If the Top 100 players All-time list is redone today, where does McDavid's career place him?

[buffalowing88]

He's barely in the top ten of the all-time Edmonton Oilers, right now.

He's not ahead of Kevin Lowe or Glenn Anderson or Messier, who have six Cups, or Esa Tikkanen, who has five. Gretzky, Fuhr, Kurri, Coffey, Chris Pronger, and Adam Oates are also ahead, due to their overall careers and individual accomplishments. All of these guys (except for Esa) are in the Hall of Fame.

Right now I'd say he's about top 30 all-time, if his career were to end today. There are too many great players ahead of him but he's already a future Hall-of-Famer with his two Harts (only 19 people have as many or more) and three Art Rosses (only 8 players have as many or more) but his story hasn't yet been written enough to determine his final standing as of yet.

That's wild. And dumb.

 

[VanIslander]

Any Oilers fan who was in at least diapers then (Gawd were you alive in 1991!) would choose Tikkanen.

 

[Albatros]

Tikkanen at times carried his team to playoff success, McDavid has so far only carried his own regular season stats. I don't see anything "top 100" worthy in McDavid's career.

 

[JackSlater]

I find that to be a telling statement.

Yes, that was the one part that was actually fairly important to me. I would put McDavid higher than most would.

 

[wetcoast]

Any Oilers fan who was in at least diapers then (Gawd were you alive in 1991!) would choose Tikkanen.

Tikkanen had an important role on those Oiler teams and I love what he brought to the table but seriously Oiler fans, nor most fans anywhere are going to rate Esa better than McDavid by any important all time metric so far in their careers.

 

[VanIslander]

If you wanna talk regular season against the Panthers, Coyotes and the Wild. Ugh.

In contrast, Tikki is/was a playoff warrior. When the rubber hit the road, he tore it up!

 

[wetcoast]

If you wanna talk regular season against the Panthers, Coyotes and the Wild. Ugh.

In contrast, Tikki is/was a playoff warrior. When the rubber hit the road, he tore it up!

McDavid has a 21-11-11-22 line in the playoffs so I think his regular season resume more than makes up the difference with Esa who played with a half dozen HHOFers in the playoffs were he tore it up.

Only Leon is realistically tracking for the HHOF from Connors team.

Look I love Esa but really he isn't even close to McDavid even if Connor never played another NHL game in his life.

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

Oates over mcdavid? Come on boys....

 

[VanIslander]

Look I love Esa but really he isn't even close to McDavid even if Connor never played another NHL game in his life.

B.S.

Not even close? Based on career to date?

Which career do you draft?

4-time Selke finalist, 5-time Stanley Cup winner with 130+ playoff points and ****ing up the opposition on most shifts.

I would go to war with Tikkanen (the heart of a Dale Hunter, Claude Lemieux). There are few in the game today like him (Marchand).

Or...


less than 6 full seasons, only 22 career playoff points and one (1) playoff series win.

Would you seriously take the career to date of a regular season scorer over a two-way playoff monster with four times the career?

 

[Czech Your Math]

Some really widely divergent opinions in here. I like a lot of the answers here. A hybrid of Lindros, Forsberg, Malkin, Apps, Dionne sounds about right. But where to rank him based on that? I think about 70th...?

With the uncertainty surrounding his playoffs, I was thinking the middle or above of this group: Lindros, Selanne, Thornton & Dionne... so 63, 69, 91 & 96... and I'd have most modern players higher than the HoH list... so instead of 60-80, probably more like 50-60. That might be a bit high if he retired tomorrow, more like if he was ~top 10 scorer for a few years, then declined... and was decent in playoffs, but not at all outstanding.

 

[wetcoast]

B.S.

Not even close? Based on career to date?

Which career do you draft?

4-time Selke finalist, 5-time Stanley Cup winner with 130+ playoff points and ****ing up the opposition on most shifts.

I would go to war with Tikkanen (the heart of a Dale Hunter, Claude Lemieux). There are few in the game today like him (Marchand).

Or...


less than 6 full seasons, only 22 career playoff points and one (1) playoff series win.

Would you seriously take the career to date of a regular season scorer over a two-way playoff monster with four times the career?

In a word yes and let's not pretend that Esa was always a playoff monster here and didn't have way better support.

Maybe you can watch McDavid to see how he actually drove possession at an elite level last year and is this years playoffs, he just didn't get puck luck or team support.

He was involved in scoring 4 of 8 Oiler goals this year and 9 of 15 the year before I wonder what the highest % of Esa's career is?

Perhaps 90-91 when he was in on 20 of the 57 Oiler goals?

 

[Albatros]

In a word yes and let's not pretend that Esa was always a playoff monster here and didn't have way better support.

Maybe you can watch McDavid to see how he actually drove possession at an elite level last year and is this years playoffs, he just didn't get puck luck or team support.

He was involved in scoring 4 of 8 Oiler goals this year and 9 of 15 the year before I wonder what the highest % of Esa's career is?

Perhaps 90-91 when he was in on 20 of the 57 Oiler goals?

Tikkanen had as many points (a hat-trick and an assist) alone in game seven against Calgary that year as McDavid had in all of playoffs this year (a goal and three assists).

This while being elite defensively whereas McDavid is... not.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

B.S.

Not even close? Based on career to date?

Which career do you draft?

4-time Selke finalist, 5-time Stanley Cup winner with 130+ playoff points and ****ing up the opposition on most shifts.

I would go to war with Tikkanen (the heart of a Dale Hunter, Claude Lemieux). There are few in the game today like him (Marchand).

Or...


less than 6 full seasons, only 22 career playoff points and one (1) playoff series win.

Would you seriously take the career to date of a regular season scorer over a two-way playoff monster with four times the career?

How do you draft a career?

Marchand is twice the player Tikkanen was.

If Edmonton doesn't draft Tikkanen (in the 4th round) and the LA Kings do, how memorable is his career?

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Tikkanen had as many points (a hat-trick and an assist) alone in game seven against Calgary that year as McDavid had in all of playoffs this year (a goal and three assists).

This while being elite defensively whereas McDavid is... not.

Tikkanen's five Cup winning seasons:

1985 - played 3 games, no points, -1

1987 - 21 games, 9 points, +1, tied for 8th in scoring for the Oilers with Randy Gregg, just behind Craig McTavish

1988 - 19 games, 27 points, +3, 4th in scoring and 10th in +/- for the Oilers

1990 - 22 games, 24 points, +12, 4th in scoring and 4th in +/- for the Oilers

1994 - 23 games, 8 points, +1, 9th in scoring and 12th in +/- for the Rangers

What was of more importance, Tikkanen to his teams or his teams to Tikkanen?

 

[Bear of Bad News]

Which career do you draft?

I would take McDavid, and it wouldn't take me very long to reach my conclusion.

 

[Michael Farkas]

Just a second, is the discussion McDavid vs Esa Tikkanen...? B-but...why?

 

[Bear of Bad News]

Because playoff warrior, or something.

 

[VanIslander]

The absurd claim was that McDavid's career to date trumps Tikkanen's career and it supposedly isn't even close.

If McDavid had a career-ending injury, no way 50 years from now would his career be seen as better. If you could draft a Tikki to do what he did in his long career or a McDavid but only for a short career, it is silly to choose the career of the latter over the former.

 

[Michael Farkas]

I know points aren't everything...Tikkanen brought a different element to the game than McDavid ever did, does, or will...but, without looking, does McDavid already have more career points than Tikkanen in, what I assume to be, less than half of the career games...?

In 30 years, we'll have to struggle to conjure up the name Esa Tikkanen, like we do now for Eddie Shack but without the rhyming jingle...

If McDavid doesn't play another game, we'll have no trouble knowing who that is for at least 50 years...

 

[JackSlater]

Call me crazy but I would take McDavid the player over Tikkanen the player and I would take McDavid's career over Tikkanen's career. Bold I know, and that's with the knowledge that Tikkanen was featured on Trailer Park Boys while McDavid's media presence is sorely lacking.

 

[jigglysquishy]

McDavid is easily the best player born in 1997. Should be fairly uncontroversial to say he's the best hockey player born after 1987. The only person with an arguably better career than him born after 1987 is Patrick Kane, and that's only if you value prime and playoffs over repeated MVPs. If Connor Bedard ends up being better, then McDavid will be the best player born between 1987 and 2005.

Tikkanen is not even a top five player born in 1965 (Lemieux, Hasek, Roy, Yzerman). Cam Neely and Pat LaFontaine would also be ahead in most lists.

There's really no comparison. One was known as the best hockey player in the world for several years, won two Harts and three Pearsons. The other never received a single Hart vote and had one year as a third team LW AS.

 

[Plural]

Tikkanen's five Cup winning seasons:

1985 - played 3 games, no points, -1

1987 - 21 games, 9 points, +1, tied for 8th in scoring for the Oilers with Randy Gregg, just behind Craig McTavish

1988 - 19 games, 27 points, +3, 4th in scoring and 10th in +/- for the Oilers

1990 - 22 games, 24 points, +12, 4th in scoring and 4th in +/- for the Oilers

1994 - 23 games, 8 points, +1, 9th in scoring and 12th in +/- for the Rangers

What was of more importance, Tikkanen to his teams or his teams to Tikkanen?

I don't think this needs a disservice of Tikkanen. Esa was absolutely dynamite to those teams. However, Tikkanen is a complimentary player. At his best, he was a world class complimentary player. But he was just that. McDavid is a core piece and most likely the best core piece of his generation. These two do not warrant a comparison.

 

[ted2019]

The absurd claim was that McDavid's career to date trumps Tikkanen's career and it supposedly isn't even close.

If McDavid had a career-ending injury, no way 50 years from now would his career be seen as better. If you could draft a Tikki to do what he did in his long career or a McDavid but only for a short career, it is silly to choose the career of the latter over the former.

McDavid is already closing in on becoming a HOF'er, while Tikkanen is known for being a very good pest and 2 way forward with a few high Selke nominations.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

Tikkanen's five Cup winning seasons:

1985 - played 3 games, no points, -1

1987 - 21 games, 9 points, +1, tied for 8th in scoring for the Oilers with Randy Gregg, just behind Craig McTavish

1988 - 19 games, 27 points, +3, 4th in scoring and 10th in +/- for the Oilers

1990 - 22 games, 24 points, +12, 4th in scoring and 4th in +/- for the Oilers

1994 - 23 games, 8 points, +1, 9th in scoring and 12th in +/- for the Rangers

What was of more importance, Tikkanen to his teams or his teams to Tikkanen?

1990 and '91, tikkanen to his teams. the other years, the other way around.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

i just find the pacing of mcdavid's seasons interesting. what might rookie mcdavid have looked like if healthy? what might 2020 mcdavid have looked like without the COVID shutdown?

year	first half total	first half per game	full year total	full year per game	stretch run total	stretch run per game
2021	48 in 28	1.714	105 in 56	1.875	41 in 17	2.412
2020	63 in 41	1.537	97 in 64	1.516	16 in 9*	1.778
2019	61 in 40	1.525	116 in 78	1.487	29 in 18	1.611
2018	46 in 41	1.122	108 in 82	1.317	37 in 21	1.762
2017	46 in 41	1.122	100 in 82	1.220	31 in 20	1.550
2016	12 in 12**	1.000	48 in 45	1.067	19 in 18***	1.056

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

* technically, there was no stretch run (or he was just starting it) because the regular season abruptly ended 18 games early

** not counting the game he was injured and left early

*** but another way of accounting for those last twenty-odd games of the regular season is those were actually his midseason, because he missed three months. if healthy all year, could he have gone into overdrive and put up video game stats as he was wont to do for basically the entire rest of his career?