GDT: HFBoards GDT | 3/23/19

[canadianmagpie]

Smith wasn't in a position to jump, realistically. Prior to contact, his right skate had come off the ground while he was backhanding the puck. Then the contact happens while his left skate is taking his weight on his left, and people claim that from that position, he managed to jump to the left under his own power. That's not really possible.

Actually it's extremely possible. As you saw in the Avery embellishment, he gets a slight shove from behind, right leg comes up and dives to the ice using just his left leg. Exactly what Smith did.

I will concede it wasn't a dive (as that indicates that there was no contact), but he embellished the hell out of the contact that was there. Look at the replay in real time, Edler is gliding into the boards to get the puck and Smith goes flying. The energy of the contact did not warrant the resulting jump by Smith.

 

[HanSolo]

It's clear as day a goalie being knocked over.

It looked like superman was trying to take flight. Come on man. Yes, contact was made, but not enough to send him flying like that.

 

[Anglesmith]

Dude, you’re the one digging your heels in. . Yes, it was a penalty to elder. . Yes, it was also massive embellishment from smith. . It’s clear as day

Neutral fans agree it was embellishment, as do several flames fans

You’re welcome to your opinion on it, but calling the opposite viewpoint sad when you’re clearly in the minority is comical

I have no issue being in the minority on this one because I think that, by and large, there is a very widespread level of ignorance regarding contact with goalies. Every time a goalie is hit, they get accused of diving. Probably very few exceptions to this. But overwhelmingly, these claims don't actually hold up to scrutiny when you watch the replay. I think it's just the lazy and fun thing for most people. The falls are always theatrical, and everyone loves a good pile-on. Neutral fans and even fans of the goalie's team are no exception, because the hockey community hates diving (thank goodness) and never want to see it.

But I think it is sad that it is something where it's acceptable to just jump to conclusion and not really analyze the play closely to form your own conclusion.

 

[Anglesmith]

It looked like superman was trying to take flight. Come on man. Yes, contact was made, but not enough to send him flying like that.

Just watch Smith's feet, I would say. If you watch his feet and his body, there is no jump, and there isn't really the ability jump. He can't go from spinning one way in a shooting motion to reversing that momentum and jumping the other way simply using one foot with a goalie skate on. Edler provides the force with his right hip and stick. And given that force, and the way goalies are equipped, what happens next is pretty much anything-goes. Calling it embellishment is fashionable, but doesn't really have any basis.

 

[canadianmagpie]

Just watch Smith's feet, I would say. If you watch his feet and his body, there is no jump, and there isn't really the ability jump. He can't go from spinning one way in a shooting motion to reversing that momentum and jumping the other way simply using one foot with a goalie skate on. Edler provides the force with his left hip and stick. And given that force, and the way goalies are equipped, what happens next is pretty much anything-goes. Calling it embellishment is fashionable, but doesn't really have any basis.

55 seconds in, watch the slow-motion replay and you can clearly see that Smith jumps. It's not due to contact from Edler that causes his legs to jump upwards. There is not enough force from Edler to cause Smith to jump the way he did. It's embellishment plain and simple.

The fact that you can't see it's embellishment when pretty much everyone else (including Flames fans) saying so probably says more about you than it does about the rest of us.

 

[Anglesmith]

55 seconds in, watch the slow-motion replay and you can clearly see that Smith jumps. It's not due to contact from Edler that causes his legs to jump upwards. There is not enough force from Edler to cause Smith to jump the way he did. It's embellishment plain and simple.

I don't think any of these statements are in any way supported by the video you're pointing to. In fact, as I have said before, it shows exactly the opposite. The video shows how Smith is not in a position to jump and that the momentum he falls with has to come from Edler.

 

[canadianmagpie]

I don't think any of these statements are in any way supported by the video you're pointing to. In fact, as I have said before, it shows exactly the opposite. The video shows how Smith is not in a position to jump and that the momentum he falls with has to come from Edler.

And yet, everyone else disagrees with you....

 

[Anglesmith]

And yet, everyone else disagrees with you....

Already addressed in-thread several times. Argumentum ad populum, anyway.

 

[canadianmagpie]

Already addressed in-thread several times. Argumentum ad populum, anyway.

There's also a thing called bias, I think it's affecting your eyesight and judgement.

 

[1989]

There's also a thing called bias, I think it's affecting your eyesight and judgement.

But that doesn't affect you because your team wasn't involved in the play, right?

 

[Anglesmith]

There's also a thing called bias, I think it's affecting your eyesight and judgement.

Then make a convincing argument to that effect. Don't just post the video and say "as you can see, Mike Smith is wearing a pink jock and everyone agrees so it's true."

 

[canadianmagpie]

But that doesn't affect you because your team wasn't involved in the play, right?

I freely admit my bias, but what about the Flames and neutral fans that called it an embellishment? What's their excuse?

Then make a convincing argument to that effect. Don't just post the video and say "as you can see, Mike Smith is wearing a pink jock and everyone agrees so it's true."

The fact that you can't watch the video and see the embellishment means there is no convincing you. Rational arguments mean nothing to you. Anyways, I can see you want to have the last word and I really don't care about that. Let's just agree that you are disagreeing with your fellow Flames fans amongst neutral ones too and let's just leave it at that.

 

[HanSolo]

Just watch Smith's feet, I would say. If you watch his feet and his body, there is no jump, and there isn't really the ability jump. He can't go from spinning one way in a shooting motion to reversing that momentum and jumping the other way simply using one foot with a goalie skate on. Edler provides the force with his right hip and stick. And given that force, and the way goalies are equipped, what happens next is pretty much anything-goes. Calling it embellishment is fashionable, but doesn't really have any basis.

You're feet don't have to be positioned perfectly to throw your body forward.

 

[Anglesmith]

The fact that you can't watch the video and see the embellishment means there is no convincing you. Rational arguments mean nothing to you.

This is serious glass house stone-throwing. I'm the one who actually pointed to real things in the video like foot positioning and momentum. You haven't addressed that at all. You just posted the video and said pretty much nothing other than "look, I'm right and you're wrong." If that's proof that I can't be convinced, your standards are pretty low. But yes, I do disagree with Flames and neutral fans calling it a dive. And I generally disagree on plays involving Bishop, Fleury, Price, etc. when the exact same thing happens. And that's probably not going to change unless people start realizing that goalies go down funny.

 

[Anglesmith]

You're feet don't have to be positioned perfectly to throw your body forward.

From a stand-still, sure, but while spinning the other way? I think it would be quite the feet feat.

 

[1989]

I freely admit my bias, but what about the Flames and neutral fans that called it an embellishment? What's their excuse?

The ability to form an opinion, regardless of anyone else's experiences or influences, is not an excuse. It's what they saw, or felt, or experienced, and you cannot take that away from them.
I thought that the last, I don't know, three pages of your conversation in this thread was an obvious enough example either way.

Neutral and biased fans can all form those opinions - your "calling out" of another's bias when you cannot be free of your own is a pretty feeble accusation. I thought it was funny. It's not impossible to have fans from any viewpoint agree or disagree on any given point, including this.

 

[Rubi]

I freely admit my bias, but what about the Flames and neutral fans that called it an embellishment? What's their excuse?

Despite his name, NeutralFan888 isn't neutral. Far from it.

 

[Johnny HFBOARDS]

nice to see the Jets play like the Jets again, down a couple serious roster players, and our rookie being a classic Jets rookie.

 

[Terrier]

https://www.bostonherald.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/sports32419.png

 

[Cane mutiny]

Lots of hats remain on heads in WPG. Didn't Atlanta tell y'all what you should do when a player scores three in a game?

It's cold up there...they need them.