News: Hamonic suspended without pay

[Static]

so you know my personal life? Glad that you know my niece has an immunodeficiency but sure

Getting the vaccination doesn't affect another person being immunocompromised. The covid vaccine is not a live virus.

 

[VanCity Millionaires]

? No most sane people didn’t think this major pandemic that’s killed so many would just vanish? He thought things would get better while not being vaxxed? I’m going off my conclusions (for him not being backed) from what’s been given from the Canucks. Why not state he’s vaxxed if he is? This has been in the media for weeks now?

I would argue that many thought the vaccines would do a better job than they have. It was reported this morning on the CBC that 1 in 5 deaths in Canada right now are vaccinated. No one is saying that COVID would vanish, please don't put words in my mouth. I was saying that he probably was hopeful that things would start to improve as many (if not almost everyone) got vaccinated. The thing is, they haven't...

As to why he's stayed silent... I know I don't like talking about my personal health, or vaccination status to others, let alone telling the whole world. Perhaps he is a private man who's doing his best to care for his family, and their privacy.

 

[VanCity Millionaires]

I’d love your source on that? Or just speculation?

I started off by saying "If I had to make a guess..." That is pretty damn clear that I'm speculating, if you ask anyone.

 

[deckercky]

The only players on LTIR are Ferland, Sutter, and Keeper. Sutter is the only one who might come off.

Sadly all the bonuses are rolling to next year.

Motte and Boeser each bump a player off the salary cap. Sutter would bump a player off the salary cap. Keeper may recover before the end of the season. Unfortunately, running the numbers, that puts them down to just over the cap once the team only has 23 players + Ferland, so the team will be all LTIR and bonuses flow to next season.

 

[izlez]

so you know my personal life? Glad that you know my niece has an immunodeficiency but sure

Please, go on.

Why would your niece's immunodeficiency prevent her parent from being able to get vaccinated?

 

[RandV]

If I had to make a guess, it would be that he acknowledges, as we all should, that vaccinated or not you can still catch and spread the virus. He is certainly vaccinated, due to his daughters precarious situation. However, knowing full well that a year of travel in crowded places, and in US cities where many are not vaccinated, he has a high likelihood of catching and transmitting the virus to his precious daughter he has decided not to play. I'm sure he wants to play, but it's not worth the risk, and he doesn't need the cash.

This is the most logical assumption, but also if this were the case there would be little reason for the Canucks not to be clear that his vaccination status is not the issue. Whatever Hamonic's personal issue is should remain private, but when almost 28 million Canadians are vaccinated and a lot of places are implementing vaccine passports there's no reason to be secretive about having it.

Canucks management tends to bungle these situations though, like last seasons team Covid outbreak. So if the above is the case I wouldn't put it past them to let this point needlessly fester.

 

[mydnyte]

suspended without pay should not affect/reduce the cap implications, else, every team can just look for a reason to 'suspend without pay' any player they want to get off the books. ...and the easiest is insubordination which near impossible to prove they they were not insubordinate.
i.e. player gets benched and says he wants to play, technically, you can call that insubordination and it can also negatively impact team moral, and you can use that as an excuse, find a tweet they made 10 years ago that goes against a team standard etc etc

 

[Static]

I would argue that many thought the vaccines would do a better job than they have. It was reported this morning on the CBC that 1 in 5 deaths in Canada right now are vaccinated. No one is saying that COVID would vanish, please don't put words in my mouth. I was saying that he probably was hopeful that things would start to improve as many (if not almost everyone) got vaccinated. The thing is, they haven't...

As to why he's stayed silent... I know I don't like talking about my personal health, or vaccination status to others, let alone telling the whole world. Perhaps he is a private man who's doing his best to care for his family, and their privacy.

1 in 5 dying are vaccinated? Would absolutely need to see the data on that because it would be an incredible outlier.

 

[Cogburn]

Ok...so let's assume it isn't an anti-vax thing. Let's say it's a family or personal issue.

He's still signed a two year contract with Vancouver. I want to respect the guys privacy, but with Vancouver suspending him without pay for failing to show up to camp, and now to their AHL affiliate, I'm not able to come up with a narrative that makes sense here. Canucks management has done a lot of things that rub me the wrong way, but not once have I been able to say that they aren't giving a player all the chances and opportunities to earn their pay. Roster spots? You bet, but they resign players we don't need, give away money like it's cursed, and call players up on 2 way contracts before roster freezes so they can earn NHL rates for a few days/weeks. Why then are we suspending Hamonic without pay? For no reason, the NHLPA would eat the Canucks alive.

Edit: Also, my local noon news just claims the Canucks have refuted this report. So, eh.

 

[VanCity Millionaires]

This is the most logical assumption, but also if this were the case there would be little reason for the Canucks not to be clear that his vaccination status is not the issue. Whatever Hamonic's personal issue is should remain private, but when almost 28 million Canadians are vaccinated and a lot of places are implementing vaccine passports there's no reason to be secretive about having it.

Canucks management tends to bungle these situations though, like last seasons team Covid outbreak. So if the above is the case I wouldn't put it past them to let this point needlessly fester.

I think it's likely that they're just busy doing other hockey related matters (insert GMJB joke here). I'm glad they're not giving in to the witch hunt. I personally find the witch hunt appalling, if not down right disgusting. One thing is for certain, Travis Hamonic and his $30,000,000 life time earnings, doesn't give a flying f*** about what a bunch of virtue-signaling, fan-boys care about when it comes to him and his family.

 

[VanCity Millionaires]

1 in 5 dying are vaccinated? Would absolutely need to see the data on that because it would be an incredible outlier.

My apologies, it was in New Brunswick, not Canada... https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/most-deaths-are-unvaccinated-1.6212234

 

[Static]

My apologies, it was in New Brunswick, not Canada... https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/most-deaths-are-unvaccinated-1.6212234

Yeah, extremely small sample size. But, it also hammers home the idea that people not getting vaccinated are not just making health decisions that affect only them.

It should be stamped in huge, bright letters: vaccinations are not nor have ever been 100% foolproof treatments. They are only as effective as the amount that exist in a given community. That is why it's so important for as many in the community to get it; to protect the vulnerable and eventually snuff out the disease as you would snuff out a fire, by systematically removing the oxygen.

 

[mouser]

suspended without pay should not affect/reduce the cap implications, else, every team can just look for a reason to 'suspend without pay' any player they want to get off the books. ...and the easiest is insubordination which near impossible to prove they they were not insubordinate.
i.e. player gets benched and says he wants to play, technically, you can call that insubordination and it can also negatively impact team moral, and you can use that as an excuse, find a tweet they made 10 years ago that goes against a team standard etc etc

If teams try to abuse the option then there's a player union and arbitration process available. Also, the league can investigate any such action as a possible circumvention attempt.

 

[Mergatroidskittle]

I would argue that many thought the vaccines would do a better job than they have. It was reported this morning on the CBC that 1 in 5 deaths in Canada right now are vaccinated. No one is saying that COVID would vanish, please don't put words in my mouth. I was saying that he probably was hopeful that things would start to improve as many (if not almost everyone) got vaccinated. The thing is, they haven't...

As to why he's stayed silent... I know I don't like talking about my personal health, or vaccination status to others, let alone telling the whole world. Perhaps he is a private man who's doing his best to care for his family, and their privacy.

Maybe I missed that wanna link it? He knew travelling would be a prerequisite for his profession. If he knew it wasn’t going away and cared so much for his family why would he still risk travel?

( off topic but you brought it up, things aren’t getting better as fast as they should cause of people thinking they know better and not taking vaccines, and people like you running to make up any excuse to undermine the people with the facts)

 

[VanCity Millionaires]

Maybe I missed that wanna link it? He knew travelling would be a prerequisite for his profession. If he knew it wasn’t going away and cared so much for his family why would he still risk travel?

( off topic but you brought it up, things aren’t getting better as fast as they should cause of people thinking they know better and not taking vaccines, and people like you running to make up any excuse to undermine the people with the facts)

I already posted the link. Look up. I have no idea what you're talking about when you say, "people like you." I'm not making up any excuses for anything. You've shown repeatedly that you have reading comprehension problems, perhaps that is the issue. One thing is crystal clear. Hamonic was not on the NHL's list of unvaccinated players, and there has never been a source or proof that he is not vaccinated. I like to look for the best in people, and assume he is hesitant to play because it may put his daughter at risk. I'm not sure how that is making up an excuse. I imagine you don't have children, and can't comprehend the worry and fear that he may have. This is clearly a complicated and difficult situation for his family, and I'm not ready to burn him at the stake for not disclosing his family's personal situation.

 

[Static]

I already posted the link. Look up. I have no idea what you're talking about when you say, "people like you." I'm not making up any excuses for anything. You've shown repeatedly that you have reading comprehension problems, perhaps that is the issue. One thing is crystal clear. Hamonic was not on the NHL's list of unvaccinated players, and there has never been a source or proof that he is not vaccinated. I like to look for the best in people, and assume he is hesitant to play because it may put his daughter at risk. I'm not sure how that is making up an excuse. I imagine you don't have children, and can't comprehend the worry and fear that he may have. This is clearly a complicated and difficult situation for his family, and I'm not ready to burn him at the stake for not disclosing his family's personal situation.

The caveat for that list was that it was players "currently in the NHL", which hamonic was not. I really, really hope it isn't a case of choosing not to be vaccinated. But, even so, it's a very strange situation where he signed a contract and then decided he didn't want to play. That isn't great.

 

[Mergatroidskittle]

I already posted the link. Look up. I have no idea what you're talking about when you say, "people like you." I'm not making up any excuses for anything. You've shown repeatedly that you have reading comprehension problems, perhaps that is the issue. One thing is crystal clear. Hamonic was not on the NHL's list of unvaccinated players, and there has never been a source or proof that he is not vaccinated. I like to look for the best in people, and assume he is hesitant to play because it may put his daughter at risk. I'm not sure how that is making up an excuse. I imagine you don't have children, and can't comprehend the worry and fear that he may have. This is clearly a complicated and difficult situation for his family, and I'm not ready to burn him at the stake for not disclosing his family's personal situation.

Which as you stated was not a source for the statement you originally made, also while not editing your comment, is spreading false information. Hmmm what kinda people could I be talking about?

 

[Chet Manley]

Maybe he doesn't want to risk dragging COVID home to his children? The vaccines won't prevent that.

 

[Mergatroidskittle]

I already posted the link. Look up. I have no idea what you're talking about when you say, "people like you." I'm not making up any excuses for anything. You've shown repeatedly that you have reading comprehension problems, perhaps that is the issue. One thing is crystal clear. Hamonic was not on the NHL's list of unvaccinated players, and there has never been a source or proof that he is not vaccinated. I like to look for the best in people, and assume he is hesitant to play because it may put his daughter at risk. I'm not sure how that is making up an excuse. I imagine you don't have children, and can't comprehend the worry and fear that he may have. This is clearly a complicated and difficult situation for his family, and I'm not ready to burn him at the stake for not disclosing his family's personal situation.

Another poster stated the reasons for that… hmm another excuse… when people have to reply with personal attacks like you are to try to strengthen their own aruments is very telling.

 

[vancityluongo]

Every one of us would sign that contract lol. Hamonic signed that contract on July 28th. There were 185 new cases in BC that day. As of the first day of training camp, there were 832 cases, and the trend of cases was on a significant spike up near the peak of the fourth wave with no indication of a decline.

Makes perfect sense to me why he'd opt-out for the short term. Things looked better in July. Yeah, he signed the contract, but maybe that's what this is about; he's agreed to not be paid until he feels comfortable to play. That's being a hell of a lot more accountable for his own personal circumstance than a lot of politicians. At least Hamonic wasn't out there in July declaring COVID over.

 

[sh724]

Hamonic had the option to opt of playing this season and chose not to opt out. This would indicate he intended to play this season at the time of the opt out deadline.

There was an article in the Vancouver Sun about a week ago that said Hamonic didnt report to camp due to the NHLs covid policies.

Whatever is going on has been on going since prior to training camp.

The statement by the team says its a "leave of absence" other reports say its an unpaid suspension

The team was aware of the situation when they chose to waive Hamonic and were most likely aware he would not report

The team could have granted a "leave of absence" instead of waiving him

Conclusion: there is not one. No one really knows what is going on. We know his daughter has an illness. We know Hamonic wanted to be out west to be closer to his family. He may or may not be vaccinated. He may or may not be worried about bringing Covid home. This may or may not have anything to do with Covid.

One thing we do know is that Hamonic has not gone into the players assistance program so that does limit what it could potentially be we still dont really know what is going on.

 

[SI90]

I fully support Hammer. I also understand the Canucks doing this.

You won’t find a guy with more character than Hamonic. His decision are based on the health of his loved ones.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I feel like it's kinda obvious what's going on here:

1. Hamonic has an immunocompromised daughter that is too young to get the COVID-19 vaccine
2. His daughter was hospitalized at 8 months old in 2019 due to a respiratory illness, which is why he opted out of the bubble in 2020
3. Vancouver had a nasty outbreak of COVID-19 last season, where 21 of 25 players caught COVID including Hamonic
4. Vaccines aren't 100% effective, so there is still the risk of Hamonic catching COVID and giving it to his daughter

I feel like it's fairly obvious: he's terrified of his daughter getting COVID-19 and doesn't think the risk of him playing is worth it. I imagine the outbreak last season was a real wake up call for him, where he basically decided playing during the pandemic isn't worth the risk even with vaccines.

 

[tarheelhockey]

You gonna force him to get the flu shot as well? Yes I understand one is more dangerous than the other, but the idea is the same as in neither shot prevents catching or transmitting the illness.

I would absolutely, 100% expect an NHL team to tell its players they are required to get the flu shot. And absolutely, 100% expect them to comply unless they had a very specific reason not to do so.

I mean, is this really even a question? Do teams not do this already? If so they're being pretty dumb about inviting midseason flu outbreaks...

Thanks once again for talking down to people since you are so high and mighty. I understand quite well that a consequence of not doing what an employer requests can result in termination. I've worked in the legal field long enough to know, but I appreciate your sage wisdom. I find the idea of forcing something upon someone that involves anything involving their health and well-being to Orwellian in scope. He deserves the right to refuse it and it's asinine to suggest otherwise or that he, or anyone, should lose their livelihood over a decision about their personal health.

Had this been a true vaccine where it was proven to completely eliminate coming down with Covid or spreading it, then I'd see the mandate having more teeth as in stopping a health crisis for the greater good. Despite that I would never support it being mandated. An adult can decide for themselves. I'm only saying had it been a true vaccine in the sense of the polio vaccine, I could see why people were in favor.

If you "worked in the legal field" in the sense of actually being responsible for legal decisions, you'd not be conflating the right to refuse it with the right to keep his job. His job specifically involves not just maintaining his physical health, but also being available for international travel. If he is going to exercise his right to refuse the vaccine, then he forfeits his right to be employed in a position with said responsibilities.

Just like I have a right to drink a bottle of hard liquor at 6:58pm, and I have a right to make money piloting a commercial airplane at 7:00pm, but I don't have the right to do both. If I decide to take a stand on one right, I'm forfeiting the other.

Again -- this isn't hard to grasp. Especially for someone who "works in the legal field".

 

[Static]

I feel like it's kinda obvious what's going on here:

1. Hamonic has an immunocompromised daughter that is too young to get the COVID-19 vaccine
2. His daughter was hospitalized at 8 months old in 2019 due to a respiratory illness, which is why he opted out of the bubble in 2020
3. Vancouver had a nasty outbreak of COVID-19 last season, where 21 of 25 players caught COVID including Hamonic
4. Vaccines aren't 100% effective, so there is still the risk of Hamonic catching COVID and giving it to his daughter

I feel like it's fairly obvious: he's terrified of his daughter getting COVID-19 and doesn't think the risk of him playing is worth it. I imagine the outbreak last season was a real wake up call for him, where he basically decided playing during the pandemic isn't worth the risk even with vaccines.

Then why did he sign the contract? Did he sign it in bad faith?