Final Fantasy VII Remake - OFFICIALLY RELEASED!! (No Spoilers)

[Do Make Say Think]

Square Enix are so incompetent... Seriously one of the most bizarre large publisher.

 

[Shareefruck]

There's actually some concern that the demo might not even be released anymore because of the leaks (which I heard is similar to what happened with Kingdom Hearts or something? Don't know).

 

[Shareefruck]

Release date 3/3/20.

Demo coming in January.

Moderator Note

Large portions of the full game have been leaked on the internet including the ending. While this is a remake, there is tons of new content in the game. Posting any information (video, screenshots, even text) without a spoiler tag as well as a warning about what is in the spoiler tag, will be grounds for a permanent threadban. Many of us have been waiting 15+ years for this game.

Do vague non-specific impressions about certain aspects of what you saw from the leaks count (such as

Spoiler

saying that there are "Greedo shot first"-esque changes that I found dumb

), or should those be in spoiler tags as well?

 

[Gardner McKay]

Do vague non-specific impressions about certain aspects of what you saw from the leaks count (such as

Spoiler

saying that there are "Greedo shot first"-esque changes that I found dumb

), or should those be in spoiler tags as well?

Nah. You're good Sharee.

I just don't want people posting video clips, screenshots, with no preface as to what is in the spoiler. It is easy to stop reading text and close it but you can't unsee a picture.

 

[kingsholygrail]

I saw the leaked demo (or at least, a version of it which didn't really show everything-- there was a gap in the middle and a montage at the end), and the in-game stuff was a lot more questionable than the opening was. There's a bit of awkwardness and clunkiness to the exchanges/transitions, but not as much as there could have been. They do make one meaningful ret-con in the story that I did think was just total trash, personally.

Spoiler

From what I saw, it looked like they absolve Avalanche of the responsibility of blowing up Sector 1/killing many innocent bystanders and made it so that Shinra is mostly responsible (in pretty much the same way that they took the plate down in order to frame them later on). That removes so much of the interesting moral grey area that the original had, the guilt/responsibility that Barrett's supposed to come to terms with, not to mention the validity of Reeves/Cait Sith's perspective. Instead it kind of becomes "We didn't really do anything wrong, but we're indirectly responsible because we caused Shinra to do it." Pretty lame. It just strikes me as taking a unique and interesting dynamic and cowardly reducing it to something generic/typical/completely unnecessary in an almost Disney-fied, Greedo-shot-first way.

Some people won't find this to be huge deal-breaker (just like Sephiroth appearing early), but these are the kinds of changes that I dreaded about the remake, personally. Hopefully we don't see more of these types of things as more of the game is revealed.

Edit: Apparently a whole crop of full game data has been leaked by data mining the demo. What a mess for SE.

Regarding the spoiler, we'll have to see where they take it. A lot of development for him comes later in the game anyway, especially Gold Saucer and Cosmo Canyon. I think it's worth keeping in mind that they are expanding the game's story to include beats made during Crisis Core, Advent Children, and even Dirge for Cerebus. I haven't read any of the leaks though, but I remember them saying they wanted to incorporate the expanded material and it does clarify and in some cases deviate from the original game.

 

[Shareefruck]

Regarding the spoiler, we'll have to see where they take it. A lot of development for him comes later in the game anyway, especially Gold Saucer and Cosmo Canyon. I think it's worth keeping in mind that they are expanding the game's story to include beats made during Crisis Core, Advent Children, and even Dirge for Cerebus. I haven't read any of the leaks though, but I remember them saying they wanted to incorporate the expanded material and it does clarify and in some cases deviate from the original game.

(note: the spoilers in the tags are pretty milquetoast)

Spoiler

Ultimately, the issue is that they went out of their way to unnecessarily remove something that was absolutely pivotal to the entire primary arcs of two playable characters, in a way that feels forced (and that was clearly done out of fearful compromise, wanting the characters to be less morally grey and more comfortable to root for). Even if the revised plot twists and turns to get to the same result in some roundabout way, it's inevitably going to feel less elegant, in my opinion. I don't even think they'll do that much, though, and will probably just settle on something like "Barrett realizes and regrets that they started a chain reaction that caused a lot of innocent deaths" (even though we know that he shouldn't blame himself for it), or "Cait Sith just thought Avalanche were criminals and flipped when he got to know and understand them." It's not like it isn't still coherent with these changes, but it's definitely weaker and less impactful.

If anything, the fact that the consequences of the change don't really affect anything until later on in the game gives me greater concern about whether or not they thought that far ahead when they made the change. There's a bigger chance that it's an outright oversight than if the impact was more immediate and obvious.

On top of that, while it may seem benign on the surface, it kind of fundamentally makes the basic premise of the first chunk of the game much more generic and much less appealing/interesting in general--

Spoiler

Avalanche essentially goes from questionable ends-justifies-the-means eco-terrorists feared by citizens who just want to get on with their lives to typical hero vigilantes/rebel forces framed by the evil empire.

What they got rid of was an interesting spin on a common trope (that had a bit of complexity), and instead we're kind of just left with the trope now (on that is completely black and white).

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Less than 2 months away!!!

 

[Suxnet]

Spoilers? Really? The game is over 20 years old...I mean yeah, I'd imagine they'd want to introduce some new things to keep the story exciting to old players, but realistically, how much could they change/add before it ruins what made the original great?

 

[Commander Clueless]

Spoilers? Really? The game is over 20 years old...I mean yeah, I'd imagine they'd want to introduce some new things to keep the story exciting to old players, but realistically, how much could they change/add before it ruins what made the original great?

Hey now, some of us never played the original.

 

[Jovavic]

Getting excited and my media blackout started a few months ago. I don't hold the original in such high regard as a lot of others, so them tweaking with the story doesn't bother me any and not using an archaic fighting system like ATB sounds awesome.

Can we please have Barrett actually curse instead of $@!/×+$%, that shit was annoying.

 

[kingsholygrail]

Spoilers? Really? The game is over 20 years old...I mean yeah, I'd imagine they'd want to introduce some new things to keep the story exciting to old players, but realistically, how much could they change/add before it ruins what made the original great?

If they expand on Wutai and Vincent's background, a lot could be added to the story. I'm hoping for it.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Spoilers? Really? The game is over 20 years old...I mean yeah, I'd imagine they'd want to introduce some new things to keep the story exciting to old players, but realistically, how much could they change/add before it ruins what made the original great?

A lot

 

[Shareefruck]

Spoilers? Really? The game is over 20 years old...I mean yeah, I'd imagine they'd want to introduce some new things to keep the story exciting to old players, but realistically, how much could they change/add before it ruins what made the original great?

You might want to read that spoiler suggestion again and understand the context of it before reacting this way.

It's not referring to spoiling the events of the 20 year old game (which is another argument altogether), it's strictly referring to spoiling any of the new and different changes in the remake that have, in fact, already been leaked. The leaks aren't vague rumored hearsay, either-- people actually do now know pretty sizable and specific chunks of how the remake will play out (including what all the character weapons will be, how Red XIII's playability or non-playability will be handled, who all the bosses/final bosses in the game will be, what certain events in the Wall Market sequence will look like, and even some exact dialogue transcripts).

The fact that changing the game may or may not ruin what made the original great is completely irrelevant to this-- The fact is that completely new changes HAVE been made that can now be spoiled.

(and for the record, that's how the spoiler tags above are used as well)

 

[SettlementRichie10]

Square Enix are so incompetent... Seriously one of the most bizarre large publisher.

If it were not for Yoshi-P pulling perhaps the most miraculous resurrection job in gaming history, Square would be kaput as a developer. FF14 is their only consistent profit generator.

And now ironically 14 is the only title that has the same magic as the old SNES/PS1 era FFs. It's absolutely fantastic, and the only great thing Square has done as a developer in what seems like two console generations. Amazing music, story, characters, everything. And hardly any old school Square fans play it because its an MMO.

Like, the story in Shadowbringers is easily a top three FF story EVER. I used to think the Final Fantasy I loved as a kid was dead. But it's very much alive in FF14.

 

[SettlementRichie10]

I saw the leaked demo (or at least, a version of it which didn't really show everything-- there was a gap in the middle and a montage at the end), and the in-game stuff was a lot more questionable than the opening was. There's a bit of awkwardness and clunkiness to the exchanges/transitions, but not as much as there could have been. They do make one meaningful ret-con in the story that I did think was just total trash, personally.

Spoiler

From what I saw, it looked like they absolve Avalanche of the responsibility of blowing up Sector 1/killing many innocent bystanders and made it so that Shinra is mostly responsible (in pretty much the same way that they took the plate down in order to frame them later on). That removes so much of the interesting moral grey area that the original had, the guilt/responsibility that Barrett's supposed to come to terms with, not to mention the validity of Reeves/Cait Sith's perspective. Instead it kind of becomes "We didn't really do anything wrong, but we're indirectly responsible because we caused Shinra to do it." Pretty lame. It just strikes me as taking a unique and interesting dynamic and cowardly reducing it to something generic/typical/completely unnecessary in an almost Disney-fied, Greedo-shot-first way.

Some people won't find this to be huge deal-breaker (just like Sephiroth appearing early), but these are the kinds of changes that I dreaded about the remake, personally. Hopefully we don't see more of these types of things as more of the game is revealed.

Edit: Apparently a whole crop of full game data has been leaked by data mining the demo. What a mess for SE.

That spoiler is actually super concerning, because once again it reveals that modern Square just has no clue what made old Square so good.

Tetsuya Nomura has to be the most overrated developer in the history of the medium.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Release date pushed back to April 10th. Wonder if this stems from some of the leaked content or if they really are just wanting some extra polish.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

I'm okay with that. Make it better and polish it up. We can wait.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Release date pushed back to April 10th. Wonder if this stems from some of the leaked content or if they really are just wanting some extra polish.

Well that blows. But can’t say i’m surprised, their games always get delayed.

They probably release the demo on March 3rd now.

 

[Shareefruck]

That spoiler is actually super concerning, because once again it reveals that modern Square just has no clue what made old Square so good.

Tetsuya Nomura has to be the most overrated developer in the history of the medium.

For what it's worth, I have softened on that stance a bit.

The tone of the demo is pretty solid overall and the voice acting is surprisingly good (some cringy-ness, but that's to be expected). While the retconn does still bother me, a counterpoint did occur to me--

Spoiler

The change didn't completely come out of nowhere-- they basically replaced the existing "Jessie made a miscalculation and didn't expect the explosion to be that big and cause unnecessary deaths" excuse in the original with "Shinra made it bigger to frame them for unnecessary deaths." So the difference between intention and outcome is actually the same, but one involves direct responsibility while the other is only indirect.

 

[Jovavic]

Fart, too close to Cyberpunk now :/ wanted to be done with FF7 when CP comes out

 

[SettlementRichie10]

I'm okay with that. Make it better and polish it up. We can wait.

People said this about the last minute FFXV delay, and look how that turned out.

Square's history of last minute delays does not suggest they're just adding some extra polish to a finished title. It means the game is bugged to the point of unplayability, or outright unfinished. Or both, like FFXV.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

FFXV was pretty solid for a game that went through development hell honestly.

Not perfect but I actually wanted to finish it.

 

[Gardner McKay]

People said this about the last minute FFXV delay, and look how that turned out.

Square's history of last minute delays does not suggest they're just adding some extra polish to a finished title. It means the game is bugged to the point of unplayability, or outright unfinished. Or both, like FFXV.

FFXV wasn't bad because of gameplay, it was bad because of its half-assed story.

This is a hyperbole at its finest. This is the first game of what is shaping up to be a 2-3 part game. Ensuring the first game is as perfect as possible will increase the likelihood that the following games receive strong sales numbers. That is why they are delaying it.

 

[syz]

Well, don't need to get it on launch day now 'cause I'll be like 10% through P5R when it comes out.

 

[RandV]

If it were not for Yoshi-P pulling perhaps the most miraculous resurrection job in gaming history, Square would be kaput as a developer. FF14 is their only consistent profit generator.

And now ironically 14 is the only title that has the same magic as the old SNES/PS1 era FFs. It's absolutely fantastic, and the only great thing Square has done as a developer in what seems like two console generations. Amazing music, story, characters, everything. And hardly any old school Square fans play it because its an MMO.

Like, the story in Shadowbringers is easily a top three FF story EVER. I used to think the Final Fantasy I loved as a kid was dead. But it's very much alive in FF14.

I'm pretty skeptical there. I played it for a month after it's second launch, but before any expansions, don't really see how they can make an MMO style gameplay mesh with a single player experience. Like if you have three different zones in FFXII, they'll be entirely dedicated to the player right now and setup so that you have to traverse them a->b->c to reach your destination and advance the story. In an MMO though they don't want big empty spaces, so in FFXIV they'll take those same 3 zones, center it around a central city hub, and partition it up into leveled tiers. All the level 5's will be playing in this section here, the level 15's the next section over here, and so on. Eventually story progression rounds out into a routine where you pick up a mission, teleport to the correct zone, then walk 2 minutes from the teleport pad to the tier zone that was too high a level the last time you were here.

There's no real 'journey' in it, just crowds and convenience. Also doesn't help when you're getting a story briefing and the NPC is like 'you are the chosen one!!!' but when it's done there's a dozen other players idling around being told the same things depending on where you are in the story. These are some of my pet peeves, but again as some who likes the single player games immersion is killed for the sake of crowds and convenience. I got to around level 30-35 in XIV by the time my free month was up, and found it to be getting a bit tedious specifically because it didn't have the flow of a single player game.