Has the boycott been effective so far?

[topshelf15]

That is ads as opposed to tickets. Melnyk and the Sens have hurt themselves with advertising, but honestly that is not as much of a revenue stream as you would think.

You sure??The leafs made pretty good bank on their naming rights for their arena,and we didnt do so bad with Canadian tire...The point is EM running his mouth instead of doing what needs to be done has hurt the team for a long time here...The trust has been broken by him with this fanbase,and will likely never recover...He needs to realise that the team is nothing more than a poisoned chalice to him now and move on

 

[GCK]

EM blames everybody else,and never takes a look in the mirror...He is supposed to be the leader,and he led us right into this ****show....Forgive me if I wont follow him any longer

The guy is a jackass and I hope he is gone soon, BUT, my hope is that fans don't anticipate that a new ownership would come in and we would be on equal financial footing with the high revenue teams in the league. I think the best we could hope for is a Budget team where nobody ever says budget, ownership that invests wisely at the right time and only speaks once after the season is over.

 

[BatherSeason]

IMO, the key point of the boycott is, or at least it should be, to frame attendance woes as a reaction to Melnyk's ownership/management of the team rather than as a reaction to team performance. Attendance was going to drop after a terrible season, it was going to drop after trading Karlsson, and it was going to drop after the Hoffman scandal/trade. Would attendance be just as bad if there wasn't a campaign by some to actively boycott the team, maybe, maybe not, but influencing attendance shouldn't be the primary action plan here, setting the narrative should, bringing attention to the perceived cause of the teams issues should.

The fanbase is speaking loud and clear, however, one of the major stumbling blocks about this whole "boycott" or whatever we want to call it is that it is very difficult to "set the narrative" when the local media is basically ignoring anything anti-Melnyk, in order to protect their access to the team. Every article or blog piece written is being completely ignored until they have no other choice. Then when any international media source picks something out, the foot soldiers (TSN1200, Garrioch, Twitter bots) are out deflecting again.

If this was the NFL, and Melnyk operated the way he currently is, the vultures would be out. The media would not allow his behaviour to continue.

 

[topshelf15]

The guy is a jackass and I hope he is gone soon, BUT, my hope is that fans don't anticipate that a new ownership would come in and we would be on equal financial footing with the high revenue teams in the league. I think the best we could hope for is a Budget team where nobody ever says budget, ownership that invests wisely at the right time and only speaks once after the season is over.

Look ,spending to the cap every season isnt wise...But the nickel and diming of everything ,from coaching to management...To assets needs to end ...The problem EM has is nobody will trust him ,at his word to make things right ...He blew it here.. He had a budding plant and he he just stopped watering it...

 

[coladin]

Ok so you agree ,then the fans in this city does support its team

For Alfie's game? One game? Ansolutely! The other 40 are a challenge.

For a clear Monday night game against Pheonix in October 2016, with our hero Karlsson playing a great game, and 11,069 showed up, erm, no.

Look, there are diehards of this team that just aren't enough to get this team the revenues it needs to compete with the big boys. This year, I think, is an anomaly and message-sending to the management. I will say that on average, this is a team that has regular paid attendance of 15K overall. At our prices .
That is the realistic economic scenario. 3500+ tickets , when filled , can add significant revenues to this team, as do playoff games.

Hopefully , a new generation of fans will start going to the games and not only add to the atmosphere, but also allow the team to compete financially to our expected levels. We all want the team to win, but we also know the realities of this market. And I am not convinced that Lebreton will change that.

 

[coladin]

Can you explain this?

You'd think they are papering to cover up current attendance issues, I'm not sure what the past has to do with the present in this case.

Sorry, should have said "just like in the past".

 

[topshelf15]

For Alfie's game? One game? Ansolutely! The other 40 are a challenge.

For a clear Monday night game against Pheonix in October 2016, with our hero Karlsson playing a great game, and 11,069 showed up, erm, no.

Look, there are diehards of this team that just aren't enough to get this team the revenues it needs to compete with the big boys. This year, I think, is an anomaly and message-sending to the management. I will say that on average, this is a team that has regular paid attendance of 15K overall. At our prices .
That is the realistic economic scenario. 3500+ tickets , when filled , can add significant revenues to this team, as do playoff games.

Hopefully , a new generation of fans will start going to the games and not only add to the atmosphere, but also allow the team to compete financially to our expected levels. We all want the team to win, but we also know the realities of this market. And I am not convinced that Lebreton will change that.

The owner has done little to foster new growth ,nobody said it was going to be easy...But EM hasnt even bothered to try

 

[coladin]

The fanbase is speaking loud and clear, however, one of the major stumbling blocks about this whole "boycott" or whatever we want to call it is that it is very difficult to "set the narrative" when the local media is basically ignoring anything anti-Melnyk, in order to protect their access to the team. Every article or blog piece written is being completely ignored until they have no other choice. Then when any international media source picks something out, the foot soldiers (TSN1200, Garrioch, Twitter bots) are out deflecting again.

If this was the NFL, and Melnyk operated the way he currently is, the vultures would be out. The media would not allow his behaviour to continue.

I don't know why they are "protecting" Melnyk. They are the press and will get access to the room.

But I am surprised there hasn't been an attendance article by now.

 

[GCK]

You sure??The leafs made pretty good bank on their naming rights for their arena,and we didnt do so bad with Canadian tire...The point is EM running his mouth instead of doing what needs to be done has hurt the team for a long time here...The trust has been broken by him with this fanbase,and will likely never recover...He needs to realise that the team is nothing more than a poisoned chalice to him now and move on

LOL. The Leafs are an outlier, the naming rights are 40M per year, but that is for the Raptors as well. I knew a previous CFO for the Sens and she set me straight on the advertising. By the way not all advertising dollars are HRR, but most is.

 

[coladin]

The owner has done little to foster new growth ,nobody said it was going to be easy...But EM hasnt even bothered to try

..but date night?

He is not blameless, far from it. He has hired more staff though both on hockey and management sides, so that is a good sign. There is a real coach in Belleville and an AGM as well . Prices are slashed. Tickets are going for free by three thousands. Half price tickets for a Penguins game. The value of going now is as good as it gets lol

But the team is looking promising with the prospects having a bigger impact than many, including myself, may have predicted.

 

[BatherSeason]

It seems it's season tickets that are down, not the everyday ticket sales

I think the biggest reason that season ticket sales are down was because of the whole Karlsson debacle. They left passionate hockey fans twisting in the wind, they promised "a plan" and never revealed any sort of plan until the bizarre Melnyk/Boro video. Management and ownership lied to the fanbase for months and tried to play everyone for fools. People didn't appreciate that and didn't renew. Some did and there is nothing wrong with that either. If they would have just pulled the band aid off earlier instead of the whole "we will offer him a contract on July 1" song & dance, maybe people would have been more forgiving. Add in the Randy Lee garbage, amongst many other things. They have no one else to blame but themselves.

As for the everyday ticket sales, the young guys are fun to watch and GB is letting them play a little for 2 periods (then the third period turtle) therefore people are walking up.

 

[topshelf15]

LOL. The Leafs are an outlier, the naming rights are 40M per year, but that is for the Raptors as well. I knew a previous CFO for the Sens and she set me straight on the advertising. By the way not all advertising dollars are HRR, but most is.

No I know the Leafs are the big boy,Iam just a fed up fan ,that wants to love his team ...But wont follow an ass off a cliff to do it

 

[GCK]

Look ,spending to the cap every season isnt wise...But the nickel and diming of everything ,from coaching to management...To assets needs to end ...The problem EM has is nobody will trust him ,at his word to make things right ...He blew it here.. He had a budding plant and he he just stopped watering it...

He also made mistakes when times were good, he should have talked up the great fan support for allowing him to invest more in the team at the beginning, but his Ego drove him to want to take credit for increased spending. He set expectations that he would fund the team rather than set the expectation that payroll and revenues were symbiotic. He never really understood the market, which is surprising with Leeder and Murray around.

 

[topshelf15]

He also made mistakes when times were good, he should have talked up the great fan support for allowing him to invest more in the team at the beginning, but his Ego drove him to want to take credit for increased spending. He set expectations that he would fund the team rather than set the expectation that payroll and revenues were symbiotic. He never really understood the market, which is surprising with Leeder and Murray around.

EM is a winner is the boardroom takedown,or in playing the market right..But as a charismatic leader,that can sell freezers to the Inuit,he is not

 

[BatherSeason]

Hopefully , a new generation of fans will start going to the games and not only add to the atmosphere

It is the responsibility of the organization to create a new generation of fans, they have failed miserably for about 10 years now.

A young, charismatic generational defenseman was the perfect tool to use to help market the team and create a new generation of fans, yet they failed miserably. Instead, Melnyk hoped names like Kovalev would help sell tickets instead. The SJ Sharks have done a better job using Erik Karlsson as a marketing tool in 2 months than the Ottawa Senators ever did in 9 seasons.

Now they are banking on great, young personalities like Tkachuk, Lajoie, Chabot, etc. to help create a new generation of fans, yet instead of featuring these guys and getting fans to really buy into these players, we get marginal players like Boro shoved down our throats.

The Ottawa Senators just don't get it.

 

[stempniaksen]

..but date night?

He is not blameless, far from it. He has hired more staff though both on hockey and management sides, so that is a good sign. There is a real coach in Belleville and an AGM as well . Prices are slashed. Tickets are going for free by three thousands. Half price tickets for a Penguins game. The value of going now is as good as it gets lol

But the team is looking promising with the prospects having a bigger impact than many, including myself, may have predicted.

Has he actually hired more staff though? Seems like for every new face there was an old one who left (Anselmi out and Ruszkowski in, 3 scouts fired and 3/4 new scouts hired).

Also, what's a "real" coach in Belleville? We all thought we had the right guy down there already with KK until it was proven that wasn't the case at all. Also, do we even have an AGM in charge of Belleville? I know they hired Peter MacTavish, but at the time Dorion stated he wouldn't be named B-Sens GM and would take on more of a numbers role.

I obviously like that the organization is bringing in (seemingly) qualified candidates to fill the shoes of people that have left, but it's always felt more like shuffling the deck chairs to me, as opposed to bringing on extra staff.

 

[topshelf15]

It is the responsibility of the organization to create a new generation of fans, they have failed miserably since Melnyk for about 10 years now.

A young, charismatic generational defenseman was the perfect tool to use to help market the team and create a new generation of fans, yet they failed miserably. Instead, Melnyk hoped names like Kovalev would help sell tickets instead. The SJ Sharks have done a better job using Erik Karlsson as a marketing tool in 2 months than the Ottawa Senators ever did in 9 seasons.

Yep,he isnt a salesman...Growing a successful hockey team takes far more than just saying you are the one cutting the cheques

 

[Micklebot]

I can agree with a lot of this, save for the direct impact that many proclaim the "boycott" is having. The boycott angle is "so long as Melnyk owns the team, I am not going". The weaker gang that follow the mantra just watch at home.

Attendance was going to be down due to their season last year, losing Karlsson and a host of other reasons. Signing Stone and Duchene can go along way in bringing people back.

Do I wish that fans had more faith and still went to watch the team? Absolutely. Am I oblivious to why people do not go? Nope. I just wish this market was like other Canadian markets when it comes to supporting their NHL teams.

Nobody knows how much or how little effect the boycott itself is having, because nobody can control for the many variables. In the end though, who cares about whether or not somebody wants to lay claim to the poor attendance. It's largely irrelevant what specific portion of the drop is cause by what specific actions.

As to the bold, kind of tough to compare though, other Canadian markets have significantly different corporate markets to bolster numbers, and aside from Calgary and Winnipeg, significantly larger populations. I wish the team was able to convert more of the Habs and Toronto fans too, that's another issue other Canadian markets don't have to overcome.

So, when somebody suggests Ottawa fans are just cheap, it really ignores the context of this market; we're already one of the smaller markets, and then you have two major roadblocks that other teams don't deal with.

 

[coladin]

Has he actually hired more staff though? Seems like for every new face there was an old one who left (Anselmi out and Ruszkowski in, 3 scouts fired and 3/4 new scouts hired).

Also, what's a "real" coach in Belleville? We all thought we had the right guy down there already with KK until it was proven that wasn't the case at all. Also, do we even have an AGM in charge of Belleville? I know they hired Peter MacTavish, but at the time Dorion stated he wouldn't be named B-Sens GM and would take on more of a numbers role.

I obviously like that the organization is bringing in (seemingly) qualified candidates to fill the shoes of people that have left, but it's always felt more like shuffling the deck chairs to me, as opposed to bringing on extra staff.

I know one of the VPs, and he says there are more people at the boardroom table, so take that for whatever it is worth...could be the creditors who don't want Melnyk out of their sight!

I like Mann and his reputation is quite high and I hated KK. Usually AGMs are more involved in the minors but I also do recall someone else was supposed to be incoming on the hockey ops side.

 

[BatherSeason]

I don't know why they are "protecting" Melnyk.

So you are admitting that they are?

 

[harrisb]

The TV numbers ares strong because they don't go live. I mean, there are lots of fans, just not at the rink.

I don't even think Lebreton will happen, but the possibility is still out there. You also fail to acknowledge that those attendance numbers of the past were always inflated up until a few years ago.

Agreed, the usual suspect general contractor for the build has heard nothing. Only way Lebreton happens is if Devcore group is building it, IMO. I personally thought their bid was far superior anyways.

 

[harrisb]

The TV numbers ares strong because they don't go live. I mean, there are lots of fans, just not at the rink.

I don't even think Lebreton will happen, but the possibility is still out there. You also fail to acknowledge that those attendance numbers of the past were always inflated up until a few years ago.

Agreed, the usual suspect general contractor for the build has heard nothing. Only way Lebreton happens is if Devcore group is building it, IMO. I personally thought their bid was far superior anyways.

 

[topshelf15]

I know one of the VPs, and he says there are more people at the boardroom table, so take that for whatever it is worth...could be the creditors who don't want Melnyk out of his sight!

I like Mann and his reputation is quite high and I hated KK. Usually AGMs are more involved in the minors but I also do recall someone else was supposed to be incoming on the hockey ops side.

Both of them have been great ,Trent has done great as the teams head of scouting...

 

[Pierre from Orleans]

What proof do you have that the attendance numbers were inflated up until last year?

Roy Mlakar was on the radio yesterday and stated that during the years where they were perennial cup contenders that the stadium was always sold out and the numbers were paid attendance

 

[coladin]

Nobody knows how much or how little effect the boycott itself is having, because nobody can control for the many variables. In the end though, who cares about whether or not somebody wants to lay claim to the poor attendance. It's largely irrelevant what specific portion of the drop is cause by what specific actions.

As to the bold, kind of tough to compare though, other Canadian markets have significantly different corporate markets to bolster numbers, and aside from Calgary and Winnipeg, significantly larger populations. I wish the team was able to convert more of the Habs and Toronto fans too, that's another issue other Canadian markets don't have to overcome.

So, when somebody suggests Ottawa fans are just cheap, it really ignores the context of this market; we're already one of the smaller markets, and then you have two major roadblocks that other teams don't deal with.

You are right, dwelling on one's ego who want to say it is all about boycotters is actually irrelevant.

Cheapest tickets, weakest attendance in Canada. Not sure what will change that here in Ottawa moving forward. Even if this team has new ownerhsip, new arena, the costs are the costs. Can this market really afford NHL hockey? I don't mean the scraping by routine we have all become accustomed to, but really compete with a rising cap?