Friedman: Flames interested in Zuccarello

[QJL]

I've come around on Zucc a bit over the past few days in terms of what he'd add for Calgary.
Would really bridge the gap in terms of the drop-off offensively between our 4th and 5th forward; right now the difference between Tkachuk and Backlund in terms of offensive production is huge. One guy's a PPG winger, and the other guy is trending to ~45ish points. It's not taking anything away from his Selke level defence abilities, Frolik after his torrid production post Agent twitter ***** session; has cooled off. He's a luxury to have on your bottom 6, but really a poor man's 2RW.

How do Rangers fans feel about:


2019 Conditional 1st round pick (condition being we either make the conference finals, OR Zucc resigns in Calgary before the draft), 2020 second round if not.
2020 3rd Round pick
Rangers pick of the following prospects: Curtis Lazar, Kerby Rychel, Spencer Foo, Rinat Valiev or Brett Pollock


Mats Zuccarello

I know the preference would be just to get a first, but we know Treliving is stingy in terms of using his firsts, he normally likes cost controlled age-appropriate players in those deals. And while Mats is a good player, he's a UFA on the wrong side of 30.

I don't think the Rangers trade Zucc for a 2nd + 3rd + and a prospect of that stature. I think there are better deals to be had and something at this level would surprise me.

 

[The S5]

You just don't move cost controlled young NHLers for rentals.

Depends if a team is pushing its chips to the middle of the table. Maybe Calgary isn't ready to do that and that is fine. Go dumpster diving instead.

 

[AvatarAang]

1st + Valimaki + for Huberdeau would be fun

 

[CauZuki]

It is crazy the amount of people who undervalue Zucc. A consistent 50-60+ top 6 winger but he is not worth a 1st? OK then.

Rangers will get a 1st+ so if Flames dont want to stump up a 1st rounder or top prospect then they wont get him.

Especially after Tatar was traded for a 1st ,2nd and 3rd , I really like Tatar but Zuccarello would be a great add for the Flames in the playoffs. I could see Flames paying a 1st or couple 2nds + b prospect. Would really complete their top 9 even though they already have a solid forward group.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

Because it's not true. Kane is a more physical player. It's not ****ing hard to understand. Kane has thrown 2.3 hits per game over his career, Zucc is at 1.2 per game, over the course of an 82 game season that's about 90 hits difference and over their careers, Kane was been in 16 fights, compared to Zucc's one. Now those aren't the be all and end all of course, but those are pretty damning wouldn't you say?

It's not a knock on Zucc to say he is less physical or "gritty" than one of the best power forwards in the NHL and it sure as **** doesn't mean I haven't watched Zucc play despite you repeating that bull**** ad nauseam.

You really need to grow the **** up and stop throwing the "you've never watched" card around because someone disagrees with you.

Everybody wants to believe their team’s players are better than the other team’s players. Generally, when there is no evidence backing their opinion, it’s easy to pull the “you don’t watch him play” card.

Anybody who watches both of these players knows Kane is far more gritty and physical than Zuccarello.

 

[Iggys Dome]

I don't think the Rangers trade Zucc for a 2nd + 3rd + and a prospect of that stature. I think there are better deals to be had and something at this level would surprise me.

It's a buyers market. A ton of rental wingers are available, Zucc is not gonna get much (in terms of quality picks or prospects).

 

[blankall]

Depends if a team is pushing its chips to the middle of the table. Maybe Calgary isn't ready to do that and that is fine. Go dumpster diving instead.

How many teams do you think are actually giving up their firsts this year?

Toronto has already given up their 1st. Beyond Zucc, there's Stone, Panarin, Brobovsky, Simmonds, Silfverberg, Duchene, Hayes, Nelson, Edler, etc...

Sportsnet did an article, and Zucc wasn't even in their top 12:

NHL's Top 12 UFAs of 2019: Latest rumours, reports - Sportsnet.ca

You're not going to see an additional 10 teams moving their 1st round picks. This is a buyer's market. Might be the best buyer's market ever, in fact.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

How many teams do you think are actually giving up their firsts this year?

Toronto has already given up their 1st. Beyond Zucc, there's Stone, Panarin, Brobovsky, Simmonds, Silfverberg, Duchene, Hayes, Nelson, Edler, etc...

Sportsnet did an article, and Zucc wasn't even in their top 12:

NHL's Top 12 UFAs of 2019: Latest rumours, reports - Sportsnet.ca

You're not going to see an additional 10 teams moving their 1st round picks. This is a buyer's market. Might be the best buyer's market ever, in fact.

Lot of people don’t seem to understand this, and a lot of people comparing Zuccarello and Kane are missing something.

Evander Kane was the best rental on the market last year. Paul Stastny was 2nd. Let’s say Kane’s perceived character issues were what made that 1st round pick a conditional one and that he would have got a normal 1st otherwise.

A late 1st, a 4th, and a C prospect was the going rate for a top rental last year. This year, Kane and Stastny would be 2nd tier rentals and they wouldn’t even headline that class; Eric Staal would.

If Gorton wants to play hardball with Zuccarello and ask for a high price, GMs will turn to Nyquist, or Dzingel, or Silfverberg, or Eric Staal, or Ferland, or somebody else.

 

[FameFlame069]

Especially after Tatar was traded for a 1st ,2nd and 3rd , I really like Tatar but Zuccarello would be a great add for the Flames in the playoffs. I could see Flames paying a 1st or couple 2nds + b prospect. Would really complete their top 9 even though they already have a solid forward group.

Tatar is younger, had term and they both have their intangibles, plus wasn't that one of the last trades? And everyone knew Detroit robbed Vegas

 

[TGWL]

I've come around on Zucc a bit over the past few days in terms of what he'd add for Calgary.
Would really bridge the gap in terms of the drop-off offensively between our 4th and 5th forward; right now the difference between Tkachuk and Backlund in terms of offensive production is huge. One guy's a PPG winger, and the other guy is trending to ~45ish points. It's not taking anything away from his Selke level defence abilities, Frolik after his torrid production post Agent twitter ***** session; has cooled off. He's a luxury to have on your bottom 6, but really a poor man's 2RW.

How do Rangers fans feel about:


2019 Conditional 1st round pick (condition being we either make the conference finals, OR Zucc resigns in Calgary before the draft), 2020 second round if not.
2020 3rd Round pick
Rangers pick of the following prospects: Curtis Lazar, Kerby Rychel, Spencer Foo, Rinat Valiev or Brett Pollock


Mats Zuccarello

I know the preference would be just to get a first, but we know Treliving is stingy in terms of using his firsts, he normally likes cost controlled age-appropriate players in those deals. And while Mats is a good player, he's a UFA on the wrong side of 30.

I'm not sure we want the best piece being a 2020 2nd. I know they don't have the 2019, and that makes it a bit difficult.

 

[Kupo]

Lot of people don’t seem to understand this, and a lot of people comparing Zuccarello and Kane are missing something.

Evander Kane was the best rental on the market last year. Paul Stastny was 2nd. Let’s say Kane’s perceived character issues were what made that 1st round pick a conditional one and that he would have got a normal 1st otherwise.

A late 1st, a 4th, and a C prospect was the going rate for a top rental last year. This year, Kane and Stastny would be 2nd tier rentals and they wouldn’t even headline that class; Eric Staal would.

If Gorton wants to play hardball with Zuccarello and ask for a high price, GMs will turn to Nyquist, or Dzingel, or Silfverberg, or Eric Staal, or Ferland, or somebody else.

Ohhh right, those trades don't count because it doesn't fit your narrative.

 

[QJL]

It's a buyers market. A ton of rental wingers are available, Zucc is not gonna get much (in terms of quality picks or prospects).

I disagree. The only wing prospects available that have more value are Panarin, Simmonds, Stone, and Huberdeau, none of which are guaranteed to move. 3 of those 4 teams are in the playoff hunt. If a majority of that lists stays put, Zucc may very well be a top 5 deadline asset.

I don't think we truly know what kind of market it is yet.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

Ohhh right, those trades don't count because it doesn't fit your narrative.

Those trades don’t count because they were in a different f***ing year.

 

[Kupo]

Those trades don’t count because they were in a different ****ing year.

So we can't use examples from last ****ing year or the ****ing year before....?

Hey, it's not like I'm using the Gaustad trade from 2012.

 

[and 99 others]

So we can't use examples from last ****ing year or the ****ing year before....?

Hey, it's not like I'm using the Gaustad trade from 2012.

The belief that other trades set a “market value” for a current year is a weird concept to me. Just because the devils received a 2nd rounder for Brian Boyle doesn’t mean any of the 29 other teams would be willing to pay close to that.

If the rangers can’t get a late first rounder for zuccarello they could always sign him and give him the captaincy. A small fast 60ish point forward with a $4-$5M cap hit seems like he’s worth at least a first round pick to me.

 

[Kupo]

The belief that other trades set a “market value” for a current year is a weird concept to me. Just because the devils received a 2nd rounder for Brian Boyle doesn’t mean any of the 29 other teams would be willing to pay close to that.

If the rangers can’t get a late first rounder for zuccarello they could always sign him and give him the captaincy. A small fast 60ish point forward with a $4-$5M cap hit seems like he’s worth at least a first round pick to me.

I realize the market is different every year, but history has shown us that quality players are worth late 1sts at the deadline. Or, 2nd round picks + a quality prospect.

I think Zucc and Hayes, if moved, will get something in that ballpark.

 

[WesMcCauley]

Another two points tonight with almost a period left. 19 points in his last 12 games.

 

[WesMcCauley]

Everybody wants to believe their team’s players are better than the other team’s players. Generally, when there is no evidence backing their opinion, it’s easy to pull the “you don’t watch him play” card.

Anybody who watches both of these players knows Kane is far more gritty and physical than Zuccarello.

I dont think Kane is more gritty, more physical sure but thats because of size. Zuccarello has a Gallagher type playing style but is more of a board player than net front guy while also being a fantastic playmaker as well.

 

[Seachd]

McKenzie is answering questions on Twitter and says there's "good action" on Zuccarello, and thinks that could mean maybe a 2nd and a prospect.