I'll Gladly Pay You Tuesday for a CBA Today (CBA & Lockout Discussion) - Part X
- Thread starter mouser
- Start date
- Status
Here's my prediction for the PA's offer tomorrow:
- Player share frozen at 1.87B for 2 years (but cannot go below 52%)
- Year 3+ split is 52%
- 6 year deal with PA option for 7th year
- RS at 300m
- All contract limits, etc are the same as previous CBA
Scottkmlps
Registered User
mossey3535
Registered User
- Feb 7, 2011
- 13,420
- 9,955
WayneSid9987
Registered User
- Nov 24, 2009
- 30,054
- 5,676
Carrying over from the last thread:
Originally Posted by Phil Parent View Post
Per Ron Fournier on 98,5FM in Montreal who takes the info from Martin Maguire who is covering the PA meeting...
- Counter-offer tomorrow is official.
- Thought to be 52-48, 51-49, 50-50, 50-50, 50-50, 50-50
- Players reject the "Make Whole" thing, want full contract value paid.
- Players want HRR as it was in last CBA
I don't know who any of those guys are but i hope this proposal is somewhat accurate.
Originally Posted by Phil Parent View Post
Per Ron Fournier on 98,5FM in Montreal who takes the info from Martin Maguire who is covering the PA meeting...
- Counter-offer tomorrow is official.
- Thought to be 52-48, 51-49, 50-50, 50-50, 50-50, 50-50
- Players reject the "Make Whole" thing, want full contract value paid.
- Players want HRR as it was in last CBA
I don't know who any of those guys are but i hope this proposal is somewhat accurate.
Digger12
Gold Fever
I expect a few more things adjusted like the ELC length in relation to the right to use an arbitrator. But still, if true it seems they will solve this pretty soon. Bettman and the owners already came a long way from their first unreal proposal.
Honestly I doubt it... it doesn't really address their demand of honoring existing contracts.
if this is true, it's an okay offer, but the NHL wont be super happy with it. definitely needs to be a little more towards the NHL's.
Why does the current players care about what the percentage is in future years? How many of them even have contracts that go that far and/or won't be replaced by current junior players?
If revenues go up to.3.8 billion, then they'll make what they made last season. That number is like two or three years from now. With expansion it could happen way sooner....
If revenues go up to.3.8 billion, then they'll make what they made last season. That number is like two or three years from now. With expansion it could happen way sooner....
Crease
Chief Justice of the HFNYR Court
- Jul 12, 2004
- 24,106
- 25,573
Phil Parent said:
I don't understand this.
The Make Whole provision guarantees the full contract is paid. Whatever the players pay back through escrow to get from 57% to 50% in Year 1 and Year 2 gets paid back to the players in full over the course of their existing contract or future contract.
If they want full contract value paid in Year 1, then how do they get from 57% to 52% in Year 1 of their proposal tomorrow?
mossey3535
Registered User
- Feb 7, 2011
- 13,420
- 9,955
It's pretty obvious they want grandfathering, the 'Make Whole' provision takes out of future player's shares.
I bet we will end up with one amnesty contract per team, since the NHL so fond of parroting the NBA.
I agree, its not how the proposal will be. What you hear over and over is they want their money so i highly doubt they start with a 52 split in yr 1. They would be immediately be taking a pay cut.
Take it for what it's Worth but bill waters was just on Vancouver radio saying that owners called Bettman after their last proposal ( not the 50-50) and told him to not go any further. He thinks the season is gone and that fehrs priority is himself first and the players second. Says fehr doesn't care about the game and will shut down the season for his own ego.
Yes bill waters is a Bettman guy but his pessimism and disdain for fehr was crazy.
Yes bill waters is a Bettman guy but his pessimism and disdain for fehr was crazy.
CBJWerenski8
Formerly CBJWennberg10 (RIP Kivi)
- Jun 13, 2009
- 42,356
- 24,276
If this is the true proposal, I think the NHL will work with the sharing and HRR. Make Whole thing they may have to further negotiate
trueblue9441
Registered User
rough math puts cap in this proposal by nhlpa at 65.6 million. theyll probably want a cap on escrow as well, but getting their full contract is within reach this year if this deal was to be signed
mouser
Business of Hockey
Grandfathering would have to either take out of future player shares also, or else delink at least some player compensation from HRR, meaning it wouldn't really be 52% next year or any of the yearly % figures cited.
could be more rhetoric, who knows. I think everyone can see it can go either way easily. Have a season or lose the season.
T-Funk
Registered User
- Oct 15, 2006
- 14,659
- 5,204
So the owners told Bettman not to go any further....and then he went further? Sounds made up, no?
It's possible that they're factoring in a percentage based on projected number. Though I doubt they would apply projected numbers to their side of the equation when it affects their money. I don't think the PA puts those numbers down either just because they want guarantees with the money on their end. I can only hope that the PA's offer (or eventual offer) is salary freeze until a 50/50 split can happen.
If their counter is structured anything like what has been posted, then I think that's great news and great traction for ongoing negotiations. I think the structure of the PA's next offer will probably be more important than the actual content. If the PA can get on the page of linkage, I think everything else is basically hammering down numbers.
The rumour only relates to money though...I hope the PA doesn't forget to include the other issues as well. Fehr's email said that the players should seek to retain the contractual rights from the last CBA at the very least. Either the PA will ask for more than what they had last time and eventually settle on keeping things as they were in the last CBA or they will ask for those issues to remain the same as the past CBA.
Some really interesting comments in this article.
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=407606&utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitterfeed
Shane hnidy
"Now that I am out of the game, I would gladly go back and play the 2004-05 season for 24 per cent of my salary," explained Hnidy. "When you're playing you think you will play forever. From the players I have talked to around the league, it seems about 26 years of age and under are willing to wait it out, 26 and over want to get a deal done by negotiating off the NHL offer. It seems some players feel playing an 82-game season is the one non-negotiable item in the proposal. Get the best deal you can in the next week and accept that any way you cut it, you will be giving something back. There are players wondering why they did not put forth a proposal forcing the NHL to negotiate off their offer."
Also on H and L was Jets captain Andrew Ladd. And credit Ladd for coming on at a time when fans are very critical of players. The only numbers fans care about are 50/50, and 82 games. "It's easy to get excited from a fans' standpoint. But the offer affects us in a negative way," said Ladd. "Things we got in the last negotiation, the owners want back. There is lots of talk among the guys I skated with today. Fans who call us greedy are entitled to their opinion, but they should look at the details of what is in the proposal and how we get to 50/50 – by giving up 12.3 per cent. We gave enough of a rollback last time. We all hope whatever the agreement is, it will be long term and we will not have to go through these issues going forward."
Ladd didn't feel the age of players changes the player's stance, referring to veteran Adrian Aucoin who feels that the older players battled for them in the last negotiation and they will battle for younger players in this one. Ladd feels the NHLPA counter offer will work off both the NHL offer and some of the ideas the players feel can help going forward. "Question is how will the owners react to that? Will they negotiate or is it a take it or leave it offer?"
Ladd wasn't sure if the players were close to a proposal of their own prior to Monday. Ideas were being thrown around but nothing concrete. Around the NHL that was the topic that seemed to bring different answers. From what Ladd had to say to others the feeling is the NHLPA did have an offer ready to be presented.
Asked for a message to fans, Ladd responded with "it's a negotiation. There will be ups and downs. Stay patient."
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=407606&utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitterfeed
Shane hnidy
"Now that I am out of the game, I would gladly go back and play the 2004-05 season for 24 per cent of my salary," explained Hnidy. "When you're playing you think you will play forever. From the players I have talked to around the league, it seems about 26 years of age and under are willing to wait it out, 26 and over want to get a deal done by negotiating off the NHL offer. It seems some players feel playing an 82-game season is the one non-negotiable item in the proposal. Get the best deal you can in the next week and accept that any way you cut it, you will be giving something back. There are players wondering why they did not put forth a proposal forcing the NHL to negotiate off their offer."
Also on H and L was Jets captain Andrew Ladd. And credit Ladd for coming on at a time when fans are very critical of players. The only numbers fans care about are 50/50, and 82 games. "It's easy to get excited from a fans' standpoint. But the offer affects us in a negative way," said Ladd. "Things we got in the last negotiation, the owners want back. There is lots of talk among the guys I skated with today. Fans who call us greedy are entitled to their opinion, but they should look at the details of what is in the proposal and how we get to 50/50 – by giving up 12.3 per cent. We gave enough of a rollback last time. We all hope whatever the agreement is, it will be long term and we will not have to go through these issues going forward."
Ladd didn't feel the age of players changes the player's stance, referring to veteran Adrian Aucoin who feels that the older players battled for them in the last negotiation and they will battle for younger players in this one. Ladd feels the NHLPA counter offer will work off both the NHL offer and some of the ideas the players feel can help going forward. "Question is how will the owners react to that? Will they negotiate or is it a take it or leave it offer?"
Ladd wasn't sure if the players were close to a proposal of their own prior to Monday. Ideas were being thrown around but nothing concrete. Around the NHL that was the topic that seemed to bring different answers. From what Ladd had to say to others the feeling is the NHLPA did have an offer ready to be presented.
Asked for a message to fans, Ladd responded with "it's a negotiation. There will be ups and downs. Stay patient."
If the NHLPA wanted full dollar value of all of their contracts then why did they invoke their 5% kicker of the cap EVERY year? Keeping the cap lower keeps escrow lower and therefore makes it more likely for each player to realize his full contract value.
A reduction in HRR% is almost assuredly going to decrease a player's contract unless the PA accepts the owners "make whole" proposal. If the counter proposal rumor is true (without some guarantee for existing contracts) then the players have just shown that all the whining about respecting current contracts was baloney.
A reduction in HRR% is almost assuredly going to decrease a player's contract unless the PA accepts the owners "make whole" proposal. If the counter proposal rumor is true (without some guarantee for existing contracts) then the players have just shown that all the whining about respecting current contracts was baloney.
- Status
