GDT: Game # 52 - Rangers @ Islanders - 7pm - MSG

[DialUp]

It's not their turn to win the Cup, but they will absolutely be ready to be a playoff team next season.

Well yeah, when I say turn, I don't mean cup, I mean playoff team. If they make it next year, very interested in who they manage to knock OUT of playoff position, and what kind of Philly level disaster happened to that doomed team. If the Rangers make the playoffs next year, it would have to be one of the youngest teams to make it in the past 15-20 years. I tried to find out but it's not the easiest thing to find. Has to be then. I do not think our team is on the path to being historically exceptional.

 

[chosen]

Well yeah, when I say turn, I don't mean cup, I mean playoff team. If they make it next year, very interested in who they manage to knock OUT of playoff position, and what kind of Philly level disaster happened to that doomed team. If the Rangers make the playoffs next year, it would have to be one of the youngest teams to make it in the past 15-20 years. I tried to find out but it's not the easiest thing to find. Has to be then. I do not think our team is on the path to being historically exceptional.

Lundqvist replacing Hajek alone is a major step forward. Personally, I love how Jones looks. Great skater. Doesn't panic. Nice offensive skills. Isn't a giveaway machine. Always makes the right outlet pass. I think he's more advanced than Miller, although if Miller stops making big turnovers (which he might), I love the Rangers D, going forward.

They still need another center who can score that is difficult to play against. This team has more than enough assets to acquire that kind of player. Hopefully, they will.

I'd love to get Larkin, and I bet he's available.

 

[jay from jersey]

Seriously. Quinn hasn’t had a point all series- I honestly can’t remember the last time he scored.

A point? What’s that got to do with anything ? Or a poor attempt a humor?

 

[jay from jersey]

When you think about it, when was the last time the Rangers were good on face offs?

Stepan and Brassard were never this Abhorrent. Boyle was good, Dubinsky was good. I’m not saying they have to win every chance, but the team was never like this under AV at the dot. Certainly not with Torts. Even Quinn’s first year they are a lot better. But so was their overall game and compete level

 

[jay from jersey]

Yes Quinn's obviously not a good coach and it's disappointing that they can't strategically match teams like the Islanders (coach has a lot to do with that) but jeez young teams (2nd youngest in the league, in fact) go through growing pains and you can't be acting like a 16-year old girl who got dumped on prom night every time they lose. Mika sucks, Filip sucks, K'Andre sucks, Strome sucks... wah wah wah grab a Snickers and go offline.

I think the age thing is a bit over blown. Basically the same team as last year. They lost Staal and Hank. Our 2 oldest guys. Not exactly key cogs to the success of the team anymore. Yes we’re a young team. But there are a lot of vets in the top 9. Some kids are learning slow, some at a snails pace, and Fox and shesty being studs.
I’m not too worried bout wins and losses. What I am worried about is the lack of overall compete level in the entire team. It’s like a crisis of identity. I don’t particularly think the communication is Great from the coaches to some of the young guys, I’m worried Quinn has kind of lost his way to motivate and teach some players vet/ rookie a like
I’m worried about the lack of game plans and adjustments in game that can be holding some of our future stars back , in order to give time to band aid players that aren’t in the long term plans.
i think this team is in real need of an identity shift. They need a few good key UFA signing/trades to really add top notch support guys and restructure the Core. The good news is the high end talent is here. There are many guys out there currently who are going to be able to fill our holes in the line up without mortgaging the future. That mixed with Quinn’s timing coming to an end soon should be a tremendous boost to the organization

 

[tomobson]

I would be so pleasantly surprised if 6 months of off-season is all it takes for those kids to grow together as a mature, cohesive, experienced team and win a playoff spot. Over half the team next year will be either on ELC or first RFA contracts. Playing against grown men in their primes. Look at the teams ahead of them now, their avg age, their cap situation, their contract situation. Anything can happen but odds are not next year.
And the Rangers aren't the only team that is going to get better.
Next year isn't their turn just yet. For all our sake's as fans, they better improve though. Things should be looking better after next year.

I'm surprised by how many people seem to think it's a given that this team will be in the playoffs next season. Having a NHL third pairing will be very helpful but where is our offense going to come from? There's a good chance our veteran core gets a shakeup and gorton would have to work some serious magic to get back players that are ready to perform now instead of a couple of years in the future. The kids on forward have been improving in baby steps. I'm not sure they could improve any less in 56 games. We will have to rely on them to take major leaps in their games to be a playoff team next season. To top it all off we have no real centers on our team. I'm assuming this is something that gorton is looking to fix in some capacity this off-season, though. But there are a lot of question marks for me to call this team a playoff team next season.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Kakko, Lafreniere and Chytil all look better now than when they started, the development angle on Quinn isn't warranted. I can accept a host of other reasons to can him but development isnt one of them. Personally my gripe is the inability to adjust our game plan to give us a better chance against certain opponents. We aren't currently good enough to dictate the play of a game so you need to be able to counter teams that are. Like the Isles are a heavy trapping team, having blackwell on a softish line with our best player will not work against them, you need to beef up that line, and forcing passes through the neutral zone from our d doesnt work, you need to carry it past the first forechecker or atleast drag him out of the play. These are simple issues that cost games.

 

[LieutenantLackluster]

 

[Bruner4329]

The results this season should not be a surprise to anyone. Coming in some of us knew that our core was young but also that the roster was unbalanced. Sorry but I have been saying this for a while now. Our centers are our weak points. Zib is a flashy player than can explode at any given point but he is way too inconsistent, loses too many faceoffs and can be handled physically by the opposition. Strome has benefited from player with Pan but you look at his game he is not a good skater nor checker and avoids contact. Also makes some dumb plays with give aways. Honestly I am a bit disappointed with FC. Still not sure what he does that really is a strong point. First he is not a center and lacks vision and skill set to be one. He may be best suited to play wing but he does make an awful amount of dumb passes. I think we have good prospects for our D although bringing in one Vet may be helpful. It is time though that we need to trade some assets to bring in some younger vets who have proven they can play in this league. Obvious need is center. I am not for trading assets and getting more draft picks as at some point you need some proven commodities. And we have seen that even having 2 first round picks always doesn't work. Lets face it 3 years after choosing LA and FC in the first round we have gotten zilch for the most part.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

4 of 8 shutouts. Just absolutely owned from a game plan and execution standpoint. NYR lineup was beyond green but that was also a function of the Isles removing Trouba and Lindgren from the equation.

Being objective the bottom line is they didn’t have enough good players on the ice tonight. The defense they dressed was Adam Fox plus an AHL defense.

Therefore the results are not surprising. Trying not to overreact, but don’t want to underreact either. This was a complete schooling. Key veterans were at best completely MIA at worst actively helping the Islanders. I lost count of the number of horrific turnovers by Zibanejad, Panarin, Strome, and Buchnevich.

The complete ineptitude of that PP in the middle of the 2nd said it all. No kids on that PP and every player aggressively struggled to...do hockey.

This is an issue of both roster construction and game plan. The NYR are built and coached to take advantage of mistakes by the opposition. Against a well-coached, conservative team who makes very few mistakes that just doesn’t work. When the other team always has 3, 4 in the frame backchecking, or maintains tight zone defense forcing the Rangers to circle around the perimeter of the zone...the NYR have no answer to break through.

 

[DialUp]

There's a good chance our veteran core gets a shakeup and gorton would have to work some serious magic to get back players that are ready to perform now instead of a couple of years in the future.

We will have to rely on them to take major leaps in their games to be a playoff team next season

But there are a lot of question marks for me to call this team a playoff team next season.

Bingo. Looking forward to the answers, but the same as I went into this year, I am not going into next expecting playoffs. Expecting progress of our ELC's and under control young players.

 

[chosen]

Bingo. Looking forward to the answers, but the same as I went into this year, I am not going into next expecting playoffs. Expecting progress of our ELC's and under control young players.

They are missing the playoffs by under 10 points. Zib lost half the season to Covid. Panarin lost time to Putin.

Huge upgrade on D coming. Kids will naturally improve.

Other changes presumably coming.

Will be very surprised if they're not in playoffs next season.

 

[Fitzy]

It’s a more skilled roster than most teams NYR had in the playoff era with the exception maybe of 2011-2015.

The issue is the extreme inexperience, combined with a shortened schedule.

There’s no doubt in my mind that under normal conditions and a full season this is a playoff team.

So I get that “blow up the veteran core” is the instinct right now, but the reality is that not every good team is full of “the right players”

Every team contending for the cup right now has inconsistent players, players who are not physical, and players who are underperforming their contracts.

You’re never going to have a perfect roster in a salary cap era. The day of Detroit and Colorado super teams is done. Best you can do is build well, be smart with ELCs and which players you sign, and make a couple opportunistic trades to acquire players with 50 percent retention like we did with Yandle and MSL

 

[DialUp]

They are missing the playoffs by under 10 points. Zib lost half the season to Covid. Panarin lost time to Putin.

Huge upgrade on D coming. Kids will naturally improve.

Other changes presumably coming.

Will be very surprised if they're not in playoffs next season.

And that's why we watch!

 

[Leonardo87]

It’s been an off season, the divisions I knew were going to be an issue for a lot of teams, we had injuries, players go on leave, or dealing with Covid. The Rangers are where I expected them to be, I just don’t know how much more skill and talent you want to add to an already stacked roster. Just need players to get better and they will, and the vets to be more consistent. Have 4 forwards on pace for at least 70 points, and a Top D on pace for over 75 points in a full 82 game season. The D will get better as the younger guys develop. Things are looking good for the future.

Players have progressed under Quinn, and yeah he doesn’t make the best decisions but think he should get a real playoff run before he is canned. Next season’s goal is to make the playoffs, if he cannot do that then yeah it’s time to move on, I don’t think now is the time to let him go.

 

[ponytrekker]

4 of 8 shutouts. Just absolutely owned from a game plan and execution standpoint. NYR lineup was beyond green but that was also a function of the Isles removing Trouba and Lindgren from the equation.

Being objective the bottom line is they didn’t have enough good players on the ice tonight. The defense they dressed was Adam Fox plus an AHL defense.

Therefore the results are not surprising. Trying not to overreact, but don’t want to underreact either. This was a complete schooling. Key veterans were at best completely MIA at worst actively helping the Islanders. I lost count of the number of horrific turnovers by Zibanejad, Panarin, Strome, and Buchnevich.

The complete ineptitude of that PP in the middle of the 2nd said it all. No kids on that PP and every player aggressively struggled to...do hockey.

This is an issue of both roster construction and game plan. The NYR are built and coached to take advantage of mistakes by the opposition. Against a well-coached, conservative team who makes very few mistakes that just doesn’t work. When the other team always has 3, 4 in the frame backchecking, or maintains tight zone defense forcing the Rangers to circle around the perimeter of the zone...the NYR have no answer to break through.

Too few guys that will grind their way to the center of the ice? Every time the Isles entered the Ozone, they cut right to the middle no matter how high. Hockey 1010 here kids.

 

[ponytrekker]

They are missing the playoffs by under 10 points. Zib lost half the season to Covid. Panarin lost time to Putin.

Huge upgrade on D coming. Kids will naturally improve.

Other changes presumably coming.

Will be very surprised if they're not in playoffs next season.

The key to me is how they have performed against good teams in big games. Last two years they haven't shown up.

 

[ponytrekker]

It’s a more skilled roster than most teams NYR had in the playoff era with the exception maybe of 2011-2015.

There was one difference with those teams. Hmm, let me put my fingers on it.

 

[ponytrekker]

I think the age thing is a bit over blown. Basically the same team as last year. They lost Staal and Hank. Our 2 oldest guys. Not exactly key cogs to the success of the team anymore. Yes we’re a young team. But there are a lot of vets in the top 9. Some kids are learning slow, some at a snails pace, and Fox and shesty being studs.
I’m not too worried bout wins and losses. What I am worried about is the lack of overall compete level in the entire team. It’s like a crisis of identity. I don’t particularly think the communication is Great from the coaches to some of the young guys, I’m worried Quinn has kind of lost his way to motivate and teach some players vet/ rookie a like
I’m worried about the lack of game plans and adjustments in game that can be holding some of our future stars back , in order to give time to band aid players that aren’t in the long term plans.
i think this team is in real need of an identity shift. They need a few good key UFA signing/trades to really add top notch support guys and restructure the Core. The good news is the high end talent is here. There are many guys out there currently who are going to be able to fill our holes in the line up without mortgaging the future. That mixed with Quinn’s timing coming to an end soon should be a tremendous boost to the organization

This, this and this. If they lost last night but . . . um, I don't know . . . scored. . . fought back . . . made the Isles uncomfortable I'd feel better about the game plan (in-game, Quinn, and structurally -- that's you Gorts and JD).

 

[ohbaby]

Very disappointed in our effort the last two games. Season had to come to an end sooner or later, was hoping later though. It was an entertaining season. That's the best way to describe it. Wasn't particularly successful, but entertaining.

I wanna wish everyone here a happy and great summer. See you guys in the fall.

 

[chosen]

The key to me is how they have performed against good teams in big games. Last two years they haven't shown up.

I already posted this on the previous page:

"For those of you complaining that the Rangers beat up on the crap teams and smell against the good teams and use that as an indictment of them, you're unaware of the reality of the NHL. That's how it works for almost every team.

This is approximately how the best teams are performing against this years likely playoff teams (I used the same opponents for all of them):

Isles are 7W 14 L against likely playoff teams.
Car 10/6
Fla 5/9
TB 7/7
Pitt 13/9
Wash 11/12
Bos 11/11
Tor 17/8
Edm 12/13
Winn 11/15
Mtl 10/13
LV 10/9
Col 13/10
Minn 8/12
St. 9/11

I don't know if it works this way every season, but this season, the best teams are all feasting on the crap, just like the Rangers do, even though they are not a top team".

You're missing the point that almost the entire NHL can't win consistently against the better teams.

Every good team is feasting on the bad teams. This is not an issue specific to the Rangers, no matter how much some people want it to be.

 

[Fitzy]

There was one difference with those teams. Hmm, let me put my fingers on it.

Sure, but I don't think we've seen Shesty's best yet.

Hank's peak was from age 27-33. People don't remember well but he had a couple really inconsistent seasons in years 2-4.

 

[The New Russian Five]

Or no balls or guts to get to the open ice. Move around skate through people to draw penalties. Not a hard concept

It's interesting. If you watch Panarin during his time in Chicago or Columbus, he made a lot more moves to get into open space or cut to the meeting. He also tried to beat players one-on-one more and was often successful at it. On the rangers he plays a much more perimeter game and sticks to the half-walls. We all turn a blind eye to it because he has been highly effective from there and has been putting up career numbers.

He's been great for us and is certainly one of the top 5 players in the game right now, but there are certain parts of his mental game that are suspect.

 

[DanielBrassard]

It's interesting. If you watch Panarin during his time in Chicago or Columbus, he made a lot more moves to get into open space or cut to the meeting. He also tried to beat players one-on-one more and was often successful at it. On the rangers he plays a much more perimeter game and sticks to the half-walls. We all turn a blind eye to it because he has been highly effective from there and has been putting up career numbers.

He's been great for us and is certainly one of the top 5 players in the game right now, but there are certain parts of his mental game that are suspect.

He did it more often last season if you go back and watch the games. It seems obvious that he's been playing hurt this season, he just isn't skating like he usually does.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Still feel this way.