How I'd fix this team..

[Chance on Chance]

Good point, just read an article on MLive where Holland agrees with you.

I am down with trading some valuable prospects for a legit D, Id just rather try to find a big scoring winger in free agency. I think Jagr or Setoguchi could be had til Mantha is ready.

What would you give up for big buff?

 

[Frk It]

What would you give up for big buff?

Not sure what it would cost to get it done, but I really like him as a player.

Tatar + Kindl?
Pulkkinen + Kindl + mid-rounder

I'm really bad at guessing trade value.

 

[SoupNazi]

What's the point of selling the farm for a goal scorer with size, when we have Mantha on his way in ~2 years? (<<holland said as much it will be that long)

Top 4 D, a need absolutely.

I think we're fine at forward. Jurco has some physicality with a high ceiling too.

I agree. If he is going to sell kids, I would rather he sells kids for a decent D. I don't want to see him add a roadblock to guys like Mantha, Pulkkinen or Jurco.

 

[Chance on Chance]

Not sure what it would cost to get it done, but I really like him as a player.

Tatar + Kindl?
Pulkkinen + Kindl + mid-rounder

I'm really bad at guessing trade value.

Me too but I kinda had something like that in my mind but switch Pulu to Backman or Marchenko

 

[stillwater]

When's the last time we had someone like Mantha!? He scored 20 more points in 5 less games than Sidney Crosby did in the same league this season.

Wait, what? I must have missed this.

Mantha outscored Crosby? Really?

It's ok to be excited about a prospect ... but, c'mon man, comparing Mantha to Crosby and using false information?

 

[Retire91]

How many of their own high first round picks were on the Bruins team that just dominated the Wings?

I count one... Dougie Hamilton.

The Bruins have managed to become a force via good drafting in the second round and later, trades, and UFA signings.

Phill Kessel was a 5th overall pick. traded for 2 first round picks one turned out to be a 2nd overall and one a 9th overall. Seguin ended up being traded for Erickson. Seguin was key to one of their playoff runs and Hamilton and Erickson are both key to their current. Boston is also one exception to the rule. Look at Chicago, LA, Pittsburg and other cup winners, how many first rounders are key to those runs. High picks aren't the end all be all but they are essential to success. Edmonton being a case study for high picks not being the only thing. But you have to mix it up. You just can't sign undrafted Eurasian players and hit homeruns in the 7th round to the cup anymore. Especially not with a cap when you can only keep a core so long and also need to time runs with key ELC contracts. I'll be happy to eat crow but I am 100% against the wings management the last several seasons and don't mind a downrun for several seasons to get reloaded. Plus if you are looking for Holland to sign the equivilant of the Chara/Thomas singings it doesn't seem to be happening.

 

[Brick Top]

I agree. If he is going to sell kids, I would rather he sells kids for a decent D.

There's gotta be a better way to say that

Selling kids makes me think Kenny drives a windowless van (or an ice cream truck) and loiters outside of grade schools when he's not in his office.

 

[Shaman464]

Plans for next season:

Tank, tank hard, tank fast. Get the first overall and draft McDavid.

2015 team:

Zetterberg-McDavid (ELC)-Mantha (ELC)
Pulkkinen (ELC)-Datsyuk-Nyquist
Tatar-Sheahan (ELC)-Jurco (ELC)
Abdelkader-Helm- Callahan (ELC)

Then I would use the savings that having so many young talented forwards on building the defense.

 

[PureDust]

CAPGEEK.COM ARMCHAIR GM ROSTER
Mine
FORWARDS
Anthony Mantha ($0.894m) / Pavel Datsyuk ($7.500m) / Daniel Alfredsson ($3.500m)
Johan Franzen ($3.955m) / Henrik Zetterberg ($6.083m) / Gustav Nyquist ($0.950m)
Tomas Tatar ($1.715m) / Riley Sheahan ($1.715m) / Tomas Jurco ($0.709m)
Drew Miller ($1.350m) / Darren Helm ($2.125m) / Justin Abdelkader ($1.800m)
Luke Glendening ($0.628m) / Mitchell Callahan ($0.605m)
DEFENSEMEN
Niklas Kronwall ($4.750m) / Brendan Smith ($1.263m)
Danny DeKeyser ($2.374m) / Christian Ehrhoff ($4.000m)
Jonathan Ericsson ($4.250m) / Ryan Sproul ($0.620m)
Brian Lashoff ($0.725m) /
GOALTENDERS
Jimmy Howard ($5.292m)
Petr Mrazek ($0.595m)
BUYOUTS
Carlo Colaiacovo ($0.000m)
Jordin Tootoo ($0.000m)
LTIR
Stephen Weiss ($4.900m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $71,100,000; CAP PAYROLL: $57,397,837; BONUSES: $693,333
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $13,702,163

If able mantha could step in or we could use the extra space on a vanek/moulson or possibly play chance qnd take heatley as a reclamation project but at his age I wouldn't trust him

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

Plans for next season:

Tank, tank hard, tank fast. Get the first overall and draft McDavid.

2015 team:

Zetterberg-McDavid (ELC)-Mantha (ELC)
Pulkkinen (ELC)-Datsyuk-Nyquist
Tatar-Sheahan (ELC)-Jurco (ELC)
Abdelkader-Helm- Callahan (ELC)

Then I would use the savings that having so many young talented forwards on building the defense.

Thank god you don't run the Red Wings.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Plans for next season:

Tank, tank hard, tank fast. Get the first overall and draft McDavid.

2015 team:

Zetterberg-McDavid (ELC)-Mantha (ELC)
Pulkkinen (ELC)-Datsyuk-Nyquist
Tatar-Sheahan (ELC)-Jurco (ELC)
Abdelkader-Helm- Callahan (ELC)

Then I would use the savings that having so many young talented forwards on building the defense.

We could play with an empty net all year and we'd still not have a chance to be as bad as Edmonton and Buffalo.

 

[14ari13]

Game 2... Howard gave up the one terrible goal. Florek's goal was abysmal and shouldn't have happened.

Reilly Smith's goal was simply because the Wings were overwhelmed. The Bruins had a 5 on 3 and were buzzing. Howard made a number of saves on the really dangerous part of the 5 on 3 and Smith only scored because the puck trickled through. That was a good hard-fought playoff goal, not really a softie. Goal #3 was entirely on Brendan Smith. He let Lucic and Iginla swoop in like it was a 2 on 0... and Howard damn near made the save.

Goal 4 was again, hard work by the Bruins and terrible defense by the Wings. Lashoff had his stick up around Chara's waist while he put the puck through Howard from point-blank range. Lashoff plays it right and ties Chara's stick up and there is no goal or it is a slow roll that Howard can pounce on and cover up.

Howard was nowhere near as bad as advertised. He was worse than Rask, but that's because Rask was dynamite. Howard made some gigantic saves in this series that went completely unnoticed to keep games like Game 2 within striking distance for the majority of play. I mean, in Game 3 the Bruins had like 10 scoring chances in the first to Detroit's zero, yet it was, what, 1-0 after one?

The Wings hung Howard and Gustavsson out to dry in this series. The Bruins were entering the Wings zone with impunity and could set up at will. The Wings couldn't enter the Bruins zone to start anything, and when they did, it got blocked on its way to Rask. When they got really good opportunities, they beat Rask... they just got far fewer opportunities like that and when they did get them, they missed the net on about 80% of them.

But no, what set the tone for the series was Detroit's inability to do a damn thing on the PP. I mean, they were playing even to better 5-on-5 and then they'd all of a sudden be unable to do a damn thing on the PP when they had an extra skater.

Did Howard and Gustavsson play well enough to win this series? Obviously not. However, the only game that the Wings were truly out of was Game 3... and that was on the offense for getting ZERO chances in the first period and not really picking it up much even after that.

Howard can and does need to play better, but it's just lazy to point the finger solely at him.

I am not blaming only Howard, but from what I have seen our goaltending has to be addressed. Howard has had some Nice regular seasons, some impressive. I thought he was our MVP and he really carried the team. Then there were playoffs and I was not impressed with his performance. This season I thought Howard would take the next step and play great in the playoffs. It did not happen. Not even that he did not play well in the playoffs, his regular season was very bad too.
You say one goal was soft in game 2. I thought all 4 were soft or softish.
We struggled to score with Howard all season long. The same happened in the playoffs, 2 goals in 3 games. Then Gustavsson takes over and as during the regular season we suddenly can score, 4 goals in 2 games. I thought Babcock made a mistake not holding Gustavsson ready.
Back to game 2. 1 st goal was huge. I think it gave the Bruins a huge advantage. We won game 1 and the Bruins knew if we win again, it might be very difficult. But what happens? Howard gives them the biggest gift, he gives them momentum. I do not think any goal was so soft as that one. That was the worst goal any Wings goalie has given up. It was not a scoring chance, it was not a shot on goal. The Bruins did not even have the puck.
Gustavsson did not grab his chance either.
Mrazek had great numbers, but is he ready?
Did the team give up on Howard?
What happens next season, who Are our goalies and what if they play as bad as this season?

Look at the Bolts. They were easily beaten cause they did not have Bishop. You do not have to have the best goalie, but you need solid and consistant goaltending if you Are going to have a chance at going all the way.
Sure there were teams winning with weak goaltending. But with our best, core players Datsyuk and Z being 36 and 34 and if we Are building around them and will try to win next 2-3 years, we need solid goaltending. The goaltending we got this season won't get us pass round 2 no matter what we do with our defence and offense.

 

[Crymson]

I think there's a chance.

The Wings have a ton of cap space and they could use another guy to carry the goal scoring load as Datsyuk, Zetterberg, and Franzen age. He can be a bridge between the Datsyuk/Zetterberg/Franzen era and the Nyquist/Mantha/Tatar/Jurco/Sheahan/Pulkkinen era.

As I posted earlier, I've also heard that Chris Ilitch wants to add a star player.

I'm just not sure the Wings believe in putting huge money towards wingers.

The Wings' system has always revolved around a strong defense. That hasn't been in the picture the past two seasons, hence the problems.

I see Niskanen being the team's big offseason pickup.

 

[Crymson]

Look at the Bolts. They were easily beaten cause they did not have Bishop. You do not have to have the best goalie, but you need solid and consistant goaltending if you Are going to have a chance at going all the way.

The Bolts lost because they got dramatically outplayed. Howard is not a bad goalie, and your long-term memory with regards to his performance and ability is apparently very bad.

 

[TouringReg]

Howard is at his best when he plays a lot of games in a row. With injuries this year, it didn't feel like he ever got in a groove. In the lockout year, 2013, didn't he play some thing like 20 games in a row down the stretch and with playoffs? Part of the problem with that is, if he doesn't function well unless he's playing 60/year, I don't know how we break Mrzak in. He's too good to just sit on the bench all year.

I think it's at least encouraging this year hearing Holland and Babcock saying we need scoring/size up front and a top four D man. The past few years it seemed like they were just signing whoever was available with no thought of who they were holding back in the pipeline. The one thing I don't care for is the talk of bringing Alfie back. I think with Z, Pavel, Weiss and Helm we have enough question marks about health up front. I'd rather see Jurco up for the full season.

Did Holland say Mantha is two years away still? On a team that desperately needs offense, I was really hoping he would get a fair look.

 

[HockeyGuy1975]

I usually stay away from trade speculations on these boards, but I wondered what others thought about:

TRADE: Howard + Tatar + Kindl + 1st for Yakupov + (insert Oilers trash contract here).

SIGN: Miller

Larionov is Yak's agent and I'm sure he could prep Yak into becoming a Wings-type player. Yak would bring a lot of life into the lineup.

 

[SoupNazi]

I usually stay away from trade speculations on these boards, but I wondered what others thought about:

TRADE: Howard + Tatar + Kindl + 1st for Yakupov + (insert Oilers trash contract here).

SIGN: Miller

Larionov is Yak's agent and I'm sure he could prep Yak into becoming a Wings-type player. Yak would bring a lot of life into the lineup.

I don't think that looks too good from a Wings perspective, personally.

 

[Brick Top]

The Bolts lost because they got dramatically outplayed. Howard is not a bad goalie, and your long-term memory with regards to his performance and ability is apparently very bad.

Howard is certainly not a bad goalie, but he's not a great one either. He's not a problem for this team because you can win a Cup with him in net with sufficient help around him, but he's not an elite goalie who carries a team to a Cup either.

He didn't have the supporting cast to help him out enough, and he's not good enough to steal many games. Improving the D is more important than replacing Howard.

 

[Bench]

Howard is certainly not a bad goalie, but he's not a great one either. He's not a problem for this team because you can win a Cup with him in net with sufficient help around him, but he's not an elite goalie who carries a team to a Cup either.

He didn't have the supporting cast to help him out enough, and he's not good enough to steal many games. Improving the D is more important than replacing Howard.

Who was the last elite goalie to carry a team to the Cup? Quick? Thomas? Both of those teams had defense first systems that also had their backup goalies with great stats.

I think you have to go back to Cam Ward in 2006 for when a goalie really "stole" a Cup for a team.

 

[HockeyGuy1975]

Who was the last elite goalie to carry a team to the Cup? Quick? Thomas? Both of those teams had defense first systems that also had their backup goalies with great stats.

I think you have to go back to Cam Ward in 2006 for when a goalie really "stole" a Cup for a team.

Quick. But your point is well-taken. The thing about Howard is that he gives up those back-breaking goals. Even when he is on top of his game, he sometimes gives up a massively discouraging goal.

 

[Brick Top]

Who was the last elite goalie to carry a team to the Cup? Quick? Thomas? Both of those teams had defense first systems that also had their backup goalies with great stats.

I think you have to go back to Cam Ward in 2006 for when a goalie really "stole" a Cup for a team.

I'll buy Quick and Thomas as being in that category; sure, they had defensive help in front of them but that doesn't take away from their talent levels. And Cam Ward was fantastic that year for the Canes.

Howard is basically Corey Crawford to me. You can win with him because he is talented, but he's not carrying a team to a Cup. I'm fine with him in net (apart from him seemingly being easy to rattle... buzz the crease a few times, piss him off and it tends to put him off his game a little). Oh, and his penchant for giving up soft goals at incredibly inopportune moments... not a big fan of that either.

 

[Bench]

Quick. But your point is well-taken. The thing about Howard is that he gives up those back-breaking goals. Even when he is on top of his game, he sometimes gives up a massively discouraging goal.

LAs team D was pretty ridiculous, though. Quick was great, but he had a lot of help. LA this year, once again, had the lowest GA/G. in the league. Quick's sv % this year was only .915, which ranks him at 23rd.

In 2011-2012, LA was the 2nd best GA/G in the league with 2.07 during the regular season.

As for Carolina, in 2005-2006 they were 20th in the league with 3.15. The bottom 3rd! Then playoffs hit, Ward steps in, and they are the 3rd best in the whole playoffs with 2.40 GA/G.

I just thought that was interesting. I don't think you're wrong.

 

[DatsyukToZetterberg]

First and foremost we have to address our goaltending. What do we do there?
Howard. He is the starter, but he struggled a lot. Had Howard had his usual season, we would have finished 5-15 points higher. He had bad playoffs too. What happens with his game next season?
Gustavsson had a great season. He helped the team makes playoffs. Regardless what some say, he was the best backup goalie in the league. But he could not stay healthy and when given a chance he did not run away with it. He is aggressive and overcommits. None of the goals in game 5 were his fault, but his reaction was not the best one. Goal 1, not his fault, broken play, but he overcommits. I don't blame him. Goal 2, a perfect shot, but some goalie stop it. I do not blame him. But goal 3 is very stoppable. Lucic is in too tight to Gustavsson and if Gustavsson goes down he stops it. The exactly same save Rask made on Alfredsson earlier in the game. I guess the brass wanted a look at him, but I do not think he convinced them.

No, Gus was not the best backup goalie in the league. I wouldn't even say he was in the top 5 of backup goalies this season. Brian Elliott, Frederik Andersen, Al Montoya, Chad Johnson, Cam Talbot, Justin Peters, Martin Jones, and Alex Stalock all had better seasons than Gus. There were also a number of backups that had equal or worse seasons so I think it'd be fair to say that he was average or below average for this season.

Luckily Howard has a track record of success, something that Gus can only dream of, and if he does falter again next season we have a better goalie in the AHL that can carry us if there is a need.

Anyways if we're going to discuss goaltenders again this offseason I think people should read over these blog posts.

 

[14ari13]

The Bolts lost because they got dramatically outplayed. Howard is not a bad goalie, and your long-term memory with regards to his performance and ability is apparently very bad.

You should read my post again. I obviouslyb stated Howard had seem great seasons behind him. Do I have to writevit 5 times for you to understand it? Howard had some seasons or very long parts of the seasons where he was as good and important if not better than Datsyuk, Z and Lidstrom. But he has never had very good playoffs performance. I thought he would make the next step, but after this season and the playoffs I strongly doubt it.

Howard is certainly not a bad goalie, but he's not a great one either. He's not a problem for this team because you can win a Cup with him in net with sufficient help around him, but he's not an elite goalie who carries a team to a Cup either.

He didn't have the supporting cast to help him out enough, and he's not good enough to steal many games. Improving the D is more important than replacing Howard.

I started strongly doubting this season we can go deep in the playoffs with Howard in net.

No, Gus was not the best backup goalie in the league. I wouldn't even say he was in the top 5 of backup goalies this season. Brian Elliott, Frederik Andersen, Al Montoya, Chad Johnson, Cam Talbot, Justin Peters, Martin Jones, and Alex Stalock all had better seasons than Gus. There were also a number of backups that had equal or worse seasons so I think it'd be fair to say that he was average or below average for this season.

Luckily Howard has a track record of success, something that Gus can only dream of, and if he does falter again next season we have a better goalie in the AHL that can carry us if there is a need.

Anyways if we're going to discuss goaltenders again this offseason I think people should read over these blog posts.

Gustavsson was the best backup in the league IMO.
Howard has had the record of success, but the question is what happens from now on. Can he go back to his strong game or will he play even worse than this season? I hope he can find his game back, but what if he does not?
And that is what I want to address. Many posters say we have to get a top 4 Dman and a scoring winger. But what does it help if Howard plays the same or worse? Do we advancie to round 2? Do we make playoffs? Do we go with Gustavsson or do we go with Mrazek?

 

[Frk It]

Howard had a bad year. Howard's not a bad goalie.

Goalie is a streaky position, and even the best ones go through some serious peaks and valleys.

I'm not really worried about Howard at all, I think he will rebound.

I'm a lot more concerned with the team in front of him.
I think the goaltender position is largely overrated anyways, in terms of importance.