Player Discussion Jesperi Kotkaniemi- So You See That's Where The Trouble Began,That Smile,That Damned Smile Edition

[admiralcadillac]

Of course the fact that he's playing in the NHL with such a lanky physique at 18 year old is impressive but thats not the point, the fact that hes that tall doesn't mean his body is mature. Can he play in the NHL right now even with his current physique? yes he's smart enough. Is it the best option for his developpement, i'm still not sure about it... i guess it's the kind of stuff we will never know, but is making him play less minutes and less overall quality minutes against tougher competition better than making a smoother transition on NA ice ( yes let's not forget he's never played north americain hockey before this season) with a top end role with top end minutes in the AHL with a developpement Coach + going to the WJC? I was never against showing him how the NHL was for a few games, he did force the managements hands but at the end of the day the decision was whats best for his futures, proving he can hold his own in the NHL or take the safest option with a smoother developpement learning NA ice and playing more minutes and grow a bigger physique for the NHL next year. My personnal humble opinion is the second option. i might be wrong, I wanted Montreal to fall into the draft since the end of the U18 because Kotkaniemi was my guy and had no faith in Montreal picking him at 5, let alone 3!

We honestly can't screw or stun this kids developpement, he's one of the key, he'll never be that shift by shift fancy flash player, but he could be that shift by shift Effective center that does it all and we need him to be that guy or else we're ****ed. Montreal top prospects are all the same type, Effective collective player. If Kotkaniemi doesn't pan out to be a 1C two-way center or the best 2C in the NHL, this team will likely go no where unless we somehow get lucky in a draft.

I think you're thinking this through way too much. Why in the hell would his development be stunted?

I think a step back and some perspective is desperately needed here.

 

[robicgi]

Right now he is the 2nd best center on the team at 18. He will get better in the areas he needs to inprove on in the coming years but IMO there is no benifit of him playing anywhere else but the NHL. The kid has been one of the most exciting players this year and regularly generates great scoring chances. I feel they are bringing him along perfectly with his ice time and now 1st pp time. Could he have more point playing with better wingers? More than likely but there is nothing wrong with easing the kid in. Why put the pressure of 1st line center on a 18 year old anyways. 3rd line with pp time is perfect IMO. From what ive seen this year (watching every game plus preseason) is that he will be 60 plus points up to mid 70ish once they feel he is ready for the 1st line role. I feel he also has the potential to be a ppg center as he gains more experience as his vision is excellent.
Also it takes time to build chemestry for any player let alone a 18 year old rookie playing on smaller ice with players hes never played with before .
To send him to the AHL to me would be foolish as anyone who has watched all the games should be able to see he is ready to play at this level . 14 mins of NHL is way better for development then 18 in the AHL IMO.

 

[PhysicX]

Three points in his last 10 games played. Fatigue settling in?

 

[Mrb1p]

Three points in his last 10 games played. Fatigue settling in?

No hes still playing with crap and getting 11 minutes a night. Hes mishandled and at this point he should be in the AHL or Liiga for the good of his development.

In the end, we were right to say he should not have made the NHL. This was written in the sky. Couldnt have been clearer. They were 100% going to bring him up and not play him and waste a year away of potential. Then we wonder why Timmins never develops anyone.

 

[Tuggy]

Three points in his last 10 games played. Fatigue settling in?

Possible.

But he's an 18 year old rookie playing in the NHL. Peaks and valleys should be expected.

 

[SpeedyPotato]

No hes still playing with crap and getting 11 minutes a night. Hes mishandled and at this point he should be in the AHL or Liiga for the good of his development.

In the end, we were right to say he should not have made the NHL. This was written in the sky. Couldnt have been clearer. They were 100% going to bring him up and not play him and waste a year away of potential. Then we wonder why Timmins never develops anyone.

I disagree. I think they're actually doing a good job with him right now. Expectations are low with this team, he's playing at center and on the first PP unit. I don't think there's anything wrong with him right now, and although I agree that I'd like to see a consistent 15 min/game, I think this will come the further we go into the season.

 

[417]

No hes still playing with crap and getting 11 minutes a night. Hes mishandled and at this point he should be in the AHL or Liiga for the good of his development.

In the end, we were right to say he should not have made the NHL. This was written in the sky. Couldnt have been clearer. They were 100% going to bring him up and not play him and waste a year away of potential. Then we wonder why Timmins never develops anyone.

More hot takes

 

[DAChampion]

More hot takes

You'll be the first person blaming Timmins if Kotkaniemi does not work out.

 

[417]

You'll be the first person blaming Timmins if Kotkaniemi does not work out.

Why?

Because I have a history of blaming Trevor Timmins that i'm not aware of?

What's this comment have to do with what I posted?

 

[Habs]

He was bad on quite a few plays last night , passing to nowhere, coughing the puck up and he doesn't hit the net very often. I know he's young, but maybe he should sit a game and take a little break.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

He's just too weak right now, and everyone on the other team knows it. He also needs to cut his stick and fix his balance issues (which could happen as he adds strentgh).

 

[Mrb1p]

I disagree. I think they're actually doing a good job with him right now. Expectations are low with this team, he's playing at center and on the first PP unit. I don't think there's anything wrong with him right now, and although I agree that I'd like to see a consistent 15 min/game, I think this will come the further we go into the season.

"This will come further we go into the season"
October 2018.

"Well he never wanted it, why didn't he grab his chance!"
October "2023"


Where have I seen this before.

 

[Mrb1p]

More hot takes

I'm surprised you can even speak with management shoved so far down your throat.

 

[DAChampion]

Mete, Juulsen, and Kotkaniemi should have each started the season in Laval.

 

[417]

I'm surprised you can even speak with management shoved so far down your throat.

LOL

Given i'm constantly critizing management/coaching...

i'll file this away in another "hot garbage" take by Mrb1p

You haven't been able to keep ONE coherent/consistent thought on Kotkaniemi ALL year.

You've gone from saying they should have never drafted him, to he should never come to training camp, to he should be sent down, to he should be bumped up to 1st line...

Now you're back on he should be in the AHL.

What a roller coaster you've taken us all along for.

 

[417]

Mete, Juulsen, and Kotkaniemi should have each started the season in Laval.

Yeah...cause Laval is churning out NHL prospects for the Habs right now lol

What a bizarre post

Kotkaniemi is developing before your very eyes...but because the only way YOU equate development is with points.

You're not able to see it.

"Score vision" is not a way to evaluate the progress of a player. You may as well not watch games and just follow boxscores.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

• NCAA would have been the best route for him. It's the best place for a skinny player to add weight and mass, and it's a pro style environment playing against men on an NHL sized rink.

 

[DAChampion]

Yeah...cause Laval is churning out NHL prospects for the Habs right now lol

That's what I'm talking about. You write some incredibly stupid comments just to be on the side of Bergevin and to be argumentative with others.

 

[Mrb1p]

Mete, Juulsen, and Kotkaniemi should have each started the season in Laval.

TBH, Juulsen has been doing really good and I'm 100% fine with him playing 2nd pairing this year.

It's the spot hes going to be playing anyway in his career, so thats where he should play.

Mete and Kotkaniemi, yep. Unless you're going to play them on the 2nd pair/first pair and the top 6, send em somewhere they can play.

 

[417]

That's what I'm talking about. You write some incredibly stupid comments just to be on the side of Bergevin and to be argumentative with others.

Can you point to which comments I've made to be on the side of Bergevin?

Considering I haven't even written the name "Bergevin" today before this very post?

Furthermore, in the VERY post you quoted...i'm sarcastically pointing to how Laval IS NOT churning out NHL prospects, which is actually a direct criticism of said management that you keep saying I support unequivocally.

You make ZERO sense.

"You write some incredibly stupid comments just to be on the side of Bergevin"

I mean, what kind of nonsense is this? When will this board be rid of this "anti vs pro Bergevin" arguments that always pop up.

Grow the F up man...I have zero reason to "be on the side of Bergevin", the only attachment I have is to this team, not the GM or the coach, who if you took the time to notice, I criticize on an almost daily basis.

 

[Mrb1p]

LOL

Given i'm constantly critizing management/coaching...

i'll file this away in another "hot garbage" take by Mrb1p

You haven't been able to keep ONE coherent/consistent thought on Kotkaniemi ALL year.

You've gone from saying they should have never drafted him, to he should never come to training camp, to he should be sent down, to he should be bumped up to 1st line...

Now you're back on he should be in the AHL.

What a roller coaster you've taken us all along for.

???

You're out to lunch.

Boqvist/Kotkaniemi is probably the most potential available. I thought we werent taking Boqvist into account, clearly. I'd go with those two.

On 17th of April.

I'm not even sure theres a drop off between Hughes/Tkahuk and the rest.

At this point I might even put Boqvist in the 2nd group, I don't even know where he stands. Theres a drop off at 4, and then about 10 players id love. Add Denisenko, Wilde, Lundestrom and Kotkaniemi to the list.

In my my top 15 since early febuary.

I had Kotkaniemi solidly at 4 on my list before the draft, just behind Boqvist, who I knew the Habs would not draft, so Kotkaniemi was my pick.

There's one constant narrative with what I'm saying, and I bet you still haven't caught on.

Hint: it's in almost every post I've made in this thread.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Mete, Juulsen, and Kotkaniemi should have each started the season in Laval.

Habs problem is depth and they make the team cause of our lack of depth at certain positions. I agree with you. I just think these guys made the team cause of lack of depth

Center: Does Kotkaneimi make our team as the 3C if we had 3 decent centers already?

Mete: We need LD depth. Mete is in/out of the line-up all year. Does he make the team if we had depth at LD?

Juulsen: I actually think he is NHL ready. Between the 3, I think I would of had no problem if he was the only guy to make it.

 

[Habs Halifax]

TBH, Juulsen has been doing really good and I'm 100% fine with him playing 2nd pairing this year.

It's the spot hes going to be playing anyway in his career, so thats where he should play.

Mete and Kotkaniemi, yep. Unless you're going to play them on the 2nd pair/first pair and the top 6, send em somewhere they can play.

We don't agree often but on this one we do! Juulsen is NHL ready in a top 4D role. Mete and Kotkaniemi should of not made the team but they did due to lack of depth and how they look based on promise and not "looking out of place"

 

[417]

???

You're out to lunch.
On 17th of April.



In my my top 15 since early febuary.

I had Kotkaniemi solidly at 4 on my list before the draft, just behind Boqvist, who I knew the Habs would not draft, so Kotkaniemi was my pick.

There's one constant narrative with what I'm saying, and I bet you still haven't caught on.

Hint: it's in almost every post I've made in this thread.

Please don't start digging up old takes...you've got some doozies on Kotkaniemi.

Who cares really, this is irrelevant to what you posted earlier.

I'm not sure what your issue with Kotkaniemi presently is?

Did you draft him in some keeper pool and you're pissed cause you're not getting enough points?? Why the hell would you want a guy whose developing/progressing/growing in the NHL to send him down to an inferior league to play on a crappy AHL team?

I mean, you've complained that he's playing with AHLer Kenny Agostino...how are you going to feel when he's playing with Alex Belzille & Daniel Audette??

What sense does that make?

Maybe if you saw past production, you'd actually notice that Kotkaniemi IS developing...

Mind you, I certainly don't disagree that i'd like to see Kotkaniemi play more, everyone does...so this idea that i'm just blindly supporting whatever CJ the Dinosaur does is totally way off base.

Try to keep up man

 

[417]

We don't agree often but on this one we do! Juulsen is NHL ready in a top 4D role. Mete and Kotkaniemi should of not made the team but they did due to lack of depth and how they look based on promise and not "looking out of place"

I'm not going to speak for Mete...

But Kotkaniemi made the team because he proved he was one of the top 3Cs for this team at training camp and he has maintained that status for the first 28 games of his NHL career.

To suggest he only made the team based on promise, is completely false.

Perhaps if this team had more depth down the middle - he would have never gotten a look, but that's different then suggesting he's here only because of his "promise".