Forbes: Atlanta Thrashers Will Likely Be Sold For $110 Million

[atl thrasher344]

Can you provide me with proof that it was impossible, or did not happen? Links? Or is that just your legal opinion?

Just like I can't prove on the internet that TNSE has/is going to buy the Thrashers, you cannot prove that ASG hasn't talked to anyone about a sale while they were in court for the last few years.

Its a stalemate, friend.

If you cannot prove the former then he has no reason to prove the latter.

Also, that article you posted basically says the Thrashers could move to Winnipeg and if they don't another team could. It was just more speculation.

 

[Dado]

The only proof that's going to settle this is the announcement that the team is going to Winnipeg. Which will come soon enough.

Until then we're all just doing donuts in the snow.

 

[atl thrasher344]

The only proof that's going to settle this is the announcement that the team is going to Winnipeg. Which will come soon enough.

Until then we're all just doing donuts in the snow.

Geez. Are you serious? How do you know? Do you have proof? Or did you hear it from the mailman?

I find it pretty unbelievable that everyone in Winnipeg knows it's a done deal for the 80 millionth time, but have no evidence and no one outside of Winnipeg has any clue.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

No, the reason I can prove the court case is the reason I argue it.

There are 2 main reasons.

First, the court case was a public affair. That means that all documents pertaining to the court case were released and are able to be viewed by the public.

There was nothing in these documents about ASG talking with anyone to sell the Thrashers. In a case where all documents pertaining to the value of the Thrashers, Hawks and Philips Arena were ordered by the Judge to be turned over to the appraisers.

This transparency and order from the Judge to turn over all documents is how we know that the ASG lost 300 million from 2005 to now, for example.

There were no documents pertaining to a sale, or talk of a sale, in such documents.

Second, the majority of the lawsuit was spent without a clear picture of who owned the team. In the beginning, ASG tried to buy out Belkin. Belkin counter sued, but was denied the right to buy them out. Then, ASG and Belkin went to court to decide how much Belkins 30% majority share was worth.

This means that, until recently, no one had a clear idea of who owned the Thrashers. More specifically, no one knew who was the majority owner. It was in limbo; Belkin had not yet been bought out, but he still owned most of it.

For these reasons, ASG could not talk to anyone about selling the Thrashers. If reason # 1 were not in place, then I could see it, but we know for a fact that no documents about ASG talking to any potential buyers during the lawsuit where provided.

Essentially, ASG has been desperate to sell for the past 6 years. But they have been blocked by Belkin and his lawsuit. Because of the legal restrictions, they could not sell.

 

[Chief Ten Bears*]

No, the reason I can prove the court case is the reason I argue it.

There are 2 main reasons.

First, the court case was a public affair. That means that all documents pertaining to the court case were released and are able to be viewed by the public.

There was nothing in these documents about ASG talking with anyone to sell the Thrashers. In a case where all documents pertaining to the value of the Thrashers, Hawks and Philips Arena were ordered by the Judge to be turned over to the appraisers.

This transparency and order from the Judge to turn over all documents is how we know that the ASG lost 300 million from 2005 to now, for example.

There were no documents pertaining to a sale, or talk of a sale, in such documents.

Second, the majority of the lawsuit was spent without a clear picture of who owned the team. In the beginning, ASG tried to buy out Belkin. Belkin counter sued, but was denied the right to buy them out. Then, ASG and Belkin went to court to decide how much Belkins 30% majority share was worth.

This means that, until recently, no one had a clear idea of who owned the Thrashers. More specifically, no one knew who was the majority owner. It was in limbo; Belkin had not yet been bought out, but he still owned most of it.

For these reasons, ASG could not talk to anyone about selling the Thrashers. If reason # 1 were not in place, then I could see it, but we know for a fact that no documents about ASG talking to any potential buyers during the lawsuit where provided.

Essentially, ASG has been desperate to sell for the past 6 years. But they have been blocked by Belkin and his lawsuit. Because of the legal restrictions, they could not sell.

Since we are playing peoples court, answer me this, YES OR NO: Is it possible that ASG could have had a casual conversation about getting out of the hockey business, if in fact they won their case?

Yes or No please, and thank you.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Since we are playing peoples court, answer me this, YES OR NO: Is it possible that ASG could have had a casual conversation about getting out of the hockey business, if in fact they won their case?

Yes or No please, and thank you.

Yes they could.

But as I already pointed out (in this thread, no less!), any such conversation would contain less information than the derisive "kicking the tires".

ASG could not provide either the value of the Thrashers OR when it could be sold.

 

[Dado]

Geez. Are you serious? How do you know? Do you have proof?

You are completely within your rights to assume I'm talking out my ass. Honestly, I won't mind.

 

[Chief Ten Bears*]

Yes they could.

But as I already pointed out (in this thread, no less!), any such conversation would contain less information than the derisive "kicking the tires".

ASG could not provide either the value of the Thrashers OR when it could be sold.

You are absolutley right, they couldn't provide the exact value of the Thrashers or when it could be sold. But, they may have said something along the lines of come see me in xxx years... We'll talk. TNSE says I'm not interested in just talking, FYI... ASG says, neither are we.

And god only knows what ASG had told the NHL about wanting out for the last 6 years, its quite possible the NHL could have been doing the work that ASG "wasn't allowed to do because they were in court"

After all, the Thrashers are a franchise of the NHL, and the NHL would be heavily involved in a sale/buy situation, regardless of ASG's court case. Better safe than sorry, right? And not leaving things to the last minute for when that court case would eventually end... I think we can all admit, it was pretty fast from the point ASG won their case, to when they said they are pretty sure they don't like hockey anymore... What was it, 45 days or so?

 

[Dado]

ASG could not provide either the value of the Thrashers OR when it could be sold.

Just for the sake of argument, let's assume the announcement just happened, and the Thrashers are off to Winnipeg. How would you square that with what you believe you know about ASG's situation?

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Uh, no.

Regardless of who was doing the discussing, any and all documents pertaining to the Thrashers value was ordered by the court to be turned over to three third party appraisers to determine the value (which was then debated endlessly in court).

So essentially, you are suggesting that the NHL tried to sell a franchise that it did not own, nor could not state the owner, nor could not state how much it was worth, nor when it would be put on the market.

I can accept this "talking" as long as people understand just how limited this "talking" was.

 

[atl thrasher344]

You are completely within your rights to assume I'm talking out my ass. Honestly, I won't mind.

Do you at least have a date or something, so I can make sure I'm seated that whole day?

I think we can all admit, it was pretty fast from the point ASG won their case, to when they said they are pretty sure they don't like hockey anymore... What was it, 45 days or so?

ASG haven't liked hockey for a while. They told the fans to deal with it when we voiced our concerns about how the team was being run. They don't care and probably never did.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Just for the sake of argument, let's assume the announcement just happened, and the Thrashers are off to Winnipeg. How would you square that with what you believe you know about ASG's situation?

I would wait to see how when discussions started. Most likely we will get "we started talking in 2005, stayed in touch during the court case, and then resumed negotiations once it was dealt with".

Please understand Dado, I am only against the idea that TSNE negotiated to buy a franchise with no clear owner or value while the owners were duking it out in court to determine the value.

And if it does turn out that they did conduct negotiations (serious ones, at least), then I wonder how the hell they bypassed the nuances that I have beaten to death.


And then I turn in my Phoenix Wright Ace Attorney at Law Printable Online Law Certificate.

 

[Dado]

It's just a thought experiment. At this point, we do not even know if ASG is even in charge of the team, and if they aren't, when the wove took over. There are a million (reasonable) ways to get from where things appear to be to an already-consummated sale.

 

[pucka lucka]

What I don't understand is why a few Atlanta fans are desperately trying to minimize any realistic relocation scenarios? This is BoH. Relocation is a possibility. There have been rumblings for a couple of years. Refusing to acknowledge that the team could relocate, doesn't change reality.

I am honestly not sure what some posters are hoping to achieve on this thread.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

What I don't understand is why a few Atlanta fans are desperately trying to minimize any realistic relocation scenarios? This is BoH. Relocation is a possibility. There have been rumblings for a couple of years. Refusing to acknowledge that the team could relocate, doesn't change reality.

I am honestly not sure what some posters are hoping to achieve on this thread.

For future reference, posters with 'Anton' in their user name are Carolina fans. We changed our usernames to worship the greatest defenseman to ever walk to face of the Earth.

And I am not minimizing a "realistic relocation scenario". I am minimizing an absurd one. Suggesting that TSNE attempted to negotiate to purchase a team that had no clear owner, no clear value and no clear time of market appearance is absurd, no?

Whether the Thrashers move or stay, I know not. As I type this post, Dustin Byfuglien and Tobias Enstrom could be hard at work debating what the new teams name will be. Or perhaps Andrew Ladd is putting down a deposit on his home in Atlanta, because he knows they are staying. Or perhaps none of these things are happening, because no one has the slightest idea what is going on, and they are all idiotic scenarios anyway (the players' actions I described, not the speculation on the relocation scenarios).


But I do know the legal case well, and the ramifications of that case (which I have beaten to death).

 

[atl thrasher344]

What I don't understand is why a few Atlanta fans are desperately trying to minimize any realistic relocation scenarios? This is BoH. Relocation is a possibility. There have been rumblings for a couple of years. Refusing to acknowledge that the team could relocate, doesn't change reality.

I am honestly not sure what some posters are hoping to achieve on this thread.

I know relocation is a realistic outcome. I just can't understand how everyone in Winnipeg thinks it's a done deal especially since no one gives me any reason to believe them.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

It's just a thought experiment. At this point, we do not even know if ASG is even in charge of the team, and if they aren't, when the wove took over. There are a million (reasonable) ways to get from where things appear to be to an already-consummated sale.

I'll play along.

If ASG were no longer the owners of the Thrashers, then why has nothing been announced?

 

[Chief Ten Bears*]

I'll play along.

If ASG were no longer the owners of the Thrashers, then why has nothing been announced?

I'll add some food for thought: could this also be why the NHL is willing to defy all logic in being commited to Phoenix? Almost like, leaving Phoenix isn't possible.

 

[The Fat Kid]

Snow!? You'll have to put it into context those in Atlanta will understand. How about we're all just doing donuts on the grass in the infield at Talledega"

talledega is in alabama...

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

I'll add some food for thought: could this also be why the NHL is willing to defy all logic in being commited to Phoenix? Almost like, leaving Phoenix isn't possible.

And sacrifice the Thrashers to save Phoenix.

Damn, in 20 years, people will ask why the NHL abandoned Atlanta.

"To save Phoenix"

"You mean the Houston Coyotes?"

"Yea, them"

 

[btn]

Stay on topic, and do not troll.

 

[gretschdrum]

Ok, back on topic. Kincade tweets:

What would fan reaction be IF an exclusive negotiating period was entered into now AND it was not a North of the Border group?

Kincade also broke into the 680AM radio show this morning to basically say the same thing. However, he added that this negotiating period would be for the Thrash, Hawks, and arena. Sounds very Balkan-esque. Still more speculation but getting interesting.

 

[Huffer]

I know relocation is a realistic outcome. I just can't understand how everyone in Winnipeg thinks it's a done deal especially since no one gives me any reason to believe them.

This really isn't directed at you personally atl thrasher344, but people really need to get off the "everybody in Winnipeg" rhetoric.

Not everyone in Winnipeg is monitoring this situation. Most people have a very "I'll believe it when I see it" mentality surrounding the NHL.

 

[BB79]

This really isn't directed at you personally atl thrasher344, but people really need to get off the "everybody in Winnipeg" rhetoric.

Not everyone in Winnipeg is monitoring this situation. Most people have a very "I'll believe it when I see it" mentality surrounding the NHL.

Same can be said about this Kincade guy who keeps talking about santa claus I mean "The Balkin". Enjoying those climbing ratings much? Give it a rest.

 

[Grudy0]

Same can be said about this Kincade guy who keeps talking about santa claus I mean "The Balkin". Enjoying those climbing ratings much? Give it a rest.

I'm pretty sure this "Kincade" guy is a reporter. Therefore, wouldn't he be just as reliable as say, Dreger?

*ducking for cover*

But this whole situation does remind me how people tend to choose what they want to believe, even if strawman facts are lined up and knocked down.