Rumor: In-season Proposals, Rumors, Free Agents & Roster Moves (related topics) LXXXIV

[FoppaForsberg*]

I still don't understand why they left Hayes unsigned for 4 years, that's pretty risky to do with a first round pick. If a team thinks they'll sign a guy within a couple years its one thing but letting a guy finish out his college career first and then signing him is rolling the dice.

Because he was in College, you can't play in the NCAA with an ELC.

 

[Blackhawkswincup]

I still don't understand why they left Hayes unsigned for 4 years, that's pretty risky to do with a first round pick. If a team thinks they'll sign a guy within a couple years its one thing but letting a guy finish out his college career first and then signing him is rolling the dice.

Hawks don't pressure kids to sign in NCAA

They let them stay if they don't want to turn pro until they feel ready. Johns + Paliotta were recent NCAA 4 year guys who signed with Hawks

Hayes was talking up signing with Hawks until they traded his brother and he hired an agent

Once that happened Hayes tune changed completely

 

[tigervixxxen]

Because he was in College, you can't play in the NCAA with an ELC.

I get that. I mean why did they let him stay there for 4 years. I wouldn't want to take any first rounder the full 4 years. Say we drafted Werenski, would anyone want to leave him in school for 4 years and just hope that he signs with the Avs when he leaves?

So let's say this hypothetical, say Butcher has a really good year next year, what do we do with him then? He probably won't leave school to play in the AHL but would we have a spot for him on our roster? or the alternative is to let him go back to school for his senior year and pray it doesn't turn into a situation.

 

[JWK]

Hayes suffered a serious injury in his Junior year, had 4 emergency surgeries and was close to getting his leg amputated. That's probably the reason why Chicago didn't sign him. He even mentioned that he would sign with Chicago after his senior year, and that was after his brother was traded.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

Kerby Rychel? Yes please. Unfortunately Columbus want D in return which isn't something we have, along be willing to give up.

 

[Gabe the Babe]

Wouldn't say horribly, but theres players like Gardiner who get paid because of potential.

That's a good example. I wouldn't say he won't be worth it at some point during that contract tho

 

[FoppaForsberg*]

Thinking of free agency and needing to bolster our #3C,what about Kyle Brodziak?

 

[R S]

I get that. I mean why did they let him stay there for 4 years. I wouldn't want to take any first rounder the full 4 years. Say we drafted Werenski, would anyone want to leave him in school for 4 years and just hope that he signs with the Avs when he leaves?

So let's say this hypothetical, say Butcher has a really good year next year, what do we do with him then? He probably won't leave school to play in the AHL but would we have a spot for him on our roster? or the alternative is to let him go back to school for his senior year and pray it doesn't turn into a situation.

But what are their options? Hayes obviously didn't see as much of a future with CHI as he did with a different team, depending on who had interest in him as a UFA. Chicago can't force him to sign if he doesn't want to sign. They can only offer so much money on his ELC, too.

Thinking of free agency and needing to bolster our #3C,what about Kyle Brodziak?

I would be down. But I don't see us doing much regarding our FW group via free agency, unless we see O'Reilly and/or someone else dealt. There are too many contracts floating around right now and only so much room on the big team. That is, unless Sakic/Roy can admit their mistakes and put a guy like Cliche in the AHL despite paying him NHL money.

 

[cgf]

Brodziak is awful. Malkin is a much better 3C

 

[dahrougem2]

In today's NHL you pay for the potential if you want to lock these kids up early. MacK will break out into a PPG+ player (I really don't say this about many players). His agent and the Avs both realize they have quite the player in MacK. In order to lock him up long term, it is going to cost a great deal of money, even if he only has a 65 point season.

Landy had a bad year before he signed, the Avs took a risk and paid for potential that all parties knew was there. They were rewarded with a contract that looks great now. Varly was rewarded with a big deal in the middle of his breakout season. You could argue he was still a risk there, and that if the Avs had waited until after the season, they are looking at a higher price tag because of his Vezina nomination. ROR had a great year coming off his ELC. The Avs had a chance to lock him up for what was though to be a bit much (here and around the league), and the Avs balked. We all know the end to that story means instead of having a $5m ROR for the next couple years, we are looking at a much different scenario. Barrie is another one that is going to cash in on his next contract. The Avs didn't pay up to get him signed long term last summer, and Barrie came out and cemented a huge deal with a big season.

At certain times, you take the risk and bet on the player. If there is anybody on the Avs to do that with, it is MacK. He is a sure thing.

I'm not debating that at all. What I'm saying is I don't think I'd be happy if I found out tomorrow MacKinnon signed a deal that has him making Toews/Kane level money or something close to it. If we could lock up MacK for 7-8 I'd be happy, no complaints from me. But I'm not ready to hand him 10M per season just because of his potential.

 

[Avs_19]

I think Brodziak is more of a 4th line center now and Mitchell and a healthy Winchester can do what he does. We do need an upgrade at that position though. I don't think Mitchell is good enough for that role.

 

[RockLobster]

But what are their options? Hayes obviously didn't see as much of a future with CHI as he did with a different team, depending on who had interest in him as a UFA. Chicago can't force him to sign if he doesn't want to sign. They can only offer so much money on his ELC, too.




I would be down. But I don't see us doing much regarding our FW group via free agency, unless we see O'Reilly and/or someone else dealt. There are too many contracts floating around right now and only so much room on the big team. That is, unless Sakic/Roy can admit their mistakes and put a guy like Cliche in the AHL despite paying him NHL money.

I don't think that will be a problem. If Bordy and Winchester were both healthy to start the year (or at any point during the season) someone on an NHL deal would have been sent to the AHL (again, pending full health)...and I'm pretty sure Noreau's deal pays him his full NHL salary (625k) even while in the AHL.

 

[dahrougem2]

I think Brodziak is more of a 4th line center now and Mitchell and a healthy Winchester can do what he does. We do need an upgrade at that position though. I don't think Mitchell is good enough for that role.

Yeah Brodziak is a 4C, if he's a 3C on a team, there's a lack of depth up front. He, Mitchell and Winchester are all 4C's.

 

[tigervixxxen]

But what are their options?

Sign him before it gets to that point. Is any first rounder taken without the intention of signing the pick? My point is why ever let a first rounder even get to that point of choosing his own future. Of course any player would take that option if given to them and there will be teams out there that will take on a former first rounder.

That is, unless Sakic/Roy can admit their mistakes and put a guy like Cliche in the AHL despite paying him NHL money.

I fully believe they see absolutely no issue with him on the roster.

I don't think that will be a problem. If Bordy and Winchester were both healthy to start the year (or at any point during the season) someone on an NHL deal would have been sent to the AHL...and I'm pretty sure Noreau's deal pays him his full NHL salary (625k) even while in the AHL.

If they don't add a forward then they have 13, nobody would get sent down.

 

[Avs_19]

Yeah Brodziak is a 4C, if he's a 3C on a team, there's a lack of depth up front. He, Mitchell and Winchester are all 4C's.

We need a guy like Kruger. I'd overpay for him. He's so good defensively and can win faceoffs. Even if his offense is limited, he'd still be very valuable. There might even be some offensive potential there that we haven't seen because he's used mainly in a defensive role.

 

[R S]

Sign him before it gets to that point. Is any first rounder taken without the intention of signing the pick? My point is why ever let a first rounder even get to that point of choosing his own future. Of course any player would take that option if given to them and there will be teams out there that will take on a former first rounder.

Because it takes two sides to sign a contract?

Chicago could want Hayes all they want, but if Hayes didn't want to sign there and is willing to play out his full college eligibility and then test the UFA market, he's free and clear to do that.

Like I said, they only have so much money they can throw at him because they are trying to sign him to an ELC. They're a deep team with not a ton of room for a guy like him. They can only promise him so much re: ice time and perks, aside from the same old same old ELC cash he can get from any other team.

It was the same case with Blake Wheeler when he chose not to sign with the Coyotes, taking a deal from Boston instead. The Coyotes offered him max money on his ELC and probably top 6 minutes but he decided to go elsewhere instead.

It's easy to say "sign him before it gets to that point" but if the guy doesn't want to sign, he doesn't want to sign.

 

[tigervixxxen]

That could apply to anyone, I get that part. I'm just saying letting NCAA picks go for long is opening the door up for a risk. A team that drafts a high NCAA player should have a plan on when they are going to need to sign them before these things are more likely to turn into a problem. I get later picks you dont know what you'll have so you wait to see how they develop, if they take a big jump in their last year it's a risk. Like I said, if the Avs select Werenski or Connor they better have a plan on when they want to sign them and not wait 4 years and say oh well it's his right to choose. Would those guys such as Hayes and Wheeler not signed if they were offered a contract 1-3 years after they were drafted or were they reluctant from day 1?

 

[dahrougem2]

I doubt the teams didn't try to sign their players re: Wheeler and Hayes. But as RS said, it takes two to tango (not those words lol). Maybe Hayes wanted finish his full 4 years of college prior to signing? Maybe Wheeler didn't want to play in front of 20 fans per night in Arizona for a perennial losing team? The team should find a way to close the deal no doubt, but it doesn't surprise me to see this stuff

 

[tigervixxxen]

Ok, enough about other players. Let's talk about our own. I brought this up earlier, maybe too much what if but it very well could be a situation for us a year from now. Let's say Butcher has a nice year next year. Not a Hobey Baker type year but he takes a nice step forward and puts up some points. Should the Avs sign him or let him play his senior year and see what happens? And let's say he's made it clear he's not interested in leaving school to play in the AHL, so he wants a NHL roster spot to sign now (and let's assume he would leapfrog another prospect, not take Holden's spot because then we all know what the answer would be). Do you want the Avs to protect their asset but maybe sign him too early and give him an opportunity that perhaps you weren't ready to offer or to make the decision when his college career is over, when he might have put together a good enough resume coupled with his team USA experience to suddenly have options and other teams interested? What's your philosophy with all that? What's the greater or better risk?

 

[member 116861]

Ok, enough about other players. Let's talk about our own. I brought this up earlier, maybe too much what if but it very well could be a situation for us a year from now. Let's say Butcher has a nice year next year. Not a Hobey Baker type year but he takes a nice step forward and puts up some points. Should the Avs sign him or let him play his senior year and see what happens? And let's say he's made it clear he's not interested in leaving school to play in the AHL, so he wants a NHL roster spot to sign now (and let's assume he would leapfrog another prospect, not take Holden's spot because then we all know what the answer would be). Do you want the Avs to protect their asset but maybe sign him too early and give him an opportunity that perhaps you weren't ready to offer or to make the decision when his college career is over, when he might have put together a good enough resume coupled with his team USA experience to suddenly have options and other teams interested? What's your philosophy with all that? What's the greater or better risk?

Sign him now and give him a spot. I'm incredibly biased towards puck-moving defensemen but I don't want to risk losing him.

 

[dahrougem2]

Take your chances with him the next year. If he's not interested in signing now unless he's promised NHL time, he better be one hell of an outstanding prospect and not somebody who is just the caliber of Butcher. I'd only promise an NHL spot to a prospect in this very position if they were absolutely tearing up the NCAA and clearly ready for it. Otherwise, I would wait it out and work on negotiations the following year.

IF in the end the player decides to leave, so be it. But as a GM, I'm not going to sacrifice the potential betterment of the team simply because an ok prospect has unreasonable demands and tries to hold the team hostage for them.

 

[LTC Pain]

Mike Reilly is leaving college and will become a Free Agent. Sakic/Roy need to sign this guy ASAP!

http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2015/05/17/report-reilly-leaves-college-headed-for-free-agency/

 

[Foppa2118]

Mike Reilly is leaving college and will become a Free Agent. Sakic/Roy need to sign this guy ASAP!

http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2015/05/17/report-reilly-leaves-college-headed-for-free-agency/

Not sure how big of an impact it might be, but there is a small connection with Colorado and Mike Reilly, as his dad played college hockey for CC.

 

[tigervixxxen]

Sakic and Roy haven't looked under every rock around the world for defensemen. Also, we don't get big fish.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

I doubt Columbus would give up on Murray especially since Friedman says they want D but how does this sound value wise?

Ryan Murray+Kerby Rychel for Ryan O'Reilly+10th overall+Siemens