Is Bergevin the worst GM in the NHL?

[Brainiac]

Bergevin is good with minor moves, but downright terrible with major ones.

 

[KevSkillz4]

No.

Weise and Fleischmann for Danault and 2nd round pick (Romanov). Steal.

2nd round pick and 5th for Jeff Petry. Great deal.

Sergachev for Drouin, be patient with Drouin, he is going to be a amazing player IMO.

Galchenyuk for Domi, Domi have a great talent, play like Gallagher, but most talented. Amazing playmaker. Like this trade.

If Price can be Price, the contract is ok, because Price who become the real Price, he is no doubt, the best goalie in the world.

Subban for Weber, Subban he is the better defenseman, but Weber is better leader//mentor for the young defenseman, he can help develop player like Mete//Juulsen and more.

With 2017 and 2018 draft, the future is bright for Habs.

 

[The Macho King]

No.

Weise and Fleischmann for Danault and 2nd round pick (Romanov). Steal.

2nd round pick and 5th for Jeff Petry. Great deal.

Sergachev for Drouin, be patient with Drouin, he is going to be a amazing player IMO.

Galchenyuk for Domi, Domi have a great talent, play like Gallagher, but most talented. Amazing playmaker. Like this trade.

If Price can be Price, the contract is ok, because Price who become the real Price, he is no doubt, the best goalie in the world.

Subban for Weber, Subban he is the better defenseman, but Weber is better leader//mentor for the young defenseman, he can help develop player like Mete//Juulsen and more.

With 2017 and 2018 draft, the future is bright for Habs.

This is what Stockholm Syndrome looks like.

 

[didimentionlarseller]

No.

Weise and Fleischmann for Danault and 2nd round pick (Romanov). Steal.

2nd round pick and 5th for Jeff Petry. Great deal.

Sergachev for Drouin, be patient with Drouin, he is going to be a amazing player IMO.

Galchenyuk for Domi, Domi have a great talent, play like Gallagher, but most talented. Amazing playmaker. Like this trade.

If Price can be Price, the contract is ok, because Price who become the real Price, he is no doubt, the best goalie in the world.

Subban for Weber, Subban he is the better defenseman, but Weber is better leader//mentor for the young defenseman, he can help develop player like Mete//Juulsen and more.

With 2017 and 2018 draft, the future is bright for Habs.

hi Marc

 

[super6646]

Know this is a bump, but great job telling everyone you aren't extending pacioretty and expecting "fair" value. God there's no way even chia is this stupid.

 

[ClydeLee]

There is recently bias. People said McPhee because the awful Forsberg trade or Chia is that how with Hall winning the Hart.

But Bergevin is consistently poor in management attempts to improve the team. People will mock others inheritance of talent but who is the top player he has added, and with several high picks at his disposal? No gm has no good trades or signings but failure is clear and consistent without a clear upward trajectory like at least Chevy had or Francis had where people are them as teams a step away from success.

 

[ohheyhemsky]

Nah - Chia.

 

[RandV]

That's how a good chunk of great teams got to where they did. Look at CHI/PIT/WSH. Benning didn't get lottery luck like those teams did.

They haven't picked that high compared to other teams with deep prospect pools tbh. Idk why you guys can't admit he came into a bad situation. The Sedin's didn't want to be moved. The owner didn't want to rebuild. The team was bad and he didn't make any moves that significantly hurt your team long term imo. Well maybe the 2014 draft, actually.

I just don't get how he can be compared to GMs that have torn down their franchises for pennies to the dollar. Canucks are going to be very good in a few years if they keep stock pliling young talent.

As a Canuck fan these kinds of posts can be a little frustrating. A lot of people hated the Canucks during their peak years, and as it was a team with an ageing core they loved projecting our downfall. So now that the Canucks are firmly in the basement a lot of people seem to look past Benning's involvement and just assume this was the inevitable conclusion.

It's severely overrating the "bad situation" part. While yes ownership turned down a rebuild and foolishly wanted to keep the team competitive, Benning sold himself and continues to sell himself (in light of the recent Linden resignation) as the man who can do the job. The majority of Canuck fans don't think he's a league worst caliber bad GM because he had a hard job to do, it's because we've had 4 years to watch him work and he's proven utterly incompetent at nearly every aspect of the job.

The HF Canucks fanbase turned on him after a sequence of moves between April-October 2015, where without any involvement from ownership he took a team that made the playoffs, made a whole bunch of moves that he said 'may lose us a few points in the regular season but will make us tougher in the playoffs', but instead dropped us 51 goals and 26 points in the standings. For the last 3 seasons Benning has spent to the cap and went into the season with the aim to 'compete for the playoffs', and we have the cumulative worst record in the league. While the league rewards his failure with high draft picks I don't think he's actually acquired a single pick in 3 years, but meanwhile continuously shells them out on other teams waiver fodder and player downgrades.

An ageing Canuck team saddled by ownership forcing them to compete under mediocre management should have looked like the 2009-10 to 2011-12 Calgary Flames. The only benefit we get now that he's been so bad that even through ownerships disillusionment we get the benefit of top draft picks. But he has as much chance as turning the Canucks around as Lowe or Mactavish did running the Oilers.

 

[M.C.G. 31]

So the worst GM in the league did the following trades :

- Raphael Diaz to Vancouver VS Dale Weise
- UFA Dale Weise + UFA Tomas Fleischmann to Chicago VS Phillip Danault + 2nd round pick (Alexander S. Romanov)
- 2nd round pick + conditional 5th round pick to Edmonton VS Jeff Petry
- Picked Paul Byron of waivers
- Simon Bourque to Winnipeg VS Joel Armia + Steve Mason
- UFA Tomas Plekanec + Kyle Baun to Toronto VS 2nd round pick (Jacob Olofsson)+ Kerby Rychel + Rinat Valiev, then re-sign Plekanec
- Zach Redmond to Buffalo VS Nicolas Deslauriers
- 5th round pick to Minnesota VS Mike Reilly
- Sebastian Collberg + 2nd round pick to Islanders VS Thomas Vanek + 5th round pick
- Signed UFA Alexander Radulov to a 1 year contract

This is way too early to judge the Drouin VS Sergachev trade and the Domi VS Galchenyuk trade. And every GM loses players to free agency. Radulov and 38 years old Markov are the only significant players he lost in 7 years.

The Subban trade looks bad, especially with the injuries to Weber. I agree he lost this one and this is a major one.

In the meantime, you have a GM like Stan Bowman who, over the years, lost players like Byfuglien, Panarin, Ladd, Teravainen, Leddy, Sharp, Hjalmarsson, Danault, Johns, Campbell, Frolik, Daley and Kempny for nothing, along with multiple 1st round picks for rentals like Vermette and an older Ladd, signed Seabrook to possibly the worst contract ever and he's still considered as a top 10 GM. If you understand that, please explain because I don't.

You can look at it like that all you want, but in the bigger picture this is what Bergevin did:

- took a team with young building blocks of Subban, Price, Pacioretty, Gallagher, and a 3rd overall pick (Galchenyuk) that was a few pieces away from being a contender to being a lottery team 5 years later, after he talked about a "5 year plan"
- traded the better, Norris winning defenseman, PK Subban for Shea Weber, when the Habs were in no position to do that deal in the first place because they weren't close to winning a Cup anyways and all they did was completely shut any chance of their Cup window than they would have had with a prime aged Subban.
- the following season, they decided to address their centre need by... trading for a winger? Not only that, but they traded that winger for a top LHD prospect, Sergachev, and let Markov walk that same summer, thus creating a MASSIVE hole at that position. Mete is a fine player, but he's just that. Sergachev could have been a gamebreaker and we traded him for a top-six winger to force at centre.
- Radulov walks after Bergevin blabs to the media and says "if you want loyalty, go buy a dog". What GM says that about their players?
- After 5 years of failing to address glaring issues (1C), he created even bigger problems, and our 1C problem turned into a 1C, 2C and top pairing mobile LHD problem, and then had the balls to blame this past season on "attitude" instead of owning up to having a shit team and enabling a shit culture because he doesn't practice what he preaches. He's a weasel.
- Kept Therrien for WAAAAY too long, who in turn kept Desharnais and a declining Plekanec ahead of Galchenyuk and absolutely stifled Galchenyuk's development into becoming an NHL centre on the Montreal Canadiens, along with hiring a bunch of his friends who really hurt the development of prospects in the AHL most notably. Only Scherbak looks like he survived that at the moment, Juulsen looks fine too but he was always pretty much projected to be a bottom-pairing defenseman iirc.

When you look at it in a bubble like you did, sure, the moves themselves look fine. Look at the whole picture and Bergevin created a mess, destroyed what should have been a contender at this point.

 

[tucker3434]

No.

Weise and Fleischmann for Danault and 2nd round pick (Romanov). Steal.

2nd round pick and 5th for Jeff Petry. Great deal.

Sergachev for Drouin, be patient with Drouin, he is going to be a amazing player IMO.

Galchenyuk for Domi, Domi have a great talent, play like Gallagher, but most talented. Amazing playmaker. Like this trade.

If Price can be Price, the contract is ok, because Price who become the real Price, he is no doubt, the best goalie in the world.

Subban for Weber, Subban he is the better defenseman, but Weber is better leader//mentor for the young defenseman, he can help develop player like Mete//Juulsen and more.

With 2017 and 2018 draft, the future is bright for Habs.

That’s about the most optimistic outlook possible on all those moves.

 

[ole ole]

Now I know Dorion is gonna get some knocks as well, but at least he has the excuse of poor ownership that has completely screwed the team. Bergevin turned a playoff contender and stripped it to a laughing stock of the NHL because of absolutely shortsighted and outright stupid decision making. I'm not a Habs fan, but thank god I'm not a Habs fan:

Galchenyuk for Domi: Trade away your best center for another play making winger when you already have bad center depth. #Logic

Subban for Weber: I mean everyone saw this as a bad trade, but boy does this look even worse now. Weber already has issues with his health, and your stuck with that 8 million cap hit for 8 more years! Subban is doing great in Nashville in the meantime, but at least Weber can show his true character and grit while he slowly heals in his iron lung.

Drouin for Sergachev: Wow, Bergevin actually kinda tried to fix his teams horrible center depth. Unfortunately, he had to give up his best defensive prospect in the process. But it gets even worse because Drouin kinda sucks as a center and can't handle the responsibilities of it, and whats even worse is he's the #1C on this team now. Also, Sergachev is doing amazing in Tampa and could've really helped that piss poor blue line. Whatever, Drouin is French so who cares ?

Carey Price 10 million dollar contract: HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! I mean I get it, Price can be a great goalie if he's healthy. But his numbers were terrible this year, and with the defense in front of him? I can't see him being a Vezina caliber goalie again, and you've got him for 8 more years. Good god what was Bergevin smoking when he gave this contract out...

Karl Alzner contract: Can't comment as much on this one, but I have heard nothing but negative feelings from Habs fans in regards to him and his play. Just another terrible contract through and through. Must be pissed his former team just won the cup though XD.

Losing Radulov to Stars: For a team that couldn't score this year to save themselves, Radulov's 72 points and 27 goals sure could've made a big difference. I can understand the issue about his age and how the Habs need to get younger, but doesn't Bergevin still think this team can be in the playoffs (LOL btw)?

Just a few examples of his wizardry. Could also go into the bad drafting and terrible misuse of players and whatnot, but I think everyone gets the general idea. I'm not going to admit to being a huge fan of the franchise that follows it day to day, but I know this team was a contender a few years ago and now looks like its on course for an ugly rebuild (which will take forever thanks to those Price and Weber contracts).

Galchenyuk for Domi bad for the Habs.

Subban for Weber Wasn't a great deal but why do the stupids have to be reminded that Weber and his contract will not be around for 8 more seasons. 4 more possibly 5.

Drouin for Sergachev: juror is still out on that one.

Price had to be done. Won't win another Vezina because of the team in front of him but will still be one of the best if not the best goalie on the planet.

Radulov left on his own. He was offered the same money but turned it down to join the Stars.

Alzner Ouch.

 

[WatchfulElm]

You can look at it like that all you want, but in the bigger picture this is what Bergevin did:

- took a team with young building blocks of Subban, Price, Pacioretty, Gallagher, and a 3rd overall pick (Galchenyuk) that was a few pieces away from being a contender to being a lottery team 5 years later, after he talked about a "5 year plan"
- traded the better, Norris winning defenseman, PK Subban for Shea Weber, when the Habs were in no position to do that deal in the first place because they weren't close to winning a Cup anyways and all they did was completely shut any chance of their Cup window than they would have had with a prime aged Subban.
- the following season, they decided to address their centre need by... trading for a winger? Not only that, but they traded that winger for a top LHD prospect, Sergachev, and let Markov walk that same summer, thus creating a MASSIVE hole at that position. Mete is a fine player, but he's just that. Sergachev could have been a gamebreaker and we traded him for a top-six winger to force at centre.
- Radulov walks after Bergevin blabs to the media and says "if you want loyalty, go buy a dog". What GM says that about their players?
- After 5 years of failing to address glaring issues (1C), he created even bigger problems, and our 1C problem turned into a 1C, 2C and top pairing mobile LHD problem, and then had the balls to blame this past season on "attitude" instead of owning up to having a **** team and enabling a **** culture because he doesn't practice what he preaches. He's a weasel.
- Kept Therrien for WAAAAY too long, who in turn kept Desharnais and a declining Plekanec ahead of Galchenyuk and absolutely stifled Galchenyuk's development into becoming an NHL centre on the Montreal Canadiens, along with hiring a bunch of his friends who really hurt the development of prospects in the AHL most notably. Only Scherbak looks like he survived that at the moment, Juulsen looks fine too but he was always pretty much projected to be a bottom-pairing defenseman iirc.

When you look at it in a bubble like you did, sure, the moves themselves look fine. Look at the whole picture and Bergevin created a mess, destroyed what should have been a contender at this point.

Maybe you need to decide if the Habs were close to being a contender or if they weren't close at all, or if you just make it up depending on which version serves your argument the best.

You might also want to do some fact checking before posting. Bergevin didn't decide to let Markov walk. It's Markov who decided to walk because he wanted 2 years.

The Radulov quote is actually excellent. It means that if you expect loyalty for your players, you're in the wrong business. I don't get what so offensive about it and to suggest it has anything to do with his decision to go to Dallas is laughable.

Also, why is it that Bergevin doesn't get any credit for signing Radulov? He didn't inherited of him. He convince him to play one good season in Montreal, which is more than 29 other GMs have gotten from him.

There's absolutely no proof that Galchenyuk's development has been stifled. So far, 2 NHL coaches have come to the same conclusion about him. Maybe he's just not responsible enough to play center? Why are there so many Habs fans that just can cope with this idea?

And the jury is still out on this trade. Same for the Drouin trade. Much too early to judge.

I still dislike the Subban trade and I agree this is a big stain on his resume. Of course he couldn't know that Weber would be so injured, but still the age difference always bothered me.

 

[Snowman]

I would pick Chiarelli. You have to give him credit for trading the number 1 and 2 picks from the same draft year and getting pennies on the dollar to do it.

 

[JohnLennon]

Know this is a bump, but great job telling everyone you aren't extending pacioretty and expecting "fair" value. God there's no way even chia is this stupid.

For anyone wondering, there is no confirmation this actually happened.

 

[didimentionlarseller]

The Radulov quote is actually excellent. It means that if you expect loyalty for your players, you're in the wrong business. I don't get what so offensive about it and to suggest it has anything to do with his decision to go to Dallas is laughable.

July 2nd 2017

"If you want loyalty, buy a dog" - Marc Bergevin on whether he expected loyalty from Radulov after taking a chance on him last year.
https://www.bardown.com/bergevin-ga...-if-he-expected-loyalty-from-radulov-1.794992


July 3rd 2017

Alexander Radulov signs five-year contract with Stars

just a coincidence he signed with the other team the next day, thats definitely not a message being sent at all

 

[ole ole]

July 2nd 2017

"If you want loyalty, buy a dog" - Marc Bergevin on whether he expected loyalty from Radulov after taking a chance on him last year.
https://www.bardown.com/bergevin-ga...-if-he-expected-loyalty-from-radulov-1.794992


July 3rd 2017

Alexander Radulov signs five-year contract with Stars

just a coincidence he signed with the other team the next day, thats definitely not a message being sent at all

Well i guess Bergevin this time nailed it."If you want loyalty, buy a dog"....

 

[WatchfulElm]

July 2nd 2017

"If you want loyalty, buy a dog" - Marc Bergevin on whether he expected loyalty from Radulov after taking a chance on him last year.
https://www.bardown.com/bergevin-ga...-if-he-expected-loyalty-from-radulov-1.794992


July 3rd 2017

Alexander Radulov signs five-year contract with Stars

just a coincidence he signed with the other team the next day, thats definitely not a message being sent at all

A free agent who signs a contract on July 3rd is not a coincidence by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[member 157595]

If Bergevin isn't the very worst, then he is certainly among them. As much as I respect and admire Quebec's unique culture, Montreal's tendency to predominantly hire francophone general managers and coaches severely limits the pool of potential quality personnel at their disposal. I'm sure the fans would rather have a winning team than a losing one with a French speaking front office.

Not that it's a representative sample or anything, but I was recently in Montreal and asked some people about this. Every single person said they couldn't care less what language the GM or coach speaks, they just want the team to win.