Salary Cap: Future Roster Building (2017-18 and beyond) Pt. 4 | Contract/FA charts in Post #1

[Malkinstheman]

All figures are cap numbers, not salaries.

Estimated 2017-18 ceiling​

​

​

|

$75.5-$76M​

​

​

Projected dollars committed |

59,420,000​

Projected July 1 cap space |

~16,580,000​

PITTSBURGH PENGUINS

Forward.................​

|

Pos.​

|

Age​

|

2017-18​

|

2018-19​

|

2019-20​

Evgeni Malkin|

C​

|

30​

|

9,500,000​

|

9,500,000​

|

9,500,000​

Sidney Crosby|

C​

|

29​

|

8,700,000​

|

8,700,000​

|

8,700,000​

Phil Kessel|

RW​

|

29​

|

6,800,000​

|

6,800,000​

|

6,800,000​

Patric Hornqvist|

RW​

|

29​

|

4,250,000​

|

UFA​

Carl Hagelin|

LW​

|

28​

|

4,000,000​

|

4,000,000​

|

UFA​

Jake Guentzel|

LW​

|

22​

|

734,167​

|

734,167​

|

RFA​

Bryan Rust|

RW​

|

24​

|

640,000​

|

RFA​

Scott Wilson|

LW​

|

24​

|

625,000​

|

RFA​

Tom Kuhnhackl|

LW​

|

24​

|

625,000​

|

RFA​

Carter Rowney|

RW​

|

27​

|

612,500​

|

UFA​

Defense.................​

|

Pos.​

|

Age​

|

2017-18​

|

2018-19​

|

.2019-20​

Kris Letang|

D​

|

29​

|

7,250,000​

|

7,250,000​

|

7,250,000​

Olli Maatta|

D​

|

22​

|

4,083,333​

|

4,083,333​

|

4,083,333​

Ian Cole|

D​

|

27​

|

2,100,000​

|

UFA​

Goalie............,.......​

|

Pos.​

|

Age​

|

2017-18​

|

2018-19​

|

.2019-20​

Marc-Andre Fleury|

G​

|

32​

|

5,750,000​

|

5,750,000​

|

UFA​

Matt Murray|

G​

|

22​

|

3,750,000​

|

3,750,000​

|

3,750,000​

WILKES-BARRE/SCRANTON PENGUINS

Forward...............​

|

Pos.​

|

Age​

|

2017-18​

|

2018-19​

|

2019-20​

Zach Aston-Reese|

LW​

|

22​

|

925,000​

|

925,000​

|

RFA​

Thomas Di Pauli|

C​

|

22​

|

742,500​

|

RFA​

Teddy Blueger|

C​

|

22​

|

705,000​

|

RFA​

Daniel Sprong|

RW​

|

19​

|

692,500​

|

692,500​

|

RFA​

Dominik Simon|

C​

|

22​

|

692,500​

|

RFA​

Defense...............​

|

Pos.​

|

Age​

|

2017-18​

|

2018-19​

|

2019-20​

Jeff Taylor|

D​

|

22​

|

742,500​

|

742,500​

|

RFA​

Ethan Prow|

D​

|

24​

|

730,000​

|

RFA​

Lukas Bengtsson|

D​

|

22​

|

705,000​

|

RFA​

Goalie..................​

|

Pos.​

|

Age​

|

2017-18​

|

2018-19​

|

2019-20​

Sean Maguire|

G​

|

23​

|

705,000​

|

RFA​

Tristan Jarry|

G​

|

21​

|

630,833​

|

RFA​

UNRESTRICTED FREE AGENTS

Player........................​

|

Pos.​

|

Age​

|

2016-17​

|

News and notes​

Mark Streit|

D​

|

39​

|

5,250,000​

|Served his purpose as a deadline rental

Chris Kunitz|

LW​

|

37​

|

3,850,000​

|Used to have something mean written here

Trevor Daley|

D​

|

33​

|

3,300,000​

|Declining, but immortalized as the anti-Scuderi

Ron Hainsey|

D​

|

35​

|

2,833,333​

|History with Rutherford could earn an extra look

Nick Bonino|

C​

|

28​

|

1,900,000​

|No way to tell which Bonino you'd be paying for

Matt Cullen|

C​

|

40​

|

1,000,000​

|Thanks for your service, Dad -- Enjoy retirement

Chad Ruhwedel|

D​

|

26​

|

575,000​

|Better than expected as an extended fill-in

David Warsofsky|

D​

|

26​

|

575,000​

|Great AHL production -- Not an NHL defender

Cameron Gaunce|

D​

|

26​

|

575,000​

|Depth defender who showed a few flashes

Kevin Porter|

C​

|

30​

|

575,000​

|Likely to move on after not sniffing a call-up

Garrett Wilson|

LW​

|

25​

|

575,000​

|Group VI UFA was solid in WBS before injury

Tom Sestito|

LW​

|

29​

|

575,000​

|Token minor-league goon

RESTRICTED FREE AGENTS

Player..........................​

|

Pos.​

|

Age​

|

2016-17​

|

News and notes​

Justin Schultz|

D​

|

26​

|

1,400,000​

|Hard to imagine anyone raising his stock more

Derrick Pouliot|

D​

|

22​

|

863,333​

|*Sigh* At least his next contract will still be cheap

Brian Dumoulin|

D​

|

25​

|

800,000​

|In line for a reasonably priced mid-range deal

Oskar Sundqvist|

C​

|

22​

|

700,833​

|Will they protect him in the expansion draft?

Conor Sheary|

LW​

|

24​

|

667,500​

|Aggressive agent could make for tough negotiation

Josh Archibald|

RW​

|

24​

|

659,167​

|Decent speed will keep him in the organization

Frank Corrado|

D​

|

23​

|

600,000​

|Worthwhile project to keep around and develop

Jean-Sebastien Dea|

C​

|

22​

|

585,000​

|Needs to take bigger step from AHL supporting cast

Tim Erixon|

D​

|

25​

|

575,000​

|Telling that he wasn't close to a call-up this season

Stuart Percy|

D​

|

23​

|

575,000​

|Unfortunately just another Leafs' first-round bust

UNSIGNED PROSPECTS

Player​

​

​

|

Pos.​

|

Age​

|

Current Team (League)​

Niclas Almari|

D​

|

18​

|HPK (Liiga)

Anthony Angello|

F​

|

20​

|Cornell (ECAC)

Dane Birks|

D​

|

21​

|Michigan Tech (WCHA)

Kasper Bjorkqvist|

F​

|

19​

|Providence (HEA)

Blaine Byron|

F​

|

21​

|Maine (HEA)

Filip Gustavsson|

G​

|

18​

|Luleå HF (SHL)

Connor Hall|

D​

|

18​

|Kitchener (OHL)

Ryan Jones|

D​

|

20​

|Nebraska-Omaha (NCHC)

Sam Lafferty|

F​

|

21​

|Brown (ECAC)

Joe Masonius|

D​

|

19​

|Connecticut (HEA)

Nikita Pavlychev|

F​

|

19​

|Penn State (B1G)

Alexander Pechurskiy|

G​

|

26​

|Amur Khabarovsk (KHL)

Frederik Tiffels|

F​

|

21​

|Western Michigan (NCHC)

Dominik Uher|

C​

|

23​

|HC Sparta Praha (ELH)

Click to read more...

 

[Malkinstheman]

Apparently Hjarlmarsson could be available. We will easily get outbid but at his salary, getting him would be huge.

 

[mpp9]

Apparently Hjarlmarsson could be available. We will easily get outbid but at his salary, getting him would be huge.

Hawks aren't gonna help us outdo them in Cups. But yeah he and Vlasic are premiere shutdown D.

 

[JTG]

Hjalmarsson is the exact type of defenseman I'd like to see us target.

 

[Malkinstheman]

Hawks aren't gonna help us outdo them in Cups. But yeah he and Vlasic are premiere shutdown D.

I wonder how much much this is actually true. Would a gm really pick a worse trade so another contender doesnt beat their domination. Not saying you're wrong, but im not entirely sure.

 

[Penske]

Hawks aren't gonna help us outdo them in Cups. But yeah he and Vlasic are premiere shutdown D.

They already did. Daley, Scuderi

 

[mpp9]

I wonder how much much this is actually true. Would a gm really pick a worse trade so another contender doesnt beat their domination. Not saying you're wrong, but im not entirely sure.

I'd say if they have a remotely similar offer, they're going with that one.

Hawks are in worse shape than I thought if they have to deal their 2nd best D-man on a great contract.

 

[Riptide]

I wonder how much much this is actually true. Would a gm really pick a worse trade so another contender doesnt beat their domination. Not saying you're wrong, but im not entirely sure.

Usually as long as it's not in the same division/conference it's not an issue. A GM might take slightly less when discussing a trade between say Edmonton and New Jersey (thinking of the C.Schneider trade), but if we were to offer up something good, it wouldn't be an issue - as long as we were paying a fair price. Chicago isn't going to not make a trade just because they might meet us in the finals.

 

[Penske]

I'd say if they have a remotely similar offer, they're going with that one.

Hawks are in worse shape than I thought if they have to deal their 2nd best D-man on a great contract.

They are in big cap trouble due to some of their contracts and bonuses that got carried over (3.56 mil according to capfriendly).

 

[Malkinstheman]

Usually as long as it's not in the same division/conference it's not an issue. A GM might take slightly less when discussing a trade between say Edmonton and New Jersey (thinking of the C.Schneider trade), but if we were to offer up something good, it wouldn't be an issue - as long as we were paying a fair price. Chicago isn't going to not make a trade just because they might meet us in the finals.

Yeah this was my thinking as well.

 

[xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]

Didn't the Hawks already give us the cold shoulder with Saad? Wasn't the report that we offered a better deal, but they chose Columbus anyway? I may be remembering that wrong.

 

[The Greatest 101]

I wonder what Dumba would cost. He would fit us perfectly.

 

[Malkinstheman]

Didn't the Hawks already give us the cold shoulder with Saad? Wasn't the report that we offered a better deal, but they chose Columbus anyway? I may be remembering that wrong.

Now that you mentioned it, I think something like that did happen. There were rumours that we did have the better deal. I think it was more just that, we were giving the greater value but the jackets had the pieces that would fit better. We wouldnt have been able to give them a guy like anismov to center their second line.

 

[Riptide]

Yeah this was my thinking as well.

As long as we're talking about a package that they like, I think we'd get the guy. They might go after someone else, but I don't think it would be simply because we're the Penguins and they might see us in the finals at some point.

Didn't the Hawks already give us the cold shoulder with Saad? Wasn't the report that we offered a better deal, but they chose Columbus anyway? I may be remembering that wrong.

I doubt it. Look at what Chicago got for him (AA, Dano, Morin, 4th). Now how would we have competed with that deal? AA is better than Bonino and unless we were talking about trading Sprong or KK or Guentzel we didn't have a prospect as good as Dano to move. Could we have made a half decent offer? Yes probably. But I don't think that we didn't get him because they didn't want to send him to us. I don't think we got him because we couldn't offer up what Chicago wanted from us for it to make sense.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I find it funny when people are complaining and acting like $500K is a deal breaker for Schultz or Bonino. "I would pay him X but if he wants X + $500K he can walk and we'll make a trade instead", etc.


The cap is going up every year -- seriously, who cares? We've got our best guys locked up at very fair prices. And our window to still win is in the next 3-5 years. We have Murray signed for a discount. He's worth $6M, and we're paying him $3.75M. So if we give Bonino a 3-4 year deal and Schultz a 5 year deal and there's slight overpayment, who the **** cares.


I would give Bonino 3 or 4 years times $4M (I would prefer 3 years but will go 4 if necessary, Bones is still young enough for 4).


And I would be thrilled to lock up Schultz for 5-6 years at $5M, but will go $5.5 without thinking twice if that's what it takes.

And now you have over $1 million in dead cap space just because you signed guys for way too much money that you didn't need to do. Schultz isn't a guy you spend $5.5 million on, if he wants that much, you trade him to someone who will pay him that much. Ditto Bonino at $4 million. The logic being thrown around in here is the same logic Shero used to re-sign Kunitz and Dupuis to the contracts that they got.



Hjarlmarsson is a guy I'd definitely target, he'd be a great player to trade for.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Didn't the Hawks already give us the cold shoulder with Saad? Wasn't the report that we offered a better deal, but they chose Columbus anyway? I may be remembering that wrong.

I heard 2 stories, that the Hawks didn't like Sutter as the centerpiece so they never went any further with negotiations with the Penguins and that the Hawks were mad at Saad for asking for too much money, so they specifically didn't trade him to Pittsburgh.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

^ The kind of small minded thinking I'm talking about. "Schultz is great at 4 or 4.5, but garbage at 5 or 5.5" but we should trade him for next to nothing and spend trade away other quality players like Sheary & Maatta to bring in [insert name of grass is greener player here]"

The problem is you're ignoring the salary cap. The reason people think Schultz works at $4 million to $4.5 million, is because it leaves more money to fix the other holes in the lineup, and because a player of Schultz's caliber shouldn't be taking up so much of your cap space. If he's making upwards of $5.5 million, it's not that he's "garbage", it's that a team that's up against the cap is paying a player about $1 million too much instead of using that money more wisely.

This isn't the old days where it doesn't matter if you overpay a guy by $1 million just to keep him around. You have to be a lot more judicial in how you allocate the cap space, particularly when it comes to non-core guys.

 

[Peat]

The problem is you're ignoring the salary cap. The reason people think Schultz works at $4 million to $4.5 million, is because it leaves more money to fix the other holes in the lineup, and because a player of Schultz's caliber shouldn't be taking up so much of your cap space. If he's making upwards of $5.5 million, it's not that he's "garbage", it's that a team that's up against the cap is paying a player about $1 million too much instead of using that money more wisely.

This isn't the old days where it doesn't matter if you overpay a guy by $1 million just to keep him around. You have to be a lot more judicial in how you allocate the cap space, particularly when it comes to non-core guys.

Valuing not having to trade for guys ahead of the tightest salaries =/= Ignoring the salary cap

The same way that

Being willing to move guys if their salary demands are too big =/= being willing to trade them for next to nothing

Personally I think people are overrating the value of being really salary efficient. No team in the NHL is paying the best possible price for every player, its not a big deal to do it every now and again. This roster's got a few overpaid players on it already. Moving a few on and adding a few more is not the end of the world, at least not compared to the price we might have to pay for another PP QB on Schultz's level.

As long as they're at a fair enough value where they can be moved again if needs be, I'm not seeing the issue.

 

[Riptide]

The problem is you're ignoring the salary cap. The reason people think Schultz works at $4 million to $4.5 million, is because it leaves more money to fix the other holes in the lineup, and because a player of Schultz's caliber shouldn't be taking up so much of your cap space. If he's making upwards of $5.5 million, it's not that he's "garbage", it's that a team that's up against the cap is paying a player about $1 million too much instead of using that money more wisely.

This isn't the old days where it doesn't matter if you overpay a guy by $1 million just to keep him around. You have to be a lot more judicial in how you allocate the cap space, particularly when it comes to non-core guys.

BS. Here's the bottom line. We absolutely need both Bonino and Schultz or at least someone very very like them over the next 2 years - beyond obviously, but the next 2 years are key.

Our best window (beyond this year) is next year while Hornqvist and Cole are here and Rust and others are on dirt cheap contracts and then the following year while Guentzel (and likely Sprong) are on dirt cheap contracts. And while overpaying to retain Schultz and/or Bonino obviously isn't the best situation... we're not talking about just a regular joe. Schultz is the closest thing to a Letang like player we have in the system. Like it or not, we need him - even if it means overpaying to keep him. The same goes for Bonino. We can replace Hornqvist or any other winger we have - and the same thing goes to a lesser extent for any other D we have outside of Schultz or Letang. But a RD who has the offense Schultz has and can QB the PP and a #3C are very very important positions - and these are not ones we can afford to not have filled with quality players.

So if we can find other options who fit our cap better, great. But if push comes to shove, I'll suck it up and pay them, because over the next 2 years we need them more than we need an extra 1m in cap space. Especially as we have other players who we could move to make room if absolutely needed.

 

[Penske]

Valuing not having to trade for guys ahead of the tightest salaries =/= Ignoring the salary cap

The same way that

Being willing to move guys if their salary demands are too big =/= being willing to trade them for next to nothing

Personally I think people are overrating the value of being really salary efficient. No team in the NHL is paying the best possible price for every player, its not a big deal to do it every now and again. This roster's got a few overpaid players on it already. Moving a few on and adding a few more is not the end of the world, at least not compared to the price we might have to pay for another PP QB on Schultz's level.

As long as they're at a fair enough value where they can be moved again if needs be, I'm not seeing the issue.

That's what is getting Chicago in trouble now.

Through the Crosby/Malkin years we need to be smart with our cap.

 

[jmelm]

The problem is you're ignoring the salary cap. The reason people think Schultz works at $4 million to $4.5 million, is because it leaves more money to fix the other holes in the lineup, and because a player of Schultz's caliber shouldn't be taking up so much of your cap space. If he's making upwards of $5.5 million, it's not that he's "garbage", it's that a team that's up against the cap is paying a player about $1 million too much instead of using that money more wisely.

This isn't the old days where it doesn't matter if you overpay a guy by $1 million just to keep him around. You have to be a lot more judicial in how you allocate the cap space, particularly when it comes to non-core guys.

I understand the concept of the salary cap and opportunity cost. But I'm saying what I'm saying because we have A LOT of free cap space, based on my projected roster. Even with Bonino @ 4M, Sheary @ 3M, Schultz @ 5M and Dumoulin @ 3.5M (which I all think are very realistic numbers for them), we would have between $5.5-6M in cap space.

If we fast forward to the next year when we need to re-sign these 5 players:
- Cole (slight bump up to $3M on a 3-4 year deal)
- Rust (probably a bridge deal in the range of $2M)
- Wilson (depending on performance, he could get a short term deal in the 1-1.5 range)
- Kuhn (bump up to around $1M).
- Sprong (if he plays most of the year in WBS, will probably sign a 2-year deal around $1M per)

Plus Hornqvist, who if he has the same kind of year next year as he did this past year, will likely only command a small raise (4.5-4.75M IMO).

Adding up all those increases for those 6 players would cost quite a bit less than the current cap space we would hold over from my roster predictions (probably in the range of 4M to 5M max). AND, the cap will likely go up $3.5 to $4.5M, which would cover a majority if not all of those raises.

So with all of that, an extra $500K to Bonino and/or Schultz concerns me not. Not in the least.

 

[Riptide]

That's what is getting Chicago in trouble now.

Through the Crosby/Malkin years we need to be smart with our cap.

Not even close. Chicago is in trouble because they're paying their top center and their top winger 21 million a year. Not to mention that they have a total of 7 players making more than 5m. Add in a couple other key players not on cheap contracts, and that is why they're in a very tight spot.

Pittsburgh on the other hand is in pretty good shape cap wise - even if they give 10m to Schultz and Bonino. If JS gets >5m, that still only leaves us with 5 players making 5m or more.

Key positions such as center depth and D depth is where you do overpay to retain players. Wingers - such as Panarin, Hossa and Kane while all very good players are not who you overpay to keep - and especially not all 3 and especially not when they combine to make 21.5m.

 

[jmelm]

Copying my projected roster from the previous thread, for our 2017-18 team.

1) Malkin - 9.5M
2) Crosby - 8.7M
3) Kessel - 6.8M
4) Hornqvist - 4.25M
5) Bonino - 4M
6) Sheary - 3M
7) Guentzel - 730k
8) Sprong - 700k
9) Archibald - 650k
10) Rust - 640k
11) Wilson - 625k
12) Kuhn - 625k
13) Rowney - 610k

1) Letang - 7.25M
2) Schultz - 5M
3) Maatta - 4M
4) Dumo - 3.5M
5) Cole - 2.1M
6) Pouliot - 900k
7) Ruhwedel - 900k

1) Murray - 3.75M
2) backup - 1.5M

TOTAL SALARY: $69,030,000
Projected Cap: $73M
Free Cap Space: $6,470,000 (could be 6.97M)

UPDATED: to include new flat-cap figure, and Sprong projected into the line up.

 

[Peat]

That's what is getting Chicago in trouble now.

Through the Crosby/Malkin years we need to be smart with our cap.

There's a big, big distance between paying top end on a few roster players to avoid having to trade for replacements and giving out gigantic long contracts to everyone. Everyone does the former. A couple of possible slight overpayments this year is nowhere near Blackhawk level nor does it ever look like getting there, unless we sign both for eight years with NMCs at the same time.

Sure, we need to be smart. We always need to be smart with our cap. But we also need to be smart with our assets. And we're so far off Blackhawking it away that it's just not a reasonable comparison right now. Come back when Kunitz gets his 3 year 5m NMC extension

 

[JimmyTwoTimes]

Just win back to back and everything that happens this off season is a bonus.

We have so many young players ready to play in the next few years. Keep taking advantage of having guys on their ELCs. If there are a few players who are due contracts that want too much money...trade em.