I think ideally Connor would be kept as part of the rebuild or if he was moved it would be for a deal built around a high potential young C, however there is a lot of value there. If things go poorly and Connor isn't interested in sticking through a rebuild I'd consider it as a Jets fan.
Proposal: If Winnipeg gets off to a bad start - Connor to NJ
- Thread starter Stephen Gionta
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EastVillageBlues
Registered User
- Feb 18, 2019
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Eggtimer
Registered User
Nope . Did Eichel ? Nope . So Eichel has the least value in the entire league because you think he broke his neck ?
Your missing the point . The offer from the Devils has more value than what Connor is worth . By a mile . Make me one trade in the past 10 years that had more value on one side of the trade than what this Devils package is .
Any no theses pieces are not disposable . It more to do with the Devils having a top three in the league prospect pool where we can afford to give up prime assets and still have a ton left .
Addressing the part where some say that other teams would beat this offer …. Ya no way in hell . They COULD technically but no way in hell they wood consider it as the Devils offer us already a massive over-pay .
Ya no .
No GM would offer more . If so , that GM would be fired . That is if he could make that substantial of an offer without having other people in management or ownership stopping him before he made an idiotic move
Dickie Dunn
Registered User
First thing that came to mind when I read the proposal is that it's very rare to see that many assets traded away in one deal for one player. Might be right on but it looks like a lot for NJ to move.
Stephen Gionta
Boston College > Boston University
Piggybacking off my earlier post - Let's take a look at the key players the elite teams of the past decade have gotten with their high draft picks as a result of being in the NHL basement.
This is why it's not smart for Winnipeg to hold on to Ehlers and Connor if they do go into a rebuild. You need top 5 picks to win Stanley Cups.
Look at all elite teams over the past decade:
Pittsburgh: NHL basement from 2002-2006 - Sidney Crosby, Evgeni Malkin, Marc-Andre Fleury, Jordan Staal, Ryan Whitney (netted Kunitz)
Chicago: NHL basement from 2004-2008 - Patrick Kane, Jonathan Toews
Washington: NHL basement from 2004-2007 - Alexander Ovechkin, Nicklas Backstrom
LA Kings: NHL basement from 2006-2009 - Anze Kopitar, Drew Doughty, Brayden Schenn (netted Mike Richards)
Tampa Bay: NHL basement from 2008-2010 - Steven Stamkos, Victor Hedman
Colorado: NHL basement from 2009-2017 - Nathan Mackinnon, Gabriel Landeskog, Mikko Rantanen, Cale Makar, Matt Duchene (netted Girard AND Byram)
This is why it's not smart for Winnipeg to hold on to Ehlers and Connor if they do go into a rebuild. You need top 5 picks to win Stanley Cups.
Look at all elite teams over the past decade:
Pittsburgh: NHL basement from 2002-2006 - Sidney Crosby, Evgeni Malkin, Marc-Andre Fleury, Jordan Staal, Ryan Whitney (netted Kunitz)
Chicago: NHL basement from 2004-2008 - Patrick Kane, Jonathan Toews
Washington: NHL basement from 2004-2007 - Alexander Ovechkin, Nicklas Backstrom
LA Kings: NHL basement from 2006-2009 - Anze Kopitar, Drew Doughty, Brayden Schenn (netted Mike Richards)
Tampa Bay: NHL basement from 2008-2010 - Steven Stamkos, Victor Hedman
Colorado: NHL basement from 2009-2017 - Nathan Mackinnon, Gabriel Landeskog, Mikko Rantanen, Cale Makar, Matt Duchene (netted Girard AND Byram)
Not commenting on the trade proposal. But the comparison of Connor to Eichel’s return.
A little context is needed.
Connor has been healthy for most of his tenure in the NHL
Eichel was injured and waiting to get an experimental surgery to repair it. Although the prognoses was good there was still an element of risk to Vegas in acquiring him
Both are 25 but Connor’s contract is FAR more attractive. 4x$7.1m vs 4x$10m
Winnipeg really has no incentive to move him. In fact he’s probably on their list of untouchables
Buffalo HAD to move Eichel. No matter what he was never going to don the Sabres jersey again
Connor is coming off a 47 goal campaign. Eichel was coming off an injury plagued season and waiting for treatment
They have similar ppg stats.
Taken all together it’s pretty clear that IF Winnipeg was so inclined to shop him (and you can’t convince me that they would. The quality of the return could/would eclipse what Eichel returned
A little context is needed.
Connor has been healthy for most of his tenure in the NHL
Eichel was injured and waiting to get an experimental surgery to repair it. Although the prognoses was good there was still an element of risk to Vegas in acquiring him
Both are 25 but Connor’s contract is FAR more attractive. 4x$7.1m vs 4x$10m
Winnipeg really has no incentive to move him. In fact he’s probably on their list of untouchables
Buffalo HAD to move Eichel. No matter what he was never going to don the Sabres jersey again
Connor is coming off a 47 goal campaign. Eichel was coming off an injury plagued season and waiting for treatment
They have similar ppg stats.
Taken all together it’s pretty clear that IF Winnipeg was so inclined to shop him (and you can’t convince me that they would. The quality of the return could/would eclipse what Eichel returned
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HugeInTheShire
You may not like me but, I'm Huge in the Shire
This isn't the deal for Connor at all, if the Devils want him they'd have to offer up Bratt + to get him unless the Jets are going full rebuild, then I'd assume they'd want the best possible prospect for him like Dawson Mercer, Luke Hughes or Simon Nemec and I can't see the Devils wanting to part with any of those guys right now.
Stephen Gionta
Boston College > Boston University
Agree with this entirely^
Those posting "This is more than the Eichel return!" ...... It should be. It should be significantly more than the Eichel return.
I would give up Mercer for Connor, but that would mean I'm not including the 2023 1st, or Muhkamadullin, or even Severson.
If WPG insisted on Mercer, I'd be willing to give up Mercer + Holtz + Walsh/Foote. Not much more than that if Mercer is going the other way
I think the deal would be smaller and have one A+ piece in it. Like Nemec.
This deal needs a base and Holtz isn’t good enough to be that base.
So make it Nemec and remove Holtz. Can pull out the other young defender you added from Jersey. Replace with a roster forward.
This deal needs a base and Holtz isn’t good enough to be that base.
So make it Nemec and remove Holtz. Can pull out the other young defender you added from Jersey. Replace with a roster forward.
HugeInTheShire
You may not like me but, I'm Huge in the Shire
I feel like WPG wouldn't be looking to go full scorched earth in their rebuild, they'd like want picks and prospects for their lesser pieces and NHL level players for Connor, not picks and not project prospects like Muk as the main piece.
You'd be looking at Connor for Bratt plus a lesser prospect like Muk or the 1st unprotected.
Players like Severson, Holtz or Foote don't really move the needle for what the Jets would be looking for in that instance.
FerrisRox
"Wanna go, Prettyboy?"
Eichel had a $10 million cap hit and serious injury concerns that could have been career threatening. There's an enormous difference.
FerrisRox
"Wanna go, Prettyboy?"
Why are you talking about the least value in the entire league? What the hell does that even mean?
Winnipeg would be extremely foolish to trade Kyle Connor, especially for that package. Chevy would be fired within a minute of announcing the trade. Really over valuing Severson here. He may fetch a 1st since Chiarot did, but that's about it.
Connor is a legitimate top line winger with term on his deal. 7.1M x 4 years for a PPG + player with potential to hit 50 goals next year, you're not getting him for that package, not even close. If Winnipeg is not in a playoff spot they will sell guys like Scheifele/Wheeler, not Kyle Connor, that's who they should build around.
Connor is a legitimate top line winger with term on his deal. 7.1M x 4 years for a PPG + player with potential to hit 50 goals next year, you're not getting him for that package, not even close. If Winnipeg is not in a playoff spot they will sell guys like Scheifele/Wheeler, not Kyle Connor, that's who they should build around.
The offer isn't insulting by any means, but Connor is way down the list of players to be moved if we decide to tear it down.
Not a bad offer…also not enough to make the Jets say yes and if you are fishing for KC, the offer has to absolutely be impossible to turn down. The Jets have no issues turning down this offer even if they get off to a slow start. It is impossible to trade every player 25 and older in on swoop and rebuild around a entirely different core. The Jets younger core is probably not even worth “rebuilding around” at this point. Perfetti maybe…Heinola, Lucius, etc? Most of those guys probably aren’t even going to core pieces. To sacrifice KC who is an ancient 25 and locked into a good long-term deal just because of a slow start is ridiculous planning.
It is far, far more likely that a slow start = a re-tool with KC at the center of the new paradigm, not pushed out of it.
You have SIX line items listed on your proposal for ONE KC. Again, I think there are some nice pieces but if you can’t make the Jets say “yes” with 2-3 max line items/assets then the core of the deal is not good enough.
It is far, far more likely that a slow start = a re-tool with KC at the center of the new paradigm, not pushed out of it.
You have SIX line items listed on your proposal for ONE KC. Again, I think there are some nice pieces but if you can’t make the Jets say “yes” with 2-3 max line items/assets then the core of the deal is not good enough.
Their window closed and they should go for a rebuild. But we all know they won't. This is a good deal for them too.
Nickel eye Heel hers
Happy thoughts
In a rebuild, you would try to keep the essential core or nucleus of the team. Any player with top 6 talent with multiple years of a team friendly contract would be the last to go.
As others have stated, Scheifele , Wheeler, Dubois, and others would be the first to go, among others before KFC.
I would think the only way the Jets organization considers trading a piece like Kyle Connor or someone like Ehlers would be for a much bigger piece that the Jets would add on to.
The Jets don't have a strong enough fan base that will support bottom 10 hockey for 5 plus years.
As others have stated, Scheifele , Wheeler, Dubois, and others would be the first to go, among others before KFC.
I would think the only way the Jets organization considers trading a piece like Kyle Connor or someone like Ehlers would be for a much bigger piece that the Jets would add on to.
The Jets don't have a strong enough fan base that will support bottom 10 hockey for 5 plus years.
tbcwpg
Moderator
- Jan 25, 2011
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Winnipeg can't really afford to go full rebuild. The markets that players don't really want to play in usually have very long rebuild periods, because they can't supplement their roster of younger players with solid players in UFA or players with NTCs that might be available from other teams. If Winnipeg does go full on tank mode, they'd have to really hope that all those players hit at the same time, or really hope that they can pry the missing players from teams that are both willing to move younger players and need what Winnipeg has to offer.
The difference between those markets you listed and Winnipeg, is that they have either a strong history and a big market (Chicago), drafted a generational talent AND added other elite players with him (Pittsburgh and Washington), or are desirable markets to play (LA and Tampa). Colorado, while I love Denver, is not an A-tier destination in the NHL but drafted cornerstones like MacKinnon and Landeskog early on and then convinced them to stick around through a rebuild - we've seen recently with Trouba and Dubois that Winnipeg has trouble even with that.
The Jets can't afford to move Connor and Ehlers, they need to try to turn these older guys on short deals into immediate impactful assets.
Drew311
Makes The Pass
- Oct 29, 2010
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Are you kidding? That offer is the equivalent of four 1st round picks, one 2nd and an established top 4 defenseman. Jets take that in a heartbeat of looking to rebuild/retool.
strattonius
Registered User
Tasteless Beaver
Here for the hot takes
Yeah we don't want to do this trade. It's not a value thing, we just like to hold onto our star players that actually want to be in Winnipeg and bring good value. Same goes for Hellebuyck. If Scheifele and PLD want out, fine, we'll take what we can get and rebuild around Connor, Ehlers, Perfetti, and whoever else is still around. We still have a young team, we're not worried just yet.
LMAO, are you really comparing Connor to a guy who was looking for a never tried before surgery on his neck? Keep trying.
Eggtimer
Registered User
I wasn’t comparing the players directly . I was saying that the biggest name played to be traded in a long time brought back a way lesser return than what was offered for Connor . Yes a in it might have move value to some but I’d still it’s close . Eichel plays the more important position and he did show he can be an elite player .
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