Speculation: Is a possible rebuild/retool coming?

[Beaker]

I would start by managing Weber / Price’s crippling cap hits - especially Weber.

 

[webersshot]

No way! We’re winning this serie

IF we win tonight we will win series

 

[cphabs]

I'd rather have a 25 year old with a degree than another working class person in charge of this team. Enough is enough. We're playing checkers here.

What degree would that be? “Sports Management” or “ Business Management”? From McGill? Lmfao!

 

[cphabs]

The President of Hockey Operations is an EXECUTIVE position. We can all agree the GM is the one whose vision gets pitched to the Executive Office. Having a CEO holding down dual responsibilities is just plain dumb. Particularly when the individual hasn’t demonstrated a working knowledge of the product. It doesn’t happen in the “real world” why is it happening to the Habs. The club is just a toy to Molson a very lucrative toy.

Well said brother! Hope the fishing is good!

 

[salbutera]

The President of Hockey Operations is an EXECUTIVE position. We can all agree the GM is the one whose vision gets pitched to the Executive Office. Having a CEO holding down dual responsibilities is just plain dumb. Particularly when the individual hasn’t demonstrated a working knowledge of the product. It doesn’t happen in the “real world” why is it happening to the Habs. The club is just a toy to Molson a very lucrative toy.

Most Fortune 500 companies have gone the route of combined President & CEO roles to eliminate bureaucracy.

Even in NHL, only teams who are part of a large conglomerate of multiple sport team holdings (MLSE, MSG, AEG, Delaware North etc,) have a President of each sports team otherwise the GM reports directly to the owner.

 

[BigDaddyLurch]

Most Fortune 500 companies have gone the route of combined President & CEO roles to eliminate bureaucracy.

Even in NHL, only teams who are part of a large conglomerate of multiple sport team holdings (MLSE, MSG, AEG, Delaware North etc,) have a President of each sports team otherwise the GM reports directly to the owner.

...pity neither our Owner nor our GM are knowledgeable hockey people...

 

[tinyzombies]

What degree would that be? “Sports Management” or “ Business Management”? From McGill? Lmfao!

Physics. Someone who can conceptualize. The guy is collecting third pairing dmen like he was, even as coach.

 

[JoelWarlord]

Listen to masai Ujiri, who actually won a championship saying winning 2 years ago means nothing and making the playoff means nothing, in fact he says anything short of a anther championship is failure, and listen to Mb saying we make the playoffs and anything can happen and you can clearly see where and how we fail,

Exactly. Your goal is to win a championship, and if you win your goal is to win another. In hockey where stars have a relatively smaller impact on the game and where there's less player movement your goal should be to set yourself up to be a regular contender for a 5-10 year period with a championship core so you can take as many swings at it and hope your goaltending luck lines up for a couple runs.

Thinking about things this way helps bring decisions into proper focus. For example, with something like getting Tatar as part of the Pacioretty trade. From the perspective of "get to da playoff anything can happen" it was great, we got a 1st line forward who was an excellent player for us for 3 years and helped keep the Habs in the hunt, huge win. From the perspective of trying to win a championship it was a complete failure of asset management. Instead of getting a 1st and a prospect like Calen Addison who could help us win some day, we held on to him and got a fake bubble playoff "win", plus a mickey mouse playoff appearance in a joke division.

The other team I follow similarly closely to the Habs is the Blue Jays and it's just night and day following the two teams. It's really made the Habs nonsense so much more frustrating to me. The Jays have some issues right now, and I have some quibbles with the pitching decisions they made in the offseason + sticking with Montoyo, but the franchise has a clear direction, a clear championship core, and a path to get there. They're a top 10 team that's young, built around Vlad Jr. who has first ballot HOF upside alongside another potentially elite young player in Bichette and a whole group of supporting talents with upside. They have an incredibly deep minor league system with tons of upper tire prospects close to contributing. They went out in free agency the past two years and spent over 250 million dollars to fix premium positions, grabbed an ace in Ryu, a top 3 CF in Springer, and fixed a roster hole with Semien who's off to a red hot start. All impact players and they were the only non Yankees/Dodgers team that was serious about spending any money this year.

Instead the Habs are just nibbling around the edges, signing average players to average money for average results. We never properly bottomed out so our prospect pool is deep but not elite. Price and Weber are no longer elite, Petry and Gallagher never were, we don't really have any elite talent in the pool, and we don't have all that much cap flexibility unless we decide to blow it up. It's just a weird spot to be and there's no clear pathway to either contending or rebuilding. It's a rough spot and it's very frustrating as a fan to be now 5 years past the "win now" Weber trade, and into year 3 of the "reset" with no clear picture of what the team wants to do beyond scrape into the playoffs and put up a respectable fight in a 6 game 1st round loss.

 

[Rapala]

Most Fortune 500 companies have gone the route of combined President & CEO roles to eliminate bureaucracy.

Even in NHL, only teams who are part of a large conglomerate of multiple sport team holdings (MLSE, MSG, AEG, Delaware North etc,) have a President of each sports team otherwise the GM reports directly to the owner.

List Them.
What a crock. Even Molson's don't have the same President and CEO. To take it a step further more and more companies are moving away from CEO/Chairman.

 

[Rapala]

List Them.

Never mind I will.
List of chief executive officers - Wikipedia

 

[salbutera]

List Them.
What a crock. Even Molson's don't have the same President and CEO. To take it a step further more and more companies are moving away from CEO/Chairman.

Apple - Tim Cook CEO (holds de facto Pres role as they eliminated the role)

Google - Sundar Pinchai CEO (also holds dual role as Prez)

Amazon - Jeff Bezos (Founder, Chairman, CEO and Prez)

Airbus - Guillaume Faury (CEO & Prez - Airbus eliminated Pres role and merged w CEO)

Raytheon Technologies - Greg Hayes (Chairman, CEO and Prez)

On and on it goes...

 

[Rapala]

Apple - Tim Cook CEO (holds de facto Pres role as they eliminated the role)

Google - Sundar Pinchai CEO (also holds dual role as Prez)

Your statement was flat out FALSE and I called you out on it. Some companies have CEO's serving as Presidents also but certainly not most and it certainly will not become the norm. These are positions 1 and 2 in most corporate structures.

 

[salbutera]

Your statement was flat out FALSE and I called you out on it. Some companies have CEO's serving as Presidents also but certainly not most and it certainly will not become the norm. These are positions 1 and 2 in most corporate structures.

Hedge fund managers and leverage buyout specialists are demanding elimination of Prez roles for Fortune 500 companies to eliminate unnecessary compensation which they view as taking away from shareholders

My firm was involved in eliminating 11–independent President roles in the last 14-months as part of activist investor movement..

My initial comment was “Most Fortune 500 companies have gone the route of combined President & CEO roles to eliminate bureaucracy” which is factual

 

[tazsub3]

Exactly. Your goal is to win a championship, and if you win your goal is to win another. In hockey where stars have a relatively smaller impact on the game and where there's less player movement your goal should be to set yourself up to be a regular contender for a 5-10 year period with a championship core so you can take as many swings at it and hope your goaltending luck lines up for a couple runs.

Thinking about things this way helps bring decisions into proper focus. For example, with something like getting Tatar as part of the Pacioretty trade. From the perspective of "get to da playoff anything can happen" it was great, we got a 1st line forward who was an excellent player for us for 3 years and helped keep the Habs in the hunt, huge win. From the perspective of trying to win a championship it was a complete failure of asset management. Instead of getting a 1st and a prospect like Calen Addison who could help us win some day, we held on to him and got a fake bubble playoff "win", plus a mickey mouse playoff appearance in a joke division.

The other team I follow similarly closely to the Habs is the Blue Jays and it's just night and day following the two teams. It's really made the Habs nonsense so much more frustrating to me. The Jays have some issues right now, and I have some quibbles with the pitching decisions they made in the offseason + sticking with Montoyo, but the franchise has a clear direction, a clear championship core, and a path to get there. They're a top 10 team that's young, built around Vlad Jr. who has first ballot HOF upside alongside another potentially elite young player in Bichette and a whole group of supporting talents with upside. They have an incredibly deep minor league system with tons of upper tire prospects close to contributing. They went out in free agency the past two years and spent over 250 million dollars to fix premium positions, grabbed an ace in Ryu, a top 3 CF in Springer, and fixed a roster hole with Semien who's off to a red hot start. All impact players and they were the only non Yankees/Dodgers team that was serious about spending any money this year.

Instead the Habs are just nibbling around the edges, signing average players to average money for average results. We never properly bottomed out so our prospect pool is deep but not elite. Price and Weber are no longer elite, Petry and Gallagher never were, we don't really have any elite talent in the pool, and we don't have all that much cap flexibility unless we decide to blow it up. It's just a weird spot to be and there's no clear pathway to either contending or rebuilding. It's a rough spot and it's very frustrating as a fan to be now 5 years past the "win now" Weber trade, and into year 3 of the "reset" with no clear picture of what the team wants to do beyond scrape into the playoffs and put up a respectable fight in a 6 game 1st round loss.

Love your reply and agree fully.

 

[Goal Caufield50]

So how do you add stars drafting 10 to 16?

Hmm, did you check? How about Iginla, selanne, Kovalev, Sakic, MacInnis, Karlsson, Radulov, Naslund, ...there is a hall of fame team in this range

 

[CHwest]

Hmm, did you check? How about Iginla, selanne, Kovalev, Sakic, MacInnis, Karlsson, Radulov, Naslund, ...there is a hall of fame team in this range

Scouting is a lot better now, that list goes way back.

 

[barbu]

Scouting is a lot better now, that list goes way back.

From casual observation reviewing drafts from 1979 til now, there has been some improvement but not that much. My take is 18 years is just too young to be that accurate.

 

[Rapala]

Hedge fund managers and leverage buyout specialists are demanding elimination of Prez roles for Fortune 500 companies to eliminate unnecessary compensation which they view as taking away from shareholders

My firm was involved in eliminating 11–independent President roles in the last 14-months as part of activist investor movement..

My initial comment was “Most Fortune 500 companies have gone the route of combined President & CEO roles to eliminate bureaucracy” which is factual

No it isn't. Give it up you have no data that can back up your claim.

 

[salbutera]

No it isn't. Give it up you have no data that can back up your claim.

I just listed Apple, Google and Amazon the former two eliminated the Presidents role and Bezos has 3-hats. Only 6-of Fortune top-50 have a Presidents role the rest have either Prez & CEO or CEO role with assumed President responsibilities without having replaced the position.

Believe what you want..

 

[SOLR]

I just listed Apple, Google and Amazon the former two eliminated the Presidents role and Bezos has 3-hats. Only 6-of Fortune top-50 have a Presidents role the rest have either Prez & CEO or CEO role with assumed President responsibilities without having replaced the position.

Believe what you want..

Yep, I can confirm presidents are disappearing. But I'm not sure how is this related to hockey.

 

[salbutera]

Yep, I can confirm presidents are disappearing. But I'm not sure how is this related to hockey.

I simply stated in the NHL teams who are part of conglomerates (MLSE, MSG, AEG etc.) who own multiple sports teams are the ones w President of Hockey Ops, individually owned teams have GMs reporting directly to the owner. CBJ is the only exception I can think of w Davidson having come back.

 

[SOLR]

I simply stated in the NHL teams who are part of conglomerates (MLSE, MSG, AEG etc.) who own multiple sports teams are the ones w President of Hockey Ops, individually owned teams have GMs reporting directly to the owner. CBJ is the only exception I can think of w Davidson having come back.

Ok, yeah that's fine.

We need a VP of hockey ops (André or Serge Savard) and a new GM. That senior is useful to see the big picture the GM might miss because of being in the weeds. Make both report to the owner.

 

[ottawa]

I would start by managing Weber / Price’s crippling cap hits - especially Weber.

Weber's is very easy to manage given his low salary / high cap hit.

Price on the other hand...you gotta think the new GM would consider exposing him to give him a better chance elsewhere (+ be close to his family) and to open up options for our rebuild

 

[Rapala]

HEY MOLSON EXTEND THEM ALL.

 

[cphabs]

Physics. Someone who can conceptualize. The guy is collecting third pairing dmen like he was, even as coach.

Physics is applied mathematics. A certainty. If we are going to follow your suggestion? About a person with a physics degree being our GM? I'd hire best high school physics teacher in Quebec. Seriously! He or she can "conceptualize" like no other.