Free Agency and Trade Thread - Post deadline wasteland

[SprDaVE]

Tuch's deal was after 1 full season. Drouin's deal was after only 1 "GOOD" season. The other two deals were after a few seasons of the same type of seasons.

AND... why isn't Kapanen signing a long term deal? Because you declare he isn't?

There are a numerous other contracts that compare that were 2-4 year deals between 2.5M and 3.5M or similar cap percentage bridge deals. Ironically, Nino and Tatar are good examples of that brought up by someone else.

I believe he will be bridged because that's what the Leafs will want to do and there's zero indication that he won't agree to some sort of bridge contract. Are we saying no player will ever sign a bridge contract?

I personally have Kapanen right now as a 2 year 3M contract, give or take 500k.

 

[rumman]

maybe its me, but I see Kadri going before KK and AJ ,,,

I could see that happening.

 

[deletethis]

Vincent Trochek: $4.75M for 6 years after 1 good season of 25 goals, 53 points (23yo, 2016)
Sean Couturier: $4.33M for 6 years after several seasons of no better than 15 goals, 39 points (23yo, 2016)
Christian Dvorak: $4.45M for 6 years after 2 seasons of no better than 15 goals, 37 points (22yo, 2018)

 

[mapleleafs34]

maybe its me, but I see Kadri going before KK and AJ ,,,

I agree with this. Especially given how Nylander has played C the past couple games.

I could see us going with:
Hyman-Tavares-Marner
Johnsson-Matthews-Kapanen
Marleau-Nylander-Moore
Who Cares-Who Cares-Who Cares

Kadri sent to Carolina for a RHD.

 

[rumman]

I agree with this. Especially given how Nylander has played C the past couple games.

I could see us going with:
Hyman-Tavares-Marner
Johnsson-Matthews-Kapanen
Marleau-Nylander-Moore
Who Cares-Who Cares-Who Cares

Kadri sent to Carolina for a RHD.

will/would Nylander be happy being the 3rd line centre for the next several years?

 

[deletethis]

There are a numerous other contracts that compare that were 2-4 year deals between 2.5M and 3.5M or similar cap percentage bridge deals. Ironically, Nino and Tatar are good examples of that brought up by someone else.

I believe he will be bridged because that's what the Leafs will want to do and there's zero indication that he won't agree to some sort of bridge contract. Are we saying no player will ever sign a bridge contract?

I personally have Kapanen right now as a 2 year 3M contract, give or take 500k.

I think you're allowing your wishes/beliefs to overrule your head.

Again the challenge was to show comparables. There are plenty of comparables. Kapanen @ ~$5.25M for 6 years is worth the risks to the Leafs IMO. I think Kapanen would be making a riskier decision taking a so-called bridge contract. And as far as I'm concerned, a bridge contract is about the team and the player being unable to meet at what the future value of the player is. I think they absolutely can in this case.

 

[SprDaVE]

I think you're allowing your wishes/beliefs to overrule your head.

Again the challenge was to show comparables. There are plenty of comparables. Kapanen @ ~$5.25M for 6 years is worth the risks to the Leafs IMO. I think Kapanen would be making a riskier decision taking a so-called bridge contract. And as far as I'm concerned, a bridge contract is about the team and the player being unable to meet at what the future value of the player is. I think they absolutely can in this case.

My wishes and beliefs? This is the situation at hand. We can't afford him at 5M+ over long-term.

It's funny because I agree that he's well worth 5M+ over a long 5-6 year term deal. The challenge was about a bridge being well over 5M, which was not specified clearly by me so I accept that. The point was to demonstrate that "bridge" contracts exist and the very likely scenario Kapanen is dealt if he wants to stay with the Leafs next season.

There's a plethora of teams that have bridged players of his ilk for a range of reasons. The Leafs in their current cap situation will not give term to Kapanen, especially after one good season. The idea is to keep as many players as well as possible and they cannot do that if they give term to everyone because term means they have to give up more money. From Tatar to Nino to Kucherov to Subban to Lindholm to Zucker to Huberdeau to Turris to Johansen to Zibanejad... they all signed bridge deals ranging from 2 to 4 years mostly around 2M to 4M.

So let me make this clear --- the Leafs cannot afford Kapanen on a longer term deal. Agreed? Right. So the Leafs will be offering a bridge contract and the comparables there are around 3M. Right? Right. If Kapanen does not want a bridge, he will be traded. If he does accept a bridge, which has happened many times in the past with other players, then he will likely stay and we can revisit his next contract when Marleau, Zaitsev, etc are gone.

If you and others believe that he will not accept a bridge contract then that's your prerogative and we will have to wait to see what happens.

 

[deletethis]

will/would Nylander be happy being the 3rd line centre for the next several years?

Fortunately I think that's little concern. Apparently it's an unpopular opinion to look at Nylander's contract, see that it's structured to be traded after July 1st 2019 and anticipate that he's moved sometime before the 2019-20 season.

 

[deletethis]

My wishes and beliefs? This is the situation at hand. We can't afford him at 5M+ over long-term.

It's funny because I agree that he's well worth 5M+ over a long 5-6 year term deal. The challenge was about a bridge being well over 5M, which was not specified clearly by me so I accept that. The point was to demonstrate that "bridge" contracts exist and the very likely scenario Kapanen is dealt if he wants to stay with the Leafs next season.

There's a plethora of teams that have bridged players of his ilk for a range of reasons. The Leafs in their current cap situation will not give term to Kapanen, especially after one good season. The idea is to keep as many players as well as possible and they cannot do that if they give term to everyone because term means they have to give up more money.

So let me make this clear --- the Leafs cannot afford Kapanen on a longer term deal. Agreed? Right. So the Leafs will be offering a bridge contract and the comparables there are around 3M. Right? Right. If Kapanen does not want a bridge, he will be traded. If he does accept a bridge, which has happened many times in the past with other players, then he will likely stay and we can revisit his next contract when Marleau, Zaitsev, etc are gone.

If you and others believe that he will not accept a bridge contract then that's your prerogative and we will have to wait to see what happens.

Yeah, a bridge at $5M AAV makes zero sense.

I absolutely don't agree that the Leafs can't afford Kapanen at ~$5M AAV. Other players just might have to be moved. The easiest to move candidate is Nylander. Zaitsev is the next easiest to move as servicable RHD during the July 1st UFA feed frenzy at $4.5M AAV are highly sought after. Then there's Kadri. I'd MUCH prefer trading any of those mentioned over Kapanen.

It's funny because I agree that he's well worth 5M+ over a long 5-6 year term deal. The challenge was about a bridge being well over 5M, which was not specified clearly by me so I accept that. The point was to demonstrate that "bridge" contracts exist and the very likely scenario Kapanen is dealt if he wants to stay with the Leafs next season.

Are you gaslighting me? I was starting to doubt what you said then I went back...

Show me Kapanen comparables around the league and let me know how many are getting paid 5M+ over 5-6 years (or similar cap hit percentage) after one strong ~25 goal and ~50 point season.

 

[rumman]

Fortunately I think that's little concern. Apparently it's an unpopular opinion to look at Nylander's contract, see that it's structured to be traded after July 1st 2019 and anticipate that he's moved sometime before the 2019-20 season.

no kidding, you should expect to be attacked in 3....2.....1......

 

[SprDaVE]

Yeah, a bridge at $5M AAV makes zero sense.

I absolutely don't agree that the Leafs can't afford Kapanen at ~$5M AAV. Other players just might have to be moved. The easiest to move candidate is Nylander. Zaitsev is the next easiest to move as servicable RHD during the July 1st UFA feed frenzy at $4.5M AAV are highly sought after. Then there's Kadri. I'd MUCH prefer trading any of those mentioned over Kapanen.



Are you gaslighting me? I was starting to doubt what you said then I went back...

The Leafs can only afford Kapanen at a long term price if Marleau is completely removed or big trades happen around him, of course.

I think I'm not explaning myself right. You did show there are plenty of examples of teams giving term to players after one good season and I fully concede that point. For the Leafs, it's not just feasible to give him 5+ years unless there's a lot of movement upfront.

EDIT:

Couturier for example signed a 2 year 1.75M contract before his 6 year extension.

For some of the examples you gave, there are many more that show 2-4 year bridge deals. Stone, Couturier, Huberdeau, Athanasiou, Miles, Mantha, Zucker, Subban, Tatar, Nino, Kucherov, Johansen, Zibanejad from mostly the top of my head.

 

[Cor]

Fortunately I think that's little concern. Apparently it's an unpopular opinion to look at Nylander's contract, see that it's structured to be traded after July 1st 2019 and anticipate that he's moved sometime before the 2019-20 season.

I don't think it's unpopular.

But there's a difference between
- Structured to be traded
- Structured to be tradable.

Patrick Marleau, would be in category 1.

William Nylander, would be in category 2.

Is William Nylander's contract structured to be easily traded? Yes. Does that means he gets moved? No.

While Patrick Marleau's deal... well, it's blatantly set up for something to happen, but even then, it's not a guarantee.

 

[Fogelhund]

Kadri is a very good 3C, and has a cap hit that is just under $2.5 mil less than Nylander. That cap space is going to be critical.

Nylander is clearly the better player, in almost every way, though Kadri is one of the few grittier players that we've got. It might come down to dollars, and who a trading partner would prefer.

 

[Jozay]

Nylander: 22
Kadri: 28

 

[Menzinger]

I don't think it's unpopular.

But there's a difference between
- Structured to be traded
- Structured to be tradable.

Patrick Marleau, would be in category 1.

William Nylander, would be in category 2.

Is William Nylander's contract structured to be easily traded? Yes. Does that means he gets moved? No.

While Patrick Marleau's deal... well, it's blatantly set up for something to happen, but even then, it's not a guarantee.

Yep.Matthews and JT also have frontloaded contracts too. Teams likenot for flexibility and players want their money ASAP: it’s not any indication of when a player is going to be moved

 

[Menzinger]

Nylander: 22
Kadri: 28

I don’t know why this is even a debate.

You trad the older player 10/10 times - especially one whose going to be looking for a big pay day once they’re 30.....

 

[Menzinger]

Nylander had multiple seasons of 60+ points. Not just one. Kapanen is having 1 strong season and he can't even get close to what Nylander did 2 seasons ago. You don't pay a player based on one season.

Kapanen can look at Nylander all he wants but he's well under what Nylander accomplished at the same age. That's a key factor into this. It doesn't matter that he didn't get top PP minutes or whatever else. Production and age matters.

Kapanen is having a terrific breakout season but he will 100% be bridged. If he has no interest in a bridge and wants to get paid long-term, he is getting traded. It's that simple.

If Kapanen is smart, he takes the bridge and proves his worth over multiple seasons. He will be able to command a lot more long-term this way.

Scoring is also way up this season across the league thanks to league changes

Kapanen has zero basis to ask for near Nylander money st the moment. His agent would get laughed out of the room if he tried

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

I don’t know why this is even a debate.

You trad the older player 10/10 times - especially one whose going to be looking for a big pay day once they’re 30.....

See Ryan Kesler for more information...

Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of all of these guys but yea Kadri should be gone long before Matthews,Marner or Nylander.

It's the same situation with Andersen. Paying a goaltender 8-10M in a contract that extends into his 30's would be crippling. As much as you want to keep him around you can't do that. It's up to us to develop a replacement or trade for one eventually

 

[Al14]

Nylander: 22
Kadri: 28

Nylander: plays like he's 4'10".
Kadri: plays like he's 6'4".

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

Nylander: plays like he's 4'10".
Kadri: plays like he's 6'4".

Skilled players don't have to hit as much because they always have the puck lol

Even a team like Boston, Bergeron/Marchand/Pasta all have less than 50 hits this year.

 

[Sergei Berezin]

Any rumours of NCAA/Euro FA interest?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but none of those players would be eligible to play in the NHL playoffs, right?

 

[Menzinger]

Any rumours of NCAA/Euro FA interest?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but none of those players would be eligible to play in the NHL playoffs, right?

In the past the Leafs have been linked to Mat Robson of the University of Minnesota Mat Robson at eliteprospects.com

Whose been one of the few bright spots of the Gophers this season

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

In the past the Leafs have been linked to Mat Robson of the University of Minnesota Mat Robson at eliteprospects.com

Whose been one of the few bright spots of the Gophers this season

I like Robson but I'd probably rather go with somebody out of the CHL if we grab another goaltender, a little bit younger, more time to develop. Stephen Dhillon would be my target.

 

[SHANNYPLAN]

Leafs - Hurricanes
Nazem Kadri
for
Dougie Hamilton

Leafs - Coyotes
Connor Brown, Jeremy Bracco
for
Christian Dvorak

Johnsson - Matthews - Nylander
Hyman - - - Tavares - - - Marner
Moore - - - Dvorak - - - Kapanen
Marleau - - - Gauthier - - - Ennis

Rielly - - Hamilton
Muzzin - Dermott
Rosen - - - Zaitsev

​

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Leafs - Hurricanes
Nazem Kadri
for
Dougie Hamilton

Leafs - Coyotes
Connor Brown, Jeremy Bracco
for
Christian Dvorak

Johnsson - Matthews - Nylander
Hyman - - - Tavares - - - Marner
Moore - - - Dvorak - - - Kapanen
Marleau - - - Gauthier - - - Ennis

Rielly - - Hamilton
Muzzin - Dermott
Rosen - - - Zaitsev

​

I'd rather have Pesce than Hamilton. Also, Zaitsev is on the 2nd pairing RD long before Dermott would be. Bottom pairing should 100% be Dermott-Liljegren, with Rosen as the extra, in this case.

I also would not add Bracco on top of Brown to get Dvorak.