GDT: GDT Preseason game 5 Halifax Edition: Pens vs Aval..... What wait?! Why the Senators? We want Mack

[PensandCaps]

Dont even know what Letang is anymore. He’s barely an NHL player.

That's a bit dramatic. He'd be a very good 2nd pair Dman if Sullivan used him like one and didn't play him 25 mins+

We just know Letang will never leave the PP, or Crosby's hip at 5v5. As with a lot of players here over the past few years, they don't suck, they're just misused.

Coaching is a serial problem here in Pittsburgh sports.

None of the media is even talking about Sullivan being on the hot seat after doing nothing for 7 years. Just like Tomlin. They all just kiss his ass.

 

[Jacob]

I don't know why coaches feel like they have to show so much loyalty to these players to the detriment of the team. It reminds me of Bylsma promising Dupuis he'd stay with Sid after the deadline we acquired Iginla. What's the point? Are you here to make friends or win?

Letang is probably better off on PP2 where he can just put pucks on net instead of deferring to better players.

 

[lokomotiv15]

This one's on Reirden. He's the PP coach. If he can't create a strategy that works then he needs to go.

I'm not even being a dick or facetious here, but I know how a coaching staff usually runs and that the head coach has a say in generally what type of formation a team might run and who is deployed on there but that the final decisions and onus fall on the PP coach. Counter to that, from all the quotes I see from Sullivan about the special teams and the free reign he seems to have on pretty much every decision regarding this team, I'm pretty sure all that Reirden does is coach the PP that Sully builds through different set plays within the formation. Id be surprised if he was allowed to bring anything to the table more than deciding if a quick-set low play or post up was the set play of choice against any given PK.

 

[PensandCaps]

preseason boys. Do you honestly think a bunch of future HOFers in their late 30s are going to lay it all out there for a meaningless game. Sure the pp could have looked better, but it is way too early to jump to any conclusions.

Meh, you don't need a preseason to know that Letang being on PP1 makes no sense.

Obviously Sullivan isn't going to bruise a legends ego and take him off for some new dude who has not won cups here.

And I'm pretty sure Letang would be very very displeased if that happened. Which is why he's still the 1st pair in any lineup formation, and is still going to be getting the Crosby minutes.

I don't know why coaches feel like they have to show so much loyalty to these players to the detriment of the team. It reminds me of Bylsma promising Dupuis he'd stay with Sid after the deadline we acquired Iginla. What's the point? Are you here to make friends or win?

Letang is probably better off on PP2 where he can just put pucks on net instead of deferring to better players.

But I do understand it, he has been here 17 years, won 2 cups with Sullivan, the leader in all franchise Dmen records. Kinda hard to just hand the keys to a guy who just got here.

Catering to Dupuis though is hilarious. Pretty sure Rust is the modern version of that, if an elite RWer was a penguin tomorrow, they'd still roll out Rust and Crosby.

 

[Scandale du Jour]

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, hockey is really back when people start bitching about Letang on the power play

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, hockey is really back when people start bitching about Letang on the power play

I mean he shouldn’t be on it to be fair.

Should also play 20-22 min to EK’s 26-27 min.

 

[Al Smith]

I mean he shouldn’t be on it to be fair.

Should also play 20-22 min to EK’s 26-27 min.

Yes and yes. And he'll be out there over 25 minutes/game, including a significant chunk of the Pens' PP time, and including numerous double clutches on actual or potential shots. And people will bitch about it.

He's clearly not the player he was, especially the ability to use his speed to make up for offensive aggressiveness or gaffes. But he's still a good mid-pairing D on a good team.

 

[Jacob]

Can probably meet everyone's egos halfway. Put Karlsson on the top unit, Letang on 2. Maybe start the 2nd unit more often. If it's late in a game and we're up, put both on the top unit as a safety valve. Problem solved.

 

[Scandale du Jour]

I mean he shouldn’t be on it to be fair.

Should also play 20-22 min to EK’s 26-27 min.

Thing is, the challenge here is the ego managing that Sullivan will have to do.

You cannot NOT start the year with Letang on PP1. If it does not work out after 10 games, sure, adjust. But he has to be on it to start. Hockey teams are social ecosystems. Letang is at the top of that ecosystem. You have him to show him the respect he earned or it will piss off other guys.

Once it is clear it is not optimal, you can adjust as you have arguments to do so. Right now, they do not. So complaining now is useless.

 

[Kristopher Letang]

Dont even know what Letang is anymore. He’s barely an NHL player.

Lol that’s crazy

 

[Sidgeni Malkby]

Can probably meet everyone's egos halfway. Put Karlsson on the top unit, Letang on 2. Maybe start the 2nd unit more often. If it's late in a game and we're up, put both on the top unit as a safety valve. Problem solved.

Yeah, the ego stuff is a challenge. I'm fine with us keeping Letang on PP1 and see if it works for the 1st 10 games. However if he is playing left wall, he needs to shoot! He can shoot. To be fair, nobody was shooting on the PP against Ottawa. Letang had that one shot and broke his stick.

It always felt like they were forcing it to EK so he could do something with it. Positioning was all over the place with no obvious clear look play. Malkin was never setup for a one timer. Neither was Crosby.

 

[The Old Master]

he's made a few nice plays tonight

then I don't remembering him after that...................could be I just checked out so I'm willing to give him a pass.

 

[Andy99]

Fine. Even if they're tracking it wrong and we're like actually 10th in HDFC instead of 2nd, it's still an amber alert level problem.
I'm only posting the stats because my words aren't getting through to you guys. I watched for this every game last year, to see if we'd improve that aspect from 2021-22 (which was also awful).
It started really good, when we were putting up 6-spots in October. We were up there with Seattle in 5v5 goals at the very top for a while, and the GFAx was strong.
Then the finishing crashed and burned, as if they forgot how to do it. They started shooting like AHL'ers.

It started happening so regularly that fans started thinking it's normal to be this flaccid, and they just need to keep generating more and more until they breakthrough. But when I watch other teams around the league, they do a lot better with the same damn types of chances.

Vancouver's an example. I follow them a bit, since I live here. They are just so much better at execution. They shoot harder, higher. Their releases are faster. They make up their minds more quickly. And when it's clear the goalie is set and it's unlikely to go in, they hang onto it and make them move laterally. Our players just shoot it at the logo or miss the net in those situations.
I'm as fed up with Sully as everyone else, but he is not instructing them to shoot this way. He is leaving it to their best judgment. He only cares about generating them, and then he wants them to "use their instincts" like he always says.

This same coach used to get strong shooting seasons out of his teams, with the same damn system. That includes a few years ago when we topped the division. The problem is, for whatever reason, it's evaporated. There's some lack of confidence/bad vibes going on. There's a lack of killer instinct and hunger. Missing some anger too. It's all too passive and wavering.

Also, our best shooters are old, I mean really old…

 

[KrisLetAngry]

Yeah, the ego stuff is a challenge. I'm fine with us keeping Letang on PP1 and see if it works for the 1st 10 games. However if he is playing left wall, he needs to shoot! He can shoot. To be fair, nobody was shooting on the PP against Ottawa. Letang had that one shot and broke his stick.

It always felt like they were forcing it to EK so he could do something with it. Positioning was all over the place with no obvious clear look play. Malkin was never setup for a one timer. Neither was Crosby.

If Letang shoots and doesn't make passes back constantly. That would be great.

Honestly I don't care we lost. I cared how pathetic the PP the exciting 5v4 opportunities went to waste.

It's pre season I won't complain about 35 year old skating half ass during the preseason.

I'm excited for the new season and I like how Karlsson looks.

Graves Is an upgrade over Dumo but by how much it is left to be seen.

 

[SomeDude]

Sure, it's on him in the same way that it's on your boss when you mess up, if you have that arrangement. They are delegating tasks. You gotta be able to trust the people you work with to handle their jobs.

What do you want Sullivan to do about it then? Take over the unit, like when he stripped Recchi of the job?
Override Reirden's decisions to the point that Reirden's a faux PP coach? Assign Vellucci to PP and Reirden to PK?

Even if Sullivan took it over, nothing would subtantially change. He is even less flexible and adaptable than Reirden. It would be mired in stagnation, bound to the same personnel, regardless of performance.
And even if he interfered more, would what he demands be helpful? He seems to be struggling quite a bit with 5v5 offense, without any insight in to how to fix it.

What they need is a new assistant entirely. Same thing with Vellucci if his PK sucks, because there's seriously no excuse with this personnel.

How about they just fire them all?

 

[pistolpete11]

I think Letang's skillset on the left boards is fine. It's not like he'll be Option A there anyway. But it's up to the coaching staff to give it some direction (which I don't have much faith in) and the players to have a killer instinct and not constantly defer to each other (which I don't have much faith in either).

At least while Jake is out, I don't think they really have a clearly better option for that spot anyway. When Jake's back and they take Rakell off, we can revisit.

 

[Andy99]

Letang -Graves pairing should be the second pairing and Letang should run PP2 as he’s probably needed more on the PK…saw too many brain farts from that pairing and I don’t think Letang is gonna be using his silky mitts enough on PP2 from what I’m seeing in that left wall spot…just too many terrible passes

 

[Zirakzigil]

Can continue this in the training camp thread