Post-Game Talk: Hawks PK tested, but mostly stands in 3-1 victory over Nashville

[Ace Card Bedard]

That 3:00 penalty kill was a thing of beauty.

 

[CertainAffinity*]

That 3:00 penalty kill was a thing of beauty.

Would definitely like to see more of that going forward. They actually looked fairly aggressive for a lot of the kills in the second half of this game.

That said, it's hard to gauge. Its a lot easier to be aggressive on Nashville than it is against STL or SJ.

Small victories though. Let's build our way up, little by little.

 

[Tofveve]

No one's mentioned Kane streak . . .

And, this team is easily most-likeable/watchable team in league.

 

[hisgirlfriday]

CA,

You had a question in the game thread of when was the last time any team had been in the bottom third of PK and won the Cup.

Looking back on the past ten years I don't think it's happened but it's been close.

Not quite bottom third, but Boston won the 2011 Cup with the 16th best PK in 2011. And Carolina won the 2006 Cup with the 19th best PK in 2006.

Also, Detroit had the 25th best PK in 2009 and Pittsburgh had the 23rd best PK in 2008 and both were good enough to be SCF runner-ups those years.

 

[hisgirlfriday]

No one's mentioned Kane streak . . .

Him getting a point is just kind of expected at this point but I guess it's double digits now?

His goal was really pretty though and he got a nice shoutout on the SportsCenter Top 10 for it.

Also the Hawks streak of PP goals is now at 10.

eta:

Toews now has a 6 game point streak going. Keith's streak is at 5. Hossa's is at 4. Pretty nice.

 

[CertainAffinity*]

CA,

You had a question in the game thread of when was the last time any team had been in the bottom third of PK and won the Cup.

Looking back on the past ten years I don't think it's happened but it's been close.

Not quite bottom third, but Boston won the 2011 Cup with the 16th best PK in 2011. And Carolina won the 2006 Cup with the 19th best PK in 2006.

Also, Detroit had the 25th best PK in 2009 and Pittsburgh had the 23rd best PK in 2008 and both were good enough to be SCF runner-ups those years.

Wow, good to know.

That actually cheers me up a bit.

Thanks for the info.

 

[Raimo Sillanpää]

"Two Goal" Raanta has become "One Goal" Raanta!

Way to go!

At this rate of progression..

one or two games more, then a blowout, then he's Antti "No Goals" Raanta.

 

[BobbyJet]

Would definitely like to see more of that going forward. They actually looked fairly aggressive for a lot of the kills in the second half of this game.That said, it's hard to gauge. Its a lot easier to be aggressive on Nashville than it is against STL or SJ.

Small victories though. Let's build our way up, little by little.

Led mainly by Toews and Hossa. Zus and Kruger were their usual passive selves most of the night; a few times were so close together waving their sticks, they almost tripped over one another. It's mainly Zus though. He's a pilon on the PK. Q needs to get him off and replace him with Ben or Saad.

 

[Hawkaholic]

Led mainly by Toews and Hossa. Zus and Kruger were their usual passive selves most of the night; a few times were so close together waving their sticks, they almost tripped over one another. It's mainly Zus though. He's a pilon on the PK. Q needs to get him off and replace him with Ben or Saad.

There was one time where Kruger and Zeus almost got tangled up and tripped over each other. It was when Seabrook had a chance to clear the puck, and messed up. They were at the end of their shift, and were probably dog tired. Zus is fine on the PK, as is Kruger.

 

[Savardian Spinorama]

Duncan Keith: The NHL's Best Defenseman

To think I was a proponent of trading him after last year too. My thinking was that while he was a good defenseman, we might have seen the last of him as elite. Better to get something for him while we could. Damn am I glad I'm not the GM. He looks better than he ever has and there isn't a single D-man in the league I would trade him for.

 

[Tofveve]

Him getting a point is just kind of expected at this point but I guess it's double digits now?

His goal was really pretty though and he got a nice shoutout on the SportsCenter Top 10 for it.

Also the Hawks streak of PP goals is now at 10.

eta:

Toews now has a 6 game point streak going. Keith's streak is at 5. Hossa's is at 4. Pretty nice.

Such an amazing group right now.

 

[CertainAffinity*]

Led mainly by Toews and Hossa. Zus and Kruger were their usual passive selves most of the night; a few times were so close together waving their sticks, they almost tripped over one another. It's mainly Zus though. He's a pilon on the PK. Q needs to get him off and replace him with Ben or Saad.

No, Zus and Kruger were fine on the PK tonight. Everybody was playing fairly aggressively.

More over, Zus and Kruger have arguably been the most consistently strong PKers. The PK actually upgraded from 'dumpster fire' to 'tire fire' when Zus was added into the mix.

 

[Marotte Marauder]

15 games back for Handzus.

He has been on for 5 PK goals against, Kruger on for 6. Not all the same goals.

 

[CertainAffinity*]

15 games back for Handzus.

He has been on for 5 PK goals against, Kruger on for 6. Not all the same goals.

And yet, still, too of our better PKers. Speaks to how bad our PK really is.

 

[Bubba88]

Our PK is about the system, not the players...


Raanta was great. He'll end up as #1 in the NHL.
Keith has been the best D in the NHL overall so far.
Kane should get the Hart as of now. Just look at Crosbys teammate Malkin and how far he is away in pts....

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Our PK is about the system, not the players...


Raanta was great. He'll end up as #1 in the NHL.
Keith has been the best D in the NHL overall so far.
Kane should get the Hart as of now. Just look at Crosbys teammate Malkin and how far he is away in pts....

Raanta has that "niemi factor" to him. He's gonna be a goalie that can steal games. I really think the Bowman's were content waiting to see how he developed but were pressured to resign Crow at 6/36. I wouldn't be surprised at all if this kid is challenging for the job by playoff time. When he made that comment in the post-game Sunday night about "wanting to bring a cup back to chicago", he has his eye on Crawford's job and clearly believes he can take it.

 

[zac]

Would definitely like to see more of that going forward. They actually looked fairly aggressive for a lot of the kills in the second half of this game.

That said, it's hard to gauge. Its a lot easier to be aggressive on Nashville than it is against STL or SJ.

Small victories though. Let's build our way up, little by little.

We ARE aggressive at trying to thwart zone entry. When that's successful our PK looks pretty good. It's when possession gets established in the zone where we have all of our problems.

When the Hawks were on the PP, Nashville's forwards were extending out to the perimeter, yielding no more than 5 feet of room to the puck holder. Ours? JFC we are 10 feet away on every PK, basically standing on top of each other in our stupid box. The result is too much shooting and passing space for the pointmen, and it makes it that much more difficult to cover ground. We did it on Nashville's PP goal, and it's the number one reason the opponent scores on 60% of our yielded goals.

If we had a smarter coach it would have been addressed already. Instead we get the "we just need to play better" bs.

 

[Bubba88]

I like Crawford, but Raanta plays a different style of his position.

We are happy to have both with us.

 

[BobbyJet]

No, Zus and Kruger were fine on the PK tonight. Everybody was playing fairly aggressively.

More over, Zus and Kruger have arguably been the most consistently strong PKers. The PK actually upgraded from 'dumpster fire' to 'tire fire' when Zus was added into the mix.

Based on what? They stood around waiting for ops to make a mistake, which may work against Preds but ....

Moreover, if the ops do fumble the puck, Zus isn't quick enough to do anything about it - interrupt the PP flow. Frolik stood out in that regard and often was able to rush the ops entry as well. Zus can do neither, and Kruger is generally too passive. He needs an aggressive mate to complement his good positional play. (We can't have both guys playing identical passive styles).

And btw, our PK has been in the bottom 2 or 3 all season, so I'm not sure where this contentment from some is coming from. This is especially concerning because the team is taking more minors (chinzy penalties aside), particularly early in games.

 

[BobbyJet]

We ARE aggressive at trying to thwart zone entry. When that's successful our PK looks pretty good. It's when possession gets established in the zone where we have all of our problems.

When the Hawks were on the PP, Nashville's forwards were extending out to the perimeter, yielding no more than 5 feet of room to the puck holder. Ours? JFC we are 10 feet away on every PK, basically standing on top of each other in our stupid box. The result is too much shooting and passing space for the pointmen, and it makes it that much more difficult to cover ground. We did it on Nashville's PP goal, and it's the number one reason the opponent scores on 60% of our yielded goals.

If we had a smarter coach it would have been addressed already. Instead we get the "we just need to play better" bs.

Good post.

 

[Salvaged Ship]

We ARE aggressive at trying to thwart zone entry. When that's successful our PK looks pretty good. It's when possession gets established in the zone where we have all of our problems.

When the Hawks were on the PP, Nashville's forwards were extending out to the perimeter, yielding no more than 5 feet of room to the puck holder. Ours? JFC we are 10 feet away on every PK, basically standing on top of each other in our stupid box. The result is too much shooting and passing space for the pointmen, and it makes it that much more difficult to cover ground. We did it on Nashville's PP goal, and it's the number one reason the opponent scores on 60% of our yielded goals.

If we had a smarter coach it would have been addressed already. Instead we get the "we just need to play better" bs.

Completely agree. We just sit back in that tight box, not aggresssively pursuing the puck. The opposition has so much room at the point to pass, shoot, whatever. And with our players so far away in that box I can see being hesitant to get in the way and try to block a shot, you could get your head taken off.

Another thing. With us so far away from the point when the opposition takes a shot, when it misses the net it always seems to bounce hard off the boards and because we are so tight in that box the rebound easily gets back to the opposition at the blue line. Its like a constant cycle and we can't get possession. And we are also terrible at clearing. How many times do we have control and can't make a simple clear down the ice, just seemingly passing it right back to the opposition? There are definitely strategy issues, but there are also execution and aggression issues.

 

[pvr]

Our PK is about the system, not the players...


Raanta was great. He'll end up as #1 in the NHL.
Keith has been the best D in the NHL overall so far.
Kane should get the Hart as of now. Just look at Crosbys teammate Malkin and how far he is away in pts....

Thank god you have finally admitted (albeit indirectly) that our PK success last year was an outlier, that it had nothing to do with Kruger (or Frolik), and therefore that Kruger is just a standard fourth liner who was given too much credit for the Hawks' PK success last year.

 

[BobbyJet]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubba88
Our PK is about the system, not the players...


Raanta was great. He'll end up as #1 in the NHL.
Keith has been the best D in the NHL overall so far.
Kane should get the Hart as of now. Just look at Crosbys teammate Malkin and how far he is away in pts....

----------------

Thank god you have finally admitted (albeit indirectly) that our PK success last year was an outlier, that it had nothing to do with Kruger (or Frolik), and therefore that Kruger is just a standard fourth liner who was given too much credit for the Hawks' PK success last year.

--------------

To a degree, yes, but it is the same PK system as last season that was so very successful. Hence there has to be more to this year's failed PK than just the system.
I'd suggest the players simple can't execute - whether it be due to lack of talent or lack of instinct, or both. I think both. Short of playing 81 and 19 more, again, I'd be inclined to replace Zus with Saad or Smith.

 

[pvr]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubba88
Our PK is about the system, not the players...


Raanta was great. He'll end up as #1 in the NHL.
Keith has been the best D in the NHL overall so far.
Kane should get the Hart as of now. Just look at Crosbys teammate Malkin and how far he is away in pts....

----------------


--------------

To a degree, yes, but it is the same PK system as last season that was so very successful. Hence there has to be more to this year's failed PK than just the system.
I'd suggest the players simple can't execute - whether it be due to lack of talent or lack of instinct, or both. I think both. Short of playing 81 and 19 more, again, I'd be inclined to replace Zus with Saad or Smith.

Certainly there will always be a regression to the mean to some extent with this type of situation. Last year our PK was *too good* and our PP was *too bad* for the personnel that we employed in each situation.

I have to say that Kruger seems stronger than last year, and his niche on the Hawks seems to be the PK over most anything else. The passive play is wrecking the kill though.

I agree that we have to utilize more of our top end guys in the PK like we did in past years when Sharp and Toews were mainstays. Saad is a good choice, as would be Smith. Both are more aggressive players than Kruger and particularly Handzus. Shaw and Versteeg also might be good choices.

 

[Hawkaholic]

To a degree, yes, but it is the same PK system as last season that was so very successful. Hence there has to be more to this year's failed PK than just the system.
I'd suggest the players simple can't execute - whether it be due to lack of talent or lack of instinct, or both. I think both. Short of playing 81 and 19 more, again, I'd be inclined to replace Zus with Saad or Smith.

Hmm, lets have a look.

Handzus - 6PPGA - 48:45TOI/SH = 1G every 8:08mins

Hossa - 6PPGA - 39:39TOI/SH = 1G every 6:56mins
Toews - 8PPGA - 51:28TOI/SH = 1G every 6:41mins

Kruger 18PPGA - 91:49TOI/SH = 1G every 5:08mins
Smith - 7PPGA - 30:44TOI/SH = 1G every 4:35mins

I could understand wanting Kruger off of it, but not Zus.