Is it time to admit that Laine might be better than Eichel?

[Gurilla]

Damn this guy really took the folks saying Laine was the best pick in the draft to heart. Dropped him to #5 in the draft. Lmao.

 

[GoJetsGo55]

No second line winger scores 40 goals a season. No one who scores 40 goals is a second line player. Coaches would not put a 40 goal winger on the second line.

Exactly! What kind of moronic coach spreads out scoring?

Now if you'll excuse me, I am going to keep reading up on 2nd line center Evgeni Malkin. It's been a great read since I finished reading up on backup goalie Cory Schneider. Not sure what I'll read after that. Maybe I'll start researching 3rd line center Auston Matthews 2016-17 season.

 

[BayStreetBully]

Damn this guy really took the folks saying Laine was the best pick in the draft to heart. Dropped him to #5 in the draft. Lmao.

I’m all for open rebuttals. Do you actually think Laine at #5 is not a consideration? What is it about the 2017-2018 season that would make you say Laine is a cut above Keller, Sergachev and McAvoy? I feel like their differences in positions makes it an easy decision to put Laine at #5 considering Laine is not outplaying any of them this year, and considering the potential the other three have shown in their own rookie years. But I can be convinced. Surely you must have a good answer for this.

 

[Patrik Barkov]

Laine is a winger. Of course it was possible for him to put up points in the NHL last year, while Keller, Sergachev and McAvoy were still playing in places that were better for their development as centers and defensemen: premiere positions that take longer to master.

You may have already made up your mind as to who is better than who, based on which was actually in the NHL last year. You would have to admit that it is a debate as to who would be a better #2 pick: Keller or Laine or McAvoy or Sergachev. It’s hard as heck to acquire a top flight centerman or elite defenseman. You have to grab them near the top of the draft. All of Keller, Laine, Sergachev and McAvoy are showing potential as top players in their respective positions, but only one of them is not doing it as a centerman or defenseman. Laine.

It’s not about last year. The 2016 picks will have longer careers extending into the 2030’s. It’s about who will have a better career from 2017-2035, not who had the better career from 2016-2017.

Keller is a winger. Keep your baiting somewhat believable in the future.

 

[BayStreetBully]

Exactly! What kind of moronic coach spreads out scoring?

Now if you'll excuse me, I am going to keep reading up on 2nd line center Evgeni Malkin. It's been a great read since I finished reading up on backup goalie Cory Schneider.

One must always allow for context. It’s quite different to play behind Sidney Crosby or Martin Brodeur than to play behind Kyle Connor.

 

[surixon]

Laine is a winger. Of course it was possible for him to put up points in the NHL last year, while Keller, Sergachev and McAvoy were still playing in places that were better for their development as centers and defensemen: premiere positions that take longer to master.

You may have already made up your mind as to who is better than who, based on which was actually in the NHL last year. You would have to admit that it is a debate as to who would be a better #2 pick: Keller or Laine or McAvoy or Sergachev. It’s hard as heck to acquire a top flight centerman or elite defenseman. You have to grab them near the top of the draft. All of Keller, Laine, Sergachev and McAvoy are showing potential as top players in their respective positions, but only one of them is not doing it as a centerman or defenseman. Laine.

It’s not about last year. The 2016 picks will have longer careers extending into the 2030’s. It’s about who will have a better career from 2017-2035, not who had the better career from 2016-2017.

Keller is playing a lot of wing for the Coyotes this season so no guarantee he is used as a center moving forward. Serge is being heavily sheltered so far so let' see what he does against good comp moving forward. Laine has proven he can score at an elite level so far (None of the others have over a full season) it's also not like Laine isn't still incredibly raw in a lot of areas and still has significant untapped potential.

 

[JetsHomer]

Damn this guy really took the folks saying Laine was the best pick in the draft to heart. Dropped him to #5 in the draft. Lmao.

It’s crazy how fast people are to dismiss Laine. He’s a 19 year old with 15 goals and 10 assists in 29 games. On pace for 42 goals 28 assists.

Do you guys know what Matthews’ score line looked like at age 19? 40 goals 29 assists

 

[DANTHEMAN1967]

Kadri is a 1C then. Tell me how many 2nd line wingers score 40g/season? HF never change. 15yr old net-warriors.

He is a 2nd line winger, by TOI 5 on 5, who scores the bulk of his goals (60%) on the power play.

 

[kunekune]

Laine looks more and more like Mario Lemieux with each passing day.

 

[BayStreetBully]

Keller is playing a lot of wing for the Coyotes this season so no guarantee he is used as a center moving forward. Serge is being heavily sheltered so far so let' see what he does against good comp moving forward. Laine has proven he can score at an elite level so far (None of the others have over a full season) it's also not like Laine isn't still incredibly raw in a lot of areas and still has significant untapped potential.

Keller has shown elements of being a great centerman through his play, and has grown up playing that way. He will be a centerman throughout his career. Now, if he ends up playing wing for his entire career, then I would reevaluate and place him behind Laine. It’s fair to say the Coyotes envision him a center-man.

Sergachev has been a big reason for the Lightning’s success as the best team in the league. He is sheltered but he is a rookie. Laine is being sheltered on the second line, and he is not a rookie. Sergachev is a potential top pairing defender, and that is invaluable.

McAvoy is already playing big number minutes as a rookie.

This is why it is a mistake to crown someone the #2 player from their draft and not be open to change after just one year. I for one will be watching Arizona, Boston and Tampa closely this year. I will be interested to see their development as future superstar centers and defensemen. Perhaps it takes time for others to realize that any one of the 4 above could be the #2 pick. The 2016 draft is shaping up to be quite a good one.

 

[GoJetsGo55]

One must always allow for context. It’s quite different to play behind Sidney Crosby or Martin Brodeur than to play behind Kyle Connor.

Ohhhh no my friend. If you can't understand a concept as simple as spreading out scoring, then I am not going to give you the benefit of context.

It's not a unique concept.

Fiala > Forsberg?????
Nashville Predators Line Combinations

Brown & Hyman > Marner, Nylander, Marleau & JVR??????
Toronto Maple Leafs Line Combinations

Johnson > Kucherov??????
Tampa Bay Lightning Line Combinations

Sobotka > Schwartz????
St Louis Blues Line Combinations


It's almost as if, and stick with me here because things are gonna get CRAZY, but it's almost as if teams don't put all their deadliest weapons on the same line. Mind....blown!

 

[Royale With Cheese]

Has Laine not been playing on the second line all year with Little? Has the first line wingers not been Kyle Connor and Blake Wheeler? First line players should be compared to first line players. And second line players to second line players.

Semantics, I think.

Connor is playing with Wheeler and Scheifele (1st line) because in Maurice's opinion, they work well together. I would tend to agree. They are all very fast players and seem to click.

Sometimes lesser players like Connor are moved up for specific reasons only the coach knows or believes. I remember Dallas Drake playing with Keith Tkachuk and Jeremy Roenick. Drake had no business being on that line, but the coach obviously thought it made sense.

Laine does play on the second line, but let's be real, he's a better LW than Kyle Connor.

Also, Mathieu Perreault is the 4th line LW on the Jets. Not sure I would call him a traditional "4th liner"

 

[GoJetsGo55]

He is a 2nd line winger, by TOI 5 on 5, who scores the bulk of his goals (60%) on the power play.

PP points didn't seem to be a big deal last year when that's how Nylander was scoring.

I think Laine will be fine. I hope that he can become a force at even strength but who knows how long that will take. My guess is -1 years.

Even Strength Scoring Leaders: 2016-17 NHL Season

 

[surixon]

Keller has shown elements of being a great centerman through his play, and has grown up playing that way. He will be a centerman throughout his career. Now, if he ends up playing wing for his entire career, then I would reevaluate and place him behind Laine. It’s fair to say the Coyotes envision him a center-man.

Sergachev has been a big reason for the Lightning’s success as the best team in the league. He is sheltered but he is a rookie. Laine is being sheltered on the second line, and he is not a rookie. Sergachev is a potential top pairing defender, and that is invaluable.

McAvoy is already playing big number minutes as a rookie.

This is why it is a mistake to crown someone the #2 player from their draft and not be open to change after just one year. I for one will be watching Arizona, Boston and Tampa closely this year. I will be interested to see their development as future superstar centers and defensemen. Perhaps it takes time for others to realize that any one of the 4 above could be the #2 pick. The 2016 draft is shaping up to be quite a good one.

And Laine scoring from the 2nd line is a reason the Jets are at the top of the western conference. Two can play at that game. Laine is also not blocked by Connor but by Wheeler who is a top 3 RW in the game who is top 5 in league scoring.

 

[BayStreetBully]

And Laine scoring from the 2nd line is a reason the Jets are at the top of the western conference. Two can play at that game. Laine is also not blocked by Connor but by Wheeler who is a top 3 RW in the game who is top 5 in league scoring.

I would agree that Laine has contributed to the Jets’ success. I never said otherwise. That’s why Laine is in the discussion for being the #2-5 pick of the 2016 draft. If Laine wasn’t contributing, he would be the clear cut pick for #5 or maybe even lower. None of this takes away from the fantastic rookie seasons of future potential center and defensemen superstars in Keller, Sergachev and McAvoy, any of whom could claim to be the right #2 pick, #3 pick, #4 pick and #5 pick.

And don’t count Puljujarvi out just yet, either. He could have a breakout season next year. And Chychrun. There’s a reason why the 2016 draft was once seen as the Matthews, Chychrun, Puljujarvi draft. We all have to remain open to change, and we all need to account for development time, especially for centers and defensemen. Rome wasn’t built in a day.

 

[GoJetsGo55]

I would agree that Laine has contributed to the Jets’ success. I never said otherwise. That’s why Laine is in the discussion for being the #2-5 pick of the 2016 draft. If Laine wasn’t contributing, he would be the clear cut pick for #5 or maybe even lower. None of this takes away from the fantastic rookie seasons of future potential center and defensemen superstars in Keller, Sergachev and McAvoy, any of whom could claim to be the right #2 pick, #3 pick, #4 pick and #5 pick.

And don’t count Puljujarvi out just yet, either. He could have a breakout season next year. And Chychrun. There’s a reason why the 2016 draft was once seen as the Matthews, Chychrun, Puljujarvi draft. We all have to remain open to change, and we all need to account for development time, especially for centers and defensemen. Rome wasn’t built in a day.

Who out of that list is capable of taking the #1 spot?

 

[BayStreetBully]

Who out of that list is capable of taking the #1 spot?

None of them. That’s why I didn’t even bother. It’s like McDavid and 2015.

 

[Narow]

I would agree that Laine has contributed to the Jets’ success. I never said otherwise. That’s why Laine is in the discussion for being the #2-5 pick of the 2016 draft. If Laine wasn’t contributing, he would be the clear cut pick for #5 or maybe even lower. None of this takes away from the fantastic rookie seasons of future potential center and defensemen superstars in Keller, Sergachev and McAvoy, any of whom could claim to be the right #2 pick, #3 pick, #4 pick and #5 pick.

And don’t count Puljujarvi out just yet, either. He could have a breakout season next year. And Chychrun. There’s a reason why the 2016 draft was once seen as the Matthews, Chychrun, Puljujarvi draft. We all have to remain open to change, and we all need to account for development time, especially for centers and defensemen. Rome wasn’t built in a day.

Its up to those to prove themselves... laine is so far well ahead, if judging by only recent play then maybe you could make a case for others.

All those guys (except pulju) are older than laine aswell. Hence why i see laine well ahead. Dude has scored over 50 goals and soon 100 points in the nhl..

 

[surixon]

I would agree that Laine has contributed to the Jets’ success. I never said otherwise. That’s why Laine is in the discussion for being the #2-5 pick of the 2016 draft. If Laine wasn’t contributing, he would be the clear cut pick for #5 or maybe even lower. None of this takes away from the fantastic rookie seasons of future potential center and defensemen superstars in Keller, Sergachev and McAvoy, any of whom could claim to be the right #2 pick, #3 pick, #4 pick and #5 pick.

And don’t count Puljujarvi out just yet, either. He could have a breakout season next year. And Chychrun. There’s a reason why the 2016 draft was once seen as the Matthews, Chychrun, Puljujarvi draft. We all have to remain open to change, and we all need to account for development time, especially for centers and defensemen. Rome wasn’t built in a day.

Sure any of them could claim that spot over time but none have done near enough to displace Laine as of yet. Keller is currently behind Laine in production this season while also pacing less points then Laine's rookie season. So why is he now placed ahead, he doesn't produce as well nor has he shown the ability as of yet to say he might. He even still plays at wing and you pit him ahead because you think He might be a C someday.

Mcovoy and Serge are 30 games into their careers. Not nearly enough sample to displace him.

 

[GoJetsGo55]

None of them. That’s why I didn’t even bother. It’s like McDavid and 2015.

.873 PPG - Falls somewhere in the top 5. Too early to tell if they can match their draft spot
.888 PPG - Generational and will clearly never be topped by anyone in his draft class

Seems a little silly does it not?

I am well aware that you're all aboard the troll boat at this time because you keep passing up a tonne of points people are making.....I just wanna see how far you're gonna take it.

 

[DANTHEMAN1967]

PP points didn't seem to be a big deal last year when that's how Nylander was scoring.

I think Laine will be fine. I hope that he can become a force at even strength but who knows how long that will take. My guess is -1 years.

Even Strength Scoring Leaders: 2016-17 NHL Season

He is nowhere close to that pace this year though, may be cause for concern come the playoffs when there are fewer power plays and closer checking.

 

[GoJetsGo55]

He is nowhere close to that pace this year though, may be cause for concern come the playoffs when there are fewer power plays and closer checking.

 

[BB88]

Has Laine not been playing on the second line all year with Little? Has the first line wingers not been Kyle Connor and Blake Wheeler? First line players should be compared to first line players. And second line players to second line players.

Playing on the 2ns line doesn't automatically make you a 2nd line player.
Laine's stats show he's a 1st liner and can be compared to other 1st line level players.

Same goes for Kadri, he's not just a 2nd line C, he's a low end #1C.

 

[Finnipeg]

The only young player currently better than Laine in the world is McDavid and even then I think you can make that case that Laine's scoring while playing with the players he does is second to none. Anyone who thinks Laine is in the same tier as Matthews/Eichel has to be joking.

 

[BayStreetBully]

Sure any of them could claim that spot over time but none have done near enough to displace Laine as of yet. Keller is currently behind Laine in production this season while also pacing less points then Laine's rookie season. So why is he now placed ahead, he doesn't produce as well nor has he shown the ability as of yet to say he might. He even still plays at wing and you pit him ahead because you think He might be a C someday.

Mcovoy and Serge are 30 games into their careers. Not nearly enough sample to displace him.

It is not about what each of Keller, Sergachev, Laine and McAvoy have done thus far in their careers. Laine deserved 2nd place in Calder voting last year. I wouldn’t dispute that.

The fact is all of these players are just beginning their careers, and all are playing at roughly the same level for their respective positions, and only Laine is not going to be a center or defenseman going forward. That’s enough to place Laine at #5 for me. The burden will be on Laine to show he is heads and shoulders above the others, and he isn’t doing that.

I have followed Laine’s play this year, because I am interested in watching young players play. There are many holes in his game, and many Jets fans have agreed all season long. He hasn’t been assertive, he hasn’t been moving his legs, he hasn’t cycled the puck. All of these are common criticisms of Laine made by Jets fans. He is a great power play shooter, but that’s not enough to be ranked #2 in his draft class.

Let’s watch more hockey throughout the season. I am sure the bundle of Keller, Sergachev, Laine and McAvoy will eventually separate themselves from each other one way or another. We can all agree on one thing: this year shows that this cohort is shaping up to be a great draft class.