Jaden Schwartz - Going pro in 2011-12?

Discussion in 'NHL Draft - Prospects' started by Yosemite Sam, Apr 4, 2011.

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  1. Yosemite Sam

    Yosemite Sam Registered User

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    Schwartz has just finished an outstanding freshman season at Colorado College (despite some time off because of injury) and seems to be considering the idea of going pro in the fall.

    Like most any team, the biggest question marks for CC fans deal with who may leave for the pros over the summer. In the Tigers’ case, freshman leading scorer Jaden Schwartz (47 points, 30 assists) and junior defenseman Gabe Guentzel (28, 22 assists) are the most likely to leave early, Tigers coach Scott Owens has said.

    “We just finished up the season so I haven’t had much time to think about it,” Schwartz said. “As of right now, I’m planning to be back. I’ve signed up for classes and been assigned a (dorm) room for this fall. I’ll think about it more, later.

    http://www.gazette.com/sports/-115518--.html

    Whenever I read about Schwartz on these boards – the St. Louis board does a great job tracking his development – it seems the consensus is he's not physically ready for the pro game.

    Before we get into that, let's look at how dominant he was this year. As I noted, he missed some time due to a broken ankle, I believe, so he finished up with 47 points in only 30 games. His PPG was third-best in the entire NCAA behind only Miele (NCAA top scorer) and Zanette, two guys who are turning 23 in a matter of a week or two. Pro-rated to a pretty standard 40-game college season, 18-year-old Schwartz would have had a 63-point season, which is elite in college hockey. Suffice it to say he was dominant.

    Now, as I mentioned above, the knock on him around here is that he needs to get stronger before going pro. According to the Hockey Database, he's 5'10", 193lbs. While he's no Chara, in today's NHL, his stated size doesn't really raise any red flags.

    While I'm not a fan of rushing kids into the NHL, I'm providing this info and asking these questions because he certainly seems to have the skill set to make it this fall. As a side note, since he's in college, he's not restricted from going to the AHL because of his age. This is an option for him.

    So, all this to ask those in the know: What would hold him back? Is he smaller than stated on the Hockey Database? Does he "play small"? Is he slow for his size?

    I really wanted to form an opinion myself during the World Juniors so I was pretty bummed when he went down. Now I have to rely on all you clowns. :D:sarcasm:

    Thanks.

    EDIT: NCAA scoring
    http://www.collegehockeynews.com/stats/overall.php
     
  2. Cooperalls

    Cooperalls Oiler Fan!!!

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    It's going to be a very tough time mentally off the ice for him. I think he'll take his time.
     
  3. Tigers1992

    Tigers1992 Registered User

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    Indeed. Thoughts to the family.
     
  4. Hooch314

    Hooch314 Registered User

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    Yea wouldn't expect anything soon.

    I do wonder (noting that Mandi losing her life is much more relevant and important than Jaden's decision) if his current situation would make him more or less likely to leave college? What do you guys think?
     
  5. Tigers1992

    Tigers1992 Registered User

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    Ive never been in that place, and truthfully I think its the furthest thing from his mind. Not sure if its really worth speculating on at this point in time.
     
  6. wej20

    wej20 Registered User

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    His brother will still be at Colorado College next season, I imagine it would be tough for him to leave his brother.
     
  7. S E P H

    S E P H @SEPH_WHL

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    Schwartz needs 1 more year. Let him build his frame over this time.
     
  8. Yosemite Sam

    Yosemite Sam Registered User

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    Yes it's terrible to hear about Mandi. I can't imagine what the Schwartz family is going through. :(

    In regards to how his sister's passing will affect what he does, no one can tell. I'm sure Jaden himself has no clue. He could decide after months of mourning that he needs a new start, or choose instead to stay somewhere comfortable surrounded by family (Colorado College with his brother).

    I didn't want to mention Mandi in my original post so as not to cloud my main question, but based on the responses so far, the situation understandably has everyone thinking of the same thing.

    My original question, though, is whether or not there is anything holding Jaden back physically.
     
  9. Rabid Ranger

    Rabid Ranger 2 is better than one

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    Aside from the personal issues affecting him, he doesn't have a pro frame right now. It's in his best interest to take another year and build himself up physically. A familiar environment will probably help him mentally as well.
     
  10. DwightKSchrute

    DwightKSchrute Registered User

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    RIP Mandi, Im sure Jaden will make you proud.
     
  11. Jzk

    Jzk Registered User

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    As a Blues fan I don't want the team rushing any prospects to the team again. I say let him play 1 more year where ever he wants to then let him start in the AHL before he makes it to the big club.
     
  12. Yosemite Sam

    Yosemite Sam Registered User

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    These are exactly the type of comments I'm wondering about. I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'm trying to figure out why people say that? He has the skill, and if he's really 5'10" and 193lbs, he's pretty well filled out for a guy that height. Are his vitals incorrect? Does he play soft? Is he slow as ****?

    I want people to explain why they say this.
     
  13. Qubax

    Qubax Registered User

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    Admitedly I've only seen Jaden play at the WJC, but amongst the best peers in his age group, Jaden was pretty good, but also IMO looked pretty small...

    When you think of the WJC and Johansen, Curtis Hamilton, Couturier etc Schwartz ended up looking kinda of small on that team. And not that Schwartz will be BIG persay or look like he's a guy like Kassian out there......but I did think that regardless of height, or size, Schwartz looked like a featherweight. He just wasn't as thick as most of his WJC teammates.....

    that didn't matter in the WJC, but would in the AHL and certainly the NHL...

    I say one year of CC, then one year of AHL, then in his rookie year he could be a Calder candidate....if he's in the AHL or NHL next year, I think he's getting himself into something that he is NOT physically ready for...

    the only way I'd see the AHL as a possibility for next year is if he works out and lives all summer with Gary Roberts...
     
  14. MN_Gopher

    MN_Gopher Registered User

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    One thing many freshmen that leave early miss is how to lead. I would say the majority of growth a player, a leader, a go to guy both on and off the ice happens in the off season for many college guys. A lesson guys like EJ, Turris, Kessel and maybe Schwartz may miss. Schwartz could be a guy in the weight room, leading and inspiring others, that next year we will win it all. Take an in coming freshmen in and show him the ropes. I feel that the off season is when winners start the season. Not the Schwartz is not a winner.If he leaves for the pros or where ever it will be his 4th team in 4 years. I would say its hard to gain intanglabales at the pro level. Being around the same guys in the off season is one way to really learn how to prepare and lead.
     
  15. David Dennison

    David Dennison Registered User Sponsor

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    He may be listed at 193, but I have my doubts as to the accuracy of the number. I would bet he played this season around or below 180.

    I think the Blues would rather let him play in college than burn a year of his ELC playing in Peoria. I also think he'd rather continue to play with his brother, at least for one more season.
     
  16. thrillhous

    thrillhous Registered User

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  17. S E P H

    S E P H @SEPH_WHL

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    I saw about 80% of the games last season and even though he completely dominated the NCAA for his first season, NHL defense are on a totally different level. It will be a much easier transition from college to pros if he built his frame with another 5-10 pounds of muscle. He does get pushed off the puck pretty easy around the boards.


    E: There is no way he is 193 lbs.
     
  18. Yosemite Sam

    Yosemite Sam Registered User

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    Thanks for your input. Based on everyone's comments, it looks like he does need to fill in (and that his stated weight is likely BS). Can't wait to see this kid in action.
     
  19. Deficient Mode

    Deficient Mode Registered User

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    Having watched a few of his games this year, my feeling is that he could still benefit from another year. Vanek and Heatley are other players who tore up the WCHA as freshmen and still came back for their sophomore years. Although both were drafted after their freshman seasons, both were and are bigger players and more-highly touted than Schwartz.

    By the way, I don't think there's any chance at all Guentzel leaves early. Where would he go exactly?
     
  20. Blues0307

    Blues0307 Registered User

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    I was only able to watch Jaden play four games this year, but this is what I was going to say. He was actually more physical on the forecheck than I expected, but he gets pushed around easily on the boards. He doesn't seem all that fast to me, but great hockey sense to make up for it. I'd say he's no bigger than 180 lbs.
     
  21. Lord Helix

    Lord Helix CarvinSigX

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    From a Blues perspective, I would say no, he's not ready. His offensive talents are great, but we don't have room for him on the top 6, where he would be most effective. We didn't draft this kid to be a penalty killer. Think along the lines of Kane...Powerplay specialist along with great cycling ability. When McDonald is gone or if Perron wouldn't be able to come back, then we will see this kid play. Much like the other posters, I'd prefer to keep him in college to build strength and hone his ability to perform under pressure. This kid is going to be something special if he hits his potential. Didn't he break Lecavalier's scoring records AND he's putting up Parise like rookie numbers in the NCAA? ;)
     
  22. God Bless Canada

    God Bless Canada Registered User

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    I think his skill level is already at an NHL level, but he's best-served to spend another year in college, or sign a pro contract with St. Louis and spend a year in the Dub. He's not ready for the rigors of the NHL - the schedule, the travel, the physical demands.

    He's best served spending another year in college, shredding a good collegiate league, and challenging for the Hobey. If he returns to college next season, I think he leads the country in scoring. I believe he led the WCHA in point-per-game pace this season, and it's the fourth straight season, in four different leagues, that he's been tops in points-per-game. If not for participation in the World Junior A Challenge, he probably leads the SJ in scoring two years ago; if not for the foot injury, he probably leads the WCHA in scoring this year. He's a dynamo who's going to score a lot of points in the show, but as someone who's a big Jaden fan, who has watched him since he was 16, I think he's best-served with another year in college, plus a year in minor pro, before he starts lighting up The Show.

    Incidentally, horrible news about Mandi. A lot of people around here knew her in some way, since her brothers played in the SJ, and so there was a lot of concern and awareness for her in the last two years. A terrible, terrible story, and a fine young woman is gone far too soon.
     
  23. rumrokh

    rumrokh Jake the Snake Man

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    As a Blues fan, I'd like to see him improve his explosiveness and speed more than just piling on muscle. He does need to get stronger overall, but strength will never be an asset. He needs to leverage balance, smarts, and elusiveness.

    Like Andy McDonald. I never think McDonald lost a puck or a play due to his lack of size and strength. But when he wins a puck or makes a play, I often think that most other players would have gotten hit squarely or pinned against the boards in that situation.

    Doug Weight is an example of a guy who is just 5'10", but very sturdy. However, he could always handle that muscle weight because he's an absolutely elite skater. Jaden's no slouch, but he's not there.
     
  24. DuklaNation

    DuklaNation Registered User

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    AT the WJC, Id say he looked 185. His real weakness was lack of speed. Works the PP at NHL level though. Didnt really get a good feel for what his NHL potential is due to limited games. Hard to say about undersized slow offensive players.
     
  25. rumrokh

    rumrokh Jake the Snake Man

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    He's not a speedster for his size, but he's not slow, either.
     

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