In Praise of Chevy
- Thread starter TorJet
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Georgetown Al*
Georgetown Al
- Oct 6, 2015
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Then why bother discussing anything related to the organization at this point - drafts, trades, free agent signings, rosters, etc.?
If there is nothing relevant that might predict future success, there's really not much to talk about. Just follow the standings.
Georgetown Al*
Georgetown Al
- Oct 6, 2015
- 1,182
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Can't argue with your valid question......
I think it finally starts to begin this season and kicks in louder and louder after each season after that.
raideralex99
Whiteout Is Coming.
Nice to see this thread ... Chevy does deserve some props instead of the hate (not all but some) on this HF.
Most of the sports world see the Jets winning down the road very shortly but some people want it now ... RELAX.
How many key injuries do the Jets have and the young guns have come up and produced ... what does that tell you?
Most of the sports world see the Jets winning down the road very shortly but some people want it now ... RELAX.
How many key injuries do the Jets have and the young guns have come up and produced ... what does that tell you?
KCjetsfan
Registered User
to be fair on the bolded.... year 6 (or more realistically 7) is a long time to wait for winning
They told everyone upfront it is at least a 5 year plan, so not sure why you are complaining. They are are executing the plan that was paid out. The fans that were expecting success much sooner might be the one at fault here.
Sure you don't care about anything other than winning but you are not the owner and the one signing his paycheck.
The owner asked him to execute a plan and looks like he is doing exactly that.
The "5 year plan" statement was a media narrative - no one in TNSE has said anything other than "It's a process".
Sorry: should have warned about the trigger phrase.
Okay I change it to "draft and develop" instead of 5 year plan
Still that meant taking some time.
First draft picks were in 2011 - Scheifele and Lowry. They are just now becoming leaders. Other draft picks / trades for prospects...
Armia (2011)
Trouba, Hellebuyck (2012)
Morrissey, Petan, Dano (2013)
Ehlers, Lemieux (2014)
Connor, Roslovic (2015)
Laine (2016)
I'm not sure whether you could really say that the Jets are "behind schedule" when you consider the time it takes to accumulate picks / prospects and then develop them. The first picks / prospects (from 2011) are just now hitting their prime years.
The only way that they could have accelerated the process would have been to try to trade some of their picks / prospects for veterans that would win sooner.
How would you have accelerated the process, considering that they started without any decent prospects in 2011?
DashingDane
Dutch boy
I think he has done marvelous considering I wouldn't have been a Jets fan if he didn't draft Ehlers 
In all seriousness though I think he has done a very solid job in the time I have followed the team. I understand the people who think it has taken too long but I don't know the Thrashers team well enough to have a opinion on that.
From what I gather there has been two Jets 2.0 mini eras. Pre making the playoffs and then everything after getting swept. It seems there was still hope that the old core + youth role players could become contenders before the Ducks series.
I think the old core gave it their all but proved too light. Everything since then has been focused on creating a new core of young players where the vets will act as supporting cast. I think that means they didn't expect a playoff run last year and won't expect one this year either. It is all about giving the youth a chance to grow in key roles in the NHL and that takes time. Next year is when I expect to see a big jump and want to see them in the playoff conversation.
Next year is also when I think we can start expecting more movement from Chevy in terms of win now trades though the Trouba situation is also very crucial. No question this team needs a Trouba + D depth but if they aren't expecting a playoff run this year then I'm ok with having patience. Now if they **** the bed next year I will politely ask for Pomo and Chevy's head
If you have watched the team at the beginning of this season you pretty much have to be blind to not be optimistic. Depleted team that looked better than the most stacked team in this league over two games. What more do you want? I also think they look like a better team now than they were when they made the playoffs.
In all seriousness though I think he has done a very solid job in the time I have followed the team. I understand the people who think it has taken too long but I don't know the Thrashers team well enough to have a opinion on that.
From what I gather there has been two Jets 2.0 mini eras. Pre making the playoffs and then everything after getting swept. It seems there was still hope that the old core + youth role players could become contenders before the Ducks series.
I think the old core gave it their all but proved too light. Everything since then has been focused on creating a new core of young players where the vets will act as supporting cast. I think that means they didn't expect a playoff run last year and won't expect one this year either. It is all about giving the youth a chance to grow in key roles in the NHL and that takes time. Next year is when I expect to see a big jump and want to see them in the playoff conversation.
Next year is also when I think we can start expecting more movement from Chevy in terms of win now trades though the Trouba situation is also very crucial. No question this team needs a Trouba + D depth but if they aren't expecting a playoff run this year then I'm ok with having patience. Now if they **** the bed next year I will politely ask for Pomo and Chevy's head
If you have watched the team at the beginning of this season you pretty much have to be blind to not be optimistic. Depleted team that looked better than the most stacked team in this league over two games. What more do you want? I also think they look like a better team now than they were when they made the playoffs.
Robinson2187
Registered Schmoozer
I think he has done marvelous considering I wouldn't have been a Jets fan if he didn't draft Ehlers
In all seriousness though I think he has done a very solid job in the time I have followed the team. I understand the people who think it has taken too long but I don't know the Thrashers team well enough to have a opinion on that.
From what I gather there has been two Jets 2.0 mini eras. Pre making the playoffs and then everything after getting swept. It seems there was still hope that the old core + youth role players could become contenders before the Ducks series.
I think the old core gave it their all but proved too light. Everything since then has been focused on creating a new core of young players where the vets will act as supporting cast. I think that means they didn't expect a playoff run last year and won't expect one this year either. It is all about giving the youth a chance to grow in key roles in the NHL and that takes time. Next year is when I expect to see a big jump and want to see them in the playoff conversation.
Next year is also when I think we can start expecting more movement from Chevy in terms of win now trades though the Trouba situation is also very crucial. No question this team needs a Trouba + D depth but if they aren't expecting a playoff run this year then I'm ok with having patience. Now if they **** the bed next year I will politely ask for Pomo and Chevy's head
If you have watched the team at the beginning of this season you pretty much have to be blind to not be optimistic. Depleted team that looked better than the most stacked team in this league over two games. What more do you want? I also think they look like a better team now than they were when they made the playoffs.
This is spot on Dane! Next year is the coming out party.
Puckatron 3000
Glitchy Prototype
Good post, DashingDane.
I'm sorta on the same timeline. There's a lot of rookies this year. Including pretty much both goaltenders. And the Trouba situation doesn't help. So this year, I'm cool with a development year. Still, it feels like anything is possible. But next year, this machine is kicked into full gear and I expect some playoff action.
I'm sorta on the same timeline. There's a lot of rookies this year. Including pretty much both goaltenders. And the Trouba situation doesn't help. So this year, I'm cool with a development year. Still, it feels like anything is possible. But next year, this machine is kicked into full gear and I expect some playoff action.
MrBoJangelz71
Registered User
- Jan 14, 2014
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I would say this season should be judged with a patient mind. I want to see improvement in all areas as the season progresses, so I want to see a stronger second half than first, and I believe we should be in around .500.
Next season the gloves are off, and wins/losses can be looked at unequivocally.
We are a very young team, that one could say is playing its worst expected hockey today.With some maturation, experience and confidence, this team will get better every game.
I could live with one more "developmental year" as long as the reigns were given fully over to the kids. Dano, Copp and Petan should be playing over Thur, Burmi and Stafford. Or at least 2 of the 3 as Stafford won't ever be in the PB when healthy.
But, and remember I'm pretty damn optimistic about just about everything, IMO this group is too talented and so young they don't realize they aren't ready to contend. All these 3rd period comebacks are nuts. We have had 2 seasons worth of comebacks in less than a month and against some pretty good teams. All with significant injuries and one of our top 4 D holding out.
I think if the injury bug subsides, the Trouba situation gets resolved and we get NHL average goaltending or better we make the playoffs. Lets not lose sight we are hanging right there in the 2nd wildcard spot even with things not going our way.
But, and remember I'm pretty damn optimistic about just about everything, IMO this group is too talented and so young they don't realize they aren't ready to contend. All these 3rd period comebacks are nuts. We have had 2 seasons worth of comebacks in less than a month and against some pretty good teams. All with significant injuries and one of our top 4 D holding out.
I think if the injury bug subsides, the Trouba situation gets resolved and we get NHL average goaltending or better we make the playoffs. Lets not lose sight we are hanging right there in the 2nd wildcard spot even with things not going our way.
Connor, Scheifele, Lowry in 3rd, Trouba, Helle in 5th, (Morrissey, Petan, Comrie, Copp, Lipon, Poolman all in 2013), Ehlers, Roslovic, are all signs of a good scouting department and very solid drafting. He did well with Buff and Ladd and fleeced the Sabres. Also, let's remember he ices a team that is nowhere near the cap. He gets a high passing grade if you ask me.
I think Chevy goes after someone like Alzner in free agency and re-signs Trouba.
I think Chevy goes after someone like Alzner in free agency and re-signs Trouba.
Aavco Cup
"I can make you cry in this room"
- Sep 5, 2013
- 37,630
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The Jets never did that. It was the guys on 1290 who began that. I've heard them say it on the radio several times since TC began.
It has been elevated to urban myth status primarily by people who have an agenda against Chevy and TNSE (all IMO)
Agreed they are easily talented enough to make the playoffs. I expect this team to continue to get better as they become more refined and confident.
Something else that hasn't been brought up is most of our key young kids are accustomed to winning and success:
Morrissey- WHL champion and WJC champion. Josh also played a key role in the Ice Caps run to the Calder Cup final.
Petan - WHL and WJC champion
Laine- WJC and Finish Elite league champion
Scheifele - WHC gold medal and a standout in the WCH.
I think we collecting a bunch of young players that are not only talented but have won prior to joining the NHL and expect to win here. I think that bodes very well for the near and long term of this team.
I hadn't really considered this. But they certainly don't fold the cards when things get tough.
KCjetsfan
Registered User
well my comment was specifically directed towards a poster upset that some people were getting impatient and the implication that anyone who isn't satisfied at this point is just impatient. I stated that it isn't unreasonable to expect some results by year 6 or 7. If it is, what is reasonable? Year 10? Or just keep pushing it forward a year every year.
To be clear, I'm not necessarily saying we aren't in a decent position now. But to expect the grand plan to produce results by now isn't unreasonable.
Specifically to your question - there's been some inconsistencies in the approach. We should have grabbed more draft picks (not players that were high picks, although that has been nice). We shouldn't have traded picks for veterans. We probably could have removed some of the 'core' that came with the team earlier, to accelerate the process. This has not been a flawless process, and frankly I think there has been some course corrections that have probably extended the grand plan. I give credit that many of the choices have been good. Many opportunities have been missed.
Where does your patience with the process end if it doesn't produce results? Mine should be this year, but I'm extending it to next. I hardly think that's unreasonable or impatient on my part.
broinwhyteridge
Registered User
Hunter368
RIP lomiller1, see you in the next life buddy.
- Nov 8, 2011
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I'm fine with being patient this year, but as you say next year the gloves are off....then it's about wins & loses.
Hunter368
RIP lomiller1, see you in the next life buddy.
- Nov 8, 2011
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One can discuss those points sure, but they are a means to an end.......it's all about results. Next year there better be much better results.
I think that's reasonable. I have actually been critical that Chevy wasn't more focused on the draft and develop approach, especially earlier. He should have traded players like Hainsey and maybe Frolik to get more futures, instead of losing them in free agency. But I think he recovered reasonably well by trading some of the core players (Kane, Bogo and Ladd) for packages that not only included picks, but also good prospects at varying stages of development (Armia, Dano, Lemieux). That actually helped to accelerate the process. Still, even if the Jets had traded for more later round picks, they would still be very much in the development stages at this point.
One disputable strategy has been keeping around lower-quality vets like Thorbs and Stuart to create a team "structure" for the younger players. I am not sure that's necessary, and it has led to some unnecessarily poor performances. However, I do think that there is some value in retaining a good core of vets with the right attitude about the team and Winnipeg to help mentor some of the younger players. I just don't know that there's evidence for that being a useful approach.
My point about the timeline is that beginning with a team that had zero prospects, you are basically starting from scratch, and it takes several years for even the first fruits of your drafting to make a mark (like Scheifele and Lowry and Armia are doing this season, all having been drafted in 2011). I'm not sure how you speed up that process, unless you trade good vets for better prospects. Those are hard trades to make in the NHL these days. But maybe trading Ladd and Kane and Bogo a bit earlier would have been a good idea. I expect that they hoped Bogo would become a stud (and not become a bit of a complicated situation), and that Kane would become a bona fide top forward and gel with the market. They were obviously wrong in that assessment.
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