Post-Game Talk: Habs Fall to Dallas, 4-1 -- Scapegoats wanted!

[Peanut]

I always love how the tax myth always gets brought up by the same exact poster then gets proven wrong quickly with sources. Then it must get ignored because it always gets brought up again by the same exact posters its like clockwork lol.

Why taxes shouldn’t prevent John Tavares or any free agent...

 

[Bloumeister]

hahahahah, the "OUUUIIIIIII" is an amazing touch

That's also a pic of MTL, not Miami

YEEAAAAHHHHH

 

[groovejuice]

This game reminded me why I couldn't stand bishop in tampa. His antics are embarrassing.

The embellishing, and interfering with players while outside of the crease, and drawing penalties in the process is very frustrating to watch. He's the type of goalie who makes you want to see free reign against goalies outside the blue paint.

Not a fan of Bishop. His personality is the polar opposite of Price. He's a constant whiner.

 

[Non Player Canadiens]

That's also a pic of MTL, not Miami

YEEAAAAHHHHH

bahahaha nice, hadn't even noticed

 

[groovejuice]

I always love how the tax myth always gets brought up by the same exact poster then gets proven wrong quickly with sources. Then it must get ignored because it always gets brought up again by the same exact posters its like clockwork lol.

Why taxes shouldn’t prevent John Tavares or any free agent...

Montreal used to be a destination players craved. It may improve when a new GM comes to town and/or when the team becomes a contender. Until then we can expect to be shunned by UFAs.

 

[roy munson]

Missed the game (again), have to live with the fact that I wasn't there LIVE for @roy munson's glorieux GDT, the only positive coming out of last night, from what I understand

I'm not worthy... but I GOT THE MUNSONS!

(I lost it at the Hotel California quote )

Luckily Runner knew someone at the hospital and they sent us some pictures. We saw that you were at stage one of the Munsons. We all felt better.

Hotel California: try reading the quotes without using the original melody

 

[Bloumeister]

Not a fan of Bishop. His personality is the polar opposite of Price. He's a constant whiner.

I have it on very good authority that Floppin' Bishop used to dodge key games against top teams by claiming to be sick or hurt while in Tampa. Stats being used the way they're currently used in the NHL, someone in the TBL org came up with charts showing that Bishop would regularly miss games when playing against Pitts, Boston, Mtl (back when Habs had his number), etc.

Take it for what it's worth, but my source is rock solid.

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

1) There are many young players on our team. Gallagher, Drouin, Domi, Tatar, Kotkaniemi have 60 pts potential. Some now and some in the future. Just depends on circumstance and how the team is producing as a whole. Looking at past production (like Pleky) when most of our forward group is 25 or under to justify we have no 60 pts potential players is weird. The potential is there and it comes down to how they do as a team. Am I saying we will have 60 pts guys this year for sure? NO. I'm saying the skill and potential is there.

None of those players have ever scored 60 points. Scherbak has 60 point potential as well. It depends on circumstance and the team as a whole. My point is that this team is far from contention and is far, far from being relied upon for any sustainable success!

Contending for the playoffs = being a below average team.

I'm not happy with that. Especially considering that it looks like Price is Back. A team with Price is automatically in contention for the playoffs, what are these bum players doing if they can't even guarantee the Habs are a playoff team? A few of them better get 60+ points this season...

2) I don't care how you want to focus on the "max" word. I clearly showed you what I meant. $8.5M for Radulov is the max deal he could get to equal the same take home pay vs Dallas and many Habs fans would of taken fits if we signed him to that. But we somehow expected Bergevin to use a cro bar and force Radulov to sign for the same deal he took in Dallas?

You said Max Deal. That's clearly not a max deal. I dunno what you want me to say. You used the wrong words.

3) Taxes are an issue no matter how you try to spin things. It's been a topic of conversation for many years now and it's not going away. Price at $10.5M and Subban at $9M are two prime examples. Do you really think Yzerman is that dam good that he was able to get Hedman, Stamkos, and Kucherov to all leave money on the table where the Lightning play in a no tax state? The higher the salaries go up, the bigger advantage those no tax state teams have. It's like less than 1/3 of the league where teams have a clear cut advantage.

Taxes are an issue. I don't care. A good GM finds a way to get things working. If it's too tough for Bergevin and Molson, they can get the heck out.

Fact: Our GM told us that Radulov asked for more money to offset the clear take home taxes. Do you believe him or not? Up to you. But this narrative was something I said all summer of 2017 and well before Bergevin told this to the media

I truly believe Bergevin got frustrated with trying to re-sign Radulov for several months where Radulov was only interested in taking the absolute max deal he could get from us. But carry on with your "max" focus.

Fact: Radulov signed a reasonable contract and the Habs signed Alzner to an equally long deal.

Giving Radulov 7m a year/five years and not signing Alzner is clearly the better move. One of many that he's missed the mark on.

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

I have it on very good authority that Floppin' Bishop used to dodge key games against top teams by claiming to be sick or hurt while in Tampa. Stats being used the way they're currently used in the NHL, someone in the TBL org came up with charts showing that Bishop would regularly miss games when playing against Pitts, Boston, Mtl (back when Habs had his number), etc.

Take it for what it's worth, but my source is rock solid.

Floppin' Bishop... you sound like a certain world leader on twitter

I hope your source is bigly reliable and tremendous!

 

[Bloumeister]

Luckily Runner knew someone at the hospital and they sent us some pictures. We saw that you were at stage one of the Munsons. We all felt better.

Hotel California: try reading the quotes without using the original melody

Try signing it with these guys:

 

[PaulD]

Radulov concerned about money?

Yeah that checks out.

AND unlike the Canadiens, Dallas actually had centermen. Wingers like that.

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

AND unlike the Canadiens, Dallas actually had centermen. Wingers like that.

Danault is a top6 centreman and JDLR is close behind. - Brian Wilde and Grant McCagg

 

[Habs Halifax]

None of those players have ever scored 60 points. Scherbak has 60 point potential as well. It depends on circumstance and the team as a whole. My point is that this team is far from contention and is far, far from being relied upon for any sustainable success!

Contending for the playoffs = being a below average team.

I'm not happy with that. Especially considering that it looks like Price is Back. A team with Price is automatically in contention for the playoffs, what are these bum players doing if they can't even guarantee the Habs are a playoff team? A few of them better get 60+ points this season...

You said Max Deal. That's clearly not a max deal. I dunno what you want me to say. You used the wrong words.


Taxes are an issue. I don't care. A good GM finds a way to get things working. If it's too tough for Bergevin and Molson, they can get the heck out.


Fact: Radulov signed a reasonable contract and the Habs signed Alzner to an equally long deal.

Giving Radulov 7m a year/five years and not signing Alzner is clearly the better move. One of many that he's missed the mark on.

1) Scherbak does not have 60 pts potential. You are stretching things a bit here.

2) Contending for the playoffs and missing the playoffs is a below average team. It's anybodies guess if we are a wild card team or we just miss the playoffs. Hard to predict.

3) Price is not the best goalie in the world. He is one of the best when he is on his game. Expecting Price to make us a playoff team alone is not something I believe in. Any good goalie needs a good team in front of him. They go hand and hand.

4) Who cares if you want to purposely not understand the max contract he could take by returning to the Habs. At the end of the day, he wanted more from us vs the offer he took with the Stars. I don't care about your "max" tunnel vision. You proved nothing

5) Taxes are an issue and it does matter. Even Yzerman would have a hard time getting Price to sign for $9M. But maybe he would of had balls to let him walk into his pending UFA with no extension? I know Bergevin wanted nothing to do with that distraction

6) You are correct on the Alzner/Radulov comment. He played hard ball with Radulov but over committed in both AVV and term with Alzner. Bergevin likely has lots of regrets from that 2017 offseason and lets hope he has learned from it.

 

[groovejuice]

he didnt break his current contract to sign the offer sheet AND even if he did ( he didn't) the preds had the choice to match or not.

Radulov ditching the preds left them with no choice. Radulov was benefiting from a guaranteed contract but thought that it ws a one way street, that even though he DID sign a contract, he was under NO obligation to actually honor the contract he signed.

if you are looking for loyalty, that's not a red flag that's a parade of red flags. So long as it goes his way, he's on board. the minute it doesnt, you have to ask " will he ditch us this time" ?

It's true that Radulov wasn't always the ideal employee. By all accounts though, he appears to have matured and is as reliable as most top players in the league.

 

[Bloumeister]

Floppin' Bishop... you sound like a certain world leader on twitter

I hope your source is bigly reliable and tremendous!

It's YUUUGE... and I ain't lying

 

[Hfbsux]

I always love how the tax myth always gets brought up by the same exact poster then gets proven wrong quickly with sources. Then it must get ignored because it always gets brought up again by the same exact posters its like clockwork lol.

Why taxes shouldn’t prevent John Tavares or any free agent...

I read the article a few months ago, had questions but didn't receive my answers... Correct me if I'm wrong:

The best strategy for players to save taxes in a high taxed market would be thru a retirement compensation arrangement (RCA). By putting 40-50% of their salary in a trust account they will only pay 25% taxes when they will withdraw the amount. 25% is great compared to what they'd pay usually.

My questions are:
How many NHL players are ready to not touch half of their salary every year?
How many players would rather play in a market with less (or no) taxes, instead of saving money for when they retired? Would they rather have the money now or to save it?
In a financial point, of course it is better to save for later. But how many players are willing to do so?

 

[sandysan]

It's true that Radulov wasn't always the ideal employee. By all accounts though, he appears to have matured and is as reliable as most top players in the league.

the " but I've stopped beating my wife " defense ?

sooo very very compelling

maybe leopards CAN change their spots. Maybe as he was washing the nashville stink off of him in montreal, he became a changed man. A stand up guy. Then, when he signed with Dallas ( after, incidentally EXPLIXCITLY denouncing the leak of his ask to the press saying it wasn't even close and it ended up being pretty much what he signed for) lied his ass off for the first 10 minutes of being a star.

So for those keeping score at home

1) doesn't honor his contract in nashville and leaves them holding the bag
2) chases the dough
3) comes back to montreal
4) becomes a paragon of virtue ( even if the paragon got gassed taking WAY too long shifts)
5) lies to the press about his contract demands
6) back to paragon of virtue
7) relapses upon being traded to being a big fat liar, again
8) continues with the paragon of virtue stage in Dallas

or maybe steps 4 and 6 and 8 never happened, and he is the same as what nashville determined he was.

 

[sandysan]

AND unlike the Canadiens, Dallas actually had centermen. Wingers like that.

the two are not mutually exclusive.

could having better teamates been a factor ? sure. But if it is true that he was willing to stay in montreal IF the habs ponied up more money ( and term) to offset the " tax issue" then its pretty clear that playing alongside better players wasn't all that high on his list.

maybe ted dibiase was right " everybody has their price !"

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

the " but I've stopped beating my wife " defense ?

sooo very very compelling

maybe leopards CAN change their spots. Maybe as he was washing the nashville stink off of him in montreal, he became a changed man. A stand up guy. Then, when he signed with Dallas ( after, incidentally EXPLIXCITLY denouncing the leak of his ask to the press saying it wasn't even close and it ended up being pretty much what he signed for) lied his ass off for the first 10 minutes of being a star.

So for those keeping score at home

1) doesn't honor his contract in nashville and leaves them holding the bag
2) chases the dough
3) comes back to montreal
4) becomes a paragon of virtue ( even if the paragon got gassed taking WAY too long shifts)
5) lies to the press about his contract demands
6) back to paragon of virtue
7) relapses upon being traded to being a big fat liar, again
8) continues with the paragon of virtue stage in Dallas

or maybe steps 4 and 6 and 8 never happened, and he is the same as what nashville determined he was.

Is there a hall of fame to nominate posts?

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Montreal used to be a destination players craved. It may improve when a new GM comes to town and/or when the team becomes a contender. Until then we can expect to be shunned by UFAs.

When? We've struggled since before Gainey.

I'm not talking about the tax situation I'm just wondering...when? I don't remember it.

All we have is Gainey signing a shitload of people after the 100th year but given he rebuilt the team it has little do with being a contender.

I think at a certain point we haven't been a contender in years so that's a knock.

There's the obvious too, there's 31 teams and if you're average there's a lot of competition. This isn't a small league anymore, we're soon to be 32. You better stand out in some positive way or you're just like everybody else.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

lets just not judge St Henri on Bergevin coming from here which is also questionable

It's become automatic the rare few times I go by the 514 southside, the first thought that pops into my head is "the anti-christ of hockey was born here"

 

[groovejuice]

When? We've struggled since before Gainey.

I'm not talking about the tax situation I'm just wondering...when? I don't remember it.

All we have is Gainey signing a ****load of people after the 100th year but given he rebuilt the team it has little do with being a contender.

I think at a certain point we haven't been a contender in years so that's a knock.

There's the obvious too, there's 31 teams and if you're average there's a lot of competition. This isn't a small league anymore, we're soon to be 32. You better stand out in some positive way or you're just like everybody else.

The Habs weren't making much noise in the playoffs then, but their reputation was still sterling and "classy" was still the universal adjective when players from other teams were talking about the Habs.

Sadly, "classy" has become a thing of the past. I hope eventually we'll earn that description back.

 

[sandysan]

I have no idea how anyone could seriously categorize a UFA (read unaffiliated) player as in breach of a nonexistent contract. Mind boggling desperation, perhaps.

Because if he didn't breach with us, then him breaching with Nashville ( let me get my best Kermit voice as I sip tea) " but that's none of our business"

 

[PaulD]

the two are not mutually exclusive.

could having better teamates been a factor ? sure. But if it is true that he was willing to stay in montreal IF the habs ponied up more money ( and term) to offset the " tax issue" then its pretty clear that playing alongside better players wasn't all that high on his list.

maybe ted dibiase was right " everybody has their price !"

Ok call it a bonus. More money. No Marc Bergevin. Seguin and Benn. It was a no brainer. A compliment to the city of Montreal if he even considered The Habs offer over the Stars offer.

 

[FloJack]

Most know that.

A few wishful thinkers . Let them have their fun.

Speak for yourself, if Habslover never told me early season standings mean nothing I wouldn’t have grasped the concept myself.