Salary Cap: Ham juice?

[mpp9]

McGinn's back issues is the primary reason I said "holy crap, no thanks" to that contract. I wouldn't want the Pens to commit that long for a guy with serious injury issues, that could become Horton 2.0. I also think Hagelin is a little overpaid, but only by like half a million or maybe a little more.

The most I'd go with McGinn is probably 2 years at $3.25 million per. It's a moot point though, McGinn really doesn't fit what we need very well. I don't think we could bring him in plus bringing in an appropriate winger for Crosby and fixing the D (if we decide to do that). He'd be really nice on our 3rd line though, just not at what he'll cost.

Well, you could deal Pouliot for a longterm solution for Sid's LW. Deal a pick for Schultz. And see if you could flip Cole+pick for McGinn. Deal Kunitz in the summer if McGinn is healthy in the playoffs and looks like a fit.

 

[SEALBound]

Well, you could deal Pouliot for a longterm solution for Sid's LW. Deal a pick for Schultz. And see if you could flip Cole+pick for McGinn. Deal Kunitz in the summer if McGinn is healthy in the playoffs and looks like a fit.

Pouliot, Kunitz, and Cole out for Schultz and McGinn in...yikes. Not sure I would do that to be honest.

I would do Kunitz for McGinn. Or Cole for McGinn. Don't want Schultz unless its part of a larger package that demands we take him back. Unless it's a Kunitz/Cole for Schultz...

I'd be more interested in Foligno from Buffalo as a long term 3/4LW.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Well, you could deal Pouliot for a longterm solution for Sid's LW. Deal a pick for Schultz. And see if you could flip Cole+pick for McGinn. Deal Kunitz in the summer if McGinn is healthy in the playoffs and looks like a fit.

I'd much rather keep Pouliot, the Pens need as many young players on ELCs as they can get and their D prospect pool is already horrendous. Pouliot has also looked very solid in the NHL so far for us.

The Pens are in the crappy situation of having multiple holes (as in 2 or 3 holes) to fill but not having the assets to fill them. I think they'll try to move Bonino or Fehr for wing help this summer, but that's not a guarantee. I'm also not sure what teams would be very interested in Bonino for a winger swap, most teams already have a defensively responsible, 30 point 3C. My guess is that we have to do something like draft picks and prospects for RFA rights if we want to get a young winger this summer.

 

[Shady Machine]

Cole played like a legitimate #4D down the stretch for us last year, I don't really know how that's debatable. The fact that the Pens D sucks this year is irrelevant from the fact that he played very well last year for us. On his best days, he's a #4 because that's where he was at his best last year. He doesn't play at that level nearly enough to justify the contract he has right now, so I think we're stuck with him.

Although then again, if Scuderi can be moved, Cole probably could be moved too. Idk, it doesn't seem like there's such a thing as an untradeable player in the NHL today.

It's very debatable. Our defense was really bad when he was playing top 4 minutes. That doesn't make him a number 4.

 

[Shady Machine]

I could see the logic in picking up Schultz if you're dealing Pouliot. Otherwise, nope.

As for McGinn getting 4 mil for 3-4 years. That's Hagelin's deal. And I'd put them as similar caliber players with just different styles of games.

So we should have two highly paid tweeners? It might be a reasonable deal in terms of the market, but the Pens can't afford that.

 

[SEALBound]

I'd much rather keep Pouliot, the Pens need as many young players on ELCs as they can get and their D prospect pool is already horrendous. Pouliot has also looked very solid in the NHL so far for us.

The Pens are in the crappy situation of having multiple holes (as in 2 or 3 holes) to fill but not having the assets to fill them. I think they'll try to move Bonino or Fehr for wing help this summer, but that's not a guarantee. I'm also not sure what teams would be very interested in Bonino for a winger swap, most teams already have a defensively responsible, 30 point 3C. My guess is that we have to do something like draft picks and prospects for RFA rights if we want to get a young winger this summer.

It's these kind of realizations that make you more and more aware of how crippling the Despres trade really way.

The lack of a 1st this year will hurt us as well which makes holding on to the 2 2nds that much more important unless a no brainer deal pops up. Hudler for a 2nd type deals are how we got to where we are now.

 

[Empoleon8771]

It's very debatable. Our defense was really bad when he was playing top 4 minutes. That doesn't make him a number 4.

That's not at all relevant to how well he was playing. He was playing like a #4 last year, without a doubt. He was very solid for us. I'm not saying he was a #4 because he was in the #4 role, I'm saying he was a #4 because he played like a #4.

 

[Shady Machine]

Pouliot, Kunitz, and Cole out for Schultz and McGinn in...yikes. Not sure I would do that to be honest.

I would do Kunitz for McGinn. Or Cole for McGinn. Don't want Schultz unless its part of a larger package that demands we take him back. Unless it's a Kunitz/Cole for Schultz...

I'd be more interested in Foligno from Buffalo as a long term 3/4LW.

I think you missed the incoming longterm LW for Pouliot. He didn't list names, but I get the idea I just disagree. We don't need to be paying 4MM for a 3rd line left wing when we have a bunch of AHL guys that could probably fit into that spot and do adequately well.

If you are going home run for young LW by using Pouliot, you will probably need extra cap space to go bring in a top 4 D in free agency not overpaying for a 3rd liner.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

A Winnik is not putting us over the top. Unless it's a 1:1 for a Cole or Kunitz, stupid trade. Don't spend assets on rental or non impact players. We've tried that for 7 years and it doesn't work. Ever.

This is pretty much exactly what I said so I'm not sure what the rebuttal is.

Also just because we've done it wrong doesn't mean to just never do rental deals again. Not saying this year necessarily, but teams do it every year. You just have to not make stupid trades.

 

[Shady Machine]

That's not at all relevant to how well he was playing. He was playing like a #4 last year, without a doubt. He was very solid for us. I'm not saying he was a #4 because he was in the #4 role, I'm saying he was a #4 because he played like a #4.

Okay. I don't really want to get into word wars about a #4 because it's meaningless. You saying he was a #4 without a doubt, without elaborating and me disagreeing is arguing nothing for the sake of probably nothing.

Cole was pretty solid last year and JR paid for that player. He didn't get that player this year and now it's probably time to look at moving him.

 

[mpp9]

So we should have two highly paid tweeners? It might be a reasonable deal in terms of the market, but the Pens can't afford that.

If you told me we could replace Dupuis and Kunitz with McGinn and Hagelin in the offseason, I'd be happy.

We moved a pending UFA in Perron for Hagelin. And could likely recoup whatever we send out for McGinn by dealing Kunitz in the offseason.

McGinn's health is definitely a factor, and I wouldn't blame anyone for not wanting to give the guy 4 years. But he's been healthy this season. If he's brought in and fits in well, I keep him.

 

[PensandCaps]

Im for just GIVING someone cole for a 7th...

 

[PensandCaps]

If you told me we could replace Dupuis and Kunitz with McGinn and Hagelin in the offseason, I'd be happy.

We moved a pending UFA in Perron for Hagelin. And could likely recoup whatever we send out for McGinn by dealing Kunitz in the offseason.

Nobody wants kuntz, hes trash. Wed have to give a pick for someone to take him and his cap hit.

 

[mpp9]

Nobody wants kuntz, hes trash. Wed have to give a pick for someone to take him and his cap hit.

Sure.

 

[SEALBound]

Nobody wants kuntz, hes trash. Wed have to give a pick for someone to take him and his cap hit.

Nah, he has value. If all you wanted back with a 4th, he'd go quick. 1st, not so quick. Hard to judge he value. Not zero, but not high.

If you told me we could replace Dupuis and Kunitz with McGinn and Hagelin in the offseason, I'd be happy.

We moved a pending UFA in Perron for Hagelin. And could likely recoup whatever we send out for McGinn by dealing Kunitz in the offseason.

McGinn's health is definitely a factor, and I wouldn't blame anyone for not wanting to give the guy 4 years. But he's been healthy this season. If he's brought in and fits in well, I keep him.

Yeah if you told me Dupuis and Scuderi would be off the roster by mid year I would have been skeptical.

McGinn worries me. Mostly because of Bennett. Don't want another Bennett here.

This is pretty much exactly what I said so I'm not sure what the rebuttal is.

Also just because we've done it wrong doesn't mean to just never do rental deals again. Not saying this year necessarily, but teams do it every year. You just have to not make stupid trades.

Was agreeing.

 

[Penske]

The way our team is set up I think Pouliot should be kept. That and he's going to be a good player still and has elite passing skills.

To fill the LW hole I'd rather trade Sprong+. It'll have to be a cheap winger so we have at least a chance to get a D man in the summer.

I'd love to get Drouin and Byfuglien.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

The way our team is set up I think Pouliot should be kept. That and he's going to be a good player still and has elite passing skills.

To fill the LW hole I'd rather trade Sprong+. It'll have to be a cheap winger so we have at least a chance to get a D man in the summer.

I'd love to get Drouin and Byfuglien.

Pouliot will be interesting the rest of the year and the start of next year. I think he's definitely made real improvement defensively. Like night and day so far. On the other hand I haven't seen the offensive flare he had. This is understandable given the mind set they probably want him in for now, and eventually he'll bring it all together at the NHL level. The question will be how good he actually is once that happens.

I'm 50/50 on trading Sprong. He's a little small but other than that he's just a standard 19 y/o prospect that needs to come into his own. It could be a critical player for us in 2-3 years, maybe even next year for all we know. At the same time I'm not penciling him in. There's still much to do before he's cemented as an NHL scorer.

 

[PensandCaps]

8 points in 6 games for perron.....the ****. Why couldn't he do that here with 2 elite centres

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

8 points in 6 games for perron.....the ****. Why couldn't he do that here with 2 elite centres

He just fits better there, Getzlaf and Perry aren't nearly as fast as Geno and Sid and his puck skills compliments them better.

Same can be said for Hagelin, he scored I think 12 points in 40 some games there and has 5 in 6 here.

 

[Speaking Moistly]

All I want is Boedker in free agency. Trade Kunitz, play Sprong, play Rust, probably play Sundqvist and possibly trade Bonino + for a defenseman.

Boedker-Crosby-Hornqvist
Hagelin-Malkin-Kessel
Rust-Fehr-Sprong
Cullen/X-Sundqvist-Bennett
Plotnikov, forever alone and watching.

Maatta-Letang
Dumoulin-Daley/Acquired
Pouliot-Daley/Acquired

 

[BeautiPhil]

So Cole played like a passable #4 for 18 games and has ranged from a mediocre 6 to a bad 7 for the other 200+ games of his career, and that some how makes him a #4?

 

[Merc29]

8 points in 6 games for perron.....the ****. Why couldn't he do that here with 2 elite centres

People seem to forget the guy had like 7 goal or something in the first five games with us then disappeared. He does this with every team he joins.

 

[Fordy]

People seem to forget the guy had like 7 goal or something in the first five games with us then disappeared. He does this with every team he joins.

lol you seriously believe this a real trend? it's literally happened once, he only played for two teams before the pens and he was successful on both of them over a long period of time

we all said it, wherever perron goes he will rebound. i do not believe he will fall off a cliff in anaheim like he did here because they're probably gonna keep using him as he should be

 

[Riptide]

http://sabres.buffalonews.com/2016/02/05/sabres-gm-tim-murray-may-have-mcginn-stick-around/



Holy crap that's for McGinn, no thanks.

I said a while ago he'd likely be 3-4m with some term. Doesn't really surprise me. Keep in mind, that quote isn't coming from Murray, but the writer who's speculating. But he currently makes 3m (2.95m cap hit). Do you really see him not asking for a raise?

Just another reason why Rutherford will not want to trade Kunitz as long as he's doing half ass decently.

 

[Riptide]

McGinn's back issues is the primary reason I said "holy crap, no thanks" to that contract. I wouldn't want the Pens to commit that long for a guy with serious injury issues, that could become Horton 2.0. I also think Hagelin is a little overpaid, but only by like half a million or maybe a little more.

The most I'd go with McGinn is probably 2 years at $3.25 million per. It's a moot point though, McGinn really doesn't fit what we need very well. I don't think we could bring him in plus bringing in an appropriate winger for Crosby and fixing the D (if we decide to do that). He'd be really nice on our 3rd line though, just not at what he'll cost.

There's almost no chance we can both bring in a winger for Crosby and fix the D. We might be able to bring in someone like McGinn who could be a better fit even if he's not a "top 6 winger" and fix the D. Unlikely, as it would probably mean we moved Daley, Cole and Kunitz and signed a couple of UFA's to great contracts, but I guess it's possible.