Post-Game Talk: Habs lose in Carolina

[WeThreeKings]

I think the being stuck in between is taking a toll. We've decided to try and eek out as many points as possible with the little talent we do have. The problem is the product is still very inferior. Meanwhile we see a parade of talent pass us by going to teams who already have more talent than we do.
The "Oh it's okay it's a deep draft " doesn't cut it and it feels like we have blown our opportunity to rebuild properly.

They aren't stuck in between. They started a rebuild two seasons ago when they fired Bergevin at the end of 2021. Since that day we have picked 1st overall and 5th overall with our own picks. We drafted Mesar in the 1st round of 2022 as well, and picked two players in the 2nd round that year. They also used additional picks acquired through the rebuild to acquire Kirby Dach and Alex Newhook.

In addition to that, we are still selling what we can, we have 4 picks in the first 3 rounds this year, 6 picks in the first 3 rounds next year and 22 picks in total over those drafts. That's without what will be acquired in the trades coming up this year.

The product is still inferior because you don't see players from drafts in your NHL team 2 years out of it very commonly. Those guys have to develop into NHL players and then develop as NHLers first. Perspective is needed to really understand what a rebuild is, what it looks like, how long it takes and what that process will look like.

I don't see how it would feel like we've blown our opportunity to rebuild properly when we are in year "3" (I say 3 in quotations because it's really 2.5 since Bergevin had part of the first year and made dumb moves like Dvorak). You'd need the biggest luck of all luck (Pittsburgh getting Malkin, Crosby, Staal and Fleury in successive drafts) to get out of a rebuild in 5 years.. typically its' 6-8 years. So there's plenty of time for the rebuild to go properly.

The other part of your post I'd like to highlight is 'talent going to teams who already have talent', isn't that kind of showing that what Hughes, Gorton and MSL are doing is important too? That having talent and putting it into a losing culture, with no expectations and no attempt to do anything but accumulate draft picks and surround them with bad coaching, weak development structures and give them nothing to help them out when they are close to the play-offs, is a bad situation?

I could care less if Columbus, Buffalo and Ottawa pick 1-2-3, those teams have picked in the top end of drafts with multiple top round picks forever and are still worse than us. There's a belief in some of the formulated core already and that will grow as we add more talent and develop more players. There's no belief in those other rooms and they're just loser orgs, frankly.

It's a recurring theme with this organization. The Mclaren - Zednik hit , the Pacioretty hit , Kreider on Price , the humiliation against the Bruins when Carbo decided to not dress Laraque and i could go on and on

This org is too "PG" while it should be more Rated R. When that kind of stuff happens you need to answer there and now...not 10 mins later with a staged fight between 2 4th liners or even worse not at all.

It's not really a recurring theme if you're going back to the 90s and early 2000s. This team has shown over the last few years way more pushback.. in fact the team pushed back many times in their cup finals run, as well.

Gorton knows they need to address toughness and I don't think they've ignored it at all. They just picked Florian Xhekaj because of that element he brings. I don't think there's a lack of toughness with guys like Guhle, Struble, Xhekaj etc. on the back end.

I don't know what happened in this particular instance but it looked like everyone was unsure of what happened more than they didn't want to get involved.

Elliotte Friedman rightfully ripping the team for the lack of response to the Slaf hit.

He's right. They were gutless.

They are saying they didn't see what happened.. it might be an excuse.. but I have a big problem with Pezzetta who is useless on a good day, doing nothing when he got back out there.

Remember when we all thought MSL was a breath of fresh air? He is the same as all the other coaches. Team is soft, not, committed and don't stand up for one another. Nothing to be excited about going forward.

This is completely untrue and I'd welcome you to watch an Ottawa Senators game or a Toronto Maple Leafs game.

Time to bring up Xhekaj, so he can whoop that punk ass Noesen next time we play against them

Time to tell Pezzetta to do his f***ing job or fire him into the sun.

 

[sandviper]

That's how Jeff Gorton builds his teams

Once his contract runs out, we’re signing Reeves to his 40+ year old contract.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

32 thoughts roasting the Habs for being soft and not doing anything, but gave credit to Caufield for kind of doing something.

Habs are soft gotta bring Xhekaj up and get rid of a bottom 6 forward and add more toughness.

 

[ReHabs]

32 thoughts roasting the Habs for being soft and not doing anything, but gave credit to Caufield for kind of doing something.

Habs are soft gotta bring Xhekaj up and get rid of a bottom 6 forward and add more toughness.

Interrupting Wifi's development in order to make-up for the ultra-soft roster is short-sighted imo. Since he's failed to do his job, Pezz has to be waived and some tough players need to be acquired (they're cheap enough). Wifi should play big minutes in the AHL for the time being, it's in all our greater interests.

The question is which tough guys would help? Can we get a Nic Deslauriers or two?

 

[habdynasty]

Get Reevo. No one messes with the leaves with Reevo in the press box lol. The nhl is soft now. It ain’t going back to the 70s either.

 

[ReHabs]

Get Reevo. No one messes with the leaves with Reevo in the press box lol. The nhl is soft now. It ain’t going back to the 70s either.

Reaves is a clown and the Leafs made a big mistake signing him. But the Habs are a rebuilding team with a lot of young players and a lot of vulnerable players. A guy who can check and isn't afraid to fight and can skate well is a worthwhile figure to have in the lineup every night.

The Leafs are different, they're optimised and cap-maxxed and need to build a team for the siege of the playoffs. Reaves was a bad fit from the get go.

 

[The Real Timo]

Just as gutless is a complicit media not holding management to account.

I remember when Gorton was just announced as VP etc there was this one caller on the d'chez nous radio station who was literally in crisis, hysterical that Habs went with Gorton. I mean his reason was different than what we are discussing, (moudit anglo, 'sti) but in the nutshell he was right to freak out. This isn't looking good.

 

[jrom]

Elliotte Friedman rightfully ripping the team for the lack of response to the Slaf hit.

He's right. They were gutless.

He made a good point that MSL was a tough player but for MSL being tough was scoring despite being slashed, elbowed or tripped, didn’t complain.

So that may work for him but clearly not helping with the team toughness.

Honestly it also starts with Slaf, he has to know people are targeting him with both legal and dubious checks and they will keep doing it until something changes (like elbowing the next dude taking a run at him so they start thinking twice before doing it).

 

[salbutera]

I remember when Gorton was just announced as VP etc there was this one caller on the d'chez nous radio station who was literally in crisis, hysterical that Habs went with Gorton. I mean his reason was different than what we are discussing, (moudit anglo, 'sti) but in the nutshell he was right to freak out. This isn't looking good.

Based on what… 1-game? Really?

 

[jrom]

I don’t see it that way.

Last year he got rocked several times because he wasn’t paying attention. This year he seems to have corrected that mistake.

Last night it looked like a play where he was aware of the player coming in but was willing to take a hit to make the play. What he was not expecting was a headshot. That was a highly hit to the head. In my opinion it was suspension worthy and I was disappointed that it wasn’t called for a penalty. Dirty hit.

Agreed but like I tell my kids, if the light is green it doesn’t mean you can cross the road. It only means it’s supposed to be your your turn but make sure the cars are respecting their red light before you cross.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Agreed but like I tell my kids, if the light is green it doesn’t mean you can cross the road. It only means it’s supposed to be your your turn but make sure the cars are respecting their red light before you cross.

Again, you can’t anticipate a dirty hit. Folks take hits to make plays all the time. If it wasn’t a headshot we wouldn’t have even remembered the hit.

 

[nhlfan9191]

Again, you can’t anticipate a dirty hit. Folks take hits to make plays all the time. If it wasn’t a headshot we wouldn’t have even remembered the hit.

He can’t make that play. It’s suicide. That’s all that needs to be said. We should be glad he wasn’t hurt worse.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

He can’t make that play. It’s suicide. That’s all that needs to be said. We should be glad he wasn’t hurt worse.

If it’s a hit to the chest, the other guy bounces off and we arent even talking about it.

 

[nhlfan9191]

If it’s a hit to the chest, the other guy bounces off and we arent even talking about it.

You don’t expose yourself to vulnerable positions as a player. He opened himself up to get railed. And it wasn’t suspension worthy or anything out of the norm. It was a terrible play on Slaf’s part. He can’t continue doing it.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Interrupting Wifi's development in order to make-up for the ultra-soft roster is short-sighted imo. Since he's failed to do his job, Pezz has to be waived and some tough players need to be acquired (they're cheap enough). Wifi should play big minutes in the AHL for the time being, it's in all our greater interests.

The question is which tough guys would help? Can we get a Nic Deslauriers or two?

Deslauriers would be great.

MacEwen isn't very tough, but he's not afraid to do stupid stuff and you'd probably get paid to take him.

Luke Kunin from San Jose should be an option to look at.

Nashville might move Trenin, but he would be expensive.

There's McCarron as a 4th line centre should the Habs move on from Evans.

Kastelic has low end offense, but everything else is OK for a 4th line centre.

There's teams with tougher players who aren't great, but don't want to deal them because you still need toughness.

 

[Catanddogguitarrr]

He made a good point that MSL was a tough player but for MSL being tough was scoring despite being slashed, elbowed or tripped, didn’t complain.

So that may work for him but clearly not helping with the team toughness.

Honestly it also starts with Slaf, he has to know people are targeting him with both legal and dubious checks and they will keep doing it until something changes (like elbowing the next dude taking a run at him so they start thinking twice before doing it).

This team looks like it's still runned by Ronald Corey. PG is the word and we're defenitivly not R. Seems like there's a lobbying of upper class cocktail schrimp caviar type who doesn't want Habs team looks like a wild bunch of hard hitters ya know, refuse to go back to the outragious '70s.

Deslauriers would be great.

MacEwen isn't very tough, but he's not afraid to do stupid stuff and you'd probably get paid to take him.

Luke Kunin from San Jose should be an option to look at.

Nashville might move Trenin, but he would be expensive.

There's McCarron as a 4th line centre should the Habs move on from Evans.

Kastelic has low end offense, but everything else is OK for a 4th line centre.

There's teams with tougher players who aren't great, but don't want to deal them because you still need toughness.

For sure we need to look at other options than Pezz.

 

[iamtalbot]

Tankers want more games like this, where the team gets physically dominated and humiliated

well, when I see making the playoffs is highly unlikely, I still want the team to play well, to play tough, to look consistent and structured, and be fun to watch, but ultimately end up losing 3-2 or 4-3 in regulation.

I mean ideally we're WINNING those games, but the roster is not ready to compete in the playoffs so hey, a win is nice, a well played game but lost in regulation is still nice in a long term view way.

getting dominated physically, looking like the Keystone cops running around in circles chasing the play, watching our young guys get hurt, ya that I hate to see.

 

[le_sean]

Oops delete

 

[NORiculous]

Interrupting Wifi's development

What?

How is sending him to Laval interrupting his development?

Maybe I missed something

 

[ReHabs]

What?

How is sending him to Laval interrupting his development?

Maybe I missed something

I meant the opposite, calling him up now would get in the way

 

[rik schau]

Armia could have been sent down to keep Heineman up, Harris should have no impact on Heineman playing.

Not what I was suggesting. Just that it was not urgent to get Harris in as the D has been sufficient regardless of the line-up. My preference but prefer that the forwards are 12 strong and not 11.

 

[rik schau]

Advanced stats suggest he was the best Hab last night

Admittedly I did cartwheels and hand-stands upon seeing the chart but obviously that is not what I was inferring.