Salary Cap: Future Roster Building (2017-18 and beyond) Pt. 3 | Contract/FA charts in Post #1

[mpp9]

The more I think about it, if Thornton is even at 75% after his injury I'd pay up big in free agency. That's a player who could really take us to another level. Can give Sid some easier matchups. PK. Create a legit 2nd PP unit. Be a playmaker for Sprong or Kessel. And obviously we wouldn't be dead in the water if 87 or 71 go down in a series.

He'd also allow us to have PH on a third line and not be a waste of his scoring ability.

If no D upgrades are out there, I'd be willing to go 6 mil on a short term deal.

 

[JTG]

Schultz gets extra money because he is also our best option on D for the PP, with or without Letang.
With that I would be fine to give him an extra year or two if it keeps salary a bit lower to aid us in the bid to be a Dynasty now. Five years, 5 million per. He might well be able to top that in free agency, but it sets him up for life in a perfect situation team and role wise.

Bonino.... I'd really like to check whats out there first. He is definitely a warrior in the playoffs, but he will never be fast, physical or one to drive posession. The player we saw most of the season certainly is not a 4 million dollar player.

Suppose one thing getting a bit lost is the matter of leadership/personality in the room. Losing MAF, Kunitz, Cullen (likely) and Bones in one go is not a joke, no matter how good we have been at bringing in WBS guys in recent seasons.

I'd definitely try to upgrade on Bonino. I've said as much numerous times.

Schultz being a great PP man means nothing because he'll never be on the PP with Letang healthy. In all honesty, I don't see Schultz looking to bend us over. His interviews have been glowing about the city and the team. I think negotiations with him will be very easy and will benefit both sides.

 

[mpp9]

I'd definitely try to upgrade on Bonino. I've said as much numerous times.

Schultz being a great PP man means nothing because he'll never be on the PP with Letang healthy. In all honesty, I don't see Schultz looking to bend us over. His interviews have been glowing about the city and the team. I think negotiations with him will be very easy and will benefit both sides.

He won't get as many minutes but they replaced Letang with Schultz before. And when the stars get too pass happy or are giving up shorties you throw both of them on the top unit.

I'd also be fine giving Letang a good long look on the top unit next year. See if he learned anything watching from up top.

 

[JTG]

Letang shouldn't be the top PPQB. It should be Schultz. It never will be though. No matter how bad Letang has ever been, he has only been taken off the top unit for a period here or there.

 

[Tender Rip]

Letang shouldn't be the top PPQB. It should be Schultz. It never will be though. No matter how bad Letang has ever been, he has only been taken off the top unit for a period here or there.

They replaced Letang with Schultz already this season before Letang went down, and it is an easy way to cut a bit from Letang's minutes, which Sullivan is clear on wanting anyway. Don't think you are right about this - and hope so even less.

 

[jmelm]

I don't know why people keep talking about how having Letang mitigates the need for Schultz (or vice-versa), while at the same time there is a general consensus that we need to bolster our D corps...


Yet people keep saying we should subtract from that by letting Schultz walk or that Schultz becomes less important with Letang playing more offensive minutes. Some people saying that because Schultz may score 10 less points with Letang being healthy that he's not so valuable and we should let him go. It's such stupid, inconsistent logic. Schultz is part of the SOLUTION by having be our 2nd pairing RD.

If Schultz is talking 5.5 I'd be trading him for sure.

^ The kind of small minded thinking I'm talking about. "Schultz is great at 4 or 4.5, but garbage at 5 or 5.5" but we should trade him for next to nothing and spend trade away other quality players like Sheary & Maatta to bring in [insert name of grass is greener player here]"


I'll take Schultz at 5 or 5.5 over Shattenkirk at 6.5 every day of the week. I probably take Schultz over Shattenkirk at the same price based on what I've seen this year.

 

[DoktorZaius]

I'll take Schultz at 5 or 5.5 over Shattenkirk at 6.5 every day of the week. I probably take Schultz over Shattenkirk at the same price based on what I've seen this year.

Strongly agreed. Schultz has come a long way since he came to Pittsburgh last season, I wouldn't be surprised if his best years are ahead of him.

 

[Penske]

I don't know why people keep talking about how having Letang mitigates the need for Schultz (or vice-versa), while at the same time there is a general consensus that we need to bolster our D corps...


Yet people keep saying we should subtract from that by letting Schultz walk or that Schultz becomes less important with Letang playing more offensive minutes. Some people saying that because Schultz may score 10 less points with Letang being healthy that he's not so valuable and we should let him go. It's such stupid, inconsistent logic. Schultz is part of the SOLUTION by having be our 2nd pairing RD.




^ The kind of small minded thinking I'm talking about. "Schultz is great at 4 or 4.5, but garbage at 5 or 5.5" but we should trade him for next to nothing and spend trade away other quality players like Sheary & Maatta to bring in [insert name of grass is greener player here]"


I'll take Schultz at 5 or 5.5 over Shattenkirk at 6.5 every day of the week. I probably take Schultz over Shattenkirk at the same price based on what I've seen this year.

Because I said he's garbage and we'd trade him for next to nothing. There's multiple moves to be made and luckily we a have a GM since that's part of their job.

JR isn't going to sign him to 5.5 deal with term without exploring other options.

If I'm Schultz I sign a 2-3 deal at a reasonable price to stay in Pittsburgh. He puts in similar seasons consistently then he can really go for the big contract.

 

[JimmyTwoTimes]

It sounded like we were in the ball park of landing every major at the deadline. Hanzal, Shattenkirk and Duchene. So JR apparently is willing to spend what big time assets we have and teams apparently are interested in what we have to offer.

If it's a move that makes us a better team beyond next season, I'm down.

JR is a smart guy, he knows if we win back to back we are going to have to add some top end talent if we want to go on another deep run.

1. 2 years of over a half of season more games played than others.

2. Target on our backs will be even bigger

3. Other teams will continue to improve, so we need to match that instead of staying put and letting those teams catch up to us in talent.

4. Prepare for injuries. Need better depth on D.


As for Sprong and ZAR , hope both tear up the AHL like Guentzel did. Will be a great sign going forward. And both may play a big role on this team next playoffs.

I can't see Thornton going to the pens , but maybe Marleau. I still say we add someone nobody is expecting tho. JR will go the " hockey trade" route. He's due.

 

[Malkinstheman]

Apparently Hjarlmarsson could be available. We will easily get outbid but at his salary, getting him would be huge.

 

[mpp9]

Apparently Hjarlmarsson could be available. We will easily get outbid but at his salary, getting him would be huge.

Hawks aren't gonna help us outdo them in Cups. But yeah he and Vlasic are premiere shutdown D.

 

[JTG]

Hjalmarsson is the exact type of defenseman I'd like to see us target.

 

[Malkinstheman]

Hawks aren't gonna help us outdo them in Cups. But yeah he and Vlasic are premiere shutdown D.

I wonder how much much this is actually true. Would a gm really pick a worse trade so another contender doesnt beat their domination. Not saying you're wrong, but im not entirely sure.

 

[Penske]

Hawks aren't gonna help us outdo them in Cups. But yeah he and Vlasic are premiere shutdown D.

They already did. Daley, Scuderi

 

[mpp9]

I wonder how much much this is actually true. Would a gm really pick a worse trade so another contender doesnt beat their domination. Not saying you're wrong, but im not entirely sure.

I'd say if they have a remotely similar offer, they're going with that one.

Hawks are in worse shape than I thought if they have to deal their 2nd best D-man on a great contract.

 

[Riptide]

I wonder how much much this is actually true. Would a gm really pick a worse trade so another contender doesnt beat their domination. Not saying you're wrong, but im not entirely sure.

Usually as long as it's not in the same division/conference it's not an issue. A GM might take slightly less when discussing a trade between say Edmonton and New Jersey (thinking of the C.Schneider trade), but if we were to offer up something good, it wouldn't be an issue - as long as we were paying a fair price. Chicago isn't going to not make a trade just because they might meet us in the finals.

 

[Penske]

I'd say if they have a remotely similar offer, they're going with that one.

Hawks are in worse shape than I thought if they have to deal their 2nd best D-man on a great contract.

They are in big cap trouble due to some of their contracts and bonuses that got carried over (3.56 mil according to capfriendly).

 

[Malkinstheman]

Usually as long as it's not in the same division/conference it's not an issue. A GM might take slightly less when discussing a trade between say Edmonton and New Jersey (thinking of the C.Schneider trade), but if we were to offer up something good, it wouldn't be an issue - as long as we were paying a fair price. Chicago isn't going to not make a trade just because they might meet us in the finals.

Yeah this was my thinking as well.

 

[xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]

Didn't the Hawks already give us the cold shoulder with Saad? Wasn't the report that we offered a better deal, but they chose Columbus anyway? I may be remembering that wrong.

 

[The Greatest 101]

I wonder what Dumba would cost. He would fit us perfectly.

 

[Malkinstheman]

Didn't the Hawks already give us the cold shoulder with Saad? Wasn't the report that we offered a better deal, but they chose Columbus anyway? I may be remembering that wrong.

Now that you mentioned it, I think something like that did happen. There were rumours that we did have the better deal. I think it was more just that, we were giving the greater value but the jackets had the pieces that would fit better. We wouldnt have been able to give them a guy like anismov to center their second line.

 

[Riptide]

Yeah this was my thinking as well.

As long as we're talking about a package that they like, I think we'd get the guy. They might go after someone else, but I don't think it would be simply because we're the Penguins and they might see us in the finals at some point.

Didn't the Hawks already give us the cold shoulder with Saad? Wasn't the report that we offered a better deal, but they chose Columbus anyway? I may be remembering that wrong.

I doubt it. Look at what Chicago got for him (AA, Dano, Morin, 4th). Now how would we have competed with that deal? AA is better than Bonino and unless we were talking about trading Sprong or KK or Guentzel we didn't have a prospect as good as Dano to move. Could we have made a half decent offer? Yes probably. But I don't think that we didn't get him because they didn't want to send him to us. I don't think we got him because we couldn't offer up what Chicago wanted from us for it to make sense.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I find it funny when people are complaining and acting like $500K is a deal breaker for Schultz or Bonino. "I would pay him X but if he wants X + $500K he can walk and we'll make a trade instead", etc.


The cap is going up every year -- seriously, who cares? We've got our best guys locked up at very fair prices. And our window to still win is in the next 3-5 years. We have Murray signed for a discount. He's worth $6M, and we're paying him $3.75M. So if we give Bonino a 3-4 year deal and Schultz a 5 year deal and there's slight overpayment, who the **** cares.


I would give Bonino 3 or 4 years times $4M (I would prefer 3 years but will go 4 if necessary, Bones is still young enough for 4).


And I would be thrilled to lock up Schultz for 5-6 years at $5M, but will go $5.5 without thinking twice if that's what it takes.

And now you have over $1 million in dead cap space just because you signed guys for way too much money that you didn't need to do. Schultz isn't a guy you spend $5.5 million on, if he wants that much, you trade him to someone who will pay him that much. Ditto Bonino at $4 million. The logic being thrown around in here is the same logic Shero used to re-sign Kunitz and Dupuis to the contracts that they got.



Hjarlmarsson is a guy I'd definitely target, he'd be a great player to trade for.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Didn't the Hawks already give us the cold shoulder with Saad? Wasn't the report that we offered a better deal, but they chose Columbus anyway? I may be remembering that wrong.

I heard 2 stories, that the Hawks didn't like Sutter as the centerpiece so they never went any further with negotiations with the Penguins and that the Hawks were mad at Saad for asking for too much money, so they specifically didn't trade him to Pittsburgh.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

^ The kind of small minded thinking I'm talking about. "Schultz is great at 4 or 4.5, but garbage at 5 or 5.5" but we should trade him for next to nothing and spend trade away other quality players like Sheary & Maatta to bring in [insert name of grass is greener player here]"

The problem is you're ignoring the salary cap. The reason people think Schultz works at $4 million to $4.5 million, is because it leaves more money to fix the other holes in the lineup, and because a player of Schultz's caliber shouldn't be taking up so much of your cap space. If he's making upwards of $5.5 million, it's not that he's "garbage", it's that a team that's up against the cap is paying a player about $1 million too much instead of using that money more wisely.

This isn't the old days where it doesn't matter if you overpay a guy by $1 million just to keep him around. You have to be a lot more judicial in how you allocate the cap space, particularly when it comes to non-core guys.