News Article: Jake Gardiner and the Leafs D

[Pholus]

Something has to give with Leafs defense before the season starts.

After Franson's contract is settled the Leafs will have only 6 NHL dmen under contract with NHL experience.

In order for teams to make the playoffs and go deep they some times call on as many as 10 dmen throughout the course of a season.

Depth at this position is critical and often tied to success.. A single injury to a Leafs regular alone would put a real strain on the defense and chances for a playoff spot.

7 after Gardiner's contract too. That said, I think the Leafs have had a very healthy blueline for the past few season, so I would not be surprised if they were hit by the injury bug this year and forced to take a long look at some of the guys playing for the Marlies.

 

[gabeliscious]

Gards and Rielly are ideal together on the PP. That really should be a set PP pairing.

If Franson gets traded what I'd be interested to see is who Carlyle matches Phaneuf up with on the PP.

i disagree. i feel like neither has a dominant enough shot. i think both have a good shot but neither seem to unload for whatever reason. imo rielly-gardiner on the pp would be like having to kaberles out there at the same time. kaberle was at his best when he was passing to mcabe.

in contrast phaneuf and franson are 2 booming shots. it would be like putting 2 mcabes out together. it appeared towards the end of the season carlyle started putting gardiner out with phaneuf on the 1st pp.

phaneuf-gardiner and rielly-franson make much more sense imo for pp pairings. skilled passer/skater/puck handler paired with a big shot. how many times did our pp suck because we couldnt get the puck out of the zone?

 

[Mess]

7 after Gardiner's contract too. That said, I think the Leafs have had a very healthy blueline for the past few season, so I would not be surprised if they were hit by the injury bug this year and forced to take a long look at some of the guys playing for the Marlies.

Actually only 6 including Gardiner (when re-signed)..

Phaneuf, Gardiner, Rielly, Robidas, Franson and Polak.

Everyone else is a Marlie with limited NHL experience.

Leafs have now removed Gunnarsson, Gleason and Ranger and added only Robidas and Polak.

 

[smpo11]

There is nothing wrong with giving the young, inexperienced guys opportunities. That is the only way they can become experienced NHL dmen.

 

[Duke Silver]

Neither can shoot. They need to be split up on the PP otherwise you have two guys the opposition know aren't a threat to shoot

Gardiner most certainly can shoot.

 

[glucker]

Actually only 6 including Gardiner (when re-signed)..

Phaneuf, Gardiner, Rielly, Robidas, Franson and Polak.

Everyone else is a Marlie with limited NHL experience.

Leafs have now removed Gunnarsson, Gleason and Ranger and added only Robidas and Polak.

Needless to say, today's roster won't be the roster come october.

Doubtful that Franson and Reimer will be on the team to start the season, or even to start camp... and even though they signed a lot of depth forwards, I'm fairly certain the Leafs are looking at one or two marlies to step up to the roster... so it wouldn't be a surprise to see one of the forwards shipped out.

 

[BertCorbeau]

Actually only 6 including Gardiner (when re-signed)..

Phaneuf, Gardiner, Rielly, Robidas, Franson and Polak.

Everyone else is a Marlie with limited NHL experience.

Leafs have now removed Gunnarsson, Gleason and Ranger and added only Robidas and Polak.

Gotta think Granberg and Percy will get some spot time in case of injury .... Holzer too

I expect Franson to be playing elsewhere to start the season too

 

[Tyler Biggs*]

The best way to play defence is to have the puck on your own stick. Gardiner does that very, very well. Every second he's helping his team keep the puck, is a second that the other team has a 0% chance of scoring. It's really not that difficult a concept, just harder to observe by eye than defensive gaffes.

 

[Sir Yeti]

gotta think granberg and percy will get some spot time in case of injury .... Holzer too

i expect franson to be playing elsewhere to start the season too

agreed with everything

 

[Mess]

Gotta think Granberg and Percy will get some spot time in case of injury .... Holzer too

I expect Franson to be playing elsewhere to start the season too

Holzer is the best fit as the #7 spare and presssbox regular as Leafs wouldn't put the kids in the box when they could be playing regularly for the Marlies.

So Granberg is likely in the top 6 or a Marlie. I think Percy needs more AHL time and would be only used in an extreme emergency.

Leafs attempt to trade Franson for Gorges so it does appear his days are numbered and with this Arbitration case happening in few days (July 21st) we will soon find out what kind of contract we are looking at. I would be surprised if he was awarded < $4 mil and that might make him even more expendable for the Leafs.

 

[zeke]

When you have prospects as good as finn, percy, granberg, loov, nilsson, macwilliam on the farm, worrying about your #7 dman doesn't make much sense.

Holzer fits there perfectly.

 

[BertCorbeau]

^ Agree I think Percy should go back to the AHL - would like to see him develop some offensive game and get some PP time with them down there

And agree with Holzer as well ... I have no issues with him as a #7 going forward this year too

 

[zeke]

Yup.

I like all the marlies dmen but all could use some more seasoning. In our current setup, they'd only be one injury away, which is pretty much perfect.


Phaneuf - Robidas
Gardiner - Franson
Rielly - Polak

Holzer

Percy - Granberg
Finn - Loov
MacW - Nilsson

With percy, finn, and loov getting plenty of PP time.

I'm more than happy with that depth situation.

Interestingly, the only guy playing on his off side in that setup would be Loov. Everyone else would be on their stick side,

 

[Kyle93]

Yup.

I like all the marlies dmen but all could use some more seasoning. In our current setup, they'd only be one injury away, which is pretty much perfect.


Phaneuf - Robidas
Gardiner - Franson
Rielly - Polak

Holzer

Percy - Granberg
Finn - Loov
MacW - Nilsson

With percy, finn, and loov getting plenty of PP time.

I'm more than happy with that depth situation.

Interestingly, the only guy playing on his off side in that setup would be Loov. Everyone else would be on their stick side,

Eh I'm sorry but no.

 

[King85Kong]

There was a time when people swore high and low that the sun revolves around the earth. Only after facts and evidence were provided that people finally admitted to their mistake. Some still stuck to their beliefs and eyes that it was still so. Sometimes our eyes and mind trick us to see what we want to see. Using your eyes in conjunction with facts and evidence is the best measurement. Do the facts and evidence back up what you're seeing?

 

[HarrisonFord]

Yup.

I like all the marlies dmen but all could use some more seasoning. In our current setup, they'd only be one injury away, which is pretty much perfect.


Phaneuf - Robidas
Gardiner - Franson
Rielly - Polak

Holzer

Percy - Granberg
Finn - Loov
MacW - Nilsson

With percy, finn, and loov getting plenty of PP time.

I'm more than happy with that depth situation.

Interestingly, the only guy playing on his off side in that setup would be Loov. Everyone else would be on their stick side,

I'm not sure I like that defense group, and it is specifically because of Franson. If we keep him, I want him on the 3rd pair with a simple, shut down guy like Polak.

This year, he had his worse year as a Leaf. His two most often 5 on 5 partners: Rielly and Gardiner. I really think Franson naturally picks up the style his partner is playing.

Playing with Fraser he was a bit nastier, but kept things simple. They played simple hockey against easy competition and life was good. Playing with Gardiner and Rielly this year, I noticed many times that he was trying to be too cute. Cross ice passes that got picked off, stickhandles in his own end leading him to turn the puck over. Basically, things that Gardiner and Rielly do - and things that they're good at (actually things that make them good players). Franson doesn't have the skill-set for it.

Phaneuf - Robidas

I don't mind. I think Robidas has been a good #2 guy in the past, and if he can regain the form he had before his injuries, I think we'll all be very happy and pleasantly surprised at how the pairing looks. If not, I wouldn't mind slotting Gardiner up there with Dion. Jake was playing harder and harder competition as the year went on, and he didn't look out of place.

Gardiner - Franson

Like I said before, Gardiner is good for me anywhere in the top 4. Franson I want out of a top 4 role. He's proven he can't do it. Gardiner - Polak I don't really like. Gardiner - Rielly would drive me crazy to watch. Gardiner on the 3rd pair is a waste, so Phaneuf-Gardiner might be the best option on the top pairing, with Rielly slotting up with Robidas on the 2nd pair.

Rielly - Polak

Polak should be a staple on the 3rd pairing. He's a really good 3rd pairing guy. Rielly though on the 3rd pairing... isn't this unnecessarily sheltering him? I get maybe starting him off here, but if he's on the 3rd pairing by the end of the season, then I'm going to be very disappointed.


Maybe start with yours, but transition to:

Phaneuf - Gardiner
Rielly - Robidas
Granberg - Polak
Franson/Holzer

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Average TOI for the NHL d-men currently on the Leafs:

Phaneuf: 23:33
Gardiner: 21:04
Franson: 20:41 (good lord)
Robidas: 20:10 (15:51 in the Playoffs)
Rielly: 17:38
Polak: 17:20 (18:37 in the Playoffs)

If personnel remains the same, ideally you see Rielly and Franson flip, with Morgan getting 20+ and Franson down around 17:00 (bottom pairing, PP specialist). Polak and Robidas both have durability issues, so you don't want to over play them.

 

[zeke]

I'm not sure I like that defense group, and it is specifically because of Franson. If we keep him, I want him on the 3rd pair with a simple, shut down guy like Polak.

This year, he had his worse year as a Leaf. His two most often 5 on 5 partners: Rielly and Gardiner. I really think Franson naturally picks up the style his partner is playing.

Playing with Fraser he was a bit nastier, but kept things simple. They played simple hockey against easy competition and life was good. Playing with Gardiner and Rielly this year, I noticed many times that he was trying to be too cute. Cross ice passes that got picked off, stickhandles in his own end leading him to turn the puck over. Basically, things that Gardiner and Rielly do - and things that they're good at (actually things that make them good players). Franson doesn't have the skill-set for it.

Phaneuf - Robidas

I don't mind. I think Robidas has been a good #2 guy in the past, and if he can regain the form he had before his injuries, I think we'll all be very happy and pleasantly surprised at how the pairing looks. If not, I wouldn't mind slotting Gardiner up there with Dion. Jake was playing harder and harder competition as the year went on, and he didn't look out of place.

Gardiner - Franson

Like I said before, Gardiner is good for me anywhere in the top 4. Franson I want out of a top 4 role. He's proven he can't do it. Gardiner - Polak I don't really like. Gardiner - Rielly would drive me crazy to watch. Gardiner on the 3rd pair is a waste, so Phaneuf-Gardiner might be the best option on the top pairing, with Rielly slotting up with Robidas on the 2nd pair.

Rielly - Polak

Polak should be a staple on the 3rd pairing. He's a really good 3rd pairing guy. Rielly though on the 3rd pairing... isn't this unnecessarily sheltering him? I get maybe starting him off here, but if he's on the 3rd pairing by the end of the season, then I'm going to be very disappointed.


Maybe start with yours, but transition to:

Phaneuf - Gardiner
Rielly - Robidas
Granberg - Polak
Franson/Holzer

Thing is with rielly no longer a raw rook, and polak hopefully a steadier presence than gleason/liles, the rielly-polak pair should be able to play many more minutes than our third pair did last year, which would reduce franson's role in a big way already. In fact, a rielly-polak pair could end up playing more than the gardiner-franson pair period, and against tougher competition.

The other good news is that with robidas and polak both righties, franson's PK duties pretty much dissappear, especially if jake or rielly can establish themslves there.

With the pairings i listed there, we could see something like this minutes distribution (48es min, 6pp, 6pk avg):

Phaneuf 18:00es, 3:00pp, 4:00pk, 25:00tot
Robidas 18:00es, 0:00pp, 4:00pk, 22:00tot

Gardiner 15:00es, 3:00pp, 1:00pk, 19:00tot
Franson 15:00es, 3:00pp, 0:00pk, 18:00tot

Rielly: 15:00es, 3:00pp, 1:00pk, 19:00tot
Polak: 15:00es, 0:00pp, 2:00pk, 17:00tot

 

[EastVan]

Average TOI for the NHL d-men currently on the Leafs:

Phaneuf: 23:33
Gardiner: 21:04
Franson: 20:41 (good lord)
Robidas: 20:10 (15:51 in the Playoffs)
Rielly: 17:38
Polak: 17:20 (18:37 in the Playoffs)

If personnel remains the same, ideally you see Rielly and Franson flip, with Morgan getting 20+ and Franson down around 17:00 (bottom pairing, PP specialist). Polak and Robidas both have durability issues, so you don't want to over play them.

The problem is Franson and Polak don't fit on the third line together because they are both RHD.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

If Petter Granberg can't crack this defence, this defence is in trouble. That's a pitiful starting 6 especially if Franson and Gardiner are paired up again.

 

[zeke]

Granberg's gonna have to be real good to win a spot against that group of proven vets and talented youngsters.

If Franson is your worst dman, then your D ain't pitiful.

 

[EastVan]

Thing is with rielly no longer a raw rook, and polak hopefully a steadier presence than gleason/liles, the rielly-polak pair should be able to play many more minutes than our third pair did last year, which would reduce franson's role in a big way already. In fact, a rielly-polak pair could end up playing more than the gardiner-franson pair period, and against tougher competition.

The other good news is that with robidas and polak both righties, franson's PK duties pretty much dissappear, especially if jake or rielly can establish themslves there.

With the pairings i listed there, we could see something like this minutes distribution (48es min, 6pp, 6pk avg):

Phaneuf 18:00es, 3:00pp, 4:00pk, 25:00tot
Robidas 18:00es, 0:00pp, 4:00pk, 22:00tot

Gardiner 15:00es, 3:00pp, 1:00pk, 19:00tot
Franson 15:00es, 3:00pp, 0:00pk, 18:00tot

Rielly: 15:00es, 3:00pp, 1:00pk, 19:00tot
Polak: 15:00es, 0:00pp, 2:00pk, 17:00tot

This seems to make pretty good sense.

I agree that the potential Polak/Rielly pairing could be quite good for us.

 

[EastVan]

If Petter Granberg can't crack this defence, this defence is in trouble. That's a pitiful starting 6 especially if Franson and Gardiner are paired up again.

Where would he fit in with all these righties?

I agree we need to find him some minutes, but it doesn't look good for him unless Franson is dealt.

If Granberg does make the team his likely partner would be Rielly; leaving us with a relatively inexperienced pairing on the backend.

 

[zeke]

So far we know the habs wanted franson. Rumours say det and dal were interested too.

Those are three pretty good teams, and good defensive teams, and franson is the worst dman on this "pitiful" defense corps.

 

[Teeder9]

So far we know the habs wanted franson. Rumours say det and dal were interested too.

Those are three pretty good teams, and good defensive teams, and franson is the worst dman on this "pitiful" defense corps.

Safe to say Det, Mon and Dal have good defensive teams because of the actual team, not the defense. All three teams have forwards who know there are 3 zones in every rink. Using their PP dman need as a reasoning to pump Franson's defensive prowess tires is one of the more remarkable things I've read on here lately