has unfinished business before he thinks about cracking an NHL lineup. IMO, the organization should be straight with him about it, send him on a mission back home, tell him what to focus on, and provide resources to help get him to the next level.

I'm not saying it's some major thing, but this way he's going to get cut, and that's going to suck, and there's no reason for it. It's just a distraction from what he needs to focus on.

I don't see what's wrong with making him measure up against his peers in an NHL training camp...this guy has been playing vs men. It's OK to challenge him.

The most likely scenario is he gets cut...but at least he'll have an idea of how far he is away from the NHL and what he needs to do to get there.

 

[MSLs absurd thighs]

I see it differently. You don't even let kids who aren't ready into camp. Jesperi has unfinished business before he thinks about cracking an NHL lineup. IMO, the organization should be straight with him about it, send him on a mission back home, tell him what to focus on, and provide resources to help get him to the next level.

I'm not saying it's some major thing, but this way he's going to get cut, and that's going to suck, and there's no reason for it. It's just a distraction from what he needs to focus on.

People will come up and say "HIS FATHER'S A COACH" and yada yada yada... but I have absolutely ZERO confidence in European-league based teams to develop our prospects. Zero. Nada. None. They ALWAYS think about the best short-term interest of their own team. We've been there and gotten burnt many, many times before. The definition of insanity is trying the same thing over and over again expecting different results.

I genuinely think the best way to go with a kid like this who is seen as more of a long-term project is bring him to Laval, let him play big minutes at C for Joel Bouchard, and let things go from there. That's going to be Bouchard's first project, and you can bet he's going to do everything for it to succeed.

It's also much easier to track one prospect's development when the context is 100% known, controlled and monitored.

 

[Kriss E]

I think you’re reading too much into this.....all Molson said was he won’t rule it out meaning they’ll let the kid play to his full potential with a mindset that he could make the team.

Imagine in training camp, day 1, having all the players lined up, and Bergevin going to all of them one by one and saying you’re gonna make it, you’re gonna make it, you, you have no chance, you were sending back on first cut.

It doesn’t work like that. You let the kids enter camp with a clear mind and let them play their game. Having that cloud of you’re going back is an unnecessary distraction.

At least that’s the way I see it

I don't see what the problem would be if they did this with Kotka. He was just drafted, he comes into camp to show what he can do. He isn't going to half ass his camp just because he has no chance of making the team this year.
Now if they said this to Scherbak, then it's different.

If telling a 19yo kid who was drafted a month ago he won't be part of the NHL this year is going to mess up his mind and distract him, well damn, that is a seriously mentally weak player.
What you are looking for is the kid to responds by telling himself he'll play so well he'll force management to backtrack on their words.

 

[BB88]

If your 18y prospects weakness is balance/strenght then you have a pretty damm good prospect on your hands.
That's the easiest to fix, just normal growth will do wonders for it, then imagine if he has a great support group behind him to help him develop as much as possible.

Smarts is still the most valuable asset, and Kotka should have that plenty.

 

[NotProkofievian]

People will come up and say "HIS FATHER'S A COACH" and yada yada yada... but I have absolutely ZERO confidence in European-league based teams to develop our prospects. Zero. Nada. None. They ALWAYS think about the best short-term interest of their own team. We've been there and gotten burnt many, many times before. The definition of insanity is trying the same thing over and over again expecting different results.

I genuinely think the best way to go with a kid like this who is seen as more of a long-term project is bring him to Laval, let him play big minutes at C for Joel Bouchard, and let things go from there. That's going to be Bouchard's first project, and you can bet he's going to do everything for it to succeed.

I have no problem putting him in Laval. If we really have to do this stupid f***ing song and dance of bringing him to training camp and wasting his time, this is the best likely outcome. We have this fancy new AHL coach, why not use him, right?

But which prospects do you think were negatively affected by euro systems? I don't think Sly would've done any better than Frölunda and KalPa did with Lehkonen for example.

 

[NotProkofievian]

I don't see what's wrong with making him measure up against his peers in an NHL training camp...this guy has been playing vs men. It's OK to challenge him.

The most likely scenario is he gets cut...but at least he'll have an idea of how far he is away from the NHL and what he needs to do to get there.

Or he's going to have the idea in his head that he just wasn't good enough despite his best effort. Why force your best prospect to fail so soon after drafting him? What's the best outcome from this situation that you think is likely, and why do you think it's better than just letting him focus on his Liiga season?

 

[DAChampion]

I think you’re reading too much into this.....all Molson said was he won’t rule it out meaning they’ll let the kid play to his full potential with a mindset that he could make the team.

Imagine in training camp, day 1, having all the players lined up, and Bergevin going to all of them one by one and saying you’re gonna make it, you’re gonna make it, you, you have no chance, you were sending back on first cut.

It doesn’t work like that. You let the kids enter camp with a clear mind and let them play their game. Having that cloud of you’re going back is an unnecessary distraction.

At least that’s the way I see it

The issue is that back in 2012, Bergevin said that he wouldn't commit to having Galchenyuk and Gallagher on the roster. He said that it was up to them to earn their spot.

We know what happened.

They both made the roster because Bergevin/Therrien wanted to "make the playoffs where anything can happen", i.e. be massacred by Ottawa in five games in the first round. The Habs missed out on another top pick. Moreover, Galchenyuk being rushed undermined his development.

Bergevin has since continued to rush and otherwise mishandle prospects.

 

[MSLs absurd thighs]

I have no problem putting him in Laval. If we really have to do this stupid ****ing song and dance of bringing him to training camp and wasting his time, this is the best likely outcome. We have this fancy new AHL coach, why not use him, right?

But which prospects do you think were negatively affected by euro systems? I don't think Sly would've done any better than Frölunda and KalPa did with Lehkonen for example.

Can we just stop bringing up Sly? He's just a terrible everything. Playing in Africa with roller blades would be better for development than playing for Sly.

FORTUNATELY, now, Sly's a nightmare from the past. We have an option we didn't have in the last few years now that we've got ourselves competent coaching in the farm. For a guy like the one we drafted who needs grooming and time before turning into what people here hope to see him become, I think it's in our best interest to put him in a context where the main focus is going to be just that; to turn him into a quality C, and to make that a priority even over a couple of wins for the Rocket.

 

[417]

Or he's going to have the idea in his head that he just wasn't good enough despite his best effort. Why force your best prospect to fail so soon after drafting him?

I wouldn't call getting cut from an NHL training camp as a fresh 18yr old a "failure"...it's more of an expectation.

What's the best outcome from this situation that you think is likely, and why do you think it's better than just letting him focus on his Liiga season?

The best outcome?

Would obviously be for him to be so impressive at training camp, that he forces management's hand to keep him in the NHL. I think that would be wonderful, again, as long as the player is forcing management's hand and not management forcing him in a situation he shouldn't be in.

If the best situation is for him to go back to Finland, then so be, but I think it's good to send him back with goals to strive for. He needs to see how far he is from the NHL.

I think challenging your prospects, especially the better ones, is good for development. The NHL is changing, it's a young man's game...maybe he's not as far away as we think.

But again, we'll know more when we get him in camp.

In turn, let me ask you...

What would be the best outcome if he's not brought over for camp and just plays the entire year in Finland?

 

[DAChampion]

People will come up and say "HIS FATHER'S A COACH" and yada yada yada... but I have absolutely ZERO confidence in European-league based teams to develop our prospects. Zero. Nada. None. They ALWAYS think about the best short-term interest of their own team. We've been there and gotten burnt many, many times before. The definition of insanity is trying the same thing over and over again expecting different results.

I genuinely think the best way to go with a kid like this who is seen as more of a long-term project is bring him to Laval, let him play big minutes at C for Joel Bouchard, and let things go from there. That's going to be Bouchard's first project, and you can bet he's going to do everything for it to succeed.

It's also much easier to track one prospect's development when the context is 100% known, controlled and monitored.

Lehkonen was developed in Europe.

 

[417]

The issue is that back in 2012, Bergevin said that he wouldn't commit to having Galchenyuk and Gallagher on the roster. He said that it was up to them to earn their spot.

We know what happened.

They both made the roster because Bergevin/Therrien wanted to "make the playoffs where anything can happen", i.e. be massacred by Ottawa in five games in the first round. The Habs missed out on another top pick. Moreover, Galchenyuk being rushed undermined his development.

Bergevin has since continued to rush and otherwise mishandle prospects.

Alex Galchenyuk is tied for 1st in points in his draft year.

Despite being drafted 147th overall, Brendan Gallagher is 11th in points from his draft year.

I'm not sure how you can argue keeping both of them up "rushed them" or somehow negatively impacted their careers.

 

[L4br3cqu3]

If he 'forces' the administration into making him a roster player on that starting lineup of ours, BECAUSE he's head and shoulders above others in the camp, fine.

If he makes the team because of our atrocious depth at C and because the administration wants to save face, that would be pathetic, whether he's ready or not.

In both cases, kid could do well, but could also struggle mightily. Good thing is that he can be sent down in the A if things turns sour, so at least there's that, and I have confidence in our development for the first time in ages, with Bouchard in place.

Let's not rush the kid, it's not like we'll compete this year anyway, damn for once build something intelligently and methodically.

I don't want another 1st round bust on our hands, we've had too many already in the last 10 years.

 

[NotProkofievian]

Can we just stop bringing up Sly? He's just a terrible everything. Playing in Africa with roller blades would be better for development than playing for Sly.

No arguments lol.

FORTUNATELY, now, Sly's a nightmare from the past. We have an option we didn't have in the last few years now that we've got ourselves competent coaching in the farm. For a guy like the one we drafted who needs grooming and time before turning into what people here hope to see him become, I think it's in our best interest to put him in a context where the main focus is going to be just that; to turn him into a quality C, and to make that a priority even over a couple of wins for the Rocket.

I agree with this, and this is the reason I don't have a problem putting him in Laval this year. I prefer Liiga, but Bouchard makes Laval an acceptable - even enticing option. The only reason I prefer having him in Liiga is practical matters. He has one thing to focus on/adapt to in Liiga. His energy this season would be devoted towards dominating his competition, which I think is an important step, especially for a kid who's been playing ahead of his age group. Learning that you can be ''the guy,'' instead of just ''good, all things considered.'' The travel and play schedule is also way lighter which is at least a better environment for physical development.

I think Jesperi would adapt to the new league, competition, travel, and playing style, and don't think it would be catastrophic for his development, I just think it's not the best choice.

 

[417]

I think in coming years...you're going to see a lot more European drafted players, who have been playing vs men in the draft years, comes right over to NA after being drafted and playing in the AHL.

With young players making an impact sooner these days, I think teams would prefer to have more control on how their prospects develop by having them close.

 

[Kriss E]

This is ridiculous. For all the **** I'm giving that pick, physical abilities should not even be something you evaluate in a game filled with Junior-aged players. The guy is not going to make this team this season anyway. Plenty of time to build some meat. This is the least of my concerns. And God knows there are many.

Molson's comments just reflect how out of bound he is when it comes to hockey-based decisions. He's basically as clueless as they come if he actually believes this kid has a shot of making this team this season.

The good news in all of this is that if Molson is that much disconnected from reality, he's going to fire Bergevin weeks into the season. Because there's no way this team does anything good.

Back to JK, I actually believe the best-case scenario for him would be to play in Laval for Bouchard from the get go and play Center in a league where quality is a known commodity. It did Pastrnak a lot of good and I think in his situation it's the way to go.

The time to build that meat is now. He is entering the perfect age to start push physical training.

 

[DAChampion]

Was Eric Chouinard ever a good prospect, or did he bust due to 1990s-era mismanagement?

 

[le_sean]

Maybe people should read the actual comment Molson made. It was very neutral. “He’ll come to training camp and we’ll see how it goes.” What else is he supposed to say, “he’s got no shot?”

You have to remember the average hockey fan has no idea who Kotkaniemi is and have never seen him play. They heard “Zadina Zadina Zadina” before the draft. If Molson starts saying he needs 2-3 years to develop, people will get pissed. They just don’t understand.

 

[MSLs absurd thighs]

Lehkonen was developed in Europe.

Can we actually say Lehkonen is a success story just yet?

 

[MSLs absurd thighs]

Was Eric Chouinard ever a good prospect, or did he bust due to 1990s-era mismanagement?

I think he was just not a very good prospect. For some reasons, some guys develop and some don't. I see guys like Ribeiro, Ryder and Markov who developed just fine in this same draft year. I just think Chouinard was a all-around bust.

I think the same can be said about Leblanc.

 

[DAChampion]

Can we actually say Lehkonen is a success story just yet?

He was trending really highly. Hopefully the Habs don't ruin him.

 

[DAChampion]

I think he was just not a very good prospect. For some reasons, some guys develop and some don't. I see guys like Ribeiro, Ryder and Markov who developed just fine in this same draft year. I just think Chouinard was a all-around bust.

I think the same can be said about Leblanc.

I saw Leblanc be extremely effective in the 2012 season playing bottom six minutes. He was just an excellent player. So, imo, the fact that he didn't make it is due to mismanagement, injuries, or both. We know that Sly was a bully so it's not a reach.