Rumor: Habs talking with Simon Gagne (UPD: Habs say no per 98.5)

[Lshap]

And Briere and Bouillon are what exactly?

Unfortunately, we still have some leftovers in the fantasy-fridge...

 

[Lshap]

It's fun to see how 33 year old Gagne can't bounce back but 31 year old Gorges can't be in decline and is just in his prime and his value can't go down in a 2 year span.

I'd say this : Gagne is 3 time the game changer that Gorges is even right now.

Gagne was a very good player, much less so now. As has been said, he's four years older than Gorges and has been chronically injured the last two years. He's no longer a top-six forward. Putting a Habs jersey on his back won't suddenly give him back his scoring touch.

A one-year deal might've made sense; more than that cripples our team's budget and roster space.

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

Unfortunately, we still have some leftovers in the fantasy-fridge...

With a tinge of foresight and ambition neither Bouillon, Briere nor Murray would have a spot on this roster.

Briere had pretty much the same production as Gagne and got 4m and a NMC. He's older, smaller and has just as many injury question marks as Gagne. Not to mention the way he rejected the Habs earlier.

Yet the Bergevin [supporters] will minimize the risks of Briere's signing "because it's a stop gap!!" and claim that we're still on track. On track for what? God if I know - but it ain't the cup. Not with Bouillon, Drewiskie and Murray on the PK and Therrien as coach.

It's not about Gagne, I said he doesn't fit from the get-go, it's about how poorly we're being managed and how deluded our fans have gotten. Shades of Sideshow Bob Gainey all over again.

 

[JohnLennon]

With a tinge of foresight and ambition neither Bouillon, Briere nor Murray would have a spot on this roster.

Briere had pretty much the same production as Gagne and got 4m and a NMC. He's older, smaller and has just as many injury question marks as Gagne. Not to mention the way he rejected the Habs earlier.

Yet the Bergevin [supporters] will minimize the risks of Briere's signing "because it's a stop gap!!" and claim that we're still on track. On track for what? God if I know - but it ain't the cup. Not with Bouillon, Drewiskie and Murray on the PK and Therrien as coach.

It's not about Gagne, I said he doesn't fit from the get-go, it's about how poorly we're being managed and how deluded our fans have gotten. Shades of Sideshow Bob Gainey all over again.

I completely agree on the topic of Bouillon and to an extent Briere as well, but what's wrong with the Murray signing?

With Emelin out, we don't have much of a physical presence on the back end. Not to mention our penalty kill was 23rd in the league last year. Murray is a great physical player and an excellent penalty killer. The way I see it, it fills two needs and provides us with some veteran depth, which is always good on the back end.

A one year contract for $1.5 million is nothing to complain about when it directly fills a need.

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

I completely agree on the topic of Bouillon and to an extent Briere as well, but what's wrong with the Murray signing?

I cheered the Murray signing for the reasons your listed but the problem is a systematic one - Murray is a patch, a declining poor-skating patch, where this organization should be looking at changing the build of the team at a fundamental level.

Bouillon, Briere and Murray are all indicative of the same problem.

 

[Bob b smith]

Josh Gorges everywhere all the time...

 

[Monctonscout]

With a tinge of foresight and ambition neither Bouillon, Briere nor Murray would have a spot on this roster.

Briere had pretty much the same production as Gagne and got 4m and a NMC. He's older, smaller and has just as many injury question marks as Gagne. Not to mention the way he rejected the Habs earlier.

Yet the Bergevin [supporters] will minimize the risks of Briere's signing "because it's a stop gap!!" and claim that we're still on track. On track for what? God if I know - but it ain't the cup. Not with Bouillon, Drewiskie and Murray on the PK and Therrien as coach.

It's not about Gagne, I said he doesn't fit from the get-go, it's about how poorly we're being managed and how deluded our fans have gotten. Shades of Sideshow Bob Gainey all over again.

I think Briere has a lot more left in the tank than Gagne. He's had one productive year in the last 6.

Not sure where you get that Murray Bouillon and Drewiske are part of the long term future. They are there as stop gaps to allow young guys to play big minutes and develop AHL, not play 15 minutes a night or sit in the press box.

Not sure how any of that is bad management. Those 3 d-men will provide a loot of production and cost less than 4 mil COMBINED. I'd like to know how that's bad mangement.

 

[Lshap]

I cheered the Murray signing for the reasons your listed but the problem is a systematic one - Murray is a patch, a declining poor-skating patch, where this organization should be looking at changing the build of the team at a fundamental level.

Bouillon, Briere and Murray are all indicative of the same problem.

It's not the same systemic problem because none of these patches have long-term contracts. The previous admins dogged us with long, expensive commitments to mid-tier players. Bergevin hasn't done that and will probably dump some of the remaining big contracts in a year. The Briere contract was his worst move, but he, Bouillon and Murray will be off the books in two years. By then, the team will be ready to add the new wave of bigger, more talented prospects.

 

[beowulf]

I cheered the Murray signing for the reasons your listed but the problem is a systematic one - Murray is a patch, a declining poor-skating patch, where this organization should be looking at changing the build of the team at a fundamental level.

Bouillon, Briere and Murray are all indicative of the same problem.

So under your plan all the young guys should be thrown into the lineup all at once and sink or swim? How is that working out for the Oilers?

 

[JohnLennon]

I cheered the Murray signing for the reasons your listed but the problem is a systematic one - Murray is a patch, a declining poor-skating patch, where this organization should be looking at changing the build of the team at a fundamental level.

Bouillon, Briere and Murray are all indicative of the same problem.

While Murray is indeed a patch, he is a cheap one and is only signed for this season. Not every need can be filled internally, and that lack of a physical presence could only be filled by an external signing.

Not everything we do needs to be an internal move. Signings and trades can benefit a team well, whether or not they are just patches. We needed a player to play big minutes on the penalty kill, we needed a player to make up for Emelin's hitting, and we've got him in Murray.

I can't see this as a bad move in any way.

 

[Arctic_Hab_Fan]

With a tinge of foresight and ambition neither Bouillon, Briere nor Murray would have a spot on this roster.

Briere had pretty much the same production as Gagne and got 4m and a NMC. He's older, smaller and has just as many injury question marks as Gagne. Not to mention the way he rejected the Habs earlier.
Yet the Bergevin [supporters] will minimize the risks of Briere's signing "because it's a stop gap!!" and claim that we're still on track. On track for what? God if I know - but it ain't the cup. Not with Bouillon, Drewiskie and Murray on the PK and Therrien as coach.

It's not about Gagne, I said he doesn't fit from the get-go, it's about how poorly we're being managed and how deluded our fans have gotten. Shades of Sideshow Bob Gainey all over again.

Bob would have drafted Zachary Fucale in the first round

 

[Agnostic]

Bob would have drafted Zachary Fucale in the first round

Gainey would never put another stud in the same barn as his prize thoroughbred.

 

[MrNasty]

With a tinge of foresight and ambition neither Bouillon, Briere nor Murray would have a spot on this roster.

Briere had pretty much the same production as Gagne and got 4m and a NMC. He's older, smaller and has just as many injury question marks as Gagne. Not to mention the way he rejected the Habs earlier.

Yet the Bergevin [supporters] will minimize the risks of Briere's signing "because it's a stop gap!!" and claim that we're still on track. On track for what? God if I know - but it ain't the cup. Not with Bouillon, Drewiskie and Murray on the PK and Therrien as coach.

It's not about Gagne, I said he doesn't fit from the get-go, it's about how poorly we're being managed and how deluded our fans have gotten. Shades of Sideshow Bob Gainey all over again.

you do realize that the current Stanley Cup champs signed vertans last year to compliment their core who became invaluable and played much bigger roles in the cup finals. If fans are scared of older more experienced players then they should stick to watching the AHL.

 

[vokiel]

Well thanks to the habs front office for making this into a lame duck. We really had no need whatsoever for Gagne. Had there been a spot on the left wing, it would have been a different story, but there's just no room with left shooting forwards overflowing.

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

you do realize that the current Stanley Cup champs signed vertans last year to compliment their core who became invaluable and played much bigger roles in the cup finals. If fans are scared of older more experienced players then they should stick to watching the AHL.

Drewiskie, Bouillon, Murray and Briere are washed up old nobodies. We have a playoff core but instead of trading some of the extra depth for some higher-end talent we keep spinning our wheels with mediocre-at-best players. That's my point.

I'm not saying throw the youth to the wolves, I'm saying that some rational, positive and creative team-building was required and we didn't get nearly enough of that with Gainey or Gauthier or Bergevin now.

Emelin and Diaz were great pick-ups, I'm talking about things like that. Finding valuable assets where we haven't looked yet. Trading for Drewiskie, signing Bouillon and so on are just the opposite of that. They're not only retreads but they're marginal players on a team that lacks both toughness and talent.

Our topline going into the season is Pacioretty - Desharnais - Briere. Is that a Stanley Cup winning top line? Do the Habs, the Forum Ghosts or the innumerable number of Habs fans deserve that as a top line?

Sure it's better than the Zednik - Koivu - old leather shoe combo of yesteryear but it's still not good enough. And it's been long enough, dammit.

 

[AntonCH]

Drewiskie, Bouillon, Murray and Briere are washed up old nobodies. We have a playoff core but instead of trading some of the extra depth for some higher-end talent we keep spinning our wheels with mediocre-at-best players. That's my point.

I'm not saying throw the youth to the wolves, I'm saying that some rational, positive and creative team-building was required and we didn't get nearly enough of that with Gainey or Gauthier or Bergevin now.

Emelin and Diaz were great pick-ups, I'm talking about things like that. Finding valuable assets where we haven't looked yet. Trading for Drewiskie, signing Bouillon and so on are just the opposite of that. They're not only retreads but they're marginal players on a team that lacks both toughness and talent.

Our topline going into the season is Pacioretty - Desharnais - Briere. Is that a Stanley Cup winning top line? Do the Habs, the Forum Ghosts or the innumerable number of Habs fans deserve that as a top line?

Sure it's better than the Zednik - Koivu - old leather shoe combo of yesteryear but it's still not good enough. And it's been long enough, dammit.

I think you're looking at the lines list upside down or out of order
Plekanec Bourque Gionta AND gally gally Eller say hi

 

[BigHabs]

Drewiskie, Bouillon, Murray and Briere are washed up old nobodies. We have a playoff core but instead of trading some of the extra depth for some higher-end talent we keep spinning our wheels with mediocre-at-best players. That's my point.

I'm not saying throw the youth to the wolves, I'm saying that some rational, positive and creative team-building was required and we didn't get nearly enough of that with Gainey or Gauthier or Bergevin now.

Emelin and Diaz were great pick-ups, I'm talking about things like that. Finding valuable assets where we haven't looked yet. Trading for Drewiskie, signing Bouillon and so on are just the opposite of that. They're not only retreads but they're marginal players on a team that lacks both toughness and talent.

Our topline going into the season is Pacioretty - Desharnais - Briere. Is that a Stanley Cup winning top line? Do the Habs, the Forum Ghosts or the innumerable number of Habs fans deserve that as a top line?

Sure it's better than the Zednik - Koivu - old leather shoe combo of yesteryear but it's still not good enough. And it's been long enough, dammit.

Bergevin is doing the right moves right now if you ask me. The signing of Murray is a good fill in guy with Emelin out who can stay in the lineup even after the return of Emelin.

Bergevin is going to get his hands on the team really good this upcoming offseason. Some could be re-signed but also let go.

Andrei Markov
Douglas Murray
Raphael Diaz
George Parros
Francis Boullion
Brian Gionta

All are FA's. Leaving all the core going forward and keeping adding muscle and skill to it. But having the budget and money to create the team how he wants it "bigger and stronger", kind of like the year that Gainey went on his shopping spree but went "speed and skill".

All RFA's re-signed in all likelihood.

We have quite a bit of cap space left With only 4 spots to fill.

FORWARDS
Max Pacioretty ($4.500m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / xxxx
Rene Bourque ($3.333m) / David Desharnais ($3.500m) / Danny Briere ($4.000m)
Alex Galchenyuk ($3.225m) / Lars Eller ($3.000m) / Brendan Gallagher ($1.500m)
Travis Moen ($1.850m) / Ryan White ($0.700m) / Brandon Prust ($2.500m)

DEFENSEMEN

P.K. Subban ($6.500m) / Josh Gorges ($3.900m)
Alexei Emelin ($2.800m) / Jarred Tinordi ($1.083m)
Davis Drewiske ($0.638m) / xxxx

GOALTENDERS

Carey Price ($6.500m)
Peter Budaj ($1.400m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $55,928,333; BONUSES: $2,512,500
CAP SPACE (18-man roster): $10,884,167

 

[Ohashi_Jouzu*]

Bergevin is doing the right moves right now if you ask me.

You realize that you just went through all that typing without commenting on a single player that the poster has issue with (and there are quite a few in there), right? Oh, except Bouillon got listed.

 

[dreamingofdrouin*]

With a tinge of foresight and ambition neither Bouillon, Briere nor Murray would have a spot on this roster.

Briere had pretty much the same production as Gagne and got 4m and a NMC. He's older, smaller and has just as many injury question marks as Gagne. Not to mention the way he rejected the Habs earlier.

Yet the Bergevin [supporters] will minimize the risks of Briere's signing "because it's a stop gap!!" and claim that we're still on track. On track for what? God if I know - but it ain't the cup. Not with Bouillon, Drewiskie and Murray on the PK and Therrien as coach.

It's not about Gagne, I said he doesn't fit from the get-go, it's about how poorly we're being managed and how deluded our fans have gotten. Shades of Sideshow Bob Gainey all over again.

With all due respect........Therrien as coach got us from 15th to 2nd.

Exactly what risks do you believe the briere signing has caused us. He's only signed for 2 years and at a very manageable cap hit for his production...not to mention the playoff production he brings. He's over a point per game! MOD

Who says bouillion drewiske and murray will be the PK. How about PK? Gorges? and why cant murray be a good PKer.

Do you have no faith in our prospects at all? Have you forgotten about beaulieu, tinordi, hudon, collberg, mccaron, de la rose, fucale, thomas? Have you sunk your head so far into the ground that you havent noticed the development of Galchenyuk, eller, gallagher, patches, SUBBAN!!?!? God almighty...we've had this gm for 1 year and your're already writing him off. **** sakes

 

[Lshap]

Drewiskie, Bouillon, Murray and Briere are washed up old nobodies. We have a playoff core but instead of trading some of the extra depth for some higher-end talent we keep spinning our wheels with mediocre-at-best players. That's my point.

I'm not saying throw the youth to the wolves, I'm saying that some rational, positive and creative team-building was required and we didn't get nearly enough of that with Gainey or Gauthier or Bergevin now.

Emelin and Diaz were great pick-ups, I'm talking about things like that. Finding valuable assets where we haven't looked yet. Trading for Drewiskie, signing Bouillon and so on are just the opposite of that. They're not only retreads but they're marginal players on a team that lacks both toughness and talent.

Our topline going into the season is Pacioretty - Desharnais - Briere. Is that a Stanley Cup winning top line? Do the Habs, the Forum Ghosts or the innumerable number of Habs fans deserve that as a top line?

Sure it's better than the Zednik - Koivu - old leather shoe combo of yesteryear but it's still not good enough. And it's been long enough, dammit.

As dreamingofdrouin said, we have a lot of legit 2nd and 3rd line talent coming up on our prospect pool. And it's BALANCED talent, with equal parts size, skill and speed. That's the kind of team we're building -- one built on balanced depth of talent and character.

No superstars however, aside from the hopeful emergence of Galchenyuk. We might end up with the best 2nd and 3rd lines in the league, and the weakest 1st-line. That's the direction our prospects are taking us, and it's a very different approach than we saw under Gainey. Under Gainey and Gauthier, the team was littered with 29-year-old semi-stars who were given big contracts and produced medium results. That quick-fix approach worked in spurts, like in 2010, but it ignored team chemistry, character and cap strategy. We saw short-term success, then it ended and we had nothing left but bad debt thanks to stupid contracts.

With our current youth, the strategy is to get the same results for less money and longer term. It's very much the Chicago/Los Angeles model of team-building, where you don't just fill spots, you grow together over time. Yes, both those teams supplemented their roster with key trades/acquisitions (Hossa, Carter, Richards), but I think Bergevin will probably make a move for another top-line player, unless it looks like one of our prospects might develop into one. We have an excellent offensive core developing over the next two/three years, and if a couple of our defense prospects develop well, we could have a very solid D core.

In a year or two, the spots given to Briere, Murray and Bouillon should be filled by rookies who are better, stronger, cheaper and younger. If that happens, Bergevin will have shown himself to be nothing like Gainey or Gauthier; he will have succeeded in building a real core that can improve together over time, and even have cap room to pursue a top UFA or trade.

 

[tinyzombies]

I think Briere has a lot more left in the tank than Gagne. He's had one productive year in the last 6.

Not sure where you get that Murray Bouillon and Drewiske are part of the long term future. They are there as stop gaps to allow young guys to play big minutes and develop AHL, not play 15 minutes a night or sit in the press box.

Not sure how any of that is bad management. Those 3 d-men will provide a loot of production and cost less than 4 mil COMBINED. I'd like to know how that's bad mangement.

Gagne was very effective in the games he played for LA to close out the finals and was good for Philly. As a one-year signing, I would have been all for it.

Team is way too small. I'm not a Desharnais fan. Gionta should be moved as soon as he's healthy. Ditch those two and Cube and sign Gagne and this is a much better playoff team on paper...

This could be Markov's last year here, and if he's 15% better than last year, we could be wasting a chance to contend because we are too small. So, sign Morrow too.

Pacioretty - Plekanec - Briere (Gagne-Plekanec-Bourque if we want power-vs-power line)
Gagne - Eller - Bourque (much better RWer than LWer)
Morrow - Galchenyuk - Gallagher
Moen - Prust - Parros
White

Gorges - Subban
Markov - Emelin
Murray/Tinordi? - Diaz

 

[Monctonscout]

Gagne was very effective in the games he played for LA to close out the finals and was good for Philly. As a one-year signing, I would have been all for it.

Team is way too small. I'm not a Desharnais fan. Gionta should be moved as soon as he's healthy. Ditch those two and Cube and sign Gagne and this is a much better playoff team on paper...

This could be Markov's last year here, and if he's 15% better than last year, we could be wasting a chance to contend because we are too small. So, sign Morrow too.

Pacioretty - Plekanec - Briere (Gagne-Plekanec-Bourque if we want power-vs-power line)
Gagne - Eller - Bourque (much better RWer than LWer)
Morrow - Galchenyuk - Gallagher
Moen - Prust - Parros
White

Gorges - Subban
Markov - Emelin
Murray/Tinordi? - Diaz

Gagne was useless in LA, that's why they gave him to Phillie. The only reason Phillie had any interest is because they had a few guys injured. Putting him on a 1st or 2nd line is a joke. We have 9 forwards better than him, 10 if you include Prust.

The size thing is way overblown. Plus a lot of the small guys won't be here when MB's cup window opens anyways. Briere and Gionta for sure, DD I expect to be traded once Galchenyuk is moved to center. Bouillon is possibly in his last year.

If Markov is 15% better he'll probably get a new contract.

 

[AntonCH]

Gagne was useless in LA, that's why they gave him to Phillie. The only reason Phillie had any interest is because they had a few guys injured. Putting him on a 1st or 2nd line is a joke. We have 9 forwards better than him, 10 if you include Prust.

The size thing is way overblown. Plus a lot of the small guys won't be here when MB's cup window opens anyways. Briere and Gionta for sure, DD I expect to be traded once Galchenyuk is moved to center. Bouillon is possibly in his last year.

If Markov is 15% better he'll probably get a new contract.

This about sums it up
We're not at our cup window, we're building to it
Gionta will most likely be traded or allowed to walk
DD may be traded OR the decision may be made that he's good enough to assume 2C duties and Pleks goes
Briere's departure likely coincides with the opening or near opening of our window. He will be replaced by better - Collberg anyone?
Bouillon will net us a 3rd rounder this year or he will walk, too much youth on the way for the D.
As for Markov, 2 more years at a reduced role and hit is fine by me. Nothing wrong with a PP specialist of his calibre