Player Discussion Henrik Lundqvist Pt. III

[offdacrossbar]

at some point in time, hes gonna lose his magic. looks like that time is now

when he was all world hank you could see shooters visibly frustrated. he would give you nothing to shoot at or give you something and snatch it away with his cat like reflexes. he played deep and he still took everything away. remember this, "if he saw it, he would stop it" the only way to beat hank was a screen or a deflection. he always stopped the first shot.

shooters would look the the heavens and ask, HOW and WHY ???

now vic stalberg- hardly a sniper, beats him pretty clean high glove side with ease.

henrik is giving up some ghastly goals:

bad angles
short sides
squeakers between his arm and body
long distance clean looks
100 ft bouncers
and sloppy floppy scrambly lay on your back out of position goals.

does anyone remember the shoot out thing recently where it appeared to me that hank didnt even want to be there. he hardly attempted anything and willingly gave up his 5 hole like it didnt matter. he stopped nothing.

does anyone here still have a scintilla of confidence when we go to a shootout ? i sure dont.

and playing the puck ? forget it, that usually leads to something ugly.

give raanta a few games

 

[Mac n Gs]

Guys, I'm pretty sure this is my fault. I drafted Hank this year in fantasy, and I drafted Price last year. Brb, gonna go trade Hank for Halak.

 

[RangerBoy]

Lundqvist has never been this bad eexcept for a stretch in his rookie year. He had migraine headaches. 2005-06. Very long time ago.

 

[silverfish]

Didn't Klein tip in the first goal, or am I crazy?
2nd goal, the original shot being tipped and becoming a fluttering change up messed him up. I'd like him to stop that before it gets behind him and banks in, though.
3rd goal is all Skjei. Lundqvist came out to poke it to the corner because Skjei got beat. Took a bad bounce, that's bad luck.
4th goal, I want him to save that, but mostly because he's Hank. I wouldn't expect every other goalie in the NHL to come up with that one.

Either way, Rangers have been playing with fire since 05-06. Looks like 11 years later, they're getting burned.

 

[Dr. Ogrodnick]

Didn't Klein tip in the first goal, or am I crazy?
2nd goal, the original shot being tipped and becoming a fluttering change up messed him up. I'd like him to stop that before it gets behind him and banks in, though.
3rd goal is all Skjei. Lundqvist came out to poke it to the corner because Skjei got beat. Took a bad bounce, that's bad luck.
4th goal, I want him to save that, but mostly because he's Hank. I wouldn't expect every other goalie in the NHL to come up with that one.

Either way, Rangers have been playing with fire since 05-06. Looks like 11 years later, they're getting burned.

1st goal Henrik is badly out of position, even if its slightly tipped. No way a shot from that angle should beat a goalie so easily on the short side. Period. 2nd goal was weird, tough to blame Henrik on that one. 3rd goal was all Henrik. No need to make the poke check there, the Islander's only reall play was going around the net. It was a gift goal at the worst possible time. Nobody is blaming him for the 4th. But he screwed up 2 and the Rangers lost by 2.

 

[Raspewtin]

My problem is that if he cannot make a difference on those shots, it's not worth it to spend more money on him instead of going with someone else. Top-heavy teams never win Cups. It's all about depth. Having Skjei, Buchnevich, Vesey, Fast and Holden contributing at a low cost certainly helps, but it's not enough.

I feel a team has a better chance at winning it if there is more spent on defense and less on goaltending.

The 2015 Blackhawks disagree.

 

[nevesis]

Didn't Klein tip in the first goal, or am I crazy?
2nd goal, the original shot being tipped and becoming a fluttering change up messed him up. I'd like him to stop that before it gets behind him and banks in, though.
3rd goal is all Skjei. Lundqvist came out to poke it to the corner because Skjei got beat. Took a bad bounce, that's bad luck.
4th goal, I want him to save that, but mostly because he's Hank. I wouldn't expect every other goalie in the NHL to come up with that one.

Either way, Rangers have been playing with fire since 05-06. Looks like 11 years later, they're getting burned.

Excluding the Ladd goal which was another bad bounce after poke checking into the corner, the rest were exactly how you explained above and in Vallys tweet.

People like to look for reasons why their team lost and in professional sports love to blame high paid players for not doing what they are paid to do. However, it's important to look at each goal individually, break it down piece by piece as any goalie coach would and identify what went wrong and why things went wrong.

When you do this over the course of the first 20 games, it isn't as big of an issue as the non experts are claiming here who don't rewatch games and or breakdown plays like Valliquette and even more so Benny.

Until Lundqvist is giving up low percentage chances on which he has clear and clean sight of the puck, there are no signs of regression. Valiquette mentioned this exact same thing last night. It hasn't happened at scale in anyway, so in my opinion there is no reason to be worried yet.

He can always be better, and 100% isn't happy with his statistical performance right now. He is the first person to know this and will be inspired to fix it in anyway he can.

As he always has in previous rough stretches.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

The 2015 Blackhawks disagree.

That team had depth both on offense (Kruger, Carcillo, Vermette, Shaw, Richards) and defense (van Riemsdyk, Oduya, Timonen, Rozsival)

 

[nevesis]

 

[silverfish]

1st goal Henrik is badly out of position, even if its slightly tipped. No way a shot from that angle should beat a goalie so easily on the short side. Period. 2nd goal was weird, tough to blame Henrik on that one. 3rd goal was all Henrik. No need to make the poke check there, the Islander's only reall play was going around the net. It was a gift goal at the worst possible time. Nobody is blaming him for the 4th. But he screwed up 2 and the Rangers lost by 2.

Bolded: If Hank reads the initial shot going far post, he's in fine position. He's likely positionining himself there to make sure he can kick the rebound out. Even if he's in the position you want, and Klein tips it (still not sure), that puck goes top corner.

This is point of contact Mayfield shooting. Hank looking around Skjei. Seems to me like he's in fine position for this shot.

Red circle here is puck. At this point, I don't think Hank has even picked up the shot yet. He's still looking around Skjei to try and find it

Now, judging where the puck is in the above screenshot, and this screenshot, I'm thinking Klein tips it. At this point (screenshot below) Hank is in position to stop the shot in the screenshot above, but not stop the shot in the screenshot below.

I can only say I think Klein tips this puck. It was my initial thought when I saw it live, and it's what I think now as well.

On the red I seriously disagree.

You really want Lundqvist to just hang back in his net here and wait and see if Prince makes a play on this puck or not? The only reason you think that Prince's only play here was to go behind the net is exactly because Hank comes out to challenge.

You want him to read that play and react, which he does, and either cover that puck (suicide play if he misses) or poke it into the corner. This third goal is just really bad luck after a terrible play by Skjei who gets absolutely walked by Prince.

 

[nevesis]

 

[East Coast Bias]

Lundqvist has never been this bad eexcept for a stretch in his rookie year. He had migraine headaches. 2005-06. Very long time ago.

Except that's not true. This isn't abnormal for his Oct-Dec start.

In 13-14 he had a .907 SV% through 30 games.

In 14-15 he had a .912 SV% through 28 games.

In 15-16 he had a .921 SV% through 31 games

In 16-17 he has a .914 SV% through 20 games thus far.

You can say he's letting in a ton of soft goals, which is fine. But then he must be making a lot of great saves, because this isn't an outlier in recent years.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

Except that's not true. This isn't abnormal for his Oct-Dec start.

In 13-14 he had a .907 SV% through 30 games.

In 14-15 he had a .912 SV% through 28 games.

In 15-16 he had a .921 SV% through 31 games

In 16-17 he has a .914 SV% through 20 games thus far.

You can say he's letting in a ton of soft goals, which is fine. But then he must be making a lot of great saves, because this isn't an outlier in recent years.

Huh. This gives me more comfort than anything I've read in this thread.

 

[Doctor King Schultz]

Except that's not true. This isn't abnormal for his Oct-Dec start.

In 13-14 he had a .907 SV% through 30 games.

In 14-15 he had a .912 SV% through 28 games.

In 15-16 he had a .921 SV% through 31 games

In 16-17 he has a .914 SV% through 20 games thus far.

You can say he's letting in a ton of soft goals, which is fine. But then he must be making a lot of great saves, because this isn't an outlier in recent years.

This is the thing that stands out to me this season. Hank has had slow starts before, but he was never letting in the weak goals like he has been this year.

 

[Irishguy42]

That doesn't mean we can't criticize him for his performance last night.

Joe is also a blowhard when it comes to team criticism. He only focuses on blaming the D and nothing else. Blind, I say.

Hank is sub-par in low and medium danger sv%, which is concerning. Being Top-10 in HDSV% is great and all, but being weak in the other two categories diminishes his success at HDSV%.

 

[East Coast Bias]

Huh. This gives me more comfort than anything I've read in this thread.

I'm still concerned, because as he ages, can he still go on .935 SV runs that brings him back to his annual norm? I don't know the answer to that.

 

[Raspewtin]

Except that's not true. This isn't abnormal for his Oct-Dec start.

In 13-14 he had a .907 SV% through 30 games.

In 14-15 he had a .912 SV% through 28 games.

In 15-16 he had a .921 SV% through 31 games

In 16-17 he has a .914 SV% through 20 games thus far.

You can say he's letting in a ton of soft goals, which is fine. But then he must be making a lot of great saves, because this isn't an outlier in recent years.

Reason #349 why the eye test sucks

That doesn't mean we can't criticize him for his performance last night.

Joe is also a blowhard when it comes to team criticism. He only focuses on blaming the D and nothing else. Blind, I say.

Hank is sub-par in low and medium danger sv%, which is concerning. Being Top-10 in HDSV% is great and all, but being weak in the other two categories diminishes his success at HDSV%.

Reason #350

 

[Irishguy42]

Reason #350

I'm not sure how to take this?

 

[nyrleetch]

That doesn't mean we can't criticize him for his performance last night.

Joe is also a blowhard when it comes to team criticism. He only focuses on blaming the D and nothing else. Blind, I say.

Hank is sub-par in low and medium danger sv%, which is concerning. Being Top-10 in HDSV% is great and all, but being weak in the other two categories diminishes his success at HDSV%.

Great point, which leads to another question. Would we rather Lundqvist not bail us out on HDSV% or be really good at Low and Medium danger.

I think sadly with this defense he's going to face a lot of HD shots but we need him to fix the softies, because it's been wayyy too frequent.

 

[Chimpradamus]

The first goal was poor. The second goal was bad. The third goal was an utter disgrace.

How's your horse? Blade sharpened?

Why was the first goal poor? Why was the second goal bad? Why was the third goal an utter disgrace? I'm not arguing the opinion, I'm arguing there is no substance to discuss.

 

[Megustaelhockey]

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=2159561