Speculation: Goaltending problem?

[daethfromabove1979]

Based on what we gave up to get rid of Nick Ritchie's contract, how much will we need to give up to unload Petr Mrazek? A first rounder?

 

[29Potvin]

Based on what we gave up to get rid of Nick Ritchie's contract, how much will we need to give up to unload Petr Mrazek? A first rounder?

What did it cost us? If the yotes take the third, that is what around what teams have paid for Lyubushkin type of Dman at the deadline in the past and will pay at this TDL, if the take the 2025 2nd and we resign Lyubushkin for under two mil as a 5/6 dman next year the 2025 2nd for him and the mil in cap savings. teams have paid 3rd/4th for 11 games of retention and you look at it as we paid a ton to get rid of Ritchie? I will side with the experts on this and that that trade was a huge win for the Leafs even if the pick is a second rounder in four drafts from now

 

[exporta]

Since January 14th:

Shots Against: 7th fewest in the NHL
Scoring Chances Against: 2nd fewest in the NHL
High Danger Chances Against: 3rd fewest in the NHL
Expected Goals Against: 3rd fewest in the NHL


Team save%: 31st in the NHL (with Leafs goalies giving up soft goals left and right)


I wonder if goaltending has been a problem?

This

 

[LeafGrief]

Based on what we gave up to get rid of Nick Ritchie's contract, how much will we need to give up to unload Petr Mrazek? A first rounder?

What? We got rid of Ritchie for free.

 

[ToneDog]

Unless you can get Varlamov or Holtby for Mrazek+, I think we stand pat in goal and it will rest on the shoulders of a healthy Soup. Not sure if MAF is the answer after watching him this past weekend against the Sens.

Get that missing top 4 dman with term, maybe a LWer for Tavares, get Muzzin back and let it ride.

The last thing we need is to pay for rentals and a quick first round exit. Tread carefully Kyle.

 

[therealkoho]

Unless you can get Varlamov or Holtby for Mrazek+, I think we stand pat in goal and it will rest on the shoulders of a healthy Soup. Not sure if MAF is the answer after watching him this past weekend against the Sens.

Get that missing top 4 dman with term, maybe a LWer for Tavares, get Muzzin back and let it ride.

The last thing we need is to pay for rentals and a quick first round exit. Tread carefully Kyle.

perhaps both a RW and LW for JT

one guy is definitely better than the other guy, but that guy who is way better is playing his way to the 4th line, and speaking of which, with AM out why isn't that guy taking over the 2C position, I'd heard somewhere that he was a bona fide can't miss NHL centreman?

 

[ToneDog]

perhaps both a RW and LW for JT

one guy is definitely better than the other guy, but that guy who is way better is playing his way to the 4th line, and speaking of which, with AM out why isn't that guy taking over the 2C position, I'd heard somewhere that he was a bona fide can't miss NHL centreman?

Have not seen any lineup for tonight but my logic says JT and Kerfoot are your #1 and #2C. Anything else and Keefe must be playing 3D chess with Kid Kyle.

 

[Buds17]

Based on what we gave up to get rid of Nick Ritchie's contract, how much will we need to give up to unload Petr Mrazek? A first rounder?

A Mrazek trade would be tougher to gauge due to the bigger contract (AAV and term) and partial NTC. Fewer spots exist on a roster for a goalie in comparison to a winger, but that could also result in a greater need for teams. I'd still consider the Ritchie trade to be enough of a win for the Leafs as they were able to add to the current team (albeit by acquiring a pending UFA) without subtracting from it.

 

[therealkoho]

Have not seen any lineup for tonight but my logic says JT and Kerfoot are your #1 and #2C. Anything else and Keefe must be playing 3D chess with Kid Kyle.

yeah it's the way it "lines-up" here

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[DraftSchmaft]

Curious what Vasilevskiys numbers would look like if he had to play in our high giveaway, non-crease clearing, non-board pinning environment.

His numbers aren't brag worthy as is given Tampas 5v5 stats. If you can reason that they'd be even worse here since Tampa is best in the league at limiting giveaways and we're one of the worst, perhaps focusing on the D instead of getting an average goalie is the course we should take? An average goalie might still suck here.

Food for thought.

Mrazek I'm done with period. His issue is chronic problem of not knowing where he is relative to the net. We can trade for Hedman and it still wouldn't help Mrazek. Campbell doesn't have that issue so if we can make things less wild in the d-zone, get a Chiarot and a Schenn (if no muzzin), I think we'll be fine. I'm on the Chiarot wagon now, St.Louis really turned that team around. He would be very useful here. His skillset is a necessity for our current build.

 

[therealkoho]

Mrazek + Nylander + Dermott + 2024 2nd rounder if Kings have to give up their 2024 1st)

Quick(1 yr left at 5.8 AAV) + Adrian Kempe(if Kempe doesn't re-sign 2023 3rd rnd)+ Olli Maata( if Maata doesn't re-sign 2024 1st)+ Arthur Kaliyev + 2022 2nd Rnd + 2022 Pitts 3 rnd + 2022 5th rnd

 

[Sypher04]

And soups OT softies?
I remember that play with Andersen and in the thickof it shit happens. Letting in a soft writer from the point with no screen, no tip is a different level bad.
Every goalie let's in bad goals that's why I try to look at their fundamentals if I'm trying to judge them.
Fred has good fundamentals.

That said I've also always said I would love to upgrade on Andersen, but we didn't, thus far it appears we downgraded. Imo it was a silly gamble as, we are now seeing, goaltending is the most valuable position.
Campbell had a great run and a meh playoffs, judging from the softies he let in. He was and is still unproven as a starter. It would have made more sense to run Fred again, then this season split the net and gradually phase feed out once you're comfortable that Campbell could manage the workload.
I like what Dubas has done for this organization and I'm far from a hater, but this Imo was a huge gaff

At best it’s a maybe gaff. It’s hard to classify this as a gaff when Andersen was most likely never going to come back

 

[AvroArrow]

 

[saltming]

At best it’s a maybe gaff. It’s hard to classify this as a gaff when Andersen was most likely never going to come back

We will never know if he wouldn't comeback. Still low class to strip the net from him for an unproven goalie.

 

[Sypher04]

We will never know if he wouldn't comeback. Still low class to strip the net from him for an unproven goalie.

It’s really not, but you can keep going with that. Campbell outplayed Andersen by a wide margin all year last year. This is a business and results matter. There was no reason for the Leafs to suddenly think Andersen would be good in the playoffs when he returned after he’d spent the better part of the last 2 seasons unable to find his game

 

[Shooter2x]

It’s really not, but you can keep going with that. Campbell outplayed Andersen by a wide margin all year last year. This is a business and results matter. There was no reason for the Leafs to suddenly think Andersen would be good in the playoffs when he returned after he’d spent the better part of the last 2 seasons unable to find his game

This explanation doesn't work for me. If that's the case you should be okay with a scenario they traded Marner after the Habs loss for more balance since it's a results oriented business and Marner brought the worst results out of the active core players in the playoffs two years in a row. I don't think you'd agree with that. I certainly don't. Consistency says you have to be though.

Andersen is even proving right now he's not washed. Carolina was so certain in Fred, they let go of their young promising goalie who had similar regular season success as Campbell. How does an outsider team make such a good call on Fred whereas we make the wrong choice?

Lebrun said Andersen was willing and would have even done a timeshare with Campbell.

 

[Sypher04]

This explanation doesn't work for me. If that's the case you should be okay with a scenario they traded Marner after the Habs loss for more balance since it's a results oriented business and Marner brought the worst results out of the active core players in the playoffs two years in a row. I don't think you'd agree with that. I certainly don't. Consistency says you have to be though.

Andersen is even proving right now he's not washed. Carolina was so certain in Fred, they let go of their young promising goalie who had similar regular season success as Campbell. How does an outsider team make such a good call on Fred whereas we make the wrong choice?

Lebrun said Andersen was willing and would have even done a timeshare with Campbell.

You’re trying to equate two dramatically different things. Freddy struggled for the better part of two regular seasons. Mitch Marner struggled for a series after having an first team allstar calibre season. One of those is a very small sample by comparison. Not absolving Marner of his own struggles but these are not remotely similar things.

Furthermore, Marners struggles vs Montreal had a lot to do with his shot not being what it needed to be, compounded by Hyman being awful and freshly returned from IR, and Matthews playing with a clearly injured wrist. The fact that line still dominated play vs Montreal’s top defenders is a testament to what could have been if they’d been healthy

In the Andersen scenario as well we had a player who had stepped into that space (created by Freddy’s struggles and alleged injury) in Campbell and was performing very well for us.

As for Carolina: don’t kid yourself, they took a massive gamble on Freddy. It’s paid off for them, but it could have just as easily blown up in their face.

 

[Shooter2x]

You’re trying to equate two dramatically different things. Freddy struggled for the better part of two regular seasons. Mitch Marner struggled for a series after having an first team allstar calibre season. One of those is a very small sample by comparison. Not absolving Marner of his own struggles but these are not remotely similar things.

Furthermore, Marners struggles vs Montreal had a lot to do with his shot not being what it needed to be, compounded by Hyman being awful and freshly returned from IR, and Matthews playing with a clearly injured wrist. The fact that line still dominated play vs Montreal’s top defenders is a testament to what could have been if they’d been healthy

In the Andersen scenario as well we had a player who had stepped into that space (created by Freddy’s struggles and alleged injury) in Campbell and was performing very well for us.

I am playing by the logic you laid out. I'm not saying you'd agree with a Marner trade, but you'd have no choice but to understand it was necessary. If it doesn't add up that shows there's a flaw in your argument, not mine.

It was horrible player evaluation. That's just a fact at this point. An external team was able to make a better call than us to the point they gave up their younger Campbell equivalent. 23 games played 1.90 g.a.a .932 save%. We had the option to go ahead with Fred and didn't take it.

Carolina is reaping the benefits and we're spiraling downwards. It's a loss for management.