Value of: Jason Zucker

[Bazeek]

What were both trades that went into the toilet for him in the past 6 months? That should give us a good look at what his value is

TDL: Zucker for CGY 1st and Frolik
Pre-draft: Zucker and Rask for Kessel and Johnson

 

[Gaud]

Would he be an available player if he waived his NTC and what assets would the Wild want for him?

He is worth less than Zucker-ello

 

[Flames Fanatic]

Why would Guerin accept less than Fenton already essentially got? The only thing reportedly stopping that 1st + Frolik deal was a mix-up filing paperwork on the Calgary end.

Interesting as unless I'm remembering it wrong I'm pretty sure the rumor on our end was referring to Tre being white hot mad at Minnesota, and that Fenton called it off cause it leaked and he blamed the Calgary end.

 

[Bazeek]

Interesting as unless I'm remembering it wrong I'm pretty sure the rumor on our end was referring to Tre being white hot mad at Minnesota, and that Fenton called it off cause it leaked and he blamed the Calgary end.

The only reliable report I've seen is this one from Russo's big Fenton story.

Then, there was the Zucker cluster-you-know-what. Sources say there was a lot of resistance, even from some of Fenton’s hires, but Fenton came close to trading Zucker to Calgary for a first-round pick and Michael Frolik. Because of an issue on Calgary’s end, the trade fell through at the very last moments before the 2 p.m. deadline. The story got out, and that created a lot of tension between Zucker and Fenton, who initially denied the story to Zucker. More than three months later, Zucker was nearly traded again to Pittsburgh, but Phil Kessel wouldn’t waive his no-trade clause to come to Minnesota.

 

[Flames Fanatic]

The only reliable report I've seen is this one from Russo's big Fenton story.

And don't get me wrong, as I tend to trust Russo as he's one of the best in the biz, just interesting on the contradicting stories.

 

[57special]

It's not a good look for a front office if a paperwork screw up messes up a deal, so no surprise that neither side is admitting to it. As a wild fan, i'm glad the deal didn't go though, so i'm not complaining.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

It's not a good look for a front office if a paperwork screw up messes up a deal, so no surprise that neither side is admitting to it. As a wild fan, i'm glad the deal didn't go though, so i'm not complaining.

As a frequent contributor to the Canes bird and staunch supporter of the Nino for Rask trade, what would get Zucker to Carolina?

I’m thinking McGinn has to go back for cap reasons. I think we have the picks and prospects to get it done with the extra collateral

 

[Bazeek]

As a frequent contributor to the Canes bird and staunch supporter of the Nino for Rask trade, what would get Zucker to Carolina?

I’m thinking McGinn has to go back for cap reasons. I think we have the picks and prospects to get it done with the extra collateral

Toronto's 1st would be a good start.

And you better take care of that bird.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

Toronto's 1st would be a good start.

And you better take care of that bird.

The birds name is Hamilton. No it’s Stormy. Shit I can’t keep track. Well McGinn + TO 1st works for me (or maybe let’s say the lower of the two picks between Car and To).

I still don’t think Canes can make that cap work but it’s all fantasy anyway so if you’re happy I’m happy and the birds happy

 

[Bazeek]

The birds name is Hamilton. No it’s Stormy. **** I can’t keep track. Well McGinn + TO 1st works for me (or maybe let’s say the lower of the two picks between Car and To).

I still don’t think Canes can make that cap work but it’s all fantasy anyway so if you’re happy I’m happy and the birds happy

It's one of the least-bad offers I've seen on here, so grab the bird a drink on me.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

It's one of the least-bad offers I've seen on here, so grab the bird a drink on me.

And I’m not opposed to adds here and there. I’m just not good with the evening out value stuff. That’s the birds job. We do it by committee in Carolina

 

[Bazeek]

And I’m not opposed to adds here and there. I’m just not good with the evening out value stuff. That’s the birds job. We do it by committee in Carolina

I lose interest once we get into who's adding the conditional 3rd for the 2nd pairing AHL guy.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

I lose interest once we get into who's adding the conditional 3rd for the 2nd pairing AHL guy.

I feel like if I was a GM I would lose every trade in that regard because after figuring out the main 90-95% of the deal if the other GM was like ‘Ok how about kicking in a conditional 4th if X player does X next season?’ I would just be like ‘Fine, whatever, just get off the f***ing phone ok?’

 

[Bazeek]

I feel like if I was a GM I would lose every trade in that regard because after figuring out the main 90-95% of the deal if the other GM was like ‘Ok how about kicking in a conditional 4th if X player does X next season?’ I would just be like ‘Fine, whatever, just get off the ****ing phone ok?’

"THAT'S WHAT I PAY THE ANALYTICS GUYS FOR"
*click*
"Hold my calls, I'm feeding the bird."

 

[YotesFan47]

Goligoski + Fisher + Hinostroza for Zucker + Soucy/Seeler + 2nd?

Goligoski is in it for cap purposes but hes not a throw in or cap dump. Player has value. Is this close/interesting?

We could also do Fisher + Hinostroza for Zucker (50%) but that would put you on the hook for 4 years and take up a valuable retention slot that could be used at the TDL to maximize value to a cup team. Not sure if guys like Staal, Rask, and Foligno will be on the block come TDL but those contracts are shorter than Zuckers.

 

[AKL]

Goligoski + Fisher + Hinostroza for Zucker + Soucy/Seeler + 2nd?

Goligoski is in it for cap purposes but hes not a throw in or cap dump. Player has value. Is this close/interesting?

We could also do Fisher + Hinostroza for Zucker (50%) but that would put you on the hook for 4 years and take up a valuable retention slot that could be used at the TDL to maximize value to a cup team. Not sure if guys like Staal, Rask, and Foligno will be on the block come TDL but those contracts are shorter than Zuckers.

It’s ugly, that’s not very good.

 

[2Pair]

Goligoski + Fisher + Hinostroza for Zucker + Soucy/Seeler + 2nd?

Goligoski is in it for cap purposes but hes not a throw in or cap dump. Player has value. Is this close/interesting?

We could also do Fisher + Hinostroza for Zucker (50%) but that would put you on the hook for 4 years and take up a valuable retention slot that could be used at the TDL to maximize value to a cup team. Not sure if guys like Staal, Rask, and Foligno will be on the block come TDL but those contracts are shorter than Zuckers.

Don't see Minnesota having any interest in that

 

[YotesFan47]

It’s ugly, that’s not very good.

Is that because you think Zucker is a 60pt forward or because you think poorly of Hinostroza and Fisher?

Not trying to be condescending, just want to understand Minnys value.

 

[AKL]

Is that because you think Zucker is a 60pt forward or because you think poorly of Hinostroza and Fisher?

Fischer and Hinostroza do absolutely nothing for us. And somehow WE are the team giving up a 2nd. And we have to take on Goligoski (3rd pair defenseman on this team) to make it happen.

I can’t think of a single redeeming quality of this deal for Minnesota. There isn’t one aspect I can look at and say, “well, at least ____”.

 

[rt]

Zucker’s career points per game is 9% higher than Hinostroza’s. He’s two years older and his cap hit is 4 million higher. I like Zucker. I’d pay in futures. But I would hang onto Hinostroza for sure.

 

[AKL]

Zucker’s career points per game is 9% higher than Hinostroza’s. He’s two years older and his cap hit is 4 million higher. I like Zucker. I’d pay in futures. But I would hang onto Hinostroza for sure.

While you're add it, stop including Goligoski and Fischer in proposals too.

 

[YotesFan47]

Fischer and Hinostroza do absolutely nothing for us. And somehow WE are the team giving up a 2nd. And we have to take on Goligoski (3rd pair defenseman on this team) to make it happen.

I can’t think of a single redeeming quality of this deal for Minnesota. There isn’t one aspect I can look at and say, “well, at least ____”.

Fair enough, I can definitely understand Goligoski breaking the deal but without moving him or retention we really would have a hard time fitting Zucker into our lineup. I felt like Arizona could be giving up more value but maybe that's just two teams liking their own players. I figured the deal kinda lined up like this:

Goligoski for Soucy/Seeler + 2nd
Hinostorza + Fisher for Zucker

I personally see Zucker as a 50 point two way player (which may be part of the value discrepancy) who leans more on the edge of a sniper. Not saying he couldn't have seasons breaking 60 points points but I feel like his career average will fall somewhere between 50-55. Hinostroza is closer to a 35-40 point player and less of a goal scorer. I think he brings some similar elements as Zucker and is a few years younger. Adding Fisher was supposed to help alleviate some of that value discrepancy as he still has upside but is probably no more than a 30-35 point player.

What from Arizona would interest you?

 

[Bazeek]

Fair enough, I can definitely understand Goligoski breaking the deal but without moving him or retention we really would have a hard time fitting Zucker into our lineup. I felt like Arizona could be giving up more value but maybe that's just two teams liking their own players. I figured the deal kinda lined up like this:

Goligoski for Soucy/Seeler + 2nd
Hinostorza + Fisher for Zucker

I personally see Zucker as a 50 point two way player (which may be part of the value discrepancy) who leans more on the edge of a sniper. Not saying he couldn't have seasons breaking 60 points points but I feel like his career average will fall somewhere between 50-55. Hinostroza is closer to a 35-40 point player and less of a goal scorer. I think he brings some similar elements as Zucker and is a few years younger. Adding Fisher was supposed to help alleviate some of that value discrepancy as he still has upside but is probably no more than a 30-35 point player.

What from Arizona would interest you?

Not much.

 

[rt]

While you're add it, stop including Goligoski and Fischer in proposals too.

I know you’re just being flippant. But I’ll give you a real response anyway. Hopefully it helps you get more in touch with the league around you.

—-

Goligoski has been helpful with Hjalmarsson down with injury. I’m glad he’s around right now. He was bad in the first couple of games this season but seems to have got back on track sooner than typical. He was excellent down the stretch for Arizona during the playoff push last season. My chief complaint with him has been slow starts. Seems to be better this year.

All things considered, he’s earned every penny of his contract thus far. He’s not young. And he’s declining. His contract might be bad in its final year (next season) but all signs are pointing to it being fine this year. And certainly in all seasons preceding it.

His mild manner reads as nonchalance when the team is struggling. And that has irritated me in the past. Especially with his slow starts. That further irritates me as the team has been prone to slow starts. Makes him seem part of the problem. But the team ha started better this season. So has Goligoski. With Hjalmarsson hurt, he’s been important.

I’d be open to trading him, but only because I have no interest in extending him, and we don’t have much capspace. But that’s the only reason. He’s a net positive for sure. And I think he’s valuable to the Coyotes right now with Hjalmarsson out.

The Coyotes have played 18 straight really good periods of hockey to start this season. They’ve been really good even in the games they’ve lost. Goligoski is averaging over 21 minutes of ice time and has been good.

—-

Fischer showed upside as an amateur, as a minor pro, and as a rookie. Last year he struggled. This year he seems to be reinventing himself.

He’s playing well, but he’s looking like a really good bottom six energy type, rather than a top six, secondary scoring type that he appeared to be turning into prior to his 2nd NHL season.

At this point I don’t know what his upside is. I think if WYSIWYG - he’s a good bottom six energy guy that’s really popular in the room and is a big bull of a player. However, if he gets his mojo back, he’s got potential to be a very effective player.

He’s only 22 years old. He’s a 220lb winger who skates well, plays an aggressive style. Season before last, he had 15g (including 5g as a pp net front presence) as a rookie on a terrible Coyotes team.

It’s possible that his rookie season in the NHL is the best of his career. That’s not typical though. And if he’s ever any better than he was as a rookie, that’s a very valuable player.

I don’t follow the Wild too closely. But they seem to be a team that could use an energetic, 22 year old, right shot, power forward with PP ability and realistic 15+ goal upside. Maybe I’m wrong.

I look at the Wild and I’m honestly baffled. I have no idea what they should be trying to do. Attempt to rebuild while hanging onto Suter, Parise, Zuccarello and Spurgeon? Seems like a tall order. Shuffle more vets around? I don’t know. I really don’t know the solution.

Keeping everyone around seems like the wrong move too. Seems like a tough spot.

 

[rt]

Not much.

Are you suggesting Zucker is more valuable than any Coyote?